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TheDancinMonarch Offline
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Post: #41
RE: 2014 Basketball Recruits
(01-02-2014 02:16 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  The people who I would say accept mediocrity are not those who realize that there is a problem, but continue to go to the games and cheer for the team. Hell, I am one of those. Those who accept mediocrity are the ones who continually make excuses as to why the program is where is it is. The people who say things like, "our program just isn't that good", and "we need to give the coach 5 years because he needs time to create relationships", or best of all, those who say "we may suck, but we have already won more games than last year." Those are the people who are accepting mediocrity. They are probably also the same people that are lining up to kiss the collective asses of JJ and Wood to tell the how much they love being invited to functions where they interact with them so that they can tell them how lucky we are to have such wonderful stewards for this crappy little insignificant university that happens to be located in one of the worst slums that The United States has to offer.

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(This post was last modified: 01-02-2014 03:47 PM by TheDancinMonarch.)
01-02-2014 02:52 PM
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ODUBB35 Offline
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Post: #42
RE: 2014 Basketball Recruits
I hate to be a thread purist, but is it possible to relocate the BT, Wood, JJ talk so that we can actually talk about 2014 recruiting news here (assuming that there will eventually be some).
01-02-2014 02:57 PM
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monarx Offline
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Post: #43
RE: 2014 Basketball Recruits
(01-02-2014 02:48 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  
(01-02-2014 02:42 PM)Quagmire Wrote:  I support football because I feel like my hard earned dollar is appreciated and I am rewarded by a fun entertaining product. I think that is the unspoken deal we make with the university with these donations.

The men's basketball program is clearly just going through the motions. This includes on (Wins/losses/style)and off (dreadful atmosphere/ticketing/media) the court and therefore they are not owning up to this "unspoken" deal.

In the end, someone of great $$ influence is going to have to walk straight up to Broderick say "I've had enough".

Well football is likely to tank after next season after Heinicke graduates. Defense isn't getting any better and we already see holes opening in Wilder's offensive system at the FBS level with our recruits. That just might be the first domino to the collapse of Wood's empire.

I disagree about football. Wilder has 3 awesome QB recruits who should be able to fill Taylor's shoes pretty well. He also has the second best recruiting class in CUSA and ODUs best ever coming in next season. Yes, the defense is very suspect still, but I dont see football tanking anytime soon. You could see basketball was going to tank three years ago unless something drastic happened. Football looks good for the foreseeable future IMO assuming the D improves.
01-02-2014 03:03 PM
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Monarchblue Offline
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Post: #44
RE: 2014 Basketball Recruits
(01-02-2014 02:52 PM)ODUDon Wrote:  
(01-02-2014 02:16 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  They are probably also the same people that are lining up to kiss the collective asses of JJ and Wood to tell the how much they love being invited to functions where they interact with them so that they can tell them how lucky we are to have such wonderful stewards for this crappy little insignificant university that happens to be located in one of the worst slums that The United States has to offer.

Get out much? What a completely uninformed comment.
My God people do I HAVE to use the stupid little sarcasm alert everytime?
How is it not obvious? I was referring, using hyperbole, to statements made by OTHER posters as attempts to make excuses for why JJ can't seem to recruit.

Let me be clear. I love Norfolk. I choose to live in Norfolk. I love ODU. I chose to attend ODU. I attend every basketball and football game because I love ODU. 03-banghead
(This post was last modified: 01-02-2014 03:07 PM by Monarchblue.)
01-02-2014 03:07 PM
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EverRespect Offline
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Post: #45
RE: 2014 Basketball Recruits
(01-02-2014 03:03 PM)monarx Wrote:  
(01-02-2014 02:48 PM)EverRespect Wrote:  
(01-02-2014 02:42 PM)Quagmire Wrote:  I support football because I feel like my hard earned dollar is appreciated and I am rewarded by a fun entertaining product. I think that is the unspoken deal we make with the university with these donations.

The men's basketball program is clearly just going through the motions. This includes on (Wins/losses/style)and off (dreadful atmosphere/ticketing/media) the court and therefore they are not owning up to this "unspoken" deal.

In the end, someone of great $$ influence is going to have to walk straight up to Broderick say "I've had enough".

Well football is likely to tank after next season after Heinicke graduates. Defense isn't getting any better and we already see holes opening in Wilder's offensive system at the FBS level with our recruits. That just might be the first domino to the collapse of Wood's empire.

