(01-15-2015 01:47 AM)Eagle78 Wrote:  Nope, defConn. I am just LMAO at Uconn fans who for years ridiculed BC as being the "red headed stepchild" of the ACC and who no one supposedly paid attention to. Now, when it suits your narrative, BC is suddenly this powerful entity able to dictate who is invited to the Conference.

That is my intuition as well, being an outsider. I just don't see BC having this huge pull in the ACC. Nor do I believe people saying that all these schools in the ACC are aligned against UConn for various reasons.

It simply comes down to UConn not being able to offer as much as the recent adds to the conference in the areas where it matters most: off the court.

(01-15-2015 01:43 PM)westwolf Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 01:02 PM)bearcatfan Wrote:  

(01-14-2015 05:08 AM)BearcatJerry Wrote:  Everyone not in a "power" conference is being "bled dry." It is what it is.

And no one in P5 wants UConn. Deal with it.

Uh... What's your point?

(01-14-2015 09:06 PM)DefCONNOne Wrote:  

(01-14-2015 07:10 PM)lumberpack4 Wrote:  1. UConn was never a part of the original discussions back in the late 1990's.
2. Those discussion were held between the Gene Corrigan, ACC Commish, NC State's Les Robinson, and Miami's Paul Dee
3. Tranghesee knew about the discussion but could do nothing because of the basketball schools
4. Dee wanted Miami to come with Syracuse and BC
5. After Duke and UNC pulled a power play, putting UVa over a barrel and allowing VT to enter, Syracuse was odd-manned out
6. While others participated Blumenthal personalized the litigation in NC by suing some ACC officers in their personal capacity - that was a mistake
7. The ACC learned enough about the law in Connecticutt to know they do not want to do business there
8. As realighnment continued, the promise to Syracuse was kept, and Pitt had been playing football at the top level of the NCAA for over 100 years
9. When it came time to replace MD, none of the schools that make their budget on Football wanted UConn because they don't recruit New England, and UConn sells no more seats in the South than Wofford, Gardner Webb, App State, or Georgia Southern.
10. UConn is existential competition for BC.
11. That means there are 5-6 no votes in the ACC against UConn. BC, FSU, Clemson, NC State, VT, and Miami. It's not personal except for BC, it's financial.
12. If an existing school says "Hell No" that does carry weight with the remainder of the schools - it's one thing not to want a certain school, it's another to say it's a deal breaker for you.


Nothing changes the fact that UConn was very late to the game, too late in fact. Cincy and Louisville played at a lower level like UConn did in the Yankee Conference until the early 70's when they went independent. Upon going independent Louisville had real success against P-5 schools by the early 90's, Cincy had real success against p-5's starting in the late 2000's.

UConn is running decades behind Louisville, and Cincy. East Carolina made a quicker commitment to big time football than UConn. You can't expect to be the last to show up and have things go your way.

I see you're still trying to convince this board you're some sort of CR "expert", when it's patently obvious you know nothing. LESS than nothing, in fact.

It's a sad person who can not accept facts about their situation.

i really dont get the ant UConn stance. I think UConn despite its recent FB issues is an important cog in the turf wars. It was mentioned by somewhere on here and I agree, UConn is the key to New York for whichever conference (ACC or B1G) grabs them

Syracuse, ND and UConn
OR
Penn st, Rutgers and UConn

would all make claim to NYC

Is UConn the most discussed school on this board?

We get a ton of attention for a little G5 school.

(01-15-2015 09:45 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  i really dont get the ant UConn stance. I think UConn despite its recent FB issues is an important cog in the turf wars. It was mentioned by somewhere on here and I agree, UConn is the key to New York for whichever conference (ACC or B1G) grabs them

Syracuse, ND and UConn
OR
Penn st, Rutgers and UConn

would all make claim to NYC

"Claiming NYC" in college sports is a silly idea.

UConn only moves the arrow in basketball, and not at all in football. UConn football gets about the same or less following in NYC as Buffalo, which is basically around 8th place (Notre Dame, Penn State, Rutgers, Michigan, Ohio State, Texas and Syracuse have much larger following in the city, esp the first 3).

