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Poll: Who Would You Like For The 15th and 16th Team
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Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
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Blackhawk-eye Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
I think the B!G made a huge mistake not picking up Mizzou. Missouri and Kansas would bring two solid midwest markets in KC and StL. Fans actually care and show up to their events, residents of their respective states follow them and buy up school gear even if they didn't go to those schools.

Those schools fit the academic profile, fit perfectly in the B1G map and draw a lot of students from the surrounding B1G states.

We'll see if the DC and NYC media markets care about college football as much as the B1G thinks. I think those markets are pro-sports markets first as foremost. Additionally, there are so many more people who went to colleges in the northeast that do not field FBS programs but do play Div 1 basketball. College basketball is big in the northeast, college football . . . not so much.

But since the B1G made its bed out east, they will probably double down. I say UVA and UNC. Noting exciting but may give my Hawkeyes an actual chance to win a darn football game.
01-05-2013 12:27 PM
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AntiG Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
(01-05-2013 12:27 PM)Fireman451 Wrote:  I think the B!G made a huge mistake not picking up Mizzou. Missouri and Kansas would bring two solid midwest markets in KC and StL. Fans actually care and show up to their events, residents of their respective states follow them and buy up school gear even if they didn't go to those schools.

Those schools fit the academic profile, fit perfectly in the B1G map and draw a lot of students from the surrounding B1G states.

We'll see if the DC and NYC media markets care about college football as much as the B1G thinks. I think those markets are pro-sports markets first as foremost. Additionally, there are so many more people who went to colleges in the northeast that do not field FBS programs but do play Div 1 basketball. College basketball is big in the northeast, college football . . . not so much.

But since the B1G made its bed out east, they will probably double down. I say UVA and UNC. Noting exciting but may give my Hawkeyes an actual chance to win a darn football game.

I'll tell you from being a Rutgers guy from NJ and now living in NYC - yes, basketball is king in NYC, but a competitive/winning team makes a big difference.

10 years ago and before NO ONE cared about Rutgers football. Then Schiano took over and the Rutgers leadership started funding the team and boom suddenly we were putting a competitive product on the field. The media started caring and we were all over NYC, NJ and Philly media. People started caring. They started following the games even if they weren't alumni. EVERYONE in Manhattan that were sports fans watched Rutgers beat Louisville and storm the field. EVERYONE. Random friends and colleagues, male and female, knew that Rutgers had been kicking butt nationally and either texted, facebooked or face to face to talk about that game. The Empire State Building was lit up in red. Similarly, when Rutgers choked the past few games and blew the Big East title and Bowl game, I heard about it as well, also from casual, non-Rutgers alum... which means they either were following or watching it. Either way, its a plus.

NYC wants a winning product to follow. People want to root for a college football team if there's one worthy of rooting for. The alumni base will always be fanatics, but the non-alumni are becoming casual fans. You see people wearing Rutgers gear and going to the games now that aren't alumni/students of RU. In New Jersey, the Block R magnets are all over the place in traffic.

If any other media market will have similar mentality, it'll work.
01-05-2013 01:31 PM
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General Mike Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
I voted for Missouri and UNC months ago and still think those are the best choices if you are going to go with a 4 pod system. NC would be a good fit in the eastern pod with Penn State, Rutgers and Maryland and Missouri could slide into a western pod with Nebraska, Iowa and Minnesota. If Missouri is unwilling, Kansas could slide into that same slot and they bring another premier basketball team.

My Pods

West - Nebraska, Iowa, Minnesota, Missouri/ Kansas
North - Michigan, Michigan State, Wisconsin, Northwestern
East - Penn State, Rutgers, Maryland, UNC
"South" - Ohio State, Illinois, Purdue, Indiana
01-05-2013 01:49 PM
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Blackhawk-eye Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
(01-05-2013 01:31 PM)AntiG Wrote:  
(01-05-2013 12:27 PM)Fireman451 Wrote:  I think the B!G made a huge mistake not picking up Mizzou. Missouri and Kansas would bring two solid midwest markets in KC and StL. Fans actually care and show up to their events, residents of their respective states follow them and buy up school gear even if they didn't go to those schools.

Those schools fit the academic profile, fit perfectly in the B1G map and draw a lot of students from the surrounding B1G states.

