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C-USA at 13 can't endure.
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GSU Eagles Offline
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Post: #41
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 07:51 PM)Kingkong13 Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 07:42 PM)galojah Wrote:  Fair enough Kingkong. I just don't see any other alternatives that are realistic. ULL has good football, usually good basketball, great baseball and fits the western geographical need that we seem to need.


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ARK State, Georgia Southern both make strong arguments. Even if they moved one of WKU and MTSU, I'm almost positive there would be a permanent cross over game as a consolation. The problem is that the West has fewer viable options than the East. I would venture to say that a compromise candidate like GA Southern or GA State would fill the void. It may end up being crazy like the AAC which has Navy in the west or the SEC that has Missouri in the East. MAYBE both WKU and MTSU move west and USM goes east.

Yes, this is what it boils down to. Ark St and Ga Southern do not have any school that has a reason to block them and both make an easy compromise addition. Ark St fills the western slot better, but being in the state of Ga and the potential of Ga Southern may outweigh that. Ga St is an option, but their football program and fan support is a disaster. In the wake of the UAB fiasco Ga St is too big of a risk.

I am curious what the tv execs thing about Ga Southern. After the Florida win espn was quick to pick two Thursday night games which was more than any other SBC school. Add in winning the SBC championship in out first year and I think espn wants to see more of Ga Southern as we have a very compelling story.
12-20-2014 08:44 PM
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CameramanJ Offline
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Post: #42
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
Mind on the money, money on the mind. As bad as this situation has worked out for UAB, this is an opportunity for the remaining C-USA schools (potentially the 12 left after a defection) to make their slices of the revenue pie a little bit bigger. Stay at and 13 and see who comes calling where and when.
12-20-2014 08:48 PM
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blazr Away
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Post: #43
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 04:31 PM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  There is no financial incentive to go back to 14 or even 16.

However, 13 is absolutely horrible for scheduling both football and basketball. Convenience will probably trump balance sheets again.

We will add someone for that reason. Unless there is a high probability they know a current school will leave. But I'm absolutely blown away that it appears no one within C-USA seemed to be aware of the situation at UAB.

It seems like UAB fans have known about this for a while and have had this looming over them for a couple of years yet BB and company was caught off guard. Had they had a sense of what might be developing then Western (and I only use them cause they were the last ones to come in) should have been held as a future option rather than making that invite so quickly. Had we done that we would have been looking at 12 and a better AAV for each school And then we could have gone to the networks to see if there was any incentive to add additional schools.

So, I doubt C-USA will make a proactive decision here (as opposed to reactive=replace cause one was lost), but it would behoove the league to hold tight for at least six more months and see if any other shoes drop. That would be a proactive decision...do nothing for now.

Hell no! In fact, that's likely to be the rope the current President hangs himself with (violation of shared governance) and, if there's any chance at all, the basis for UAB's argument to remain in CUSA while they revive/rebirth football (the President/BOT violated numerous fundamental SACS and NCAA rules and not just regarding football...the argument being that the program should be given the benefit of the doubt because the decision was by a rogue actor(s) operating in complete secrecy). That most inside of insiders at UAB were completely blindsided by this. They're only now putting the pieces together that this was a fait accompli between the President & certain BOT members going back to the 2013 season. If certain people I know connected to UAB didn't know, there's no way in hell Banowsky or anyone else in CUSA offices could have had the slightest indication that this was coming.

It's always been common knowledge that certain powerful people on the UA BOT were anti-UAB, but never that they would pull something this brazen and politically risky. Maybe they pull it off, but it's still an "all-in" with them holding face cards but not pocket aces. Still, completely out of nowhere.
(This post was last modified: 12-20-2014 08:54 PM by blazr.)
12-20-2014 08:49 PM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #44
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 08:44 PM)GSU Eagles Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 07:51 PM)Kingkong13 Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 07:42 PM)galojah Wrote:  Fair enough Kingkong. I just don't see any other alternatives that are realistic. ULL has good football, usually good basketball, great baseball and fits the western geographical need that we seem to need.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

ARK State, Georgia Southern both make strong arguments. Even if they moved one of WKU and MTSU, I'm almost positive there would be a permanent cross over game as a consolation. The problem is that the West has fewer viable options than the East. I would venture to say that a compromise candidate like GA Southern or GA State would fill the void. It may end up being crazy like the AAC which has Navy in the west or the SEC that has Missouri in the East. MAYBE both WKU and MTSU move west and USM goes east.