The B1G already has their tv network established in all of the major NYC carriers, and they are really looking for new territories to expand (Texas, UVA, UNC/Duke probably being their top targets outside of Notre Dame) whenever the next step comes around. There's very little interest in UConn, and especially won't be interested in adding for the sake of adding.

UConn if anything would probably benefit ACC a lot more due to their basketball focus (if the ACC ever starts to fracture, having another basketball power will at least make it more likely that the basketball-centric North Carolina schools, Louisville and Syracuse probably to stick together), and their history with Syracuse and BC would make for a good competitive fit.

(01-15-2015 04:58 AM)rednblackattack Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 03:12 AM)firmbizzle Wrote:  

(01-14-2015 04:50 PM)rednblackattack Wrote:  We earned our spot in the ACC, just like we earned our spot hen we went to the Big East. UConn's best chance IMO is the Big 10 and I don't see them expanding again in the near future.

You may have earned it (which is never the criteria)but it's still a very odd fit.

Actually its a great fit for us. The ACC is where we have always wanted to be. What is a odd fit is Missouri in the SEC and West Virginia in the Big 12

Your profile really doesn't fit with the other 13 schools academically, geographically or culturally. I do agree that Missouri is a bad fit culturally and geographically. West Virginia's fit is bad geographically.

(01-16-2015 12:39 AM)AntiG Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 09:45 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  i really dont get the ant UConn stance. I think UConn despite its recent FB issues is an important cog in the turf wars. It was mentioned by somewhere on here and I agree, UConn is the key to New York for whichever conference (ACC or B1G) grabs them

Syracuse, ND and UConn
OR
Penn st, Rutgers and UConn

would all make claim to NYC

"Claiming NYC" in college sports is a silly idea.

UConn only moves the arrow in basketball, and not at all in football. UConn football gets about the same or less following in NYC as Buffalo, which is basically around 8th place (Notre Dame, Penn State, Rutgers, Michigan, Ohio State, Texas and Syracuse have much larger following in the city, esp the first 3).

The B1G already has their tv network established in all of the major NYC carriers, and they are really looking for new territories to expand (Texas, UVA, UNC/Duke probably being their top targets outside of Notre Dame) whenever the next step comes around. There's very little interest in UConn, and especially won't be interested in adding for the sake of adding.

UConn if anything would probably benefit ACC a lot more due to their basketball focus (if the ACC ever starts to fracture, having another basketball power will at least make it more likely that the basketball-centric North Carolina schools, Louisville and Syracuse probably to stick together), and their history with Syracuse and BC would make for a good competitive fit.

Wrong.

In college football, the NYC metro area is split roughly evenly with five schools: Rutgers & UConn (the two local flagship schools), plus Syracuse, ND, and Penn State. Even though it's close, I believe Rutgers is ahead of the others.

In basketball, it's just UConn & Syracuse. No one else matters.

But the NYC area cares more about pro sports. The Giants have exponentially more fans than any college.

Note to anyone: if you're not from the NY area, please don't pretend to be an expert on NY sports.

(01-16-2015 04:02 AM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  

(01-16-2015 12:39 AM)AntiG Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 09:45 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  i really dont get the ant UConn stance. I think UConn despite its recent FB issues is an important cog in the turf wars. It was mentioned by somewhere on here and I agree, UConn is the key to New York for whichever conference (ACC or B1G) grabs them

Syracuse, ND and UConn
OR
Penn st, Rutgers and UConn

would all make claim to NYC

"Claiming NYC" in college sports is a silly idea.

UConn only moves the arrow in basketball, and not at all in football. UConn football gets about the same or less following in NYC as Buffalo, which is basically around 8th place (Notre Dame, Penn State, Rutgers, Michigan, Ohio State, Texas and Syracuse have much larger following in the city, esp the first 3).

