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The obligatory playoff vs. BCS debate
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JD Heel Offline
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Post: #1
 
You know what's coming. Which is the better system for college football: the BCS, or a playoff. Just for good measure, I've thrown in the old alliance bowl system, which some have said was better than the BCS....

-JD
05-31-2002 12:11 AM
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Terpy Offline
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Post: #2
 
I havent voted yet because I think the whole thing is a little more complex then a lot of people realize. I hate the BCS and think it is crappy just like the next guy but there is reason as to why NCAA D I football does not yet have a playoff system. Alot of money is generated from the current Bowl system, money the NCAA obviously does not want to lose but that is only part of the problem. If a playoff system was put in place it would drastically change the schedules for all the teams. It could possibly destroy any out of conference rivalries and limit the already limited in conference schedule for many teams. In order to make room for the playoffs the teams would have to play less games in a sport where every game already nearly makes or breaks your season. College Football is one of the few sports where people do not complain about the schedule being too long. A playoff system would simply make football schedules very ugly. Also a playoff would certainly not prevent all of the bickering that goes on about deserving teams not getting a chance. Seedings for the playoffs would have to be based on some kind of arbitrary rankings just like the BCS and every year some one would get screwed just like they do now. My whole point is, I dont think a playoff is necessarily the answer that many of you think it is. And presently I would say that any kind of playoff for college football is very unlikely.
05-31-2002 12:32 AM
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JD Heel Offline
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Post: #3
 
I'll take you up on some of those points.

A) First of all, all other NCAA divisions have some form of a playoff. The number of games or whatnot is not a good enough excuse for me.

B) Secondly, I don't really agree with the "somebody still gets left out" argument. I just think that there's a big difference between the 3rd best team being left out versus the 9th or 17th best, etc. In basketball, the national champion almost always comes from a top 10 team. But, it doesn't always come from one of the top 2.

There's a conceivable chance that we could end up with 3 undefeated teams one year. If so, the BCS will be worthless. In contrast, if even the 9th team gets left out of a playoff, then they probably played their way out and can blame it on themselves.

C) The only good argument for the bowl system is $$$. There are deals set up and it will take a lot to break them up. But, I believe it's possible to work a playoff system in somehow....

I'm coming back with my plan for a joint playoff-bowl system....

-JD

<small>[ May 31, 2002, 01:49 AM: Message edited by: JD Heel ]</small>
05-31-2002 12:48 AM
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JD Heel Offline
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Post: #4
 
I'd love to see a 16 or 32 team playoff, but I realize that is unlikely in the present format. IMO, that's something to work for in the future.

I think an eight-team playoff is the way to go for now, and I think the present BCS format can add a lot to this....

I'd keep all other bowls the same, except for the BCS bowls. The four BCS bowls would now become the first-round sites of the playoff system. Heck, they could even still call it the BCS -- Bowl Championship Series. It would make more sense in this format.

Voting for the BCS would remain the same as it presently does. As I said before, some team will end up being the 9th team on the outside looking in, but they will have done that to themselves.

-----------------------------------------

The first-round format
Rose Bowl: Big 10 Champ vs. Pac 10 Champ
Fiesta Bowl: Big 12 Champ vs. At-Large
Sugar Bowl: SEC Champ vs. At-Large
Orange Bowl: ACC Champ vs. Big East Champ

Second round
National Semifinal I: Rose Bowl winner vs. Fiesta Bowl winner
National Semifinal II: Sugar Bowl winner vs. Orange Bowl winner

National Championship

The second-round and championship games will rotate between the four BCS bowl sites each year. For example... one year, the Rose Bowl will have a semifinal, the next they will have the championship, the next a semifinal, and then a year off. Follow that rotation for each stadium.

-----------------------------------------

Either that, or there could be a re-seeding when the eight teams are chosen. I agree with this format because it is somewhat regional and will cut down on travel for most teams.

This way would let in teams from outside the 6 major conferences with the 2 at-large spots. Thus, everybody truly has a shot.

Regular season games are still important -- maybe even more so because they could cost a spot in the BCS playoff.

