Who was the last MAC player to be drafted? Serious question, not trying to be a D.

(12-06-2012 04:31 PM)EagleSam Wrote:  Who was the last MAC player to be drafted? Serious question, not trying to be a D.

I believe it was Kaman from CMU

Wow it's been that long?

We shouldn't be surprised, considering...

A) There are TONS of really good college basketball players.
B) There are only 60 players drafted every year.

Throw in European players, and you have many talented seniors (and declared underclassmen) going undrafted. That makes it even more difficult for mid majors to get looks.

I would imagine someone gets drafted this year. Zeke is probably a lock and if Cooper or Offutt go off come tourney time I think they get picked as well despite their size. A couple darkhorses as well..

(12-06-2012 07:25 PM)The Optimist Wrote:  I would imagine someone gets drafted this year. Zeke is probably a lock and if Cooper or Offutt go off come tourney time I think they get picked as well despite their size. A couple darkhorses as well..

Zeke won't get drafted even with his height. His attitude sucks and people know that.
If you have to rely on getting hot at the end of a season to sniff getting drafted, enjoy your time in the NBA D-league and best pray you have a legit degree in something.

Zeke has an outside shot if he has a great season, but it doesn't look like he will. Cooper and Offaut? No. The draft is shorter than you think. There are no MAC players on the NBA radar, and that's being generous. A good number can play in Europe.

Offut? No chance. Cooper? Very doubtful. Big guy from Akron? Well, he's big, but he's certainly no Kaman.

I agree 100 percent with everybody who said, it's all about the money. The fact that the MAC continues to get better in football, while getting worse in basketball (at least compared to 1990s-early 2000s levels) is all the proof you need.

Across the board, MAC schools are spending more on football, and the results are 7 bowl teams. At the same time, there are only a handful of MAC schools doing the same in basketball, and the two on the top of that list, Akron and Ohio, just happen to be the two "Marquee" schools in the league right now. And even in Akron's case in football, the results can't be due to not investing in the sport (no MAC school has invested more in the sport in the last 10 years ... it's just poor use of that money).

Look at Kent State as more proof of how money reflects which way a the typical MAC program goes. While Kent is still a solid basketball program, it is not close to where it was 4-5 years ago. That is because the school has started to direct more athletic funds toward the football program (and obviously that has led to meteoric success there, but at the expense of the basketball program.)

Back to hoops, somebody brought up Akron disappointing the league early, I got to respond to that. No way has Akron "disappointed". Sure, there was the loss at Coastal Carolina, but it was literally hours before tip-off did the school learn that two of its top 6 players (Demetrius Treadwell and Nick Harney) were suspended for the first three games. Still, Akron should've won that game, but losing on the road in OT, isn't that bad when you consider the circumstances.

Treadwell and Harney also didn't play against Oklahoma State (another OT loss ... on a nuetral court). Even without those two, that was a game Akron still would've won in regulation had Zeke Marshall hit a foul shot in the final minute. Ohio fans, rightfully, want to talk about how close they were to the Elite 8 if they hit a foul shot against North Carolina. Akron was just as close to moving on in Puerto Rico (while not an NCAA field overall, still a field almost just as strong as what you would see in the first three rounds of the NCAA). Instead Oklahoma State, a team still ranked in the top 25, snuck out an OT win and then went on to blast both Tennessee and North Carolina State to win the tourney. Akron had to go to the consolation round where they blasted UNC-Asheville and Penn State by 20 points each (both games Akron led by 25-plus late).

Of course, it's if, what and buts, but logic seems to point to Akron having a legit shot against both Tennessee and North Carolina State if they would have been playing at full-strength against Oklahoma State. (the Treadwell and Harney suspensions were over after that Oklahoma State game).

If not for a "BS" suspension (due to a clerical error), this thread isn't "what has gone wrong with MAC hoops", but is rather "Why can't the rest of the MAC do what Akron is doing." When Akron had potential wins against Oklahoma State, Tennessee, North Carolina State and Middle Tennessee State.