We'll see if the DC and NYC media markets care about college football as much as the B1G thinks. I think those markets are pro-sports markets first as foremost. Additionally, there are so many more people who went to colleges in the northeast that do not field FBS programs but do play Div 1 basketball. College basketball is big in the northeast, college football . . . not so much.

But since the B1G made its bed out east, they will probably double down. I say UVA and UNC. Noting exciting but may give my Hawkeyes an actual chance to win a darn football game.

I'll tell you from being a Rutgers guy from NJ and now living in NYC - yes, basketball is king in NYC, but a competitive/winning team makes a big difference.

10 years ago and before NO ONE cared about Rutgers football. Then Schiano took over and the Rutgers leadership started funding the team and boom suddenly we were putting a competitive product on the field. The media started caring and we were all over NYC, NJ and Philly media. People started caring. They started following the games even if they weren't alumni. EVERYONE in Manhattan that were sports fans watched Rutgers beat Louisville and storm the field. EVERYONE. Random friends and colleagues, male and female, knew that Rutgers had been kicking butt nationally and either texted, facebooked or face to face to talk about that game. The Empire State Building was lit up in red. Similarly, when Rutgers choked the past few games and blew the Big East title and Bowl game, I heard about it as well, also from casual, non-Rutgers alum... which means they either were following or watching it. Either way, its a plus.

NYC wants a winning product to follow. People want to root for a college football team if there's one worthy of rooting for. The alumni base will always be fanatics, but the non-alumni are becoming casual fans. You see people wearing Rutgers gear and going to the games now that aren't alumni/students of RU. In New Jersey, the Block R magnets are all over the place in traffic.

If any other media market will have similar mentality, it'll work.
I'm familiar with NJ/NY/PA area, i travel there regularly.

NYC, DC and the northeast in general are nothing like B1G Ten country. Rutgers and Maryland fit the academic mold without a doubt, students and alumni will be on par I'm sure. The rest, not so much.

I attend all Iowa home games and on just about every Hawkeyes message board. Nobody is looking forward to football games with the new additions . . . but we all want them in our division! 03-cool

Maybe it will change, we'll see.
01-05-2013 04:57 PM
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Yukon Territory Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
UConn and Kansas
01-23-2013 06:46 PM
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ohio1317 Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
While I don't see expansion again that soon (I think people look for big plans more than they are really there), if we do go to 16, for once in this conference realignment saga, they need to consider the alignment before inviting teams. Regardless of how they invite, they need to fit one of a couple of models.

1. Two 8 team divisions: The conference shouldn't choose this approach and I don't think will. Even with 9 conference games, we'd essentially have 2 separate conferences for football united by a CCG.

2. 4 divisions with semi-finals. This would allow the conference more flexibility in a lot of ways, but I don't see NCAA rules changing soon so don't see this being adopted.

3. 4 pods rotating to form 2 divisions. This is probably what they'll do in order to keep games somewhat regular. There are a few approaches they can take. The big questions with it though are a) 8 or 9 conference games? b) locked crossovers outside of pods or no c) if there are locked crossover outside of the pods, then does everyone have one or is it going to be for just a few and let the rest rotate.

I'm going to assume they go with #3, but their answers to the 3 questions in it, greatly impact how they'd design the pods. I'm guessing they'll go 9 conference games. If they do, the big remaining choice is do they want more balanced pods and to use crossover to keep rivalries (playing non locked teams about 42% of the time) or do they want less balanced pods so they can avoid locked games and play everyone (outside their pod) 50% of the time. If you choose the latter, I think 2 east coast schools are almost required and would give you something like this (just randomly taking Georgia Tech and Virginia since they were the most recent with major rumors):

Pod A: Penn State, Maryland, Georgia Tech, Virginia
Pod B: Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, Rutgers
Pod C: Illinois, Northwestern, Indiana, Purdue
Pod D: Nebraska, Wisconsin, Iowa, Minnesota

In the above set-up, you could get away with no crossovers and you could also leave 2 pods always in opposite divisions if you wanted to (they'd still play everyone those teams 50% of the time, just never in division). The problem would be a very weak pod c.

Alternatively, they could decide they want a lot of competive balance and split up the 4 kings. That would require locked crossovers though.