And, this format only adds one more week of games for two teams and two more weeks for two teams. Not too much to ask, especially for teams that will rake in a lot of money.

Well, I guess that's how I see it now. The main argument against it would probably be that the other bowl games would be rendered meaningless in light of a playoff -- but aren't they already?

IMO, the four-game BCS is a playoff system waiting to happen....

-JD

<small>[ May 31, 2002, 02:13 AM: Message edited by: JD Heel ]</small>
05-31-2002 01:08 AM
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Post: #5
 
My long thoughts.....

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Terpy:
If a playoff system was put in place it would drastically change the schedules for all the teams. It could possibly destroy any out of conference rivalries and limit the already limited in conference schedule for many teams. In order to make room for the playoffs the teams would have to play less games in a sport where every game already nearly makes or breaks your season. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">It doesn't have necessarily have to be that way. Look at Iowa State this year. They've got a preseason game vs. FSU, plus their 12 game schedule - that's 13. If (not likely) they were to win the Big 12 North, they would play in the Big 12 Championship game - that's 14. Then they would play in a bowl game - that's 15 games. IIRC, BYU is the last team to play 15 games in a season (went 14-1 in '96). Teams in the SEC/MAC/Big 12 Championship games always play at least 13 games.

So many people complain about the up to 50 day lay-off between the end of the season and the bowl game. So many things can happen during that time (that's why so many players are ineligible for bowl games). A playoff system would eliminate that, plus it wouldn't be any longer of a schedule than a team like Iowa State could play this year.

My suggestion would by 16 team playoff system...There could also still be bowl games for the teams that didn't get in...sort of like football's version of the NIT...Say a team played the traditional 11 game schedule. It would take 4 wins to win the national championship, for a total of 15 games. If the team came out of the SEC, MAC, or Big 12, they would have to play 16.

I don't see any reason to have to back up the schedule more than one week, if that. But, teams are already playing the 3rd weekend in August now anyway (the preseason games).

Say the schedule started August 31st. With a 13 week schedule (11 games/2 off weeks), the season would last until November 23rd, which it usually does. The following weekend, November 30th, would be when the conf. championships are played.

The NCAA could give those teams a week off (the rest get 2 weeks) to prepare for the NCAA Tournament. That brings us to December 14th. The final 8 teams would play Dec. 21st, and the final four would play Dec. 28th. So, the national championship game would then be played on January 4th, the same date that it was actually played last season.

So, if they plan it out, the schedule really won't be a problem. Money and the "powers that be" are what's stopping the playoff system from happening IMO.

If this doesn't happen, at least eliminate the BCS. It has not helped one bit in it's four years of existance. In 1998, K State and UCLA choked and FSU backed into the championship game. Ohio State fans were irate. In 1999, things were pretty much decided by themselves, but the right two teams played for the title, Virginia Tech and FSU. In 2000, Oklahoma proved they belonged. FSU once again backed their way in and Miami fans were disgusted. Washington had an argument as well. If OU would have lost the Orange Bowl, there would've been a split title, defeating the whole purpose of the BCS. The same thing happened in 2001. Nebraska and Miami played in the Rose Bowl. Florida could have put the griping to rest if they took care of business. Same goes for Texas and Tennessee. None of those teams could, and Nebraska stole the spot, ahead of Oregon and Colorado. If the Huskers would've won the Rose Bowl, they, along with Oregon, would have been co-champions.

My point is the BCS hasn't helped anything. There has been controversy every year, and things have luckily played out where there could be serious gripes as far as who deserved the national championship. I say we go back to the way it's been decided for the last 70 years - by the pollsters....and THAT boys and girls, is my $0.02 on this situation.

<small>[ May 31, 2002, 02:24 AM: Message edited by: JoltinJacket ]</small>
05-31-2002 01:18 AM
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georgia_tech_swagger Offline
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Post: #6
 
You are all neglecting the one thing that is keeping the bowl system in place...

MONEY.

