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"Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
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f1do Online
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Post: #1
"Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
Tim Montemayor has weighed in from time to time on Big 12 expansion due to his ties to BYU from when he previously worked in the Salt Lake City market. Here is his string of tweets from last night: https://twitter.com/TheMontyShow

Quote:Long conversation w/ a #BYU source who said there is a "plan b" should #BIGXII expansion "go south"
Working to confirm a few things but #BYU has had discussions with other #BIGXII members about alternate plans should expansion fail
My feeling from talking to people today is #BYU & several CURRENT members of the #BIGXII have been working on plans outside of the #BIGXII
Tom Holmoe is a master relationship builder and I've been told repeatedly his singular goal is to position #BYU ...
...to compete for championships in major sports on an annual basis. The collapse of #BIGXII expansion has always been an possibility...
...I am told #Holmoe has been telling #BYU Leadership for sometime that alternative plans were needed.
Text just now: "Texas + other institutions in the state + #Houston & #BYU = a revenue & ratings machine in a super conference world"
"Everyone knows the #BIGXII shld add #Houston and #BYU but can't get along well enough to slice the pie...everyone is watching and waiting"

And so the plot thickens. If the Big 12 remains gridlocked on expansion, perhaps the Texas teams work with a TV network and break off, add some candidates of their choosing that the non-Texas schools won't support (Houston), and then bring in some others who help round out a decent ratings package and leave some of the contrarian schools to fend for themselves being shut out of Texas all together.Fuel To The Fire
09-14-2016 07:07 AM
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MWC Tex Offline
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Post: #2
RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
So...trying to schedule a couple of games with some Big 12 schools with the usual scheduling.
(This post was last modified: 09-14-2016 07:33 AM by MWC Tex.)
09-14-2016 07:29 AM
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CliftonAve Offline
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Post: #3
RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
Wait... so what this is saying there will be a new conference comprised of five Texas Teams and BYU?

Not buying it. I think the viewership countrywide will not be as good as they believe. As a result, the networks will pay less than the currently do for the Big 12. Don't see why the 4 Texas Big 12 programs would do this.
09-14-2016 07:42 AM
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shere khan Offline
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
(09-14-2016 07:07 AM)f1do Wrote:  Tim Montemayor has weighed in from time to time on Big 12 expansion due to his ties to BYU from when he previously worked in the Salt Lake City market. Here is his string of tweets from last night: https://twitter.com/TheMontyShow

Quote:Long conversation w/ a #BYU source who said there is a "plan b" should #BIGXII expansion "go south"
Working to confirm a few things but #BYU has had discussions with other #BIGXII members about alternate plans should expansion fail
My feeling from talking to people today is #BYU & several CURRENT members of the #BIGXII have been working on plans outside of the #BIGXII
Tom Holmoe is a master relationship builder and I've been told repeatedly his singular goal is to position #BYU ...
...to compete for championships in major sports on an annual basis. The collapse of #BIGXII expansion has always been an possibility...
...I am told #Holmoe has been telling #BYU Leadership for sometime that alternative plans were needed.
Text just now: "Texas + other institutions in the state + #Houston & #BYU = a revenue & ratings machine in a super conference world"
"Everyone knows the #BIGXII shld add #Houston and #BYU but can't get along well enough to slice the pie...everyone is watching and waiting"

And so the plot thickens. If the Big 12 remains gridlocked on expansion, perhaps the Texas teams work with a TV network and break off, add some candidates of their choosing that the non-Texas schools won't support (Houston), and then bring in some others who help round out a decent ratings package and leave some of the contrarian schools to fend for themselves being shut out of Texas all together.Fuel To The Fire
Bargaining stage
09-14-2016 07:43 AM
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
(09-14-2016 07:42 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Wait... so what this is saying there will be a new conference comprised of five Texas Teams and BYU?

Not buying it. I think the viewership countrywide will not be as good as they believe. As a result, the networks will pay less than the currently do for the Big 12. Don't see why the 4 Texas Big 12 programs would do this.

