What do you all think about adding them to the conference?

Personally, I like the idea of spreading the footprint into areas where the B1G doesn't have a presence for membership. New markets. New populations to plant flags in. New recruiting grounds that become footprint.

I would like to see them get a school in Texas since there isn't much of a presence in that state and there are plenty of Midwest folks who moved to Texas for various reasons.

I'd rather we stay at 14. Personally, I already feel much more disconnected to the teams in the west than I want and think any further expansion would make that far worse (we'd basically be 2+ conferences at that point).

(04-24-2016 02:06 PM)Nebraskafan Wrote:  What do you all think about adding them to the conference?

Personally, I like the idea of spreading the footprint into areas where the B1G doesn't have a presence for membership. New markets. New populations to plant flags in. New recruiting grounds that become footprint.

I would like to see them get a school in Texas since there isn't much of a presence in that state and there are plenty of Midwest folks who moved to Texas for various reasons.

Assuming Texsa and A&M aren't walking through that door the list becomes a bit interesting but all face various problems:

Houston - Growing school in a growing area of the country but not the most popular school in its own city, apparently. Academics aren't AAU-level yet but somewhat closer. Is a Carnegie R1 in research level. Good public school but having Rice in the same city detracts this somewhat.

TCU - Good academics but may be too small and private, even with a prime location.

Baylor - Religious affiliation would be a huge problem with northern elitists. Location close to the middle of the state would be interesting but culturally would be a misfit.

Texas Tech - Academics slowly improving and a public school getting funds from energy sales but location in a part of the state that's not fertile for recruiting purposes. Culture also a concern.

Rice - Has academic chops but sports needs more advancement. Sharing the city with UH a factor as well. Small and private, very few alumni.

SMU - Scandal still gives that school a taint even decades after. Another small, private school that would give the B1G fits.


Conclusion: if being in the state of Texas is that important then the Big Ten would have to forego some of their demands to get what they want. I suspect the COP/C aren't that desperate to take in a school that stands out for being so different from the vast majority of the B1G schools. That's why I would not rule Kansas, like you have. If we're talking about 20 (and I'm very skeptical of that happening) then the perfect can't be the enemy of the good. Kansas basketball is a brand and the B1G would be foolish to pass them if it means the other pieces don't go together.

7

(04-25-2016 12:00 AM)Transic_nyc Wrote:  

(04-24-2016 02:06 PM)Nebraskafan Wrote:  What do you all think about adding them to the conference?

Personally, I like the idea of spreading the footprint into areas where the B1G doesn't have a presence for membership. New markets. New populations to plant flags in. New recruiting grounds that become footprint.

I would like to see them get a school in Texas since there isn't much of a presence in that state and there are plenty of Midwest folks who moved to Texas for various reasons.

Assuming Texsa and A&M aren't walking through that door the list becomes a bit interesting but all face various problems:

Houston - Growing school in a growing area of the country but not the most popular school in its own city, apparently. Academics aren't AAU-level yet but somewhat closer. Is a Carnegie R1 in research level. Good public school but having Rice in the same city detracts this somewhat.

TCU - Good academics but may be too small and private, even with a prime location.

Baylor - Religious affiliation would be a huge problem with northern elitists. Location close to the middle of the state would be interesting but culturally would be a misfit.

Texas Tech - Academics slowly improving and a public school getting funds from energy sales but location in a part of the state that's not fertile for recruiting purposes. Culture also a concern.

Rice - Has academic chops but sports needs more advancement. Sharing the city with UH a factor as well. Small and private, very few alumni.

SMU - Scandal still gives that school a taint even decades after. Another small, private school that would give the B1G fits.


Conclusion: if being in the state of Texas is that important then the Big Ten would have to forego some of their demands to get what they want. I suspect the COP/C aren't that desperate to take in a school that stands out for being so different from the vast majority of the B1G schools. That's why I would not rule Kansas, like you have. If we're talking about 20 (and I'm very skeptical of that happening) then the perfect can't be the enemy of the good. Kansas basketball is a brand and the B1G would be foolish to pass them if it means the other pieces don't go together.