Yes, this is what it boils down to. Ark St and Ga Southern do not have any school that has a reason to block them and both make an easy compromise addition. Ark St fills the western slot better, but being in the state of Ga and the potential of Ga Southern may outweigh that. Ga St is an option, but their football program and fan support is a disaster. In the wake of the UAB fiasco Ga St is too big of a risk.

I am curious what the tv execs thing about Ga Southern. After the Florida win espn was quick to pick two Thursday night games which was more than any other SBC school. Add in winning the SBC championship in out first year and I think espn wants to see more of Ga Southern as we have a very compelling story.

I haven't posted SBC Ratings yet because I'm waiting on Bowl numbers, but Texas State won the regular season ratings war. Highest rated Thursday Night game (Arkansas State) and Tuesday Night game (ULL)

You guys had great ratings for App State, but pretty awful numbers against Troy.
(This post was last modified: 12-20-2014 08:53 PM by chiefsfan.)
12-20-2014 08:52 PM
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lmckay92 Offline
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Post: #45
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 06:28 PM)HerdZoned Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 05:28 PM)lmckay92 Wrote:  I'm for retraction to 12.

Thats all fine and good but who do you tell to shove off.

FIU. Their facilities are way behind and they seem to be the weakest link.
(This post was last modified: 12-20-2014 08:57 PM by lmckay92.)
12-20-2014 08:53 PM
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GEAUX UL Offline
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Post: #46
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 08:40 PM)RougeDawg Wrote:  I would rather not add. But if we have to add a western team, ULL is absolutely unacceptable to Tech. Adding a new team right in the middle of our recruiting territory would be a huge hit. Every time I read a CUSA member mention adding them it bumps my blood pressure up.

Arkansas State is close to the Memphis market and they have had some good runs on football.

Well, let's at least be accurate.

UL is unacceptable to Tech fans, but the Tech administration is fully supporting us.

And Arkansas State isn't in the Memphis market. Conferences and TV networks don't care what market you border. They only care about what market you're actually in. The people I know who are "in the know" at Arkansas State have said that C-USA has no interest in them.
(This post was last modified: 12-20-2014 09:03 PM by GEAUX UL.)
12-20-2014 08:59 PM
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winston70 Offline
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Post: #47
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
I think AR ST is the best option available right now if we have to add someone soon
12-20-2014 09:01 PM
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gostAte870 Offline
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Post: #48
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 08:59 PM)GEAUX UL Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 08:40 PM)RougeDawg Wrote:  I would rather not add. But if we have to add a western team, ULL is absolutely unacceptable to Tech. Adding a new team right in the middle of our recruiting territory would be a huge hit. Every time I read a CUSA member mention adding them it bumps my blood pressure up.

Arkansas State is close to the Memphis market and they have had some good runs on football.

Well, let's at least be accurate.

UL is unacceptable to Tech fans, but the Tech administration is fully supporting us.

And Arkansas State isn't in the Memphis market. Conferences and TV networks don't care what market you border. They only care about what market you're actually in. The people I know who are "in the know" at Arkansas State have said that C-USA has no interest in them.
A-State is located where the 'i' is in the word Craighead. That's close enoughCOGS
[Image: memphis_designated_market_map.gif]
12-20-2014 09:22 PM
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GEAUX UL Offline
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Post: #49
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 09:22 PM)gostAte870 Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 08:59 PM)GEAUX UL Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 08:40 PM)RougeDawg Wrote:  I would rather not add. But if we have to add a western team, ULL is absolutely unacceptable to Tech. Adding a new team right in the middle of our recruiting territory would be a huge hit. Every time I read a CUSA member mention adding them it bumps my blood pressure up.

Arkansas State is close to the Memphis market and they have had some good runs on football.

Well, let's at least be accurate.

UL is unacceptable to Tech fans, but the Tech administration is fully supporting us.

