Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
Question about Big Ten expansion.
Author Message
Bookmark and Share
He1nousOne Offline
The One you Love to Hate.
*

Posts: 13,285
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 215
I Root For: Iowa/ASU
Location: Arizona
Post: #1
Question about Big Ten expansion.
I am curious how some of the other Big Ten folks here feel about this. As another poster commented in the Realignment section, he would like to see Big Ten expansion maintain the midwest tradition of the conference.

In any expansion scenario I have surmised for the Big Ten they all include some eastern seaboard expansion. Would you folks be against this and do you think a very large percentage of Big Ten fans would be against this as well?
03-03-2012 08:40 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


crixus Offline
Banned

Posts: 195
Joined: Apr 2012
I Root For: Truth
Location: SoCal
Post: #2
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
The first thing the Big Ten needs to do is change the name of the conference. They already have 12 teams and now you're talking about adding more. The name doesn't make sense anymore, so come up with a new one.
04-22-2012 02:56 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
He1nousOne Offline
The One you Love to Hate.
*

Posts: 13,285
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 215
I Root For: Iowa/ASU
Location: Arizona
Post: #3
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
(04-22-2012 02:56 AM)crixus Wrote:  The first thing the Big Ten needs to do is change the name of the conference. They already have 12 teams and now you're talking about adding more. The name doesn't make sense anymore, so come up with a new one.

Oh man I am in complete agreement with you. I can understand the brand recognition argument being that I am in advertising myself.

The best explanation I could make around here is that the B1G also kind of looks like B16. Code for Big Sixteen.

The Big 12 has the rights to the Big 14 but I am not sure about 16.

Still brand recognition wise it would be like starting over when the PAC and SEC will always have that constant brand recognition. The ACC too I suppose. It was a poor naming choice in the beginning but who would have known then what college sports has turned into?

We have to deal with it the best we can and Brand Recognition is a bigger deal than most realize.
04-24-2012 02:34 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Campaign4Liberty Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 901
Joined: May 2012
Reputation: 21
I Root For: Neil Young
Location:
Post: #4
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
Frankly I hope it never changes from the Big Ten. We are about tradition and class. Let's keep it that way. Let the other fools keep changing the name of their conference. When PSU was added to make 11 WAY back in 1990 I am glad they didn't change it. Now on to expansion talk -

This is simple, and really only two schools fit the profile.

1. Notre Dame
2. Rutgers

Why -

1. Markets. Rutgers would add parts of NY that PSU doesn't, and NF would add, well, the entire rest of the country.
2. Academics - both are AAU schools
3. Footprint - ND within...Rutgers not too far away.


ND has NBC now but eventually their hand will be forced, ESPECIALLY if we move towards a 4 team playoff made up of the big 4 conference winners - (pac12, sec, big ten, big 12)

The Big East and ACC are on the outside looking in.
05-08-2012 08:18 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
vabearcat Offline
All American
*

Posts: 3,279
Joined: Nov 2004
Reputation: 83
I Root For:
Location:
Post: #5
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
(05-08-2012 08:18 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  Frankly I hope it never changes from the Big Ten. We are about tradition and class. Let's keep it that way. Let the other fools keep changing the name of their conference. When PSU was added to make 11 WAY back in 1990 I am glad they didn't change it. Now on to expansion talk -

This is simple, and really only two schools fit the profile.

1. Notre Dame
2. Rutgers

Why -

1. Markets. Rutgers would add parts of NY that PSU doesn't, and NF would add, well, the entire rest of the country.
2. Academics - both are AAU schools
3. Footprint - ND within...Rutgers not too far away.


ND has NBC now but eventually their hand will be forced, ESPECIALLY if we move towards a 4 team playoff made up of the big 4 conference winners - (pac12, sec, big ten, big 12)

The Big East and ACC are on the outside looking in.

