Now that the sausage-making process has, by necessity, been exposed to public eyes, I hope you can objectively understand that THIS is why so many people think the schools still planning and hoping to be part of the A-12 are following through on monumentally terrible decisions. For very little gains they are jumping into a flaming, quicksand, acid, alligator, shark pit...and doing so, still, with eyes, ears, and mouths covered. I'm trying to think of more insulting ways Marinatto, Aresco, and the ever-changing cast of your potential new all-sports home could have exploited you with hollow promises, shifting goalposts, and straight-out lies by omission (does anyone still honestly dispute that the C7 were on their way out the door as far back as 2011), but it's actually quite difficult...which is frightening.

What has been going on this calendar year, and is only escalating at this point, is not the exception as to how this conference, and quite clearly the one intended to follow, operates. The seeds being sown now will tear the new entity apart just as those sown at the beginning of the Cartel and during the '06 realignment did the old BE. Hence, why there will eventually be a Western group and Eastern group...do it now and save a potentially crippling amount of money, or do it later when your schools still haven't broken even - in real terms - on the net negative this move would be...either on 2013-14 or 2014-15 budgets.

The only possibly positive development from this week is a tick up in the possibility that Tulsa will sign on, and that would at least save the rest of the planned newcomers from being the dumbest rock in the quarry.

still doesn't matter- UAB wouldn't be in EITHER conference.

Regardless of how bad the situation in the A12 is or becomes, for the old CUSA schools it is a matter of avoiding their athletic programs losing ground. To stay where they were is a downgrade, to move to the A12 is an upgrade or at the least a maintaining of where they are. Just because there are no really good options doesn't mean the best option is to do nothing. You have to take the best bad option.

(03-08-2013 10:27 AM)lazydawg58 Wrote:  Regardless of how bad the situation in the A12 is or becomes, for the old CUSA schools it is a matter of avoiding their athletic programs losing ground. To stay where they were is a downgrade, to move to the A12 is an upgrade or at the least a maintaining of where they are. Just because there are no really good options doesn't mean the best option is to do nothing. You have to take the best bad option.

This. When faced with two bad choices, we chose the lesser wrong.

I don't know if ECU made a good choice or not, but what I do know is some 18-20 team "eastern" league isn't a good choice. There wasn't enough money to make the merger work or to make the coast to coast Big East work yet a collection of quite frankly much worse schools is going to make enough money to be viable? I don't see how.

(03-08-2013 10:20 AM)blazr Wrote:  ... and that would at least save the rest of the planned newcomers from being the dumbest rock in the quarry.

The only dumb decision would have been staying tied to the hip with UAB.

The problem is that the schools that will be asked to move up from the A-12 in the future (as a result of moves made by power 5 conferences) can't do that for 2013. There has to be the conference for at least one year. The A-12 is a doomed venture from the beginning and I think everyone involved has come to that realization. That's why the leftovers from the BE are making every effort to keep as much of the war chest as they can and the invitees are making every effort to get as big a share of that cash as they can. They both know that the A-12 future is not bright.

(03-08-2013 10:27 AM)lazydawg58 Wrote:  Regardless of how bad the situation in the A12 is or becomes, for the old CUSA schools it is a matter of avoiding their athletic programs losing ground. To stay where they were is a downgrade, to move to the A12 is an upgrade or at the least a maintaining of where they are. Just because there are no really good options doesn't mean the best option is to do nothing. You have to take the best bad option.

I really mean no offense to the old C-USA schools remaining, but if Tulsa is added, then I can't see how I as a UCF fan cannot see this as an upgrade. Aside from Southern Miss, the teams I looked forward to playing the most are coming with us...

ECU - My personal favorite C-USA rivalry
Tulsa - Played in multiple C-USA championship games against them. Finished top 25 in Coaches Poll this last season.
Houston - Had some great games against. Been in the top 25 in recent years.
SMU - Played in C-USA Championship game against them.

