How is it that our self-proclaimed board insider doesn't understand what is meant by "big boy money" (even if that's not the best descriptor)? With their lack of accuracy on everything else, I guess I'm not surprised they failed here as well.

The Big Ten and SEC are poised to bring in $15M+ more than the ACC in the next couple of years. That is not a position the ACC is capable of maintaining and surviving in. The ACC will absolutely lose members and struggle to remain a relevant property if that revenue gap comes to fruition.

Big Ten and SEC schools already bring in $20M more due to their stadiums/alumni base? Yup, so you know what would make that even better? If they added an extra $15M to that from tv rights/conference payouts. Expanding our stadium to host Wake, Cuse and BC on the reg is a sure way to gain on Big Ten/SEC revenue. Not.

I'm sorry I don't get Memphis. If I am the Big 12, BYU and Cincy would be the ideal candidates. If not BYU, then USF.

(07-27-2015 12:00 AM)john01992 Wrote:  

(07-26-2015 10:15 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(07-26-2015 09:21 PM)nole Wrote:  JRSEC,
True....but that is a HUGE IF....and that number is ever changing depending on growth with other conferences.

Next summer schools will start to get VERY skiddish.

Last year (2014), ACTUAL media rights + licensing payments to Florida State totaled $40,493,922.

By comparison, the Florida Gators got $39,424,395.

So, HOW did the Gators bring in more money?

It wasn't their stadium - FSU had about $2.5 million more in ticket revenues

The $20M advantage enjoyed by the Gators was in direct donations:
UF: $42,962,368
FSU: $22,521,553

Which FSU contract are you referring to?

NONE - it's USA Today actual revenues reported.
http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances

(07-27-2015 12:14 AM)Marge Schott Wrote:  

(07-25-2015 02:13 PM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  The only way that the ACC would break up is if there isn't a network & ND doesn't come all in with possibly Texas.

If doomsday hits I could see FSU, Clemson, Miami, GT, VT & Louisville joining Texas, TT, Oklahoma, Ok State, Kansas, WV along with Missouri & Nebraska to form a new conference.

If I'm FSU, why even wait? Just try to create a conference like that right now.

1. Getting Missouri from the SEC and Nebraska from the B1G are not realistic.
2. If you try to balance it into 7 East and 7 West division teams, you get this:



Personally, I just don't think Kansas, Kansas State and Iowa State belong here. However, I think having more than 2 teams in Texas could also be a problem.

ACC should go to 16 teams and these would be the divisions.

Boston College
UConn
Syracuse
Pitt
West Virginia
Cincinnati
Louisville
Miami

Virginia Tech
Virginia
North Carolina
North Carolina State
Wake Forest
Duke
George Tech
FSU

(07-27-2015 07:23 AM)Wilkie01 Wrote:  ACC should go to 16 teams and these would be the divisions.

Boston College
UConn
Syracuse
Pitt
West Virginia
Cincinnati
Louisville
Miami

Virginia Tech
Virginia
North Carolina
North Carolina State
Wake Forest
Duke
George Tech
FSU

Where is Clemson going? Maybe switch them back out with UConn & it could be possible.

(07-27-2015 06:59 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(07-27-2015 12:14 AM)Marge Schott Wrote:  

(07-25-2015 02:13 PM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  The only way that the ACC would break up is if there isn't a network & ND doesn't come all in with possibly Texas.

If doomsday hits I could see FSU, Clemson, Miami, GT, VT & Louisville joining Texas, TT, Oklahoma, Ok State, Kansas, WV along with Missouri & Nebraska to form a new conference.

If I'm FSU, why even wait? Just try to create a conference like that right now.

1. Getting Missouri from the SEC and Nebraska from the B1G are not realistic.
2. If you try to balance it into 7 East and 7 West division teams, you get this:



Personally, I just don't think Kansas, Kansas State and Iowa State belong here. However, I think having more than 2 teams in Texas could also be a problem.

I think Nebraska could be possible but Missouri would be a long shot, it would definitely need some help from the networks to pull it off. Kansas brings its blue blood basketball program. What happens to the remainder of the ACC world dictate where ND lands.

Re did, forgot Clemson and good by BC.
ACC should go to 16 teams and these would be the divisions.

UConn
Syracuse
Pitt
West Virginia
Cincinnati
Louisville
Virginia Tech
Miami

Virginia
North Carolina
North Carolina State
Wake Forest
Duke
Clemson
George Tech
FSU
[/quote]

(07-27-2015 06:59 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(07-27-2015 12:14 AM)Marge Schott Wrote:  

(07-25-2015 02:13 PM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  The only way that the ACC would break up is if there isn't a network & ND doesn't come all in with possibly Texas.

