Pretty interesting article

http://www.fbschedules.com/2018/01/bowl-...rformance/

Not in the Big Ten. Michigan (5-4) jumped Sparty (7-2) and Northwestern (7-2).

(01-04-2018 07:26 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Not in the Big Ten. Michigan (5-4) jumped Sparty (7-2) and Northwestern (7-2).

Holiday bowl picked before the Outback bowl.

(01-04-2018 08:29 PM)utpotts Wrote:  

(01-04-2018 07:26 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Not in the Big Ten. Michigan (5-4) jumped Sparty (7-2) and Northwestern (7-2).

Holiday bowl picked before the Outback bowl.

Could be the case in other seasons but this season it was Outback.
https://www.freep.com/story/sports/colle...917908001/

(01-04-2018 07:05 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Pretty interesting article

http://www.fbschedules.com/2018/01/bowl-...rformance/

Nice find. A couple things to point out though:

1) Payout doesn't matter because all conferences throw the money into a common kitty and divide it up. So it's not like Texas got to keep $3.1 million from the Texas Bowl while Texas Tech was stuck with $1m for the Birmingham Bowl. Doesn't work that way. Sure some conferences like the SEC have a tiered system that allows teams that play in higher-pay bowls to keep a little more for travel, but these are small dollar differences.

2) That said, payout can be a proxy for something that does matter, the prestige of the bowl, because that gives the teams involved more media attention, a higher profile. E.g., playing in the Citrus Bowl, as LSU and Notre Dame did, was better than playing in the Birmingham Bowl, like USF and Texas Tech did, because the Citrus Bowl was played on New Year's Day and televised on ABC. That's just a much higher profile platform.

But a lot of times it doesn't matter. Take the Texas Bowl vs another Big 12 bowl, the Cactus Bowl. The Texas Bowl had a much higher payout, but really provided no advantage to playing in the Cactus Bowl. The games have the same name-recognition prestige, and one was played on 12/26 at 9 PM on ESPN, the other on 12/27 at 9 PM on ESPN. So no real difference there at all.

(01-05-2018 08:27 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(01-04-2018 07:05 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Pretty interesting article

http://www.fbschedules.com/2018/01/bowl-...rformance/

Nice find. A couple things to point out though:

1) Payout doesn't matter because all conferences throw the money into a common kitty and divide it up. So it's not like Texas got to keep $3.1 million from the Texas Bowl while Texas Tech was stuck with $1m for the Birmingham Bowl. Doesn't work that way. Sure some conferences like the SEC have a tiered system that allows teams that play in higher-pay bowls to keep a little more for travel, but these are small dollar differences.

2) That said, payout can be a proxy for something that does matter, the prestige of the bowl, because that gives the teams involved more media attention, a higher profile. E.g., playing in the Citrus Bowl, as LSU and Notre Dame did, was better than playing in the Birmingham Bowl, like USF and Texas Tech did, because the Citrus Bowl was played on New Year's Day and televised on ABC. That's just a much higher profile platform.

But a lot of times it doesn't matter. Take the Texas Bowl vs another Big 12 bowl, the Cactus Bowl. The Texas Bowl had a much higher payout, but really provided no advantage to playing in the Cactus Bowl. The games have the same name-recognition prestige, and one was played on 12/26 at 9 PM on ESPN, the other on 12/27 at 9 PM on ESPN. So no real difference there at all.

Quo, I think that depends on the conference about Payout. I know the ACC does pool the money. I would think other conferences may do the same but I believe the old Big East did not. In addition, even though the BWW Bowl was an ACC slot, ND gets the payout since they don't share in the bowl or CFP sharing.

(01-05-2018 08:27 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(01-04-2018 07:05 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Pretty interesting article

http://www.fbschedules.com/2018/01/bowl-...rformance/

Nice find. A couple things to point out though:

1) Payout doesn't matter because all conferences throw the money into a common kitty and divide it up. So it's not like Texas got to keep $3.1 million from the Texas Bowl while Texas Tech was stuck with $1m for the Birmingham Bowl. Doesn't work that way. Sure some conferences like the SEC have a tiered system that allows teams that play in higher-pay bowls to keep a little more for travel, but these are small dollar differences.

