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+---- Thread: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal (/thread-493775.html)
ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - mattsarz - 04-18-2011 08:17 AM
http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2011/04/18/Media/ESPN-Big-East.aspx
Hope they're coming with cash and less weeknight football, or I'd wait and see what the interest level is on the open market. Might not be at Pac-12 per school levels ($16-$18m per school), but it better not be far off.
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - cuseroc - 04-18-2011 08:29 AM
(04-18-2011 08:17 AM)mattsarz Wrote: http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2011/04/18/Media/ESPN-Big-East.aspx
Hope they're coming with cash and less weeknight football, or I'd wait and see what the interest level is on the open market. Might not be at Pac-12 per school levels ($16-$18m per school), but it better not be far off.
Nice find Matt. I wish I was a subscriber to the WSJ.
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - TexanMark - 04-18-2011 08:39 AM
(04-18-2011 08:17 AM)mattsarz Wrote: http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2011/04/18/Media/ESPN-Big-East.aspx
Hope they're coming with cash and less weeknight football, or I'd wait and see what the interest level is on the open market. Might not be at Pac-12 per school levels ($16-$18m per school), but it better not be far off.
I'd be extremely happy with $13-15M per school...not sure we'll see it with the Providence gang. I hope they bring Tags in let him speak. I would drive a hard bargain then open up bidding to FOX, NBC, TBS and even the NFL Network
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - Wilkie01 - 04-18-2011 08:50 AM
Its time to split Mark and make some money.
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - mattsarz - 04-18-2011 08:57 AM
I know someone who is a subscriber who may be able to get key points of article. SBJ opens select articles throughout the week, so it may be freely available later on.
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - Ring of Black - 04-18-2011 08:59 AM
(04-18-2011 08:39 AM)TexanMark Wrote: I hope they bring Tags in let him speak.
I'd hope that's one of the underlying reasons for him being around.
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - mattsarz - 04-18-2011 09:04 AM
Don't go w/NFL Network. Not on Time Warner or Bright House, where a few of our schools would take a hit (Cincy, SU, USF, parts of NYC)
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - TexanMark - 04-18-2011 09:32 AM
(04-18-2011 09:04 AM)mattsarz Wrote: Don't go w/NFL Network. Not on Time Warner or Bright House, where a few of our schools would take a hit (Cincy, SU, USF, parts of NYC)
Ahh good point...thanks
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - WacoBearcat - 04-18-2011 09:36 AM
Hopefully, numbers will be run for various scenarios (split, stay, 10/17, 12/20 etc).
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - cuseroc - 04-18-2011 10:20 AM
I like the following from the article:
Sources indicate the early numbers range from $110 million to $130 million annually, but conference sources describe those figures as a starting point for any negotiation. The initial offer would fall short of the $155 million annual payout the ACC will receive from ESPN in a deal that kicks in this summer. But the bold push by ESPN shows the network wants to lock down college rights in the face of increasing competition
I LOL at those doubters who didnt think that the BE had enough juice to be able to get a deal similar to the other conferences and "should be happy to even double their current deal." And those that didnt think that the BE was valuable enough in the eyes of ESPN and other networks to land a big tv deal.
Well it appears to me that ESPN sees the league being so valuable that they want to do something that they normally wouldnt do, and thats to enter negotiations much earlier than normal to get a deal with the BE and take the league off the market. This is very good for the BE. ESPN cannot afford to lose more fb inventory and definitly cant afford to lose BE bb. The BE negotiators need to land a deal north of $180 million per year over a 7 to 10 year period, with multiple guaranteed time slots on ABC and language that allows for potential future expansion renegotiation. The league is negotiating from a position of strength now, just as many fans have predicted.
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - Metropolis777 - 04-18-2011 10:31 AM
I don't like the idea of refraining from taking this to the open market. However, if ESPN is going to insist on more weeknight games (i.e. Wed & Fri nights), then that deal better come in at $16 million+ for each football school. DO NOT concede to ESPN for mere "exposure" dollars. They aren't real. What is real is the burden put on the league and the lower level branding you get from constantly playing on Wed nights.
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - bitcruncher - 04-18-2011 10:37 AM
Sports is a valuable commodity for TV, and advertisers and executives are well aware of this. I didn't think ESPN wanted to let the conference in the most populous part of the nation go by the wayside. If we play our cards right, and don't jump on the first offer, we should easily exceed the ACC's per school payout on our next contract...
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - SuperFlyBCat - 04-18-2011 10:38 AM
http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2011/04/18/Media/ESPN-Big-East.aspx
This link might include the entire story.