"We are all about tradition and class". Yep, Head coaches who lie under oath (Tressel at OSU), cheat (Rodriguez at Michigan), Sampson at IU, etc. Half of the Big Ten conference schools have been on probation in the last half dozen years. Several University Presidents fired for incompetence or worse (see Penn State and Illinois). Should I go on? If you think that Big Ten schools have "superior academics" than schools in the "inferior conferences-ACC and Big East" like Duke, Georgetown, Univ. of Virginia, Boston College, Villanova, then you are either very badly misinformed or just plain stupid.
05-08-2012 10:40 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
He1nousOne Offline
The One you Love to Hate.
*

Posts: 13,285
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 215
I Root For: Iowa/ASU
Location: Arizona
Post: #6
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
Ouch Bearcat, a bit harsh on the delivery but valid points.

I really do not think Notre Dame will be joining anyone anytime soon. They are playing everyone as fools currently. They are in no threat of losing credibility as an Indie.

Rutgers is alright I guess but for me I really like Maryland. They won't throw the hierarchy into chaos as far as sports go but they will fit in great with the B1G especially in the research departments. They go along with Penn State perfectly.

If we really ever want Notre Dame, we would have to remove some of the enticements of the ACC and bring them to the B1G. By that I mean Boston College and Syracuse. I no longer believe in Notre Dame being our play but for someone who does, that is where I would look.

That way if we ever move to 16 with new NCAA rules we could then partner Notre Dame with Maryland for those last two spots. That MIGHT work but even then, a lot of Irish folks who really do not like the Big Ten.
05-10-2012 01:04 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


tcufrog86 Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,167
Joined: Nov 2006
Reputation: 101
I Root For: TCU & Wisconsin
Location: Minnesota Uff da
Post: #7
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
Maryland is intriguing to me, they have solid football potential IMO. They state has decent talent and when you throw in the other talent in a 200 mile radius you pick up a lot. I also think they are a good academic mission fit with the B1G.
05-10-2012 01:26 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
joe4psu Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 350
Joined: Oct 2010
Reputation: 23
I Root For: Penn State
Location: Hawk Run, PA
Post: #8
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
(05-10-2012 01:04 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  Ouch Bearcat, a bit harsh on the delivery but valid points.

I really do not think Notre Dame will be joining anyone anytime soon. They are playing everyone as fools currently. They are in no threat of losing credibility as an Indie.

Rutgers is alright I guess but for me I really like Maryland. They won't throw the hierarchy into chaos as far as sports go but they will fit in great with the B1G especially in the research departments. They go along with Penn State perfectly.

If we really ever want Notre Dame, we would have to remove some of the enticements of the ACC and bring them to the B1G. By that I mean Boston College and Syracuse. I no longer believe in Notre Dame being our play but for someone who does, that is where I would look.

That way if we ever move to 16 with new NCAA rules we could then partner Notre Dame with Maryland for those last two spots. That MIGHT work but even then, a lot of Irish folks who really do not like the Big Ten.

Late to respond I know...

Unless the B12 actually peels off a couple of schools I don't think the ACC is vulnerable. UMD will stay for better or worse IMO. Even if FSU and Clemson would leave I don't know if any other schools would blink. And I don't think ND is close to joining a conference. Even if, improbably, the 4x16 conference scenario came to be it would end up being 4x16+1 because no one has the nuts to stand up to ND.

To entice ND and get into NYC as much as possible I'd go with Rutgers. They are a large state university that does a lot of research and is an AAU member. Syracuse has apparently changed their mission because they let there membership in AAU slide. If they want to go back in that direction, or if the B1G wants to add another small private school then I'd go for SU. Having them and RU is definitely the best way to attract any audience in NYC other than adding ND. I would only add BC if ND was joining and that was a requirement. They are a small private school that has a so so history and has never had a big fanbase. They do nothing for the B1G except act as a lure for ND. Another thing about adding ND is that they will throw the balance of the conference off unless another king is added. Who could be added as a counterbalance to ND? Texas? I don't think they're interested in playing up north or being an equal and that is a cultural thing that will not change for a very long time if ever. I'd add RU and SU when the next contract is negotiated. Even if SU only gets the BTN on upstate NY that is what 7 million people? And NJ is huge too. The BTN fees alone should pay for those two and when the next contract is signed the money will be so big that they could probably be added and everyone would make more money without the BTN.
06-02-2012 02:14 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
dbackjon Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 12,006
Joined: May 2010
Reputation: 655
I Root For: NAU/Illini
Location:
Post: #9
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
I don't like conferences bigger than 12 - kind of defeats the purpose of the conference to begin with.