I disagree about football. Wilder has 3 awesome QB recruits who should be able to fill Taylor's shoes pretty well. He also has the second best recruiting class in CUSA and ODUs best ever coming in next season. Yes, the defense is very suspect still, but I dont see football tanking anytime soon. You could see basketball was going to tank three years ago unless something drastic happened. Football looks good for the foreseeable future IMO assuming the D improves.

I hope you are right and I am wrong, but there are 4 games we would have lost this year if TH wasn't in the backfield IMO (NSU, LU, Idaho, Citadel). That is how close we are to being a 4-8 team. I see it coming and it reminds me of that 2011-2012 basketball team that was so so, didn't beat anyone good, and won most of their games by razor thin margins. The wheels fell off after Baze, who single handedly helped mask the problems, graduated.

Washington isn't going to cut it and I'll believe McCarley and Bentley are as good as TH when I see it. Once TH graduates, the D is going to have to be competitive (be able to hold teams to 20 points) or we are going to go 1-11.
(This post was last modified: 01-02-2014 03:13 PM by EverRespect.)
01-02-2014 03:11 PM
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DaBigBlue Offline
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Post: #46
RE: 2014 Basketball Recruits
There are very few fans on here that support the team better than ODU Coach. He also knows more about what's going on at ODU, than most. He does a good job of separating his job and being a fan. But I take his word over anyone posting in this tread. With ODAF kicking in the money for the practice gym, and the added travel cost of moving from a bus league. I would find it hard to beleive ODU is spending less on basketball, maybe on the coaching staff, but not overall.

JJ is at 500K, +bonuses (don't have to worry about them this year) and BT was 750K in 2011 with his bonuses. With $200K how many trips to Texas does that get you.
01-02-2014 03:25 PM
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Monarchblue Offline
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Post: #47
RE: 2014 Basketball Recruits
If we couldn't afford to move up and be competitive then we should not have moved up. I suspect that is NOT the case. Just to put coaching salaries into perspective. VCU is paying their coach more that we are pay our Football, Men's, and Women's basketball coaches combined. They are also building a practice facility that costs more than twice as much as ours. Pretty easy to see who is committed to success.
(This post was last modified: 01-02-2014 03:38 PM by Monarchblue.)
01-02-2014 03:36 PM
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DaBigBlue Offline
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Post: #48
RE: 2014 Basketball Recruits
Are they building a $100mil football stadium on the river? We are heading in a different direction than VCU, they are all in on MBB having to raise their student fees to pay Smart. We sold $2mil more in tickets to sporting events than VCU did and have an athletic budget that is 50% higher (+$10mil), we aren't exactly the poor school that no one supports.
(This post was last modified: 01-02-2014 04:00 PM by DaBigBlue.)
01-02-2014 03:59 PM
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Old Dominion Navy Offline
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Post: #49
RE: 2014 Basketball Recruits
(01-02-2014 01:49 PM)84Monarch Wrote:  Ever, you hit the nail exactly on the head. The Blue Barons of the world are not the ones who can effect change on the program.
While Razor made some excellent points, I think there are those of us who are trying to see the glass half full because half empty just tastes bad and raging about it does not do anyone any good. I am willing to give Jones his shot, because I have little chance of impacting his length of stay in ODU blue. Am I going to continue to purchase tickets and go to the games? Yes. Does that mean I am settling for mediocrity, maybe for some the answer is yes, but I don't see it that way. My allegiance is to Old Dominion University and I support the athletic teams they put on the field. Period. Do I hope and pray we get better players and get back the NCAA in order to make s splash - ABSOLUTELY. But until then I am going to support the coaches and players we have because like them or not they represent ODU.

As for keeping top players at home. My tenure as a fan goes back to being a kid watching Wilson Washington and Dave Twardzik play, so I have seen my fair share of ODU games and players. Honestly, it is wasted energy to rail about keeping the top recruits at home. Kids like McAdoo, Finney-Smith are going to the ACC schools if they come calling. The ACC is viewed as the cream of the crop, the standard by which college basketball is measured. Why wouldn't a kid want to take a shot against the best. I am pretty sure not all of Richmond's best players are going to VCU. I would bet quite a bit of money that if NC State or MIAMI came and put the recruiting blast on a kid along side VCU, that kid would probably go to the ACC. Bigger stages, pretty much guaranteed NCAA or post season appearances, a chance to play against pros in the off season. I could go on. But beyond that going away to college and getting away from home is attractive to most kids. How is the local school going to compete against that sentiment?