If doomsday hits I could see FSU, Clemson, Miami, GT, VT & Louisville joining Texas, TT, Oklahoma, Ok State, Kansas, WV along with Missouri & Nebraska to form a new conference.

If I'm FSU, why even wait? Just try to create a conference like that right now.

1. Getting Missouri from the SEC and Nebraska from the B1G are not realistic.
2. If you try to balance it into 7 East and 7 West division teams, you get this:



Personally, I just don't think Kansas, Kansas State and Iowa State belong here. However, I think having more than 2 teams in Texas could also be a problem.

I agree Mizzou/NU aren't realistic. But I said to make a conference "like" that. The key components are FSU, UT and OU and building out from there with ACC and Big 12 parts.

UM has to follow FSU. UL fans seem like they would ask to follow FSU. WVU would almost assuredly be down for the league assuming the SEC didn't come calling. It seems like VT wouldn't go, so I wouldn't expect them. (What say you VT fans?) And GT may not go, either. Clemson would be a tough pull, but if they lost both FSU and UM (rivalry + recruiting access) that may be enough to get them on board as well, which then might free up GT. It'd obviously be more difficult than that, but certain dominoes would need to fall in order for additional "properties" to be acquired.

Also, if the ACC truly did lose parts/all of its southernmost flank, I think UNC, Duke and UVA would look at their escape pods themselves and likely move to the SEC or Big Ten. There's likely no way those 3 + NC State and VT get invited to the same conference. And Wake? Sorry, nobody is adding you. NC State and VT should be invited by either "loser" of the UNC/Duke/UVA sweepstakes between the Big Ten and SEC (at least I would think).

They probably all couldn't join the FSU/Texas/OU league either. The best combo for a new league would probably be VT and both UNC and Duke. But a more realistic option might be adding VT and NC State with UNC, Duke and UVA going elsewhere.

I suppose the tobacco road schools may be arrogant enough in that situation to believe keeping the ACC intact while adding UC, Memphis, UCF, USF, UConn (consensus on the best available ACC options for expansion?) would somehow keep the ACC as relevant as it was prior to expansion. I actually think I can name a particular UNC fan on her who would actually prefer to drop some of the ACC's current heavyweights in order to pick up middleweights they could control easier and mold in the likeness of the "Carolina Way".

I'd offer ND the same deal with this new conference that they currently have with the ACC.

And from the western 9 of the Big 12, I'm fine with inviting UT, Baylor, TCU, OK State, OU, KU and even ISU if need be (yes, ISU is still an horrendous expansion candidate for the ACC in the present, real-world composition of the two entities). But would Texas and OU require ISU's inclusion? It doesn't seem like it. And I'd much prefer a stronger presence in the DFW-Houston-SA triangle than TTU in northwestern TX, even if it meant adding a private institution or two. (Or should you add Houston instead of Baylor?) I'd even be fine with adding BYU to those 7 to make a western 8.

And if you're going for geographical accuracy, you should have both KU/KSU and OU/OSU flipped in your map, HokieMark.

There aren't many good western replacements for Iowa State. Memphis? Houston? Colorado State? Probably the only 3 realistic ones.

I think something like this would probably be the best you could hope for:
FSU-------------Texas
UM--------------Baylor/Houston
GT--------------TCU
Clemson--------OU
NC State-------OK State
VT---------------Kansas
UL---------------Colorado State/Memphis
WVU------------BYU

If I were playing "build-a-conference" and my choices had to come from the ACC, Big XII, independents and G5 conferences, this would probably be the strongest 16 teams you could assemble for football over the LONG haul (short-term/recent results notwithstanding):



Now, if you want to argue that I should've taken Oklahoma State or Kansas/Kansas State or even another Texas school instead of two NC schools, have at it. You could also argue the need to take UVa, or BC for the TV market. But overall, I think this captures the best options available.

For example, every team in this map has won at least one national championship in football except UNC, NC State, VT, Louisville and Texas Tech - but those are all solid bowl teams year in/year out.

(07-27-2015 08:27 AM)Wilkie01 Wrote:  Re do, forgot Clemson and good by BC.
ACC should go to 16 teams and these would be the divisions.

UConn
Syracuse
Pitt
West Virginia
Cincinnati
Louisville
Virginia Tech
Miami

Virginia
North Carolina
North Carolina State
Wake Forest
Duke
Clemson
George Tech
FSU

[/quote]

So, you would drop BC and add Uconn? BC sits in the 7th largest media market in the U.S. and enjoys solid ratings in that market. It's also has a much better FB program. Both of these facts are not unimportant if we are talking about getting an ACCN off the ground, IMO.

