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ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
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Wilkie01 Offline
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Post: #421
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
Frank, you are young and inexperienced. You have very good insight for what you know, But I tell you 35 years ago, Miami and FSU were two football programs that were in deep trouble. They were both ready to fail. They had the good insight to hire Bob Bowden and Howard Schellenberger as their coaches and the rest is history. There are no absolutes in this world. Things change both USF and UCF will prosper as they grow. In reality both FSU and Miami are heading backwards again. Temple could rebound under the right leadership. However, I am not sure, if Temple has the right leadership. Image and the public's perception of your product is always paramount. Providence, Seton Hall, and DePaul really hurt in the perception department for the Big East. Temple suffers from a bad image that cause a bad perception for them overall. I tell you unless you are forward thinking, you will always be stuck in the past and the status quo. The Big East has to change or fade eventually fade away. 04-cheers
(This post was last modified: 04-26-2011 09:46 AM by Wilkie01.)
04-26-2011 09:44 AM
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MichaelSavage Offline
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Post: #422
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
Yes, Florida State continues to be a top national draw even when having lackluster seasons:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424...72488.html
04-26-2011 09:45 AM
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MichaelSavage Offline
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Post: #423
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
(04-26-2011 09:44 AM)Wilkie01 Wrote:  Frank, you are young and inexperienced. You have very good insight for what you know, But I tell you 35 years ago, Miami and FSU were two football programs that were in deep trouble. They were both ready to fail. They had the good insight to hire Bob Bowden and Howard Schellenberger as their coaches and the rest is history. There are no absolutes in this world. Things change both FSU and UCF will prosper aa they grow. In reality both FSU and Miami are heading backwards again. Temple could rebound under the right leadership. However, I am not sure, if Temple has the right leadership. Image and the public's perception of your product is always paramount. Providence, Seton Hall, and DePaul really hurt in the perception department for the Big East. Temple suffers from a bad image that cause a bad perception for them overall. I tell you unless you are forward thinking, you will always be stuck in the past and the status quo. The Big East has to change or fade eventually fade away. 04-cheers

You could make a case that Miami is heading backwards but you'll find little evidence for your claim that Florida State is.
04-26-2011 09:46 AM
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Wilkie01 Offline
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Post: #424
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
I think FSU is still solvent and making money, but Jimbo has to start winning BCS bowls again or FSU will become just another school that plays football for a while. Everyrhing comes full circle, look at Tennessee, Notre Dame and UCLA football. 04-cheers
04-26-2011 09:51 AM
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UCF08 Offline
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Post: #425
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
FSU is still feeling the aftermath of the Bowden debacle, but as a program they're moving forward again and I think will be in the elite status before UF. The reason why I feel so strongly about UM's downward spiral is that the administration seems content to have mediocre sports if their academics and public image isn't taking a hit (a la the "U" of the 90's). Also, UM's facilities are on par with, well, a few low rated high schools in my area and it's making it harder for them to recruit the talent they used to. USF/UCF/FIU/FAU are all building new facilities, are located in major metropolitan cities (another reason for UM's success in recruiting), and all of their administrations are firmly behind their athletics programs.

UM is really a small school, and as of right now they seem to be coasting on their name alone. Just look at that last job hunt they had. You think the head coach of Temple was the first guy they contacted? How many do you think turned them down before they got him? It's not the job it used to be, and a lot of that has to do with the administration.

EDIT: For what it's worth, I don't think FSU ever carried a market not on the I-10 corridor, even in it's hayday. I know in Central Florida it was always UF first, then FSU, and then UM by a long shot. I think the Bowden issue hurt them a fair amount, but just pointing out this isn't me having Black and Gold colored glasses since I was actually born and raised an FSU fan (was the only kid in my kindergarten class who could spell FLORIDA and I did it through the fight song cheer. Pretty sure that was the proudest day of my dads life). We were always outnumbered throughout Florida to UF, but nationally I think they drew better than FSU. I think UM was much the same during their successful run.
(This post was last modified: 04-26-2011 09:56 AM by UCF08.)
04-26-2011 09:52 AM
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adcorbett Offline
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Post: #426
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
(04-26-2011 09:21 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  Let's put it this way: would the BE *ever* pick UCF over Miami or FSU if those 2 latter schools were available? Heck, if the BE could trade with the ACC *any* 2 current BE members for Miami and FSU, do you think they'd hesitate for more than 2 seconds? I don't think there's any question about what the answers would be and that gives you the true insight into who's more valuable. So, who's spinning whom, here?

In the world of sports, this is what we call a knockout blow. 03-nutkick

Hell, many on this board would damn near sell their souls for Boston College to come back. And there are multiple threads full of jizz for teams like Kansas, Kansas State, and Missouri, who have less than 1/4 of their national following.
04-26-2011 09:58 AM
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UCF08 Offline
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Post: #427
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
(04-26-2011 09:58 AM)adcorbett Wrote:  
(04-26-2011 09:21 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  Let's put it this way: would the BE *ever* pick UCF over Miami or FSU if those 2 latter schools were available? Heck, if the BE could trade with the ACC *any* 2 current BE members for Miami and FSU, do you think they'd hesitate for more than 2 seconds? I don't think there's any question about what the answers would be and that gives you the true insight into who's more valuable. So, who's spinning whom, here?