The B1G already has their tv network established in all of the major NYC carriers, and they are really looking for new territories to expand (Texas, UVA, UNC/Duke probably being their top targets outside of Notre Dame) whenever the next step comes around. There's very little interest in UConn, and especially won't be interested in adding for the sake of adding.

UConn if anything would probably benefit ACC a lot more due to their basketball focus (if the ACC ever starts to fracture, having another basketball power will at least make it more likely that the basketball-centric North Carolina schools, Louisville and Syracuse probably to stick together), and their history with Syracuse and BC would make for a good competitive fit.

Wrong.

In college football, the NYC metro area is split roughly evenly with five schools: Rutgers & UConn (the two local flagship schools), plus Syracuse, ND, and Penn State. Even though it's close, I believe Rutgers is ahead of the others.

In basketball, it's just UConn & Syracuse. No one else matters.

But the NYC area cares more about pro sports. The Giants have exponentially more fans than any college.

Note to anyone: if you're not from the NY area, please don't pretend to be an expert on NY sports.

No one cares about UConn football in the city. Maybe up near the border but not in the city. College football here is really diverse, but the largest followings are ND, PSU and RU.

In basketball I agree, you're missing SJU who has aa huge following in the city.

I've lived in the heart of NYC over the past 10 years and grew up 20 mins from the city, so yeah I think I have enough experience to know this.

In the end it's pro sports dominating here.

(01-15-2015 12:57 PM)10thMountain Wrote:  BC, Cuse, Pitt and Syracuse all have reason to keep UConn out for turf reasons and don't want yet another northern, basketball school to compete for recruits and fans in the north/NE area for.

VT, Clemson, Miami, FSU and GT all have reason to keep UConn out for FB reasons and don't want another northern basketball school weakening their SOS and hurting their ticket sales (and SU/Pitt may not be great now but they have tremendous FB histories that are appreciated by FB fans).

Tobacco Road +UVA were probably for UConn and usually they are the strongest opinion among the ACC's 3 factions but at the time with the Big 12 a wounded animal, they felt the need to side with the Southern Gridirons to keep the peace.

UL was the perfect compromise between the 3 factions that make up the ACC (Northern Hardwoods, Tobacco Road + UVA and the Southern Gridirons)

Ncsu may have sided with the southern gridiron on that one, not sure. Other than that, spot on.

(01-16-2015 04:02 AM)UConn-SMU Wrote:  

(01-16-2015 12:39 AM)AntiG Wrote:  

(01-15-2015 09:45 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  i really dont get the ant UConn stance. I think UConn despite its recent FB issues is an important cog in the turf wars. It was mentioned by somewhere on here and I agree, UConn is the key to New York for whichever conference (ACC or B1G) grabs them

Syracuse, ND and UConn
OR
Penn st, Rutgers and UConn

would all make claim to NYC

"Claiming NYC" in college sports is a silly idea.

UConn only moves the arrow in basketball, and not at all in football. UConn football gets about the same or less following in NYC as Buffalo, which is basically around 8th place (Notre Dame, Penn State, Rutgers, Michigan, Ohio State, Texas and Syracuse have much larger following in the city, esp the first 3).

The B1G already has their tv network established in all of the major NYC carriers, and they are really looking for new territories to expand (Texas, UVA, UNC/Duke probably being their top targets outside of Notre Dame) whenever the next step comes around. There's very little interest in UConn, and especially won't be interested in adding for the sake of adding.

UConn if anything would probably benefit ACC a lot more due to their basketball focus (if the ACC ever starts to fracture, having another basketball power will at least make it more likely that the basketball-centric North Carolina schools, Louisville and Syracuse probably to stick together), and their history with Syracuse and BC would make for a good competitive fit.

Wrong.

In college football, the NYC metro area is split roughly evenly with five schools: Rutgers & UConn (the two local flagship schools), plus Syracuse, ND, and Penn State. Even though it's close, I believe Rutgers is ahead of the others.

In basketball, it's just UConn & Syracuse. No one else matters.

But the NYC area cares more about pro sports. The Giants have exponentially more fans than any college.

Note to anyone: if you're not from the NY area, please don't pretend to be an expert on NY sports.