And Arkansas State isn't in the Memphis market. Conferences and TV networks don't care what market you border. They only care about what market you're actually in. The people I know who are "in the know" at Arkansas State have said that C-USA has no interest in them.
A-State is located where the 'i' is in the word Craighead. That's close enoughCOGS
[Image: memphis_designated_market_map.gif]

[Image: pzv5j7l.jpg]
12-20-2014 09:50 PM
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ThreeifbyLightning Offline
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Post: #50
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 08:49 PM)blazr Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 04:31 PM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  There is no financial incentive to go back to 14 or even 16.

However, 13 is absolutely horrible for scheduling both football and basketball. Convenience will probably trump balance sheets again.

We will add someone for that reason. Unless there is a high probability they know a current school will leave. But I'm absolutely blown away that it appears no one within C-USA seemed to be aware of the situation at UAB.

It seems like UAB fans have known about this for a while and have had this looming over them for a couple of years yet BB and company was caught off guard. Had they had a sense of what might be developing then Western (and I only use them cause they were the last ones to come in) should have been held as a future option rather than making that invite so quickly. Had we done that we would have been looking at 12 and a better AAV for each school And then we could have gone to the networks to see if there was any incentive to add additional schools.

So, I doubt C-USA will make a proactive decision here (as opposed to reactive=replace cause one was lost), but it would behoove the league to hold tight for at least six more months and see if any other shoes drop. That would be a proactive decision...do nothing for now.

Hell no! In fact, that's likely to be the rope the current President hangs himself with (violation of shared governance) and, if there's any chance at all, the basis for UAB's argument to remain in CUSA while they revive/rebirth football (the President/BOT violated numerous fundamental SACS and NCAA rules and not just regarding football...the argument being that the program should be given the benefit of the doubt because the decision was by a rogue actor(s) operating in complete secrecy). That most inside of insiders at UAB were completely blindsided by this. They're only now putting the pieces together that this was a fait accompli between the President & certain BOT members going back to the 2013 season. If certain people I know connected to UAB didn't know, there's no way in hell Banowsky or anyone else in CUSA offices could have had the slightest indication that this was coming.

It's always been common knowledge that certain powerful people on the UA BOT were anti-UAB, but never that they would pull something this brazen and politically risky. Maybe they pull it off, but it's still an "all-in" with them holding face cards but not pocket aces. Still, completely out of nowhere.

Well, I've heard form quite a few UAB folks who have said that the contract that Clark was given was because the program was going to be shut down, which goes back at least a year. The lack of future non-conference games scheduled was another example given and then the Carr report was commissioned a while back too, so these are all reasons I have heard mentioned that indicate this wasn't a surprise.
12-20-2014 10:40 PM
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ThreeifbyLightning Offline
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Post: #51
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 09:50 PM)GEAUX UL Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 09:22 PM)gostAte870 Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 08:59 PM)GEAUX UL Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 08:40 PM)RougeDawg Wrote:  I would rather not add. But if we have to add a western team, ULL is absolutely unacceptable to Tech. Adding a new team right in the middle of our recruiting territory would be a huge hit. Every time I read a CUSA member mention adding them it bumps my blood pressure up.

Arkansas State is close to the Memphis market and they have had some good runs on football.

Well, let's at least be accurate.

UL is unacceptable to Tech fans, but the Tech administration is fully supporting us.

And Arkansas State isn't in the Memphis market. Conferences and TV networks don't care what market you border. They only care about what market you're actually in. The people I know who are "in the know" at Arkansas State have said that C-USA has no interest in them.
A-State is located where the 'i' is in the word Craighead. That's close enoughCOGS
[Image: memphis_designated_market_map.gif]

[Image: pzv5j7l.jpg]

But that is irrelevant, because Jonesboro is it's own designated media market. You don't often see local Jonesboro advertising taking place via the Memphis broadcasts.
12-20-2014 10:46 PM
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RougeDawg Offline
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Post: #52
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 08:59 PM)GEAUX UL Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 08:40 PM)RougeDawg Wrote:  I would rather not add. But if we have to add a western team, ULL is absolutely unacceptable to Tech. Adding a new team right in the middle of our recruiting territory would be a huge hit. Every time I read a CUSA member mention adding them it bumps my blood pressure up.

Arkansas State is close to the Memphis market and they have had some good runs on football.

Well, let's at least be accurate.

UL is unacceptable to Tech fans, but the Tech administration is fully supporting us.