In the world of sports, this is what we call a knockout blow. 03-nutkick

Hell, many on this board would damn near sell their souls for Boston College to come back. And there are multiple threads full of jizz for teams like Kansas, Kansas State, and Missouri, who have less than 1/4 of their national following.

I don't think I saw anyone arguing that USF/UCF had come anywhere near to the national draw that UM or FSU is. We were just commenting on the Tampa and Orlando Markets themselves. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if many college football fans outside of the South East still didn't know where UCF was located at this point in time, or USF for that matter, though I think nationally they're much better known than we are (a product of the Big East invite and that nice run you had a few years ago).
04-26-2011 10:02 AM
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Cubanbull Offline
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Post: #428
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
Correct the discussion was about the LOCAL markets in Florida. In Tampa it would be UF, USF and then FSU.
04-26-2011 10:12 AM
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frogman Offline
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Post: #429
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
(04-26-2011 09:21 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  Let's put it this way: would the BE *ever* pick UCF over Miami or FSU if those 2 latter schools were available? Heck, if the BE could trade with the ACC *any* 2 current BE members for Miami and FSU, do you think they'd hesitate for more than 2 seconds? I don't think there's any question about what the answers would be and that gives you the true insight into who's more valuable. So, who's spinning whom, here?

The only spin is coming from those that are pumping up the expansion candidates and playing down the influence of the massive traditional powers that they directly compete with.

I doubt the BE would trade SYR for either FSU or Miami and Boston college is headed to the crapper faster than grandma with the runs. I don't even think the BE would jump to get UNC and DUKE for BB. Who cares.

FSU was consistently overrated and their BCS game record shows that. Miami has fallen on hard times and is now coached by Temple's old coach Golden.

Outside of these boards where we started off talking about USF and UCF, do you really think anyone in the FB world is even thinking about Miami and FSU.

Heck Miami has had top recruits under Shannon and now Shannon is fired so they hired a top notch coach--- From Temple? Please. Miami USED to be Miami.


Not even the roaches showed up for the final games in the Orange Bowl and how's that league championship game looking with all these powerhouses in the ACC?
(This post was last modified: 04-26-2011 03:22 PM by frogman.)
04-26-2011 03:21 PM
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UCF08 Offline
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Post: #430
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
(04-26-2011 03:21 PM)frogman Wrote:  
(04-26-2011 09:21 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  Let's put it this way: would the BE *ever* pick UCF over Miami or FSU if those 2 latter schools were available? Heck, if the BE could trade with the ACC *any* 2 current BE members for Miami and FSU, do you think they'd hesitate for more than 2 seconds? I don't think there's any question about what the answers would be and that gives you the true insight into who's more valuable. So, who's spinning whom, here?

The only spin is coming from those that are pumping up the expansion candidates and playing down the influence of the massive traditional powers that they directly compete with.

I doubt the BE would trade SYR for either FSU or Miami and Boston college is headed to the crapper faster than grandma with the runs. I don't even think the BE would jump to get UNC and DUKE for BB. Who cares.

FSU was consistently overrated and their BCS game record shows that. Miami has fallen on hard times and is now coached by Temple's old coach Golden.

Outside of these boards where we started off talking about USF and UCF, do you really think anyone in the FB world is even thinking about Miami and FSU.

Heck Miami has had top recruits under Shannon and now Shannon is fired so they hired a top notch coach--- From Temple? Please. Miami USED to be Miami.


Not even the roaches showed up for the final games in the Orange Bowl and how's that league championship game looking with all these powerhouses in the ACC?

Whoa, to be fair, FSU wasn't underrated. They didn't do that well since the BCS era but before that they had one of the best bowl records in college football. From 1982-1999, they only lost 2 Bowl Games while going to bowls every year. Now, from 2000 to the current years, they didn't do quite as well (though they also played in BCS bowl games many years against top competition) but they still ended up at .500 if you don't count the vacated win as a loss.

FSU will be fine, they might not be the dynasty they once were, but then again I'm confident enough to say that no one ever will be again (short of massive rule changes or something). UM on the other hand, I think that program might be digging a hole even South Florida talent can't get them out of.
04-26-2011 03:33 PM
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omniorange Offline
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Post: #431
RE: ESPN, Big East talking extension per Sports Business Journal
(04-26-2011 04:40 AM)frogman Wrote:  Of course you get a different picture here:

http://espn.go.com/blog/sec/post/_/id/17...tched-game

Thanks for that listing which includes more games during the 2010 season. However, I don't believe that list changes the list linked by Frank. It lists games for all channels, not just ESPN and it lists viewers, which is not the same as TV households, what the other list did.

Just for reference here, outside the two games talked about in the article and then the first two games in the "others" list for 2010 (one of which was on the ESPN list), all the other games would be below the UL-RU game back in 2006, which wasn't even on the ESPN only list.

Cheers,
Neil
04-26-2011 03:39 PM
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