There would need to be other schools involved obviously. And it would certainly not be something that would happen if any other kind of compromise could be worked out. And its just more twitter rumors....but interesting fodder. With Texas having its Longhorn Network deal with ESPN and BYU having an ESPN contract, maybe they work something out there. Who knows.
(This post was last modified: 09-14-2016 07:58 AM by f1do.)
09-14-2016 07:57 AM
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
Every school in that league needs to be working on "Plan B" because they don't want to be the UCONN/USF/Cincy left holding the bag when everyone bolts for better homes.
09-14-2016 07:59 AM
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
(09-14-2016 07:42 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Wait... so what this is saying there will be a new conference comprised of five Texas Teams and BYU?

Not buying it. I think the viewership countrywide will not be as good as they believe. As a result, the networks will pay less than the currently do for the Big 12. Don't see why the 4 Texas Big 12 programs would do this.

I also doubt this will happen but if it did it would be 5 Texas schools, BYU, plus several of BSU, CSU, AFA, Cincy, Memphis, UConn, UCF, USF... you know, the usual suspects. A threat like that might move the needle for the programs resisting Houston's and/or BYU's admission to the conference.
09-14-2016 08:02 AM
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
If this happens, the new SWC would add Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, and Air Force and Boise St. for football only. The Big 12 would add UConn, Cincy, USF, UCF, and Army and Navy for football only. At this point ND and the new P6 would be the exclusive D1-A.
09-14-2016 08:05 AM
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Post: #9
RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
If a move like this were to happen, I'd think Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, and Baylor would all stick together. The question becomes where would someone like West Virginia (assuming their bridge in Cincinnati gets added) stands. And would the non-Texas bloc hold firm (Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State). Would Oklahoma try and jump for the SEC and leave Oklahoma State hanging? There may be a few defectors who would rather stick with the whole than figure out their "plan B". Then from non-P5 add the most frequently mentioned names in Houston, BYU, Cincinnati, UCONN, etc. to fill the gaps. This would require a deal with a TV network (ESPN and/or Fox) before it was done and would need support from them. Not sure if the schools left behind try and backfill in the AAC or something if they don't get snatched up by another P5 conference.

But I agree--the most likely scenario is this is a negotiating bluff. Although BYU has experience building a new conference before in the MWC which emerged from the expanded WAC.
09-14-2016 08:29 AM
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
(09-14-2016 08:05 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  If this happens, the new SWC would add Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, and Air Force and Boise St. for football only. The Big 12 would add UConn, Cincy, USF, UCF, and Army and Navy for football only. At this point ND and the new P6 would be the exclusive D1-A.

New SWC:
Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, Air Force, Boise State

New Big 12:
Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, West Virginia, UConn, Cincinnati, USF, UCF, Army, Navy

The question would be whether or not those conferences would be considered "P5" with half of the teams coming from G5 conferences. If the new SWC wasn't considered "P5", it wouldn't happen. But would the new Big 12 maintain? I would think especially no if Oklahoma were to jump to the SEC for example.
09-14-2016 08:35 AM
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CliftonAve Offline
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Post: #11
RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
(09-14-2016 08:02 AM)MinerInWisconsin Wrote:  
(09-14-2016 07:42 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Wait... so what this is saying there will be a new conference comprised of five Texas Teams and BYU?

Not buying it. I think the viewership countrywide will not be as good as they believe. As a result, the networks will pay less than the currently do for the Big 12. Don't see why the 4 Texas Big 12 programs would do this.

I also doubt this will happen but if it did it would be 5 Texas schools, BYU, plus several of BSU, CSU, AFA, Cincy, Memphis, UConn, UCF, USF... you know, the usual suspects. A threat like that might move the needle for the programs resisting Houston's and/or BYU's admission to the conference.

So the threat is to dump Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, K-State and WVU and replace them with Houston, BYU, CSU, AFA and Memphis?

If this threat is actually being thrown out there I am guessing Oklahoma and Kansas are rolling on the floor laughing.
09-14-2016 08:42 AM
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Post: #12
RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
(09-14-2016 08:35 AM)f1do Wrote:  
(09-14-2016 08:05 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  If this happens, the new SWC would add Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, and Air Force and Boise St. for football only. The Big 12 would add UConn, Cincy, USF, UCF, and Army and Navy for football only. At this point ND and the new P6 would be the exclusive D1-A.