"ESPN’s offer has created a division among the conference’s schools. Some want to rebuff ESPN’s offer and take the conference’s media rights to the open market. The reason: The amount of potential bidders in the market has helped other leagues increase their media rights more than they initially expected"
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - TexanMark - 04-18-2011 10:39 AM
Maybe ESPN will stop the unwarranted trashing if they are paying us market rate. I don't mind trashing when it is warranted but most of the TV talking heads go overboard pandering to the average Joe sports fan.
BTW, SuperFlyCat thanks for the link
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - mattsarz - 04-18-2011 10:39 AM
(04-18-2011 10:20 AM)cuseroc Wrote: I like the following from the article:
Sources indicate the early numbers range from $110 million to $130 million annually, but conference sources describe those figures as a starting point for any negotiation. The initial offer would fall short of the $155 million annual payout the ACC will receive from ESPN in a deal that kicks in this summer. But the bold push by ESPN shows the network wants to lock down college rights in the face of increasing competition
I LOL at those doubters who didnt think that the BE had enough juice to be able to get a deal similar to the other conferences and "should be happy to even double their current deal." And those that didnt think that the BE was valuable enough in the eyes of ESPN and other networks to land a big tv deal.
Well it appears to me that ESPN sees the league being so valuable that they want to do something that they normally wouldnt do, and thats to enter negotiations much earlier than normal to get a deal with the BE and take the league off the market. This is very good for the BE. ESPN cannot afford to lose more fb inventory and definitly cant afford to lose BE bb. The BE negotiators need to land a deal north of $180 million per year over a 7 to 10 year period, with multiple guaranteed time slots on ABC and language that allows for potential future expansion renegotiation. The league is negotiating from a position of strength now, just as many fans have predicted.
Making assumptions on the math using the numbers of $130m and $180m
Lets say 2/3 of this money is divided evenly over 17 schools. The other 1/3 is the football money.
130 / 3 = 43.3. 86.6 for everyone, 43.3 additional for football to be spread.
Schools not playing football in the conference would receive approximately $5m, football playing members would receive $9.8m in rights fees based on $130m.
If we wanted to get $180m, the split becomes $7m for those playing all sports but football in conference and football playing members would receive $13.3m.
$180m should be the target number, again based on my split of revenues. At $130m, football members are likely not going to make as much as the bottom tier of the Big 12 and still be behind the ACC.
At $130m, using these assumptions and football playing members only
Big East = $9.8m
ACC = $12.91m
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - SuperFlyBCat - 04-18-2011 10:45 AM
(04-18-2011 10:39 AM)mattsarz Wrote:(04-18-2011 10:20 AM)cuseroc Wrote: I like the following from the article:
Sources indicate the early numbers range from $110 million to $130 million annually, but conference sources describe those figures as a starting point for any negotiation. The initial offer would fall short of the $155 million annual payout the ACC will receive from ESPN in a deal that kicks in this summer. But the bold push by ESPN shows the network wants to lock down college rights in the face of increasing competition
I LOL at those doubters who didnt think that the BE had enough juice to be able to get a deal similar to the other conferences and "should be happy to even double their current deal." And those that didnt think that the BE was valuable enough in the eyes of ESPN and other networks to land a big tv deal.
Well it appears to me that ESPN sees the league being so valuable that they want to do something that they normally wouldnt do, and thats to enter negotiations much earlier than normal to get a deal with the BE and take the league off the market. This is very good for the BE. ESPN cannot afford to lose more fb inventory and definitly cant afford to lose BE bb. The BE negotiators need to land a deal north of $180 million per year over a 7 to 10 year period, with multiple guaranteed time slots on ABC and language that allows for potential future expansion renegotiation. The league is negotiating from a position of strength now, just as many fans have predicted.
Making assumptions on the math using the numbers of $130m and $180m
Lets say 2/3 of this money is divided evenly over 17 schools. The other 1/3 is the football money.
130 / 3 = 43.3. 86.6 for everyone, 43.3 additional for football to be spread.
Schools not playing football in the conference would receive approximately $5m, football playing members would receive $9.8m in rights fees based on $130m.
If we wanted to get $180m, the split becomes $7m for those playing all sports but football in conference and football playing members would receive $13.3m.
$180m should be the minimum number, again based on my split of revenues. At $130m, football members are likely not going to make as much as the bottom tier of the Big 12 and still be behind the ACC.
Wonder what a ten team football/bball conference could get?
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - cuseroc - 04-18-2011 10:46 AM
(04-18-2011 10:39 AM)mattsarz Wrote:(04-18-2011 10:20 AM)cuseroc Wrote: I like the following from the article:
Sources indicate the early numbers range from $110 million to $130 million annually, but conference sources describe those figures as a starting point for any negotiation. The initial offer would fall short of the $155 million annual payout the ACC will receive from ESPN in a deal that kicks in this summer. But the bold push by ESPN shows the network wants to lock down college rights in the face of increasing competition
I LOL at those doubters who didnt think that the BE had enough juice to be able to get a deal similar to the other conferences and "should be happy to even double their current deal." And those that didnt think that the BE was valuable enough in the eyes of ESPN and other networks to land a big tv deal.
