ACC w/ 14 teams ==> everybody's pie slice gets thinner.

ACC w/ 12 teams ==> maximize the pie slices

I wonder if what's really going on is a switch.

Miami + Cuse + BC = came in short
Miami + UCONN + VT = Oooooo... nice.

ACC just keeps adding the Pansies man....

SouthLink02 Wrote:ACC just keeps adding the Pansies man....

I'll take UCONN and VT over Cuse and BC any day.

Both UCONN and VT are better in football (UCONN will be a top notch program under Edsall).
Cuse and BC have a slight basketball edge -- but if VT would pick it up some they'd be about even.

14 teams is ridiculous, with the addition of Miami though it will be tougher for FSU to run the conf table year in and year out.

I think they should cap it at 12, the Big East is dead in Football anyhow without Miami, VT will take that conf over now.

:eek:

SDSundevil Wrote:I think they should cap it at 12, the Big East is dead in Football anyhow without Miami, VT will take that conf over now.

:eek:

If Miami and any combination of the other 4 schools leave, the Big East will probably lose their automatic BCS bid. That doesn't hurt BC and the 'Cuse much, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Va Tech migrate over to the Big 10 or just become an independent.

I agree that 14 teams is way too much though.

they should cap it at 9

Yes...let's trade the NY and Boston media markets for Blacksburg and CT. Sounds good to me!

p5mmr9 Wrote:Yes...let's trade the NY and Boston media markets for Blacksburg and CT. Sounds good to me!

Boston College does not have much of the Boston market watching them so you wouldn't be losing them.

A little of Boston is a lot more than a lot of Blacksburg.

Boston Demographic Overview
Population: 3.4 million
Median Household Income: $62,495


Blacksburg Demographic Overview
Population: 42,849
Median Household Income: $48671

The math does not add up. Simply put, the ACC garners little from a VT addition. While I'm not a big fan of BC and I don't think BC is really an ACC school...I can't argue with the fact that adding BC over VT offers this conference much more in terms of media market diversity and the possibility for larger media contracts ($$. None of this is even taking into account VT's weak athletic department and abysmally poor football graduation rates.

Toledo played BC in the Motor City Bowl last season. Terrible, horrible game. However, my point is that BC only brought about 4-5 thousand fans with them. Pathetic fan support.

I don't think you understand what I'm trying to convey...

4000-5000 fans to one game
13000-20000 fans to one game

irrelevant numbers. Do you think 20,000 people at one bowl game are going to support the ACC? Besides

That man knows his... um... media.

:eek:

this is why I hate this expansion thing, they are not looking at what would be a better fit, just who brings in more money.

when a conference is based purely greed it will not survive.

The difference is: all of Blacksburg will be watching VT football games. I'm not sure much more than that 1.5% of the Boston market even cares about BC sports.

And, I don't think you can just attribute the Blacksburg market to VT. I think you basically have to throw in all of western Virginia -- Roanoke, etc. I'm not saying it's an enormous market by any means, but those people care about their college football.

I really doubt the folks around Boston care too much about college sports except for hockey and maybe Harvard-Yale football.

Median household income doesn't really mean anything to me, when you consider the fact that none of the wealthy Bostonians are going to be spending any money that benefits the ACC. Even though Virginia mountain folk may make less income, I guarantee that they all have a TV, spend money on season tickets, and will buy all sorts of merchandise out the wahoo (excuse the pun).

Now, don't get me wrong -- I still don't want them in the ACC. And I'm not saying that they're a better choice for expansion than BC, because there are other factors like academics, overall athletics, etc. that factor into that.

But, the "Boston market" thing doesn't really fly with me.

-JD

One more thing to consider. Last year Big East football received the second highest average football television ratings of all the conferences (second to the SEC). Is that because of Miami and VT? Maybe. I believe it has a lot to do with the fact that even though the NE schools in the BE are mediocre, they still garner large television ratings because of the enormous population figures in the NE. I think the ACC is trying to cut off a small piece of that pie.

JD Heel Wrote:Median household income doesn't really mean anything to me, when you consider the fact that none of the wealthy Bostonians are going to be spending any money that benefits the ACC. Even though Virginia mountain folk may make less income, I guarantee that they all have a TV, spend money on season tickets, and will buy all sorts of merchandise out the wahoo (excuse the pun).


-JD

In reality...or so far as conference expansion goes, season tickets and team merchandise have little to do with this big picture. The big picture is advertising dollars. Here is the chain:

a) lots of people with buying power (regardless of commodity) -> b) advertising company -> c) media enterprise (i.e. ESPN/ABC) -> d) television contract -> e) athletic conference

This is what the conference is contemplating...you maximize "a" in order to maximize "e"

Why would advertising companies up there give a flip when none of the people up there do?

I just don't suddenly see any ads for ACC football (or basketball, for that matter) popping up around the Boston or New York areas anytime soon.

-JD

p5mmr9 Wrote:One more thing to consider. Last year Big East football received the second highest average football television ratings of all the conferences (second to the SEC). Is that because of Miami and VT? Maybe. I believe it has a lot to do with the fact that even though the NE schools in the BE are mediocre, they still garner large television ratings because of the enormous population figures in the NE. I think the ACC is trying to cut off a small piece of that pie.

I don't think so. I think it's because of Miami (and VT, to a smaller extent).

The Big East is floundering, and the only true money-maker seems to be Miami.

-JD

[quote="p5mmr9"] I don't think you understand what I'm trying to convey...

4000-5000 fans to one game
13000-20000 fans to one game

irrelevant numbers. Do you think 20,000 people at one bowl game are going to support the ACC? Besides

JD Heel Wrote:Why would advertising companies up there give a flip when none of the people up there do?

I just don't suddenly see any ads for ACC football (or basketball, for that matter) popping up around the Boston or New York areas anytime soon.

-JD

It's not ads for ACC football...it's ads for goods and services marketed to people who watch the program in question. it's why you're tv selections aren't all pay per view...