Actually, back in the 80s we (along with a number of other organizations) made it a violation to have an open source of alcohol (bowl of punch, kegs, etc.). Its actually easier to have a drunken beer/liquor fest if you're not in a fraternity now. If you joined a group of guys that wanted to date rape chicks, then you picked the wrong group.

You join to be a part of something bigger than yourself. Just like you join the college republicans/democrats, or an intramural team. A fraternity is a conglomeration of organizations. Like a service organization, sports team, social club, business group, etc. giving you leadership experience, social connections, a large academic, spiritual and personal support group, etc.

Just as you would put time and money into each of these organizations, you put time and money into your fraternity.

I know that in my organization it showed me how to become more social. I entered college shy and terrified of meeting new people. I also gained experience coordinating fund raising efforts, public relations, spiritual development, event planning, and too many other valuable experiences to count.

I know it seems like Im just trying to be an ass here but Im not.

(02-11-2009 10:05 PM)Raider_ATO Wrote:  Actually, back in the 80s we (along with a number of other organizations) made it a violation to have an open source of alcohol (bowl of punch, kegs, etc.). Its actually easier to have a drunken beer/liquor fest if you're not in a fraternity now.

^this is ridiculous

If you joined a group of guys that wanted to date rape chicks, then you picked the wrong group.

You join to be a part of something bigger than yourself. Just like you join the college republicans/democrats, or an intramural team. A fraternity is a conglomeration of organizations. Like a service organization, sports team, social club, business group, etc. giving you leadership experience, social connections, a large academic, spiritual and personal support group, etc.

Just as you would put time and money into each of these organizations, you put time and money into your fraternity.

so its kind of like being a part of any other college organization except it is clearly different

I know that in my organization it showed me how to become more social. I entered college shy and terrified of meeting new people. I also gained experience coordinating fund raising efforts, public relations, spiritual development, event planning, and too many other valuable experiences to count.

I was a bit of a social outcast before college as well but I found my way fine without being hazed.

And just for the record Im not saying that frats are necessarily a bad thing, clearly some are a better than others. Its just as I said throughout this thead I never saw the point. I was in Boy scouts all through middle and high school and before I started college I was kind of curious about the frats because of how much I enjoyed my time in boy scouts. Before the start of my freshmen year I went on a hiking trip with several other incoming freshmen to get to know a few people. One of the guys who was our chaperon (for lack of a better term) was in a frat and I asked him what exactly it was that they did and he couldnt really give me an answer.

Its just all bizarre to me, really. Just for example at Gettysburg College (my alma mater) ATO was pretty notorious for the date rape drugs and stuff, now obviously that runs counter to your experience at MTSU. So what exactly is the point of a national organization if there is no common thread between different campuses? And its like this way for all frats, Lamda chi was known as the nerd frat at Gettysburg but I happen to know that its reputation is quite the opposite at the university of Maryland. To go back to the ATO example why the hell is a decent person that happened to be a member of ATO supposed to help a date rape douchebag get a job just because they have the same goofy letters on their shirt?

It makes no sense.

Rice doesn't have frats and I kind of like it that way. We have residential colleges (in the mold of Oxford... or I guess Harry Potter) that serve pretty much the same roles. Students are randomly assigned to a college when they enter and then stay with that college for the rest of their time at Rice. The colleges work as dorms, but they also run parties, organize IM teams, provide upperclassman mentorship, etc. The difference between residential colleges and frats is that everyone is involved and we don't have silly ties to national organizations.

Oh, and Don't **** with Jones. JIBA!

(02-11-2009 11:29 PM)Terpy Wrote:  To go back to the ATO example why the hell is a decent person that happened to be a member of ATO supposed to help a date rape douchebag get a job just because they have the same goofy letters on their shirt?

-I don't expect to get or give a job based only upon one's letters they wore. Membership shows that a person is more likely to have that leadership experience, management experience, etc.

-It's not just like being a part of ANY other organization. Its like being a part of EVERY organization.

-Banning of open sources of alcohol isn't all that ridiculous. When you allow alcohol to freely flow, there is little way to measure how much a person has drank and manage the risk that is presented. When you host an event much of the liability lies on you. When you purchase the alcohol the liability lies on you. So, if an organization were to purchase a keg, they would also be purchasing all the liability that travels with that alcohol. If a person were to leave the party and crash their car, the organization would be liable (thanks to overzealous lawyers). If an individual provided their own alcohol, the liability would rest on themselves.

-I wasn't hazed, and I don't know why people would put up with being hazed. When you are a pledge, you are to be taught how to act as a brother. Not be taught how to be a pledge.

-The national organization gives you a connection to 100,000's of living alumni, and each organization is founded upon principles that every person is supposed to share, and hold dear. It's part of my job to make sure that is happening. You get to choose who you are joining, unlike a dorm, where its luck of the draw.

Oh, and Gettysburg is a bit different now. As with every organization, they change over time.

I graduated just 5 years ago and I know for a fact that hazing took place, a good friend of mine began pledging at I believe it was TKE and he was definitely hazed before he decided the **** wasnt worth it. Maybe it has changed in the 5 years but I doubt it. Even if you take measures to prevent/curb hazing that certainly doesnt mean it doesnt happen. The kids who join frats for the most part know what they are getting into and even the hazing is just a rite of passage, something they feel they have to go through, so all of the anonymous hazing reporting and crap is for the most part bogus.

And I wasnt saying that banning alcohol was ridiculous, I meant the idea of that actually happening is ridiculous.

A chapter can change over the course of 2 years. In 4 years the chapter can be completely opposite what it used to be. (in all aspects of chapter operation)

Just as a college experience is what you make of it, A fraternity is all about what you put back into it. Like raider said, chapters are only as good as the mindset and competency of those in it. It's kinda of like a NFL franchise, if you have a s#it ton of AL Davis' trying to run the show you already know what the output is going to be, but if you have the right attitudes and people it's one of the best groups to ever be a part of....

(Another ATO)

Sigma Chi

I served as an officer all four years of my college experience and got a great deal out of it. I learned more about public speaking, leadership, bookkeeping, teaching/training, and friendship than I did just attending classes.

But, most importantly, I improved my social skills with women. I was a total goofball with girls before I got more comfortable with them in college. My fraternity 'forced' me to meet lots of ladies (and I MEAN ladies, not the house whores). I'd recommend it for any young man today if he has the right attitude and aptitude for it.