Said the guy living in McKinney, TX

I think that is the old way of looking at it.

First, our culture is such that by and large more people are interested in "big games" "best players" than the "small games" "weaker players". That is why tens of millions will watch a college football game and hundreds of millions will watch a Superbowl.

With the clear and unequivocal movement by the most powerful conferences to separate themselves from the rest, NYC will find whatever interest it normally has channeled to these big programs. It may not be a big interest, but the small amount that does exist won't be tuned in for a Uconn-Tulsa game. That isn't a knock on either program, just a pretty common sense conclusion.

The decline of Uconn is inevitable. Money and separation guarantee it. So long as the exit fees keep coming and the NCAA tournament gives opportunities for Uconn (and other mid majors) to enter it, Uconn will be able to limp along. What has kept the Uconn fan base motivated is the hope that some power conference will accept them. Jeff Jacobs NO MATTER YOUR ACCEPTANCE of his opinions, is the one person out of all Connecticut media that is in the best position of assembling the UConn administration's viewpoint, innuendo, conjecture, conversations with politicos, network execs, and other schools and distill that down to what he perceives to be the future of Uconn athletics. He may be right or wrong, but his take on the pulse of that hope is infinitely more credible than star wars bloggers.

Further, the peril in all of this is what way Uconn goes, so do the other mid major conferences and schools.If Uconn can't make it, with their revenue (twice that of any other mid major), national athletic brand, and domination of such a large market (state of Connecticut, including Fairfield County/northern NYC DMA) than what other school has a chance?

Certainly the quiet confidence out of Cincinnati and Santa Ono leads me to believe that SOME mid major schools will get plucked. But other than being part of the major conferences, a school has no chance intoday's environment.

I used to live in Fairfield County...the county closest to NYC and where most residents watch NYC Stations and not the Hartford/New Haven ones. You also get a fair number of NYC commuters living in Fairfield. My assessment is that Fairfield is very similar to NYC in that the national teams (ND, OSU, Michigan, etc) dominate over the local UConn. Mostly because of transplants to the NYC area looking to enjoy the Burbs. Very similar in that way to Bergen and Hudson County NJ (Very hard for Rutgers to claim they own that part of NJ).

To be fair there are UConn fans in Fairfield, just not to the same saturation as the Hartford area.

Additionally, I distinctly recall the local outrage over tax dollars being used to build the Rent (which was originally proposed to be a new home for the NE Patriots) when I lived there.

(01-16-2015 12:32 PM)Danger in Carolina Wrote:  I used to live in Fairfield County...the county closest to NYC and where most residents watch NYC Stations and not the Hartford/New Haven ones. You also get a fair number of NYC commuters living in Fairfield. My assessment is that Fairfield is very similar to NYC in that the national teams (ND, OSU, Michigan, etc) dominate over the local UConn. Mostly because of transplants to the NYC area looking to enjoy the Burbs. Very similar in that way to Bergen and Hudson County NJ (Very hard for Rutgers to claim they own that part of NJ).

To be fair there are UConn fans in Fairfield, just not to the same saturation as the Hartford area.

Additionally, I distinctly recall the local outrage over tax dollars being used to build the Rent (which was originally proposed to be a new home for the NE Patriots) when I lived there.

The main local newspaper in Fairfield County just dropped the UConn beat guy. That can't help.

I lived in NYC for about 18 months during 2012-2013 to support a client. From what I observed, I agree with many of the comments here regarding the dominance of pro sports in the City. While people pay attention to the big games, like everybody else, the day-to-day following of college football is pretty much off the radar in NYC - with the exception of some interest in following CFB at Fordham.

College basketball has a bit more of a presence in the City from what I saw, but nowhere near at the levels of pro sports. The three CBB programs that seemed to get the most interest were SU, Uconn, and SJU (with SJU commanding the most interest of the three; most likely due to the fact that they are located in the City and their home games are played in the City).