Hope they stay at 12.

But, if they were to expand, my preferences

KU/MU
MD/VA
Rutgers
06-02-2012 09:58 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ClairtonPanther Offline
people need to wake up
*

Posts: 25,056
Joined: Mar 2005
Reputation: 777
I Root For: Pitt/Navy
Location: Portland, Oregon

Donators
Post: #10
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
(06-02-2012 09:58 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  I don't like conferences bigger than 12 - kind of defeats the purpose of the conference to begin with.

Hope they stay at 12.

But, if they were to expand, my preferences

KU/MU
MD/VA
Rutgers

I agree w/ your stance. Other than FCS teams moving up, I'd like to see some relative stability for 15 or so years.
06-02-2012 10:05 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
templefootballfan Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 7,614
Joined: Jan 2005
Reputation: 162
I Root For: TU & BGSU & TEX
Location: CLAYMONT DE Temple T
Post: #11
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
He1, we had dissicion about this topic on another thread
even tough I'm not B-10 fan, I'm CFB & this is my take.
Seems like Syc & Rutgers are front runners here.
Syc is perfect complement to NW, Syc could also play home Games
in Yankee stadium & meadowlands.
NJ is 9 th most populus state, also eastern Pa does not pay premiun rates for BTN.
Rutgers might be able to change that.
Now granted both schools might not be able to deliever NYC.
The NYC market is gonna have to be cultivated to follow CFB.
too many people not to try.
06-05-2012 02:12 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


templefootballfan Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 7,614
Joined: Jan 2005
Reputation: 162
I Root For: TU & BGSU & TEX
Location: CLAYMONT DE Temple T
Post: #12
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
MD does look to be a nice add to B-10.
Wouldn't Va take Wash DC market withthem also.
Va & NC add the 11th & 12th most populus states to the B-10.
that would be 8 of top 12 in the country, that's alot of cable TV

Syc, Rutgers, Va & NC would be top 4 the B-10 goes after.
NC leaves Duke for 10 million a yr in a heartbeat
06-05-2012 02:18 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
nzmorange Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 8,000
Joined: Sep 2012
Reputation: 279
I Root For: UAB
Location:
Post: #13
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
(05-08-2012 08:18 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  Frankly I hope it never changes from the Big Ten. We are about tradition and class. Let's keep it that way. Let the other fools keep changing the name of their conference. When PSU was added to make 11 WAY back in 1990 I am glad they didn't change it. Now on to expansion talk -

This is simple, and really only two schools fit the profile.

1. Notre Dame
2. Rutgers

Why -

1. Markets. Rutgers would add parts of NY that PSU doesn't, and NF would add, well, the entire rest of the country.
2. Academics - both are AAU schools
3. Footprint - ND within...Rutgers not too far away.


ND has NBC now but eventually their hand will be forced, ESPECIALLY if we move towards a 4 team playoff made up of the big 4 conference winners - (pac12, sec, big ten, big 12)

The Big East and ACC are on the outside looking in.

ND isn't in the AAU, and Ru doesn't add anything. Yes, RU is in the NYC area, but RU doesn't have any fans, and that's what really matters. Ask Alabama. They are in the middle of nowhere, but they make a TON of money.
09-10-2012 12:25 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
nzmorange Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 8,000
Joined: Sep 2012
Reputation: 279
I Root For: UAB
Location:
Post: #14
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
(05-08-2012 10:40 PM)vabearcat Wrote:  
(05-08-2012 08:18 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  Frankly I hope it never changes from the Big Ten. We are about tradition and class. Let's keep it that way. Let the other fools keep changing the name of their conference. When PSU was added to make 11 WAY back in 1990 I am glad they didn't change it. Now on to expansion talk -

This is simple, and really only two schools fit the profile.

1. Notre Dame
2. Rutgers

Why -

1. Markets. Rutgers would add parts of NY that PSU doesn't, and NF would add, well, the entire rest of the country.
2. Academics - both are AAU schools
3. Footprint - ND within...Rutgers not too far away.