2) That said, payout can be a proxy for something that does matter, the prestige of the bowl, because that gives the teams involved more media attention, a higher profile. E.g., playing in the Citrus Bowl, as LSU and Notre Dame did, was better than playing in the Birmingham Bowl, like USF and Texas Tech did, because the Citrus Bowl was played on New Year's Day and televised on ABC. That's just a much higher profile platform.

But a lot of times it doesn't matter. Take the Texas Bowl vs another Big 12 bowl, the Cactus Bowl. The Texas Bowl had a much higher payout, but really provided no advantage to playing in the Cactus Bowl. The games have the same name-recognition prestige, and one was played on 12/26 at 9 PM on ESPN, the other on 12/27 at 9 PM on ESPN. So no real difference there at all.

Quo, I think that depends on the conference about Payout. I know the ACC does pool the money. I would think other conferences may do the same but I believe the old Big East did not. In addition, even though the BWW Bowl was an ACC slot, ND gets the payout since they don't share in the bowl or CFP sharing.

(01-05-2018 04:06 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  Quo, I think that depends on the conference about Payout. I know the ACC does pool the money. I would think other conferences may do the same but I believe the old Big East did not. In addition, even though the BWW Bowl was an ACC slot, ND gets the payout since they don't share in the bowl or CFP sharing.

I don't think this is correct. My understanding is that since Notre Dame is part of the ACC's bowl hierarchy, their Citrus money would go to the ACC, and then Notre Dame gets the same share of the non-CFP bowl money that all other ACC teams get. IOW's, for the non-CFP bowl games such as the Citrus, ND is part of the ACC pool just like Virginia is, though as you say they do not share in the ACC's CFP money.

The one thing I am unsure of is whether ND shares in the ACC's non-CFP money pool in all years or only years in which they make a (non-CFP) bowl game. But when they do play in a bowl game as part of the ACC's bowl tie-ins, their money is kicked back to the ACC and then they get a share of the overall non-CFP pool like all ACC teams do.

One last thing: The ACC - ND deal says that ND's spot in the ACC bowl hierarchy is determined by record. The bowls choose who they want from the available ACC teams, in this order:

1) Citrus (if ACC is in the Citrus, which only happens if the B1G is in the Orange Bowl)

2) Tier I Bowls - Belk, Sun, Pinstripe, Music City/Gator (ACC plays in one of these but not both each year)

- there is no picking order for these games. The bowls work it out amongst themselves. There is a coin flip process if two or more bowls in this tier insist on the same school.

3) Tier II Bowls - Military, Independence, Quick Lane, St. Pete (in that order)

Final note: The Citrus and Tier I bowls are bound by the "1 game" rule. Meaning, the can only choose team X over team Y if team X is within 1 win of team Y. That prevents a bowl from taking say 7-5 Notre Dame over 9-3 Wake Forest. They could take 8-4 Notre Dame over 9-3 Wake Forest.

Note that overall record, including FSC wins, is the only thing that counts here, not conference record, and H2H doesn't matter either.

In this case, the Citrus was able to take Notre Dame, because at 9-3, there was no available ACC team that had a more than one win advantage over the Irish.

It is old, but ND only gets that bowl money they are chosen too and does not share in the conference bowl collection. The same way they are not part of the ACC CFP payout. They only get that if they are full ACC football members. Similar as why they can't take the Orange bowl slot from the ACC.

http://www.espn.com/blog/ncfnation/post/...rrangement

(01-05-2018 08:14 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  It is old, but ND only gets that bowl money they are chosen too and does not share in the conference bowl collection. The same way they are not part of the ACC CFP payout. They only get that if they are full ACC football members. Similar as why they can't take the Orange bowl slot from the ACC.

http://www.espn.com/blog/ncfnation/post/...rrangement

I think you are misinterpreting. From the article you link there is this passage:

"Notre Dame could step over an ACC team and take its place in one of the non-BCS bowls if its record is better than, equal to or within one win of the ACC team or ranked higher in the BCS standings. Notre Dame would share in the revenues if selected to any of those bowls, and get an expenses allowance. If Notre Dame is picked for a BCS game, it would keep its revenues from that appearance."

To me, that is saying that if ND plays in a non-CFP bowl, they *share* in that revenue (not keeping it all for themselves). I think this interpretation is further bolstered by the statement that ND also gets an expense allowance from the ACC, which is also characteristic of a school sharing in a bowl pool. Finally, the last sentence which refers to playing in the CFP bowls, says ND keeps its revenues from the BCS bowl game, which is different language from "sharing" it as in the description of the non-CFP bowl games.