We are replacing teams that I feel we had no real rivalry with or connection to (UAB, Rice, UTEP, Marshall) with these guys:

USF - Added in the rival that UCF fans always wanted to see
UC - Successful Top 25 program
UConn - Excellent basketball, went to BCS in 2010.
Navy - I honestly cannot wait to see Navy lined up on the other side of the football field. If UCF plays in Annapolis, then I am making that trip!

If they negotiate waiving the entrance fees and paying off the C-USA exit fees, then I don't see how I as a fan can look at the run-down and come away feeling sorry for myself aside from losing Southern Miss (which I am actually bummed about).

Make no mistake. The A-12, Metro (or whatever the final nomenclature is) is still > CUSA. CUSA really made a mess with the additions they made, otherwise a merger of some degree could have been considered.

(03-08-2013 11:29 AM)LSUtah Wrote:  Make no mistake. The A-12, Metro (or whatever the final nomenclature is) is still > CUSA. CUSA really made a mess with the additions they made, otherwise a merger of some degree could have been considered.

If C-USA had done what the MWC did and back filled minimally, like after the first 4 left add only 2 teams (my choices would have been La Tech and MTSU) and then after ECU and Tulane left added either 2 more or no one right away they'd be in position to make a really compelling case to get everyone to come back to C-USA right now.

(03-08-2013 11:40 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(03-08-2013 11:29 AM)LSUtah Wrote:  Make no mistake. The A-12, Metro (or whatever the final nomenclature is) is still > CUSA. CUSA really made a mess with the additions they made, otherwise a merger of some degree could have been considered.

If C-USA had done what the MWC did and back filled minimally, like after the first 4 left add only 2 teams (my choices would have been La Tech and MTSU) and then after ECU and Tulane left added either 2 more or no one right away they'd be in position to make a really compelling case to get everyone to come back to C-USA right now.

Yup. It would have been a viable possibility. If Im reading his concept right (which is difficult because his posts are more cyrptic than a Masons treasure map written on the back of the Constitution)---then for Blazer predicted future to happen, CUSA has to split into western and eastern confereneces.

(03-08-2013 11:40 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(03-08-2013 11:29 AM)LSUtah Wrote:  Make no mistake. The A-12, Metro (or whatever the final nomenclature is) is still > CUSA. CUSA really made a mess with the additions they made, otherwise a merger of some degree could have been considered.

If C-USA had done what the MWC did and back filled minimally, like after the first 4 left add only 2 teams (my choices would have been La Tech and MTSU) and then after ECU and Tulane left added either 2 more or no one right away they'd be in position to make a really compelling case to get everyone to come back to C-USA right now.

The "problem" with that logic, look where we are with the calendar. C-USA HAD to add at least 4 teams for play in 2013-14 and so they had to do that expansion. Don't think they had to go to 6 more but that is what it is. If they had just added only 4 teams(to keep 12 for the CCG), they would absolutely have been more viable as a fallback option(threat)

(03-08-2013 10:20 AM)blazr Wrote:  Now that the sausage-making process has, by necessity, been exposed to public eyes, I hope you can objectively understand that THIS is why so many people think the schools still planning and hoping to be part of the A-12 are following through on monumentally terrible decisions. For very little gains they are jumping into a flaming, quicksand, acid, alligator, shark pit...and doing so, still, with eyes, ears, and mouths covered. I'm trying to think of more insulting ways Marinatto, Aresco, and the ever-changing cast of your potential new all-sports home could have exploited you with hollow promises, shifting goalposts, and straight-out lies by omission (does anyone still honestly dispute that the C7 were on their way out the door as far back as 2011), but it's actually quite difficult...which is frightening.

What has been going on this calendar year, and is only escalating at this point, is not the exception as to how this conference, and quite clearly the one intended to follow, operates. The seeds being sown now will tear the new entity apart just as those sown at the beginning of the Cartel and during the '06 realignment did the old BE. Hence, why there will eventually be a Western group and Eastern group...do it now and save a potentially crippling amount of money, or do it later when your schools still haven't broken even - in real terms - on the net negative this move would be...either on 2013-14 or 2014-15 budgets.