ND has NBC now but eventually their hand will be forced, ESPECIALLY if we move towards a 4 team playoff made up of the big 4 conference winners - (pac12, sec, big ten, big 12)

The Big East and ACC are on the outside looking in.

"We are all about tradition and class". Yep, Head coaches who lie under oath (Tressel at OSU), cheat (Rodriguez at Michigan), Sampson at IU, etc. Half of the Big Ten conference schools have been on probation in the last half dozen years. Several University Presidents fired for incompetence or worse (see Penn State and Illinois). Should I go on? If you think that Big Ten schools have "superior academics" than schools in the "inferior conferences-ACC and Big East" like Duke, Georgetown, Univ. of Virginia, Boston College, Villanova, then you are either very badly misinformed or just plain stupid.

The ACC has the best academic ranking of any major conference (i.e. every non-Ivy) according to US News. The B1G is number two, though.
09-10-2012 12:27 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
nzmorange Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 8,000
Joined: Sep 2012
Reputation: 279
I Root For: UAB
Location:
Post: #15
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
(06-02-2012 02:14 AM)joe4psu Wrote:  
(05-10-2012 01:04 PM)He1nousOne Wrote:  Ouch Bearcat, a bit harsh on the delivery but valid points.

I really do not think Notre Dame will be joining anyone anytime soon. They are playing everyone as fools currently. They are in no threat of losing credibility as an Indie.

Rutgers is alright I guess but for me I really like Maryland. They won't throw the hierarchy into chaos as far as sports go but they will fit in great with the B1G especially in the research departments. They go along with Penn State perfectly.

If we really ever want Notre Dame, we would have to remove some of the enticements of the ACC and bring them to the B1G. By that I mean Boston College and Syracuse. I no longer believe in Notre Dame being our play but for someone who does, that is where I would look.

That way if we ever move to 16 with new NCAA rules we could then partner Notre Dame with Maryland for those last two spots. That MIGHT work but even then, a lot of Irish folks who really do not like the Big Ten.

Late to respond I know...

Unless the B12 actually peels off a couple of schools I don't think the ACC is vulnerable. UMD will stay for better or worse IMO. Even if FSU and Clemson would leave I don't know if any other schools would blink. And I don't think ND is close to joining a conference. Even if, improbably, the 4x16 conference scenario came to be it would end up being 4x16+1 because no one has the nuts to stand up to ND.

To entice ND and get into NYC as much as possible I'd go with Rutgers. They are a large state university that does a lot of research and is an AAU member. Syracuse has apparently changed their mission because they let there membership in AAU slide. If they want to go back in that direction, or if the B1G wants to add another small private school then I'd go for SU. Having them and RU is definitely the best way to attract any audience in NYC other than adding ND. I would only add BC if ND was joining and that was a requirement. They are a small private school that has a so so history and has never had a big fanbase. They do nothing for the B1G except act as a lure for ND. Another thing about adding ND is that they will throw the balance of the conference off unless another king is added. Who could be added as a counterbalance to ND? Texas? I don't think they're interested in playing up north or being an equal and that is a cultural thing that will not change for a very long time if ever. I'd add RU and SU when the next contract is negotiated. Even if SU only gets the BTN on upstate NY that is what 7 million people? And NJ is huge too. The BTN fees alone should pay for those two and when the next contract is signed the money will be so big that they could probably be added and everyone would make more money without the BTN.

SU focuses on the soft sciences (i.e. social sciences, like political science), whereas the AAU focuses on hard sciences (i.e. biology). Much of the reason why SU left is because SU doesn't have a med school.

However, moving to the ACC might change things at Syracuse. The academics should improve, and the athletics should improve.

In a couple of years, SU will likely be in the 40's academically*, top 20 in football (SU is improving like crazy, and has a history of being good**), top 10 in basketball, and top 1-2 in lax. Combine that with a strong following in NYC***, and a fanatical following in upstate, NY (esp. western NY), and I think that it would be hard to turn down (esp. given its history with PSU). Then again, I went to SU, so I am biased.

*It's currently 62, but last year was an outlier. It had spent the last decade in the mid 50's. I think that SU will cut back on diversity this year, so it will look better on paper (i.e. higher high school gpa's and sat's), and joining the ACC should give it a boost. Combine that with an economy that is starting to favor private schools, and SU should see a 15 point jump over the next couple of years.