And Arkansas State isn't in the Memphis market. Conferences and TV networks don't care what market you border. They only care about what market you're actually in. The people I know who are "in the know" at Arkansas State have said that C-USA has no interest in them.

The fans and administration would love to have Louisville come back to CUSA.
12-20-2014 10:50 PM
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MUHERD76 Offline
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Post: #53
Re: RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 01:23 PM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 12:12 PM)USM@FTL Wrote:  UAB's tragedy will inevitably bring a new school to C-USA.

Banowsky is probably very busy right now, or should be. He'll have no less than 10 schools actively courting him intensely. Mostly Sunbelt schools, openly, however I wonder what is going on behind the scenes.

Arkansas State and Louisiana must be politicking like mad. They know they don't have the TV markets like some of the newbie FBS programs South Alabama or Georgia Southern, so they have to sell their tradition and recent successes. Louisiana-Monroe, NMSU, Troy, Georgia State, and Appalachian State are either too new, or have politics working against them.

Are any MAC schools even interested? NIU might be flattered with an overture, but leaving the MAC would be a bold step. UMass would want a football-only membership. That would let us keep UAB around in other sports I guess, which is good for publicity I guess. So a UAB/UMass combo could be another viable possibility.

Is anyone from the MWC interested? No, they have a good thing going now, that will only continue to strengthen. Will they poach from C-USA? Same answer.

Is anyone from the AAC interested? This is the REALLY intriguing question of the affair. Houston was thrown about on this board as seemingly wild speculation, but I have had some time to think about it. It's viable, but improbable. UTSA, UTEP, UNT, and Rice would bring more fans EACH than Tulsa, SMU, Tulane, and Memphis COMBINED. Ok, I pulled that out of my butt, but that's mostly true. C-USA has some appeal.

Likely no one from the MWC is interested but there is a post on their board discussing the dissatisfaction of some schools based on the lack of even distribution of conference income. That was created to entice Boise St to return from their BE (AAC) adventure. Air Force was mentioned as a possibility for the AAC for example, if they were unhappy with their share of conference income. If they see the opening now available in C-USA as a way to get fair distribution of money while assisting C-USA in securing a better tv deal, that could be interesting. I don't think that will happen but if I were BB I would be exploring all possibilities and talking to anyone that would help our conference.

Interesting you mention that. Makes me wonder now if the "Anonymous" school I mentioned is a MWC member.
12-20-2014 11:08 PM
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Luckyshot Offline
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Post: #54
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 04:31 PM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  That would be a proactive decision...do nothing for now.

I'm not saying you have the wrong idea, but that's exactly the opposite of what proactive means.
12-20-2014 11:31 PM
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blazr Away
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Post: #55
C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 10:40 PM)ThreeifbyLightning Wrote:  Well, I've heard form quite a few UAB folks who have said that the contract that Clark was given was because the program was going to be shut down, which goes back at least a year. The lack of future non-conference games scheduled was another example given and then the Carr report was commissioned a while back too, so these are all reasons I have heard mentioned that indicate this wasn't a surprise.

All pieces of the puzzle that were put together about 6 weeks before the Pres announced his decision. That prompted some meetings to inquire wherein the Pres was noncommittal and alarms started going off. Yes, it is now known that this decision was made by the BOT and communicated to the Pres before the hiring of Clark. But no one, I mean absolutely no one, knew anything about it outside of them (possibly the AD, but the evidence of what he did/didn't know is shaky). NO ONE, much less anyone from CUSA, knew this was coming outside of a few people on the BOT and the man ordered to pull the plug. The study was framed as one to improve the program, not kill it (it's debatable, even now, whether the consulting firm knew what it was going to be used for as it only presents data and the costs of being competitive in FBS).
12-21-2014 06:56 AM
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goodknightfl Offline
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Post: #56
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 05:28 PM)lmckay92 Wrote:  I'm for retraction to 12.

CUSA sending Marshall back to the MAC?? 03-lmfao

On a serious note, CUSA is likely safe from above for now. I think the P5 likely stand pat for 2 to 5 years, which means AAC and MWC won't be raiding. From the outside I see one of the Ga schools, or Umass fb only as logical.
(This post was last modified: 12-21-2014 09:25 AM by goodknightfl.)
12-21-2014 09:15 AM
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chuckk3 Offline
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Post: #57
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-20-2014 08:40 PM)RougeDawg Wrote:  But if we have to add a western team, ULL is absolutely unacceptable to Tech.