(Not that this would ever happen as I don't think the ACC will be kicking out existing members.)

(07-27-2015 12:10 PM)Eagle78 Wrote:  So, you would drop BC and add Uconn?

Trust me, NO ONE would make that trade for football (basketball maybe, but NOT for football!)

Duplicate post

(07-27-2015 12:18 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(07-27-2015 12:10 PM)Eagle78 Wrote:  So, you would drop BC and add Uconn?

Trust me, NO ONE would make that trade for football (basketball maybe, but NOT for football!)

I agree. That's why his post was so baffling. BC sits in one of the largest and wealthiest media markets in the country, and has been a successful ACC FB program, sitting in the top half of the Conference for total wins since it entered the ACC.

LOL

When I read "good by BC" I thought they meant they were going to "do right by BC" and remove UConn. Whoops.

Big XII should add BYU and Memphis. They aren't getting any ACC schools, lay off the psychedelics guys.

(07-27-2015 12:10 PM)Eagle78 Wrote:  

(07-27-2015 08:27 AM)Wilkie01 Wrote:  Re do, forgot Clemson and good by BC.
ACC should go to 16 teams and these would be the divisions.

Boston College
Syracuse
Pitt
West Virginia
Cincinnati
Louisville
Virginia Tech
Miami

Virginia
North Carolina
North Carolina State
Wake Forest
Duke
Clemson
Georgia Tech
FSU

Rotators
ND
Texas

So, you would drop BC and add Uconn? BC sits in the 7th largest media market in the U.S. and enjoys solid ratings in that market. It's also has a much better FB program. Both of these facts are not unimportant if we are talking about getting an ACCN off the ground, IMO.

(Not that this would ever happen as I don't think the ACC will be kicking out existing members.)
[/quote]

Fixed it assuming ND still won't join Full time. And if If Workable with Texas as well with ND type rotation

(07-27-2015 11:55 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  If I were playing "build-a-conference" and my choices had to come from the ACC, Big XII, independents and G5 conferences, this would probably be the strongest 16 teams you could assemble for football over the LONG haul (short-term/recent results notwithstanding):



Now, if you want to argue that I should've taken Oklahoma State or Kansas/Kansas State or even another Texas school instead of two NC schools, have at it. You could also argue the need to take UVa, or BC for the TV market. But overall, I think this captures the best options available.

For example, every team in this map has won at least one national championship in football except UNC, NC State, VT, Louisville and Texas Tech - but those are all solid bowl teams year in/year out.

I know you said it was a football focused map and a few tweaks that others might recommend are viewed as minor details by you. That said:

I don't think NC State is needed if you have UNC, and if you take two from NC I'd rather it be Duke and UNC. Why take Texas Tech when you have 2 other TX schools and other in-state options? And why Pitt and Cuse, solely for their state populations? VT would be willing to leave for another conference without UVA? Since I'm also accounting for basketball, I think you have to try to get Kansas. And obviously ND isn't going to join as a football member (though they likely would as a non-football member), but in your scenario you'd have to add them, agreed.

None of this is going to happen anyway.

What is more likely is the Big adds Texas and Kansas to get to 16.

The SEC adds Oklahoma and West Virginia.

The remaining Big 12:

Iowa State
Kansas State
Oklahoma State
Texas Tech
TCU
Baylor

PAC 12 adds Kansas State, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, and TCU to get to 16.

ACC adds Cincinnati and Connecticut to get to 16.

Iowa State and Baylor join the American as replacement for cincinnati and UConn.

(07-27-2015 06:59 AM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  

(07-27-2015 12:14 AM)Marge Schott Wrote:  

(07-25-2015 02:13 PM)Lenvillecards Wrote:  The only way that the ACC would break up is if there isn't a network & ND doesn't come all in with possibly Texas.

If doomsday hits I could see FSU, Clemson, Miami, GT, VT & Louisville joining Texas, TT, Oklahoma, Ok State, Kansas, WV along with Missouri & Nebraska to form a new conference.

If I'm FSU, why even wait? Just try to create a conference like that right now.

1. Getting Missouri from the SEC and Nebraska from the B1G are not realistic.
2. If you try to balance it into 7 East and 7 West division teams, you get this:



Personally, I just don't think Kansas, Kansas State and Iowa State belong here. However, I think having more than 2 teams in Texas could also be a problem.

Take that lineup and add Cincinnati and ND and you have a premiere football conference.