Rice,Houston or Kansas with that group is fine with me.

UConn

Ya UConn would be alright also.

In order of my preference: Texas, Notre Dame, Kansas.

Oklahoma & Texas should be the priorities, FSU being next. Dominoes...

(04-24-2016 02:06 PM)Nebraskafan Wrote:  What do you all think about adding them to the conference?

Personally, I like the idea of spreading the footprint into areas where the B1G doesn't have a presence for membership. New markets. New populations to plant flags in. New recruiting grounds that become footprint.

I would like to see them get a school in Texas since there isn't much of a presence in that state and there are plenty of Midwest folks who moved to Texas for various reasons.

Mizzou and KU and finally be done with this ridiculous stuff. College sports shouldn't be about money. Destroying history, tradition, and rivalries for the dollar isn't worth it.

(04-26-2016 02:11 PM)5thTiger Wrote:  

(04-24-2016 02:06 PM)Nebraskafan Wrote:  What do you all think about adding them to the conference?

Personally, I like the idea of spreading the footprint into areas where the B1G doesn't have a presence for membership. New markets. New populations to plant flags in. New recruiting grounds that become footprint.

I would like to see them get a school in Texas since there isn't much of a presence in that state and there are plenty of Midwest folks who moved to Texas for various reasons.

Mizzou and KU and finally be done with this ridiculous stuff. College sports shouldn't be about money. Destroying history, tradition, and rivalries for the dollar isn't worth it.

Why even expand at all if not for the money? Its not like Mizzou & KU have a particularly compelling historical rivalry with anyone in the Big Ten. Yes, Nebraska, but nothing to make the conference go "WOW we NEED to have them in our conference." Same goes for those wanting UConn. Nothing impressive being brought to the table here outside of a great basketball program. Hartford is a good market to add, but that's about it.

Texas & Oklahoma as a package though, that's the fantastic wow factor. THAT moves the needle, that makes the money, that adds to our conference's tradition, history, and adds a fantastic rivalry that extends to Nebraska as well.

The B1G isn't going to expand just for the sake of expanding. They are going after the money, which means the biggest markets and/or "Franchise player" type of schools... meaning the specific targets are Texas, Oklahoma, Florida State, Notre Dame, North Carolina, Duke.

(04-26-2016 02:46 PM)AntiG Wrote:  

(04-26-2016 02:11 PM)5thTiger Wrote:  

(04-24-2016 02:06 PM)Nebraskafan Wrote:  What do you all think about adding them to the conference?

Personally, I like the idea of spreading the footprint into areas where the B1G doesn't have a presence for membership. New markets. New populations to plant flags in. New recruiting grounds that become footprint.

I would like to see them get a school in Texas since there isn't much of a presence in that state and there are plenty of Midwest folks who moved to Texas for various reasons.

Mizzou and KU and finally be done with this ridiculous stuff. College sports shouldn't be about money. Destroying history, tradition, and rivalries for the dollar isn't worth it.

Why even expand at all if not for the money? Its not like Mizzou & KU have a particularly compelling historical rivalry with anyone in the Big Ten. Yes, Nebraska, but nothing to make the conference go "WOW we NEED to have them in our conference." Same goes for those wanting UConn. Nothing impressive being brought to the table here outside of a great basketball program. Hartford is a good market to add, but that's about it.

Texas & Oklahoma as a package though, that's the fantastic wow factor. THAT moves the needle, that makes the money, that adds to our conference's tradition, history, and adds a fantastic rivalry that extends to Nebraska as well.

The B1G isn't going to expand just for the sake of expanding. They are going after the money, which means the biggest markets and/or "Franchise player" type of schools... meaning the specific targets are Texas, Oklahoma, Florida State, Notre Dame, North Carolina, Duke.