Careful speaking for The University there, my Bulldog brother.

A bunch of us fans wouldn't like it, but university systems and Louisiana politics make for strange bedfellows. Heck you're in Walker...super close to Red Stick. I'm not telling you anything you haven't seen up close.
(This post was last modified: 12-21-2014 09:30 AM by chuckk3.)
12-21-2014 09:29 AM
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MarshallHerdFanz Offline
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Post: #58
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
Just add USA, Georgia Southern, Ohio, Ark St, Army, UMass. End of it. No going to 12.
12-21-2014 09:30 AM
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Post: #59
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-21-2014 09:29 AM)chuckk3 Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 08:40 PM)RougeDawg Wrote:  But if we have to add a western team, ULL is absolutely unacceptable to Tech.

Careful speaking for The University there, my Bulldog brother.

A bunch of us fans wouldn't like it, but university systems and Louisiana politics make for strange bedfellows. Heck you're in Walker...super close to Red Stick. I'm not telling you anything you haven't seen up close.

As a fan I can understand not wanting another state school in the same conference. Now as someone who makes money off cost vs rewards I see UL-L as a home run for Tech over a Umass or GST or Txst...

You are swapping out bus trips with a lot of down and back with costly plane trips and overnight stays. Not just football and basketball but all of those Olympic sports that cost just as much on travel as your basketball team.

Easily a hundred thousand (maybe even two) you can spend somewhere else. Then you also have the addition rewards of 5,000 @$20 or more in the stands for a football game...another $100,000 you will make, not counting the average of $5 off each one of those on concessions so $25,000. Add 2k to a basketball game @$20 (including concessions) and you have another $40,000

By the time you finish look at the cost of travel east or Texas and the gain in attendance when playing UL-L you could easily be talking about 2% of the Tech budget. Not to mention a easy travel game when you are on the road. I can almost guarantee one thing if La Tech was against adding UL-L and CUSA added another school that added cost to the Tech budget...

the next time you go to the state needing something a million here a million there. It will be brought up that La Tech had the chance to cut cost by a few hundred thousand but blocked it.
(This post was last modified: 12-21-2014 10:43 AM by WKUYG.)
12-21-2014 10:42 AM
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Blue Raider Dave Offline
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Post: #60
RE: C-USA at 13 can't endure.
(12-21-2014 10:42 AM)WKUYG Wrote:  
(12-21-2014 09:29 AM)chuckk3 Wrote:  
(12-20-2014 08:40 PM)RougeDawg Wrote:  But if we have to add a western team, ULL is absolutely unacceptable to Tech.

Careful speaking for The University there, my Bulldog brother.

A bunch of us fans wouldn't like it, but university systems and Louisiana politics make for strange bedfellows. Heck you're in Walker...super close to Red Stick. I'm not telling you anything you haven't seen up close.

As a fan I can understand not wanting another state school in the same conference. Now as someone who makes money off cost vs rewards I see UL-L as a home run for Tech over a Umass or GST or Txst...

You are swapping out bus trips with a lot of down and back with costly plane trips and overnight stays. Not just football and basketball but all of those Olympic sports that cost just as much on travel as your basketball team.

Easily a hundred thousand (maybe even two) you can spend somewhere else. Then you also have the addition rewards of 5,000 @$20 or more in the stands for a football game...another $100,000 you will make, not counting the average of $5 off each one of those on concessions so $25,000. Add 2k to a basketball game @$20 (including concessions) and you have another $40,000

By the time you finish look at the cost of travel east or Texas and the gain in attendance when playing UL-L you could easily be talking about 2% of the Tech budget. Not to mention a easy travel game when you are on the road. I can almost guarantee one thing if La Tech was against adding UL-L and CUSA added another school that added cost to the Tech budget...

the next time you go to the state needing something a million here a million there. It will be brought up that La Tech had the chance to cut cost by a few hundred thousand but blocked it.

Then let's just add Murray State and WKU can experience the same thing 03-wink

(j/k. I couldn't resist :) )
12-21-2014 10:48 AM
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