Here's a more recent article that says ND will "kick" its Citrus money back to the ACC for redistribution:

https://247sports.com/college/notre-dame...-111655034

(01-05-2018 08:30 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(01-05-2018 08:14 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  It is old, but ND only gets that bowl money they are chosen too and does not share in the conference bowl collection. The same way they are not part of the ACC CFP payout. They only get that if they are full ACC football members. Similar as why they can't take the Orange bowl slot from the ACC.

http://www.espn.com/blog/ncfnation/post/...rrangement

I think you are misinterpreting. From the article you link there is this passage:

"Notre Dame could step over an ACC team and take its place in one of the non-BCS bowls if its record is better than, equal to or within one win of the ACC team or ranked higher in the BCS standings. Notre Dame would share in the revenues if selected to any of those bowls, and get an expenses allowance. If Notre Dame is picked for a BCS game, it would keep its revenues from that appearance."

To me, that is saying that if ND plays in a non-CFP bowl, they *share* in that revenue (not keeping it all for themselves). I think this interpretation is further bolstered by the statement that ND also gets an expense allowance from the ACC, which is also characteristic of a school sharing in a bowl pool. Finally, the last sentence which refers to playing in the CFP bowls, says ND keeps its revenues from the BCS bowl game, which is different language from "sharing" it as in the description of the non-CFP bowl games.

Here's a more recent article that says ND will "kick" its Citrus money back to the ACC for redistribution:

https://247sports.com/college/notre-dame...-111655034

That's correct. Notre Dame does not share in the NY6/CFP money. They get to keep what they kill. But they pool the money from the non-NY6 bowls.

I stand corrected.

In addition, I found a link that shows the bowl payouts to be split from the teams. Glad I was incorrect, glad to see the ACC did not give up all the bowl money to ND. For the CFP, worst case scenario is really small in payout comparison, 6 additional million to pay in the CFP playoffs.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristidosh/...b9ac3b2938

(01-05-2018 10:03 PM)bullet Wrote:  That's correct. Notre Dame does not share in the NY6/CFP money. They get to keep what they kill. But they pool the money from the non-NY6 bowls.

One weird caveat with ND's NY6 payout is with the Orange Bowl. The ACC and their B1G or SEC opponents each get $27.5M for playing in the bowl. If ND is selected to the orange, they only get $13.75M and the ACC gets $41.5M.

http://www.espn.com/college-football/sto...new-format

(01-05-2018 11:05 PM)ColKurtz Wrote:  

(01-05-2018 10:03 PM)bullet Wrote:  That's correct. Notre Dame does not share in the NY6/CFP money. They get to keep what they kill. But they pool the money from the non-NY6 bowls.

One weird caveat with ND's NY6 payout is with the Orange Bowl. The ACC and their B1G or SEC opponents each get $27.5M for playing in the bowl. If ND is selected to the orange, they only get $13.75M and the ACC gets $41.5M.

http://www.espn.com/college-football/sto...new-format

Yes, and that's a big Cha-Ching! situation for both ND and the ACC. But unfortunately, the deal with the SEC/B1G says that can only happen twice in the eight years of the CFP where the OB is not a playoff game, and it doesn't have to happen at all. So far, there have been 3 opportunities for it to happen but it hasn't.

(01-05-2018 10:06 PM)msm96wolf Wrote:  I stand corrected.

In addition, I found a link that shows the bowl payouts to be split from the teams. Glad I was incorrect, glad to see the ACC did not give up all the bowl money to ND.

When the Orange Bowl is not a playoff bowl, the best money situation for the ACC is when ND makes the Orange Bowl, because then the ACC gets $41.5m from the OB that year.

The next best situation is what just happened, the B1G making the Orange Bowl, because the ACC gets its normal $27.5m from the OB but also $4.25m for replacing the B1G in the Citrus Bowl (as per the OB agreement). Notre Dame repped the ACC in the Citrus this year.

The worst situation is when the SEC makes the OB, because then the ACC just gets the $27.5m for the OB but does not get to play in the Citrus bowl, the non-CFP bowl with the highest payout, as the SEC's deal with the Citrus says it always plays in that bowl.

Citrus is valuable, it's basically equal in payout to putting a team in a non-playoff NY6 bowl. The ACC and SEC got as much from the Citrus as the PAC and B1G got for having USC and Ohio State in the Cotton Bowl.