Ohio fans would probably be touting their Sweet 16 run and returning everybody off that team as proof that Akron isn't running away from the league (and they would be correct). But that still would be the only school whose fans have any argument. ... Why? Because Ohio and Akron are the two schools in this league that are the most serious about enhancing their hoops programs.

Until others step up, the MAC in basketball is Akron, Ohio and then everybody else. Hopefully some of this additional bowl money the league members will receive in football, will be rediverted to men's basketball.

(12-07-2012 03:56 AM)Wadszip Wrote:  I agree 100 percent with everybody who said, it's all about the money. The fact that the MAC continues to get better in football, while getting worse in basketball (at least compared to 1990s-early 2000s levels) is all the proof you need.

Across the board, MAC schools are spending more on football, and the results are 7 bowl teams. At the same time, there are only a handful of MAC schools doing the same in basketball, and the two on the top of that list, Akron and Ohio, just happen to be the two "Marquee" schools in the league right now. And even in Akron's case in football, the results can't be due to not investing in the sport (no MAC school has invested more in the sport in the last 10 years ... it's just poor use of that money).

Look at Kent State as more proof of how money reflects which way a the typical MAC program goes. While Kent is still a solid basketball program, it is not close to where it was 4-5 years ago. That is because the school has started to direct more athletic funds toward the football program (and obviously that has led to meteoric success there, but at the expense of the basketball program.)

Can someone put up some verified numbers? What changes in budgeting are we talking about here?

Just Seniors...
http://www.draftexpress.com/rankings/NCAA-Seniors/

My God, we are bragging about "potential wins" in games already lost. That's all you need to know about the state of the MAC this year. That's the point--the top of the MAC is not doing much. How is the MAC better this year than its been? It isn't, despite some pre-season expectations.

KSU not being a top team this year has absolutely nothing to do with the football and basketball budgets and everything to do with graduation of 2/3 of the team. There is so little experience on the floor this season, it will be a very up and down year. If KSU is better next year, it won't be because the budget has changed no more than this year can be seen as the fault of the budget.

I agree that Akron and Ohio will be the best two teams in the MAC for this season, but that may be damning with faint praise. They look like the best MAC teams do most years: outside the bubble. If Akron wants to be considered a good team beyond just good relative to the MAC, they have to start winning games against tough competition, maybe even winning an NCAA tourney game sometime in Dambrot's tenure. Who is left on the schedule OOC? Creighton? Must win. There is not a resume win left OOC. So come March, no matter how good Akron or Ohio look compared to the rest of what looks to be a very weak MAC, what do you have? How is this season different from any other season in the last 8 years? Our bad teams are bad and our good teams are not all that good compared to our mid-major peers.

Ohio has committed solid cash to basketball recently, although it really came after our success I believe.

(12-07-2012 07:50 AM)axeme Wrote:  come March, no matter how good Akron or Ohio look compared to the rest of what looks to be a very weak MAC, what do you have? How is this season different from any other season in the last 8 years? Our bad teams are bad and our good teams are not all that good compared to our mid-major peers.

What? How many of our mid-major peers have won multiple tournament games the last 3 years?

(12-07-2012 07:47 AM)The Optimist Wrote:  Just Seniors...
http://www.draftexpress.com/rankings/NCAA-Seniors/

That pretty much proves the point that no MAC player is likely to get drafted. Last year there were only 22 seniors selected in the 60 player NBA draft.

Zeke in the 30's still has that outside shot. Cooper in the 70's is obviously well outside the draft. He'd be outside the draft even if ONLY seniors were taken.

Marshall is the fifth best senior center? Does not bode well for being drafted.

(12-07-2012 09:30 AM)H2Oville Rocket Wrote:  Marshall is the fifth best senior center? Does not bode well for being drafted.