Mizzou-kansas border war. Mizzou-Nebraska victory bell. kansas- nebraska. Mizzou-Illinois Braggin rights. Border with Iowa. Of the Top 22 most played programs for Mizzou, B1G schools make up 8, including former conference foes.
So far as rivalries/history go, Missouri is easily the most connected out of any remaining schools.

Oklahoma, Florida St, and UConn don't have academic (AAU) chops.

If Texas wanted to be in the B1G, they would be there already.

Duke isn't coming by themselves. Which would mean UNC, while skipping UVA.

Going beyond 16 is unrealistic at this point, and for the forseeable future (30 years). That means 2 schools (if any at all) that would get into the B1G. I'm not unrealistic, so I don't expect Missouri and Kansas to be invited anytime soon. Truth be told, the top 2 targets are almost definitely Virginia and UNC. Virginia, I can see, but I really don't think UNC would leave their comrades/rivals in the dust. The whole Georgia Tech, Florida St train is even more unrealistic than the Texas train, which is minuscule at best.

The best way to sum it up is that there are 2 spots up for grabs, with roughly 4 options in the West, and 4 options in the Central/East.

Missouri, Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas in the West. Notre Dame, Virginia, UNC, Duke in the Central/ East. Anyone else you have to go through these states to get to, which goes beyond 16. If I'm being extremely visionary, MAYBE throw UConn in there if they can grow football and academic reputations...but that would take decades.

(04-27-2016 09:37 AM)5thTiger Wrote:  MAYBE throw UConn in there if they can grow football and academic reputations...but that would take decades.

I'm not advocating for UConn's inclusion nor am I advocating against it. That being said there's nothing wrong with UConn academically whatsoever. They aren't a member of the AAU as their research output is not yet high enough to merit consideration for membership. AAU is not something that is an end all, be all for the conference. Its a great chip, but it would never keep Oklahoma out of the conference if they're able to come without any stowaways.

(04-27-2016 09:37 AM)5thTiger Wrote:  Mizzou-kansas border war. Mizzou-Nebraska victory bell. kansas- nebraska. Mizzou-Illinois Braggin rights. Border with Iowa. Of the Top 22 most played programs for Mizzou, B1G schools make up 8, including former conference foes.
So far as rivalries/history go, Missouri is easily the most connected out of any remaining schools.

Again this reiterates what I said before, there is history sure, but nothing impressive enough to make the B1G want to expand immediately. I'm not for or against Mizzou or KU, but there's a reason why they currently aren't in the conference, and that's because the B1G is trying to acquire either the target markets (Texas, Florida, Georgia, North Carolina - same reason why Rutgers got added obviously because they are the only NYC DMA FBS school other than Army), or the "franchise players" of NCAA football.

(04-27-2016 09:37 AM)5thTiger Wrote:  Oklahoma, Florida St, and UConn don't have academic (AAU) chops.

Academically all 3 are very good and eventually will get to AAU. AAU is not a requirement, but a preference.

(04-27-2016 09:37 AM)5thTiger Wrote:  If Texas wanted to be in the B1G, they would be there already.

Absolutely. Doesn't mean the door is closed. Like stated before the conference isn't just going to expand for the sake of expansion, they are specifically targeting. Texas, along with Notre Dame, have been their #1 target. IF Oklahoma to the B1G happens eventually (and they have indeed been in touch with the conference), the B12 destabilizes and may push Texas to either join the B1G, PAC or go independent.

(04-27-2016 09:37 AM)5thTiger Wrote:  Duke isn't coming by themselves. Which would mean UNC, while skipping UVA.

If UNC joins the B1G someday, most likely Duke will come along as well as an agreed upon package. But if UNC someday jumps to the SEC without Duke, then Duke will naturally want to join one of the two conferences (SEC or B1G) with B1G being the better fit.