Pod A: Penn State, Maryland, Rutgers, Virginia
Pod B: Ohio State, Illinois, Northwestern, Missouri
Pod C: Michigan, Michigan State, Indiana, Purdue
Pod D: Nebraska, Iowa, Wisconsin, Iowa

You could switch this up a lot (including the expansion teams) and would assign everyone a crossover they play every year regardless of if they happen to be in division or not that year.
01-24-2013 08:57 PM
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He1nousOne Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
(01-24-2013 08:57 PM)ohio1317 Wrote:  While I don't see expansion again that soon (I think people look for big plans more than they are really there), if we do go to 16, for once in this conference realignment saga, they need to consider the alignment before inviting teams. Regardless of how they invite, they need to fit one of a couple of models.

1. Two 8 team divisions: The conference shouldn't choose this approach and I don't think will. Even with 9 conference games, we'd essentially have 2 separate conferences for football united by a CCG.

2. 4 divisions with semi-finals. This would allow the conference more flexibility in a lot of ways, but I don't see NCAA rules changing soon so don't see this being adopted.

3. 4 pods rotating to form 2 divisions. This is probably what they'll do in order to keep games somewhat regular. There are a few approaches they can take. The big questions with it though are a) 8 or 9 conference games? b) locked crossovers outside of pods or no c) if there are locked crossover outside of the pods, then does everyone have one or is it going to be for just a few and let the rest rotate.

I'm going to assume they go with #3, but their answers to the 3 questions in it, greatly impact how they'd design the pods. I'm guessing they'll go 9 conference games. If they do, the big remaining choice is do they want more balanced pods and to use crossover to keep rivalries (playing non locked teams about 42% of the time) or do they want less balanced pods so they can avoid locked games and play everyone (outside their pod) 50% of the time. If you choose the latter, I think 2 east coast schools are almost required and would give you something like this (just randomly taking Georgia Tech and Virginia since they were the most recent with major rumors):

Pod A: Penn State, Maryland, Georgia Tech, Virginia
Pod B: Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, Rutgers
Pod C: Illinois, Northwestern, Indiana, Purdue
Pod D: Nebraska, Wisconsin, Iowa, Minnesota

In the above set-up, you could get away with no crossovers and you could also leave 2 pods always in opposite divisions if you wanted to (they'd still play everyone those teams 50% of the time, just never in division). The problem would be a very weak pod c.

Alternatively, they could decide they want a lot of competive balance and split up the 4 kings. That would require locked crossovers though.

Pod A: Penn State, Maryland, Rutgers, Virginia
Pod B: Ohio State, Illinois, Northwestern, Missouri
Pod C: Michigan, Michigan State, Indiana, Purdue
Pod D: Nebraska, Iowa, Wisconsin, Iowa

You could switch this up a lot (including the expansion teams) and would assign everyone a crossover they play every year regardless of if they happen to be in division or not that year.


I agree I think #1 is an idea that just doesn't work for the Big Ten, the conference is too homogenous.

In regards to #2 I think the new rules are more ready to be passed than most people realize. Commish Bowlsby really let the cat out of the bag when he complained to CBS about not wanting to see Conference Tournaments be heavily regulated by the NCAA. That means there is a lot of talk going on about those tournaments. That means guidelines and rules are already being talked about and the talk is leaning towards a set up that is heavily regulated much like today's system with defined divisions and method of having a championship.

The conference might only have to play one or two seasons at most with pods in my estimation.

When it comes to those pods set up I think your second setup is the one that they would go with and cross overs would have to be maintained.