New SWC:
Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, Air Force, Boise State

New Big 12:
Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, West Virginia, UConn, Cincinnati, USF, UCF, Army, Navy

The question would be whether or not those conferences would be considered "P5" with half of the teams coming from G5 conferences. If the new SWC wasn't considered "P5", it wouldn't happen. But would the new Big 12 maintain? I would think especially no if Oklahoma were to jump to the SEC for example.

What if the Oklahoma schools were with the Texas schools? That would be a very viable threat IMO. You'd have Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma St, Houston, BYU as the 8 core schools. Maybe add West Virginia and Cincy to make 10.

That would leave Kansas, Kansas St, Iowa St hanging on an island. Note that 2 of those 3 are the ones who have been most vocal about BYU.
09-14-2016 08:47 AM
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
(09-14-2016 08:47 AM)stever20 Wrote:  
(09-14-2016 08:35 AM)f1do Wrote:  
(09-14-2016 08:05 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  If this happens, the new SWC would add Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, and Air Force and Boise St. for football only. The Big 12 would add UConn, Cincy, USF, UCF, and Army and Navy for football only. At this point ND and the new P6 would be the exclusive D1-A.

New SWC:
Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, Air Force, Boise State

New Big 12:
Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, West Virginia, UConn, Cincinnati, USF, UCF, Army, Navy

The question would be whether or not those conferences would be considered "P5" with half of the teams coming from G5 conferences. If the new SWC wasn't considered "P5", it wouldn't happen. But would the new Big 12 maintain? I would think especially no if Oklahoma were to jump to the SEC for example.

What if the Oklahoma schools were with the Texas schools? That would be a very viable threat IMO. You'd have Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma St, Houston, BYU as the 8 core schools. Maybe add West Virginia and Cincy to make 10.

That would leave Kansas, Kansas St, Iowa St hanging on an island. Note that 2 of those 3 are the ones who have been most vocal about BYU.

Agreed. If the Oklahomas are in the plan is totally viable.
09-14-2016 08:51 AM
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Post: #14
RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
(09-14-2016 08:47 AM)stever20 Wrote:  
(09-14-2016 08:35 AM)f1do Wrote:  
(09-14-2016 08:05 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  If this happens, the new SWC would add Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, and Air Force and Boise St. for football only. The Big 12 would add UConn, Cincy, USF, UCF, and Army and Navy for football only. At this point ND and the new P6 would be the exclusive D1-A.

New SWC:
Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, Air Force, Boise State

New Big 12:
Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, West Virginia, UConn, Cincinnati, USF, UCF, Army, Navy

The question would be whether or not those conferences would be considered "P5" with half of the teams coming from G5 conferences. If the new SWC wasn't considered "P5", it wouldn't happen. But would the new Big 12 maintain? I would think especially no if Oklahoma were to jump to the SEC for example.

What if the Oklahoma schools were with the Texas schools? That would be a very viable threat IMO. You'd have Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma St, Houston, BYU as the 8 core schools. Maybe add West Virginia and Cincy to make 10.

That would leave Kansas, Kansas St, Iowa St hanging on an island. Note that 2 of those 3 are the ones who have been most vocal about BYU.

Lets refer back to the thread about kicking teams out of a conference. Thats what your scenario would be and i'm sure there would be a lawsuit where all the dirty laundry would be aired. So for the record thats NOT a realistic option and neither is this "Plan B".

More than likely Holmoes Plan B is to get a scheduling agreement with the schools receptive of adding them to the conference.

I also didn't think Mormons believed in premarital sex, how do they know about Plan B?

[Image: plan-b.jpg]
09-14-2016 08:57 AM
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
(09-14-2016 08:47 AM)stever20 Wrote:  
(09-14-2016 08:35 AM)f1do Wrote:  
(09-14-2016 08:05 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  If this happens, the new SWC would add Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, and Air Force and Boise St. for football only. The Big 12 would add UConn, Cincy, USF, UCF, and Army and Navy for football only. At this point ND and the new P6 would be the exclusive D1-A.

New SWC:
Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, Air Force, Boise State

New Big 12:
Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, West Virginia, UConn, Cincinnati, USF, UCF, Army, Navy

The question would be whether or not those conferences would be considered "P5" with half of the teams coming from G5 conferences. If the new SWC wasn't considered "P5", it wouldn't happen. But would the new Big 12 maintain? I would think especially no if Oklahoma were to jump to the SEC for example.