**SU is currently ranked #15 in all time wins, and #7 in players in the hall of fame.

***Watch last year's SU v. St. John's game at MSG if you don't believe me

{I'm on a B1G forum, because I went to SU for undergrad, and PSU for grad}
(This post was last modified: 09-10-2012 12:43 AM by nzmorange.)
09-10-2012 12:40 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
DexterDevil Offline
DCTID
*

Posts: 5,008
Joined: Sep 2012
Reputation: 218
I Root For: EMU, DCFC
Location: Jackson, Mi
Post: #16
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
(05-08-2012 10:40 PM)vabearcat Wrote:  
(05-08-2012 08:18 PM)Campaign4Liberty Wrote:  

"We are all about tradition and class". Yep, Head coaches who lie under oath (Tressel at OSU), cheat (Rodriguez at Michigan), Sampson at IU, etc. Half of the Big Ten conference schools have been on probation in the last half dozen years. Several University Presidents fired for incompetence or worse (see Penn State and Illinois). Should I go on? If you think that Big Ten schools have "superior academics" than schools in the "inferior conferences-ACC and Big East" like Duke, Georgetown, Univ. of Virginia, Boston College, Villanova, then you are either very badly misinformed or just plain stupid.

And those head coaches have been fired and completely removed from those respective universities for doing so. It's not their fault someone acts on their own, all of them took responsibility and fired the cheaters. Big Ten also has some of the best Student academic rankings with Michigan, Ohio State, and Penn State, Athletes are a different story however.
09-13-2012 10:54 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


chargeradio Offline
Vamos Morados
*

Posts: 7,466
Joined: Mar 2007
Reputation: 121
I Root For: ALA, KY, USA
Location: Louisville, KY
Post: #17
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
With the ACC having put in a $50 MM exit fee, I think Kansas and Rutgers would be the only reasonable candidates in the foreseeable future. Kansas would be hobbled by the Big 12 Grant of Rights, but at least that has an expiration date.

The SEC has no exit fee, so Missouri could be an option, not that I think the Tigers would move.
09-16-2012 09:24 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
DexterDevil Offline
DCTID
*

Posts: 5,008
Joined: Sep 2012
Reputation: 218
I Root For: EMU, DCFC
Location: Jackson, Mi
Post: #18
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
(09-16-2012 09:24 PM)chargeradio Wrote:  With the ACC having put in a $50 MM exit fee, I think Kansas and Rutgers would be the only reasonable candidates in the foreseeable future. Kansas would be hobbled by the Big 12 Grant of Rights, but at least that has an expiration date.

The SEC has no exit fee, so Missouri could be an option, not that I think the Tigers would move.

I know Louisville's or Cincy's academics don't exactly fit but I'd love to have them in the B1G Ten... They'd finally get some challenging competition and be able to prove they can play with the "B1G" dogs all the time. Besides, I'd love to see Ohio State get beat by Cincy every year.
09-16-2012 10:33 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
He1nousOne Offline
The One you Love to Hate.
*

Posts: 13,285
Joined: Oct 2011
Reputation: 215
I Root For: Iowa/ASU
Location: Arizona
Post: #19
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
So much has now changed. Syracuse or Pitt would have to get an invite ASAP before that exit fee of the ACC kicks in. Any other ACC schools, in my estimation, are for now a no go unless something major happens to cause that 50 mil price tag to go away.

I just do not see expansion in our immediate future anytime soon.

I see no reason to go to 14 because I do not see any new rules coming down the pipeline for new divisions for 16 teams.
09-17-2012 10:09 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ClairtonPanther Offline
people need to wake up
*

Posts: 25,056
Joined: Mar 2005
Reputation: 777
I Root For: Pitt/Navy
Location: Portland, Oregon

Donators
Post: #20
RE: Question about Big Ten expansion.
I honestly think that Realignment for BCS leagues is over for the most part. Well until at least the next round of TV Deals of course. The only move coming is the BE #14 and possible moves within the mid majors after the BE expands.
09-17-2012 12:50 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.