Well it appears to me that ESPN sees the league being so valuable that they want to do something that they normally wouldnt do, and thats to enter negotiations much earlier than normal to get a deal with the BE and take the league off the market. This is very good for the BE. ESPN cannot afford to lose more fb inventory and definitly cant afford to lose BE bb. The BE negotiators need to land a deal north of $180 million per year over a 7 to 10 year period, with multiple guaranteed time slots on ABC and language that allows for potential future expansion renegotiation. The league is negotiating from a position of strength now, just as many fans have predicted.
Making assumptions on the math using the numbers of $130m and $180m
Lets say 2/3 of this money is divided evenly over 17 schools. The other 1/3 is the football money.
130 / 3 = 43.3. 86.6 for everyone, 43.3 additional for football to be spread.
Schools not playing football in the conference would receive approximately $5m, football playing members would receive $9.8m in rights fees based on $130m.
If we wanted to get $180m, the split becomes $7m for those playing all sports but football in conference and football playing members would receive $13.3m.
$180m should be the minimum number, again based on my split of revenues. At $130m, football members are likely not going to make as much as the bottom tier of the Big 12 and still be behind the ACC.
At $130m, using these assumptions and football playing members only
Big East = $9.8m
ACC = $12.91m
I agree. Using similar breakdowns is why I came up with the $180 million mark. But we should be well north of that since we have 16 members, soon to be 17.
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - Frank the Tank - 04-18-2011 10:47 AM
(04-18-2011 09:36 AM)WacoBearcat Wrote: Hopefully, numbers will be run for various scenarios (split, stay, 10/17, 12/20 etc).
The current TV deal is about 2/3 for basketball and 1/3 for football.
If you take the high number quoted ($130 million per year), apply the current distribution and assume for the time being that Villanova doesn't move up, it would have the following averages:
Basketball - $87 million per year average; $5.12 million per basketball school
Football - $43 million per year average; $4.78 million per football school
So, at $130 million per year, the schools that play both football and basketball would make just a tad under $10 million per year on average.
Assume that the football number is a constant (that number isn't going to change whether or not you split). That means that if there's a split, a 9-team all-sports conference would need to pull in about $46 million for basketball in order to break even. Note that no one is going to split just to break even - there has to be a substantial benefit for making that move. You likely need to get around $8 million per year per school for basketball ($72 million per year for 9 schools) in order to make it worth it. Are the 8 Catholic schools only worth $15 million (the difference between what would make a split league worth it versus what's on the table for a hybrid) all put together?
Here's where the dichotomy lies. For a lot of split proponents, they believe that if "all things are equal", then that supports a split. In reality, it's exactly the opposite for the university presidents - for them, if "all things are equal", then there's absolutely zero reason to make a move and incur a massive amount of litigation costs. It has to be a whole lot more compelling financial change in order to justify a split and there's clearly doubts as to whether the UCF/Houston-types would really add enough (if anything at all).
Think of it this way: under these figures, each additional Big East school has to bring in $10 million each just to break even, meaning that those expansion candidates actually have to bring in $12 million each or so to make a really good case. Is UCF really going to add $12 million per year? Is Houston? Heck, would even Missouri or Kansas do that? These are the benchmarks that people need to starting taking into account.
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - Frank the Tank - 04-18-2011 10:50 AM
(04-18-2011 10:39 AM)mattsarz Wrote: Making assumptions on the math using the numbers of $130m and $180m
Lets say 2/3 of this money is divided evenly over 17 schools. The other 1/3 is the football money.
130 / 3 = 43.3. 86.6 for everyone, 43.3 additional for football to be spread.
Schools not playing football in the conference would receive approximately $5m, football playing members would receive $9.8m in rights fees based on $130m.
If we wanted to get $180m, the split becomes $7m for those playing all sports but football in conference and football playing members would receive $13.3m.
$180m should be the target number, again based on my split of revenues. At $130m, football members are likely not going to make as much as the bottom tier of the Big 12 and still be behind the ACC.
At $130m, using these assumptions and football playing members only
Big East = $9.8m
ACC = $12.91m
Well, we seem to be thinking the same way here.
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal - bitcruncher - 04-18-2011 10:58 AM
(04-18-2011 10:45 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote: Wonder what a ten team football/bball conference could get?I wouldn't be at all surprised if that wasn't being explored, as well as a few other possible options...