I don't know. My eyes tell me there is no way he gets drafted.

My mind starts thinking about the poo poo platter some NBA team will be signing up for if they take Derrick Nix (who is ranked 1 spot ahead of Marshall), and I come to the conclusion that an NBA team might just take a risk on Marshall simply because the guys in front of him stink too. You can't teach 7' tall and coordinated.

I mean seriously, if you are an NBA GM and you have a pick in the 50's and you need a backup Center and your choices are Nix or Marshall...what would you do?

I'm a big fan of DJ Cooper. Any school in the MAC would KILL for a kid like that, who shines on the big stage. I just can't see him in the NBA. If he went to Europe for a couple years and worked on his shot, then he'd have a chance, but streaky 5'11 point guards better have Will Bynum's athleticism if they want to survive in the big leagues.

I thought of Cooper when I was watching Michael Carter-Williams and Syracuse dismantle EMU. Oddly enough, they are similar players...fast (Cooper is faster), playmaking PGs who defend with quick hands, are inconsistent with their outside shooting, but can get to the lane and finish despite having only respectable athleticism. The difference: Carter-Williams is 6'6. That's the crazy state of basketball; so many REALLY good basketball players have trouble even sniffing the NBA. I'm sure we can assemble a hell of a good team of former MAC players who never even got a look in the big show. So much talent, yet so few roster spots.

The MAC doesn't recruit NBA draft players. The NBA drafts a lot of elite level underclassmen and some internationals. The Sr's that do get picked seem to be more likely to come from bigger conferences. Maybe that's because they get seen more because they're scouted along with the **** and ***** Freshman and Sophmores. Mateen Cleaves and Ty Lawson were first round picks asupperclassmen from elite programs. I think Cooper as every bit as good as them, but they got bonus points for the name on the front of the uniform.

The NBA is a curious league...it seems like the worst thing a player can do is give a clear impression of what his ceiling might be.

i'm not into the NBA at all so i couldn't care less if anyone from Ohio or anywhere else in the MAC gets drafted or not. but people are saying DJ is too short to play in the NBA, right? what about that one guy from Eastern Michigan who played in the 1990s. I don't remember his name but i remember our fans used to call him Webster. he got drafted, right?

Earl Boykins went undrafted. He and Cooper are pretty different players, though. Earl was a scoring machine. He had a career in the NBA because he could provide an offensive spark off the bench and knock down shots. Cooper is more of a complete PG, but not necessarily great enough at any one trait to find a niche in the 'league'. If he can go overseas and work on his jumper, he'd have a chance.

(12-07-2012 07:50 AM)axeme Wrote:  My God, we are bragging about "potential wins" in games already lost. That's all you need to know about the state of the MAC this year. That's the point--the top of the MAC is not doing much. How is the MAC better this year than its been? It isn't, despite some pre-season expectations.

KSU not being a top team this year has absolutely nothing to do with the football and basketball budgets and everything to do with graduation of 2/3 of the team. There is so little experience on the floor this season, it will be a very up and down year. If KSU is better next year, it won't be because the budget has changed no more than this year can be seen as the fault of the budget.

I agree that Akron and Ohio will be the best two teams in the MAC for this season, but that may be damning with faint praise. They look like the best MAC teams do most years: outside the bubble. If Akron wants to be considered a good team beyond just good relative to the MAC, they have to start winning games against tough competition, maybe even winning an NCAA tourney game sometime in Dambrot's tenure. Who is left on the schedule OOC? Creighton? Must win. There is not a resume win left OOC. So come March, no matter how good Akron or Ohio look compared to the rest of what looks to be a very weak MAC, what do you have? How is this season different from any other season in the last 8 years? Our bad teams are bad and our good teams are not all that good compared to our mid-major peers.

I agree. I don't think Kent's budget was big even at our best and I think it is has not really diminished. It has not gone up of course but big budgets has never been Kent's way.