Am I niave maybe, but I am a Monarch and will support whoever is hired because they represent my university. Will I voice my displeasure to the appropriate officials, yes and I have, but at the end of the day I will support them because they came into the Monarch family. I will also give the coaches time to get the job done or prove they cannot do it with the resources we have to offer. In my opinion the jury is still out regarding Jeff Jones.

(01-02-2014 03:36 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  If we couldn't afford to move up and be competitive then we should not have moved up. I suspect that is NOT the case. Just to put coaching salaries into perspective. VCU is paying their coach more that we are pay our Football, Men's, and Women's basketball coaches combined. They are also building a practice facility that costs more than twice as much as ours. Pretty easy to see who is committed to success.

First - when you get to be Cinderella for a year your coaches name comes up for every big coaching vacancy so of course he is going to get a boatload of money thrown at him to stay. Shaka would make a lot less without the final four run.
Second - of course they can spend more money on their practice facility, basketball is their only revenue sport they have to support. We have chosen to not increase student fees and rely only on donations to fund most or all of the costs (im not 100% on that). Plus we are paying to build a new football stadium at the same time. I don't know about you but a state of the art stadium is more important to the future of ODU athletics then a practice facility.
01-02-2014 04:02 PM
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Monarchblue Offline
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Post: #50
RE: 2014 Basketball Recruits
(01-02-2014 03:59 PM)DaBigBlue Wrote:  Are they building a $100mil football stadium on the river? We are heading in a different direction than VCU, they are all in on MBB having to raise their student fees to pay Smart. We sold $2mil more in tickets to sporting events than VCU did and have an athletic budget that is 50% higher (+$10mil), we aren't exactly the poor school that no one supports.

My point is that we are acting like the little poor school that nobody supports when it comes to paying a basketball coach. We are paying JMU money for a job that is closer to VCU. I am sorry for those of you who think that going all in for football and neglecting basketball as a byproduct is part of the deal, but at our level football isn't the cash cow, and it won't be anytime in the foreseeable future. Basketball is the money maker at the mid major level. If we continue to neglect it, we will put the football program in peril eventual too.
01-02-2014 04:14 PM
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ODUBB35 Offline
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Post: #51
RE: 2014 Basketball Recruits
In the first place, "supporting mediocrity" and "supporting a program that is currently mediocre (at best) in the hopes that it will get better" are two entirely different things.

Secondly, we have a long ways to go to reach mediocrity. Mediocre programs don't lose 3 straight to W&M or GSU. We just plain suck right now. (Not JJ's fault).

Having said that, it would be nice to hear some sort of good news about next year. Charleston can recruit big men who can play. W&M can recruit shooters. Why not us? Where are all these connections that JJ and Stith are supposed to have? Hearing about a verbal commitment would do wonders for this fanbase.

C'mon JJ. Give us something...
01-02-2014 04:17 PM
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Monarch Maniac 10 Offline
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Post: #52
RE: Complaints Dept
It's funny how one simple non-complaint post designed to provide a bit of perspective is labeled as excuse-making and starts Jones/Wood topic #52. For that, I apologize. I simply wanted to show how it is possible a recruit could consider us to be in that company. Is it right? Who knows, but it's possible and that's all that matters in the eyes of a 16 year-old kid and his parents who are so eager for their son to become the next big thing.
01-02-2014 05:48 PM
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Monarchblue Offline
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Post: #53
RE: Complaints Dept
(01-02-2014 05:48 PM)Monarch Maniac 10 Wrote:  It's funny how one simple non-complaint post designed to provide a bit of perspective is labeled as excuse-making and starts Jones/Wood topic #52. For that, I apologize. I simply wanted to show how it is possible a recruit could consider us to be in that company. Is it right? Who knows, but it's possible and that's all that matters in the eyes of a 16 year-old kid and his parents who are so eager for their son to become the next big thing.

It is an excuse. An excuse that Pat Skerry did not entertain. An excuse that Ron Hunter didn't entertain, and an excuse that ODU certainly should not entertain.

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01-02-2014 06:27 PM
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Justanodufan Offline
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Post: #54
RE: Complaints Dept
(01-02-2014 09:50 AM)Monarchblue Wrote:  
(01-02-2014 12:49 AM)Justanodufan Wrote:  
(01-01-2014 11:11 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  Sounds like excuses to me. We are a top 100 program. Before BT destroyed it we were a top 50 program. Kids will come here when we have a staff that knows how to recruit.