Contracts with cities over bowls bring in lots of money. Fans come to watch the game. They gotta buy the tickets. Did I mention finding somewhere to stay? How about visiting attractions? A man has got to eat too. What about gas?

It all adds up to money, money, money, and LOTS of it.

A playoff system eliminates this contract between city and bowl and teams. They are no longer guaranteed all that money. Also, fans have to plan their bowl trips in advance. A playoff system eliminates the certainty of a team's course in the post-season. Forget those 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round tickets if your team loses in the 1st round. Time to log on to EBAY.

While I personally approve of the ideals of a playoff system and the philosophical concept behind it, I also want to know where my team is headed with CERTAINTY in the post-season if I want to go and watch them. Seeing it realistically, unless the NCAA can pull off a deal like no other with all cities currently hosting bowls to get them regional teams and a definate contract, the bowl system will stay because of the one thing that makes the world go 'round...

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
05-31-2002 02:02 AM
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JD Heel Offline
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Post: #7
 
My system keeps all of the current bowls and adds three more games. Seems that it just adds more money to the mix....

-JD
05-31-2002 02:17 AM
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JoltinJacket Offline
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Post: #8
 
[Image: t1_mora_all.jpg]

[Jim Mora]

"Playoffs? Don't talk about playoffs!" "Are you kidding me?!? Playoffs?!?"

[/Infamous postgame tirade]

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[laugh]" title="" src="graemlins/laughing.gif" />

<small>[ May 31, 2002, 03:52 AM: Message edited by: JoltinJacket ]</small>
05-31-2002 02:48 AM
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JD Heel Offline
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Post: #9
 
We didn't play worth diddly poo!

-JD
05-31-2002 02:49 AM
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Upper Deck Chevy Offline
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Post: #10
 
There are a thousand reasons for a playoff system, and only one against it: money (and most people are only guessing that the BCS system would actually bring in more than a playoff). The choice is obvious, right? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="rolleyes.gif" />

<small>[ May 31, 2002, 07:51 AM: Message edited by: Upper Deck Chevy ]</small>
05-31-2002 06:47 AM
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hoops13 Offline
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Post: #11
 
They need to make it a small playoff. The BCS is a joke.
05-31-2002 07:00 AM
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Post: #12
 
The current results:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">BCS..............................3 (17%)
Playoff System..................14 (78%)
Bowl Alliance....................0 (0%)
I'm a Dookie. What's football?...1 (6%)</pre><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">
05-31-2002 01:56 PM
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georgia_tech_swagger Offline
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Post: #13
 
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by JD Heel:
My system keeps all of the current bowls and adds three more games. Seems that it just adds more money to the mix....

-JD</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">True, but your format isn't a true playoff for most/many good teams. It's nowhere close to as inclusive as March Madness and other effective playoff systems. Even I-AA is more inclusive.
05-31-2002 02:16 PM
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JD Heel Offline
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Post: #14
 
True -- it's not what my favored playoff system would look like. But, I think it's the most practical for what we have right now, and definitely better than the BCS system.

And, hopefully, it would continue to evolve into a more clear-cut playoff system and move away from the old bowl system....

-JD
05-31-2002 02:36 PM
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apocalypse dude Offline
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Post: #15
 
I don't feel I'm obligated to debate this issue.
05-31-2002 03:01 PM
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Oriorip5 Offline
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Post: #16
 
I feel there should be a 16 team playoff. Keep the remaining bowls because they already are like the NIT of college football, in all seriousness there is only one bowl game that matters. With the playoff system there are 15 games that matter, and will make a lot of money, probably more than the current BCS.

Each conference champ should get an automatic bid to the playoff, which is 11 automatic bids and 5 at-large bids. Consider that 6 of those 11 conference champs would make the BCS anyway, there will be 5 teams that would not win, but it will quit any controversy of a Tulane or Marshall going undefeated and getting left out.

If there is no playoff, then just go back to the old system of bowl alliances. It is a lot better than having the BCS. And I would rather argue over the champ then have to argue who plays in a championship game and leave a good team out of having a chance.
05-31-2002 05:43 PM
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