What if the Oklahoma schools were with the Texas schools? That would be a very viable threat IMO. You'd have Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma St, Houston, BYU as the 8 core schools. Maybe add West Virginia and Cincy to make 10.

That would leave Kansas, Kansas St, Iowa St hanging on an island. Note that 2 of those 3 are the ones who have been most vocal about BYU.


Basically wouldn't this be just kicking four members out of a conference? Wouldn't it violate the GOR, not to mention conference by-laws and any other contract that may be in existence?

I don't know the specifics of the contracts but I would imagine there would have to be cause for schools to get the boot and I doubt those schools have done anything to put their membership in jeopardy from a competitive standpoint (ie. Kansas basketball, K-State has been strong in football and Iowa State has great attendance/support).
09-14-2016 08:58 AM
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
Just more evidence that nobody has 8 votes and that the available candidates are simply not good enough to garner a real consensus.

Expansion gets tabled for another off season
09-14-2016 09:00 AM
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
(09-14-2016 08:57 AM)RutgersGuy Wrote:  
(09-14-2016 08:47 AM)stever20 Wrote:  
(09-14-2016 08:35 AM)f1do Wrote:  
(09-14-2016 08:05 AM)shizzle787 Wrote:  If this happens, the new SWC would add Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, and Air Force and Boise St. for football only. The Big 12 would add UConn, Cincy, USF, UCF, and Army and Navy for football only. At this point ND and the new P6 would be the exclusive D1-A.

New SWC:
Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Houston, BYU, SMU, Rice, UNLV, New Mexico, Air Force, Boise State

New Big 12:
Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, West Virginia, UConn, Cincinnati, USF, UCF, Army, Navy

The question would be whether or not those conferences would be considered "P5" with half of the teams coming from G5 conferences. If the new SWC wasn't considered "P5", it wouldn't happen. But would the new Big 12 maintain? I would think especially no if Oklahoma were to jump to the SEC for example.

What if the Oklahoma schools were with the Texas schools? That would be a very viable threat IMO. You'd have Texas, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma St, Houston, BYU as the 8 core schools. Maybe add West Virginia and Cincy to make 10.

That would leave Kansas, Kansas St, Iowa St hanging on an island. Note that 2 of those 3 are the ones who have been most vocal about BYU.

Lets refer back to the thread about kicking teams out of a conference. Thats what your scenario would be and i'm sure there would be a lawsuit where all the dirty laundry would be aired. So for the record thats NOT a realistic option and neither is this "Plan B".

More than likely Holmoes Plan B is to get a scheduling agreement with the schools receptive of adding them to the conference.

I also didn't think Mormons believed in premarital sex, how do they know about Plan B?

[Image: plan-b.jpg]

A scheduling agreement is certainly what I think is meant by "Plan B". I could see them agreeing to playing 4-6 Big 12 teams a yearsort of like how Notre Dame does with the ACC.
09-14-2016 09:00 AM
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
(09-14-2016 08:58 AM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Basically wouldn't this be just kicking four members out of a conference? Wouldn't it violate the GOR, not to mention conference by-laws and any other contract that may be in existence?

I don't know the specifics of the contracts but I would imagine there would have to be cause for schools to get the boot and I doubt those schools have done anything to put their membership in jeopardy from a competitive standpoint (ie. Kansas basketball, K-State has been strong in football and Iowa State has great attendance/support).

I have to agree but "if" and I stress "if" something like this was in the works I had this thought......

"If" the leaving schools secured the same payments and access to the playoffs they enjoy now through the end of existing contract what grounds would those left behind have to stand on.

It all boils down to loss of revenue and access if both are guaranteed I don't see much that could be called detrimental to those schools affected.

Again I am stressing "IF" not saying this is happening.
(This post was last modified: 09-14-2016 09:03 AM by GO Coogs GO!!!.)
09-14-2016 09:02 AM
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bluesox Offline
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Post: #19
RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
The Texas schools or really u of Texas isn't going to leave the big 12 to form a new league with byu. If the big 12 doesn't add byu as a member, I could see them form a scheduled alliance with byu for say 4-6 games per year.
09-14-2016 09:02 AM
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RE: "Plan B" on Big 12 expansion?
this is so dumb.
09-14-2016 09:04 AM
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