The only possibly positive development from this week is a tick up in the possibility that Tulsa will sign on, and that would at least save the rest of the planned newcomers from being the dumbest rock in the quarry.

Funny thing is, as disfunctional as the conference is, UAB would join in a second if asked.

going to the A-12/Metro/whatever conference is still a LOT better of a choice than staying with CUSA aka Sunbelt redux, and makes more money than the MWC. In the end its in their best interests because no one else wants them.

(03-08-2013 10:22 AM)stever20 Wrote:  still doesn't matter- UAB wouldn't be in EITHER conference.

Damn.

(03-08-2013 11:48 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(03-08-2013 11:40 AM)b0ndsj0ns Wrote:  

(03-08-2013 11:29 AM)LSUtah Wrote:  Make no mistake. The A-12, Metro (or whatever the final nomenclature is) is still > CUSA. CUSA really made a mess with the additions they made, otherwise a merger of some degree could have been considered.

If C-USA had done what the MWC did and back filled minimally, like after the first 4 left add only 2 teams (my choices would have been La Tech and MTSU) and then after ECU and Tulane left added either 2 more or no one right away they'd be in position to make a really compelling case to get everyone to come back to C-USA right now.

Yup. It would have been a viable possibility. If Im reading his concept right (which is difficult because his posts are more cyrptic than a Masons treasure map written on the back of the Constitution)---then for Blazer predicted future to happen, CUSA has to split into western and eastern confereneces.

He predicted that the CUSA schools that left for the BE, would be sorry because the BE would not retain the automatic bid to the NCAA basketball tournament after the BE basketball schools shut down the conference. And on top of that the NCAA was supposedly not going to issue any more automatic bids; so those bunch of bastard CUSA schools that had the nerve to leave UAB would be sorry that they ever considered it.

Well, the BE basketball schools left. The conference did not shut down. The NCAA must have issued somebody a new automatic bid, because the A12 and the BE will both have one. UAB has been conference corrected; and the Sun still comes up in the East.

(03-08-2013 12:20 PM)blunderbuss Wrote:  

(03-08-2013 10:22 AM)stever20 Wrote:  still doesn't matter- UAB wouldn't be in EITHER conference.

Damn.

am I wrong?

West:
Tulane, La Tech, So Miss, SMU, Houston, Tulsa, Arkansas St, UTSA, UTEP, Rice- right there is 10
East:
UCF, USF, FAU, FIU, ECU, ODU, Charlotte, Temple, Marshall, Cincy, UConn. Right there is 11. Add UMass for 12.

blazr's "western group" is the MWC. His "Eastern group" is some hodge-podge of the A12/nBE fallout + select members from CUSA. I have no idea how the pieces are supposed to come together after that and whether it's one league or a scheduling / TV deal Alliance or what. None of it makes a lot of sense to me to be honest.

Maybe this is more fantasy. I'd certainly be hoping for the A12 to fail miserably if I'm Marshall, UAB or USM. There is literally NOTHING attractive about CUSA for me personally at this point, sans USM.

Bottom line is that if Tulsa chooses to join, it should tell us a lot about where we really are regarding fantasy and reality.

(03-08-2013 11:29 AM)LSUtah Wrote:  Make no mistake. The A-12, Metro (or whatever the final nomenclature is) is still > CUSA. CUSA really made a mess with the additions they made, otherwise a merger of some degree could have been considered.

Very true... the additions were made by our commissioner in an attempt to protect his own inflated salary.

After they finish killing USM, maybe I'll pull for LSU.

I'm in Atlanta. I will miss UAB. I loved driving to B-ham eating great Bar B que and sitting in a legendary stadium. Best wishes to UAB going forward.