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Out of curiosity what other schools were recruiting you? What other schools gave you offers? Just trying to figure out what made you choose ODU, since there was no practice facility here when you came through

Huh?

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Well you said kids will come here when we have a staff that knows how to recruit. So I am assuming you are a former recruited student-athlete, so what made you choose ODU? unless of course you have never been through the recruiting process and know nothing about what it takes to get a kid to commit to a losing program. Trust me, kids want to go to schools that win!
01-02-2014 10:32 PM
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Monarchblue Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Complaints Dept
We are a school that wins. I also coached a high school sport for nearly a decade, so I do have a bit of familiarity with the process since you apparently have to be credentialed to post opinions here. Further I have worked with high school aged kids for about 15 years in one capacity or another, so yes I do have some understanding of what makes teens tick.

The fact is, if it was an easy job JJ wouldn't be getting paid 500k a year to do it. It is also true that many teams have, and do, go from bad to good. A huge part of making that happen is selling a dream. Selling a vision of the fantastic future that this kid has an opportunity to help build and watch unfold as a part of our team. A vision of an opportunity to be a hero that helped launch a program to the next level. A vision that is going to happen because of the commitment of the coaching staff, the admin, and a passionate fan base that just donated 8 Million dollars to build a facility to make you a better player, because they want you to succeed. They want ODU to succeed, and I for one know that you are a key that can help us make that happen. There is my vision if I'm the coach. What is JJ's? What is HE excited about? What is HE selling? How is HE creating excitement around this basketball program? He should be out there selling this program and the grand vision that he has for it to anyone who will listen? With that I ask you, what is JJ's vision? I have no idea what it is because I havent heard him say it, when he should be shouting it from every rooftop. You know what Bobby Wilder's vision is, and you have from day one. Ask yourself why you don't know what JJ's is.

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(This post was last modified: 01-02-2014 11:12 PM by Monarchblue.)
01-02-2014 11:00 PM
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TheDancinMonarch Offline
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Post: #56
RE: Complaints Dept
(01-02-2014 11:00 PM)Monarchblue Wrote:  We are a school that wins. I also coached a high school sport for nearly a decade, so I do have a bit of familiarity with the process since you apparently have to be credentialed to post opinions here. Further I have worked with high school aged kids for about 15 years in one capacity or another, so yes I do have some understanding of what makes teens tick.

The fact is, if it was an easy job JJ wouldn't be getting paid 500k a year to do it. It is also true that many teams have, and do, go from bad to good. A huge part of making that happen is selling a dream. Selling a vision of the fantastic future that this kid has an opportunity to help build and watch unfold as a part of our team. A vision of an opportunity to be a hero that helped launch a program to the next level. A vision that is going to happen because of the commitment of the coaching staff, the admin, and a passionate fan base that just donated 8 Million dollars to build a facility to make you a better player, because they want you to succeed. They want ODU to succeed, and I for one know that you are a key that can help us make that happen. There is my vision if I'm the coach. What is JJ's? What is HE excited about? What is HE selling? How is HE creating excitement around this basketball program? He should be out there selling this program and the grand vision that he has for it to anyone who will listen? With that I ask you, what is JJ's vision? I have no idea what it is because I havent heard him say it, when he should be shouting it from every rooftop. You know what Bobby Wilder's vision is, and you have from day one. Ask yourself why you don't know what JJ's is.

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I think what Jeff is selling is Sominex. The problem is you fall asleep just listening to him, making the pills unnecessary.
01-03-2014 02:01 AM
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ODU Hugh Offline
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Post: #57
RE: Complaints Dept
I'm certainly not going to defend Blaine. I don't think dealing with the present card we have been dealt means accepting mediocrity. No, I wasn't pleased with the Jones hire or the way it went down, but it's done. I do expect better and if Jones can't turn this around within a few years, I won't be singing a happy tune.
01-03-2014 11:58 AM
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Monarchblue Offline
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Post: #58
RE: Complaints Dept
The problem is "a few years" is way too long. By then, we will be in an even tougher spot that will take another few years to rebuild. We are in a spot right now where we need a coach who is able to assemble the personnel in a couple years that will turn this thing around shortly there after. We can't afford to allow the brand to be completely destroyed before then next coach comes in and tries to turn it around.
01-03-2014 12:28 PM
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