IMO, the Conferences want a presence in NYC mostly due to the fact that this is the biggest media, marketing, and advertising center in the Nation (indeed, the World). Just my opinion, but I think the Conferences value an association with the City as a means to effectively leverage their products across national/global media, advertising, and marketing platforms. It is important to realize that these platforms in NYC are more national/global as opposed to NYC centric. Accordingly, I think size of a specific fanbase in the City, while certainly helpful, is not a huge factor in this strategy.

(01-15-2015 12:57 PM)10thMountain Wrote:  BC, Cuse, Pitt and Syracuse all have reason to keep UConn out for turf reasons and don't want yet another northern, basketball school to compete for recruits and fans in the north/NE area for.

VT, Clemson, Miami, FSU and GT all have reason to keep UConn out for FB reasons and don't want another northern basketball school weakening their SOS and hurting their ticket sales (and SU/Pitt may not be great now but they have tremendous FB histories that are appreciated by FB fans).

Tobacco Road +UVA were probably for UConn and usually they are the strongest opinion among the ACC's 3 factions but at the time with the Big 12 a wounded animal, they felt the need to side with the Southern Gridirons to keep the peace.

UL was the perfect compromise between the 3 factions that make up the ACC (Northern Hardwoods, Tobacco Road + UVA and the Southern Gridirons)

Absolutely. They satisfy all 3 groups very well. They are serious about football and usually produce a very good squad and they're in a Southern state. The first part checks the box of all 5 of the "Southern Gridirons". The second part checks the box of the "Southern Gridirons" not named Miami as I don't think they care either way about that. They are an elite basketball program which checks the box for the "Northern Hardwoods" and the Tobacco Road/UVA faction. They also have varying amounts athletic history with Florida State, Miami, VT, Cuse, Pitt and ND. Obviously some of which is very recent and sans for the 2013 season unbroken.

(01-16-2015 01:18 PM)Eagle78 Wrote:  I lived in NYC for about 18 months during 2012-2013 to support a client. From what I observed, I agree with many of the comments here regarding the dominance of pro sports in the City. While people pay attention to the big games, like everybody else, the day-to-day following of college football is pretty much off the radar in NYC - with the exception of some interest in following CFB at Fordham.

College basketball has a bit more of a presence in the City from what I saw, but nowhere near at the levels of pro sports. The three CBB programs that seemed to get the most interest were SU, Uconn, and SJU (with SJU commanding the most interest of the three; most likely due to the fact that they are located in the City and their home games are played in the City).

IMO, the Conferences want a presence in NYC mostly due to the fact that this is the biggest media, marketing, and advertising center in the Nation (indeed, the World). Just my opinion, but I think the Conferences value an association with the City as a means to effectively leverage their products across national/global media, advertising, and marketing platforms. It is important to realize that these platforms in NYC are more national/global as opposed to NYC centric. Accordingly, I think size of a specific fanbase in the City, while certainly helpful, is not a huge factor in this strategy.

I agree with everything stated above. However, I've never really seen any interest in the city proper or in the suburbs in Fordham football. The news will give you scores and if they were on TV somewhere the highlights same goes with any of the "local" FCS squads, but I feel like they spend far more time on Rutgers, Syracuse, UConn and Notre Dame plus really (and I mean REALLY) key Big Ten and national matchups.

No one is being "bled dry". I hear this crap all the time with people bitching about the UMass move to FBS. The budgets for these football teams is tiny compared to the overall university budget.

I don't know what UConn's is, but UMass' football budget is LESS than 1% of the entire UMass budget.

I'm guessing that the title was not an implication about the finances of the university itself.

(01-16-2015 02:36 PM)EmeryZach Wrote:  No one is being "bled dry". I hear this crap all the time with people bitching about the UMass move to FBS. The budgets for these football teams is tiny compared to the overall university budget.

I don't know what UConn's is, but UMass' football budget is LESS than 1% of the entire UMass budget.

Agree with this statement. Unfortunately, one of the realities of playing FB in New England if you are a public university is that the press can beat this drum (however questionable the argument, as you state) and claim it is in the "interests of taxpayers."