The major problem I see right now is that we do not have a very well defined scenario to 16. We may very well see the Big Ten have to go to 20 in order to get the schools that are considered valuable enough for expansion.
01-26-2013 11:38 AM
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Post: #48
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
CINCINNATI
01-27-2013 01:38 PM
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Post: #49
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
Id love Cincy personally but lacks AAU and Ohio $tate are greedy mofos
01-27-2013 04:03 PM
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ohio1317 Offline
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Post: #50
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
(01-27-2013 04:03 PM)DexterDevil Wrote:  Id love Cincy personally but lacks AAU and Ohio $tate are greedy mofos

Ohio State could be 100% the biggest advocates of UC to the Big Ten and it would make zero difference. Every expansion candidate has been about expanding the footprint of the Big Ten or a very large national program. UC has risen from their past, but still doesn't come close to either of those. The Bearcats are making a better case for the Big 12 or ACC eventually, but they'd have as much chance of being taken seriously by the Big Ten as Iowa State or Pitt. They don't add a new market or have other intangibles enough to warrant expansion for.
01-28-2013 09:32 PM
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Blackhawk-eye Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
Mizzou and Kansas.
01-29-2013 04:30 PM
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Post: #52
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
I really believe that Florida State should be given an invitation. The state of Florida has tremendous high school football talent and a large, growing population. Their are oodles of B1G grads living there. I realize that they are not an AAU school. But neither is Notre Dame and Nebraska. As far as I'm concerned, FSU would bring more to the conference than Nebraska has.
01-29-2013 07:50 PM
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brista21 Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
Well maybe Hopkins becomes the first ever associate member in Lacrosse. Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, Maryland, Rutgers and Hopkins gives you a very solid 6 team lacrosse league. It also is big enough for an autobid.
01-30-2013 01:12 PM
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AtlanticLeague Offline
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Post: #54
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
(01-30-2013 01:12 PM)brista21 Wrote:  Well maybe Hopkins becomes the first ever associate member in Lacrosse. Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, Maryland, Rutgers and Hopkins gives you a very solid 6 team lacrosse league. It also is big enough for an autobid.

That lacrosse lineup isn't as solid as you may think, especially compared with the ACC.
01-30-2013 02:26 PM
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brista21 Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
(01-30-2013 02:26 PM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  
(01-30-2013 01:12 PM)brista21 Wrote:  Well maybe Hopkins becomes the first ever associate member in Lacrosse. Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, Maryland, Rutgers and Hopkins gives you a very solid 6 team lacrosse league. It also is big enough for an autobid.

That lacrosse lineup isn't as solid as you may think, especially compared with the ACC.

Sure compared to the ACC's Duke, UVA, Syracuse, UNC 4 pack. But in terms of other leagues its as good or better than any of the others.
01-30-2013 05:49 PM
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templefootballfan Offline
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Post: #56
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
Missouri, Syc, Rutgers, UVA & UNC are they 5 I would have took.
Deleney already made 2 mistakes.
I would have took Neb & MD after UVA & UNC said no way.
01-31-2013 12:38 AM
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He1nousOne Offline
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Post: #57
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
(01-30-2013 02:26 PM)AtlanticLeague Wrote:  
(01-30-2013 01:12 PM)brista21 Wrote:  Well maybe Hopkins becomes the first ever associate member in Lacrosse. Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, Maryland, Rutgers and Hopkins gives you a very solid 6 team lacrosse league. It also is big enough for an autobid.

That lacrosse lineup isn't as solid as you may think, especially compared with the ACC.

No but having Hopkins in the CiC makes it pretty damn sexy to schools like UVA and UNC.

Imagine that collection of elitists all sitting around together? It is an absolutely great move for those institutions and if UVA and UNC jump on board then that lacrosse league IS that damn good. Throw in Duke too? Of course! How does GT do at lacrosse? Who cares, let's take them too.
01-31-2013 09:39 PM
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Post: #58
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
Bearcats of Cincinnati! So close to being AAU already! Protects the Ohio southern Indiana and Northern Ky area from others and a huge growing TV market. 1 billion dollar endowment, top 25 campus in world. Access anytime it need PBS stadium for large games. Perfect geography for Big! Oh yes and a top 25 Football and Basketball team where are you going to find that! Only 6 schools in nation last year and we are doing it back to back! If you do not want us please help us get into the ACC ar Big 12 we have done nothing but win and improve since the BCS gave us a chance!
02-01-2013 01:37 PM
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brista21 Offline
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Post: #59
RE: Who SHOULD Be 15 & 16?
As much as I love Cincy and I do, the reality is the Big Ten isn't going to pickup another school inside its own existing 11-state footprint unless that school is Notre Dame. I think Cincy and the ACC would make a great fit. It would also make that conference contiguous again, albeit in a roundabout way.
02-02-2013 06:43 AM
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