(01-29-2018 11:18 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(01-29-2018 08:21 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  While I agree that presidents are always going to buy as much house as they can afford you still have to make the mortgage payment.

No you don't. The house is paid for.

Quote:I think it is very plausible that La Salle cannot afford a budget that is competitive.

Then they won't be competitive. They'll still be in the A-10 though.

That's what would be interesting to see in the study. Do you save net money by dropping to the MAAC? The real problem is that IIRC, the A-10 has some pretty strong requirements for athletic department budgets.

(01-29-2018 11:13 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  And A-10 revenue, while higher than mid major conferences, is not 20 million a year. Its not even close. At my A-10 school, half the attendance was students, who got in for no incremental revenue. The good news? Students actually attended the games. Bad news? At LaSalle, there aren't a whole lot of students to begin with. And LaSalle, suffering through decades of bad seasons, and in the same city as Villanova, Temple, Drexel, Penn, and St Josephs, is unlikely to have much local support. LaSalle does have that NCAA Championship banner hanging in its rafters....but beyond that, its really small, its really poor, and it really hasn't done much in the A-10.

What are they getting for that likely 10+ million dollar deficit each year? I just don't see it make much sense for them. They've fallen further behind St Josephs, which appears to be a much better fit.

That Sweet 16 run may be one of the biggest flashes in the pan ever. They had to win three games to get there too. Pretty much all of La Salle’s NCAA Tournament wins came in three different seasons. Another one pretty much wasn't even an NCAA Tournament game.

That NCAA title was so long ago no one can relate to it, except Bill Raftery. Send it in Jerome!

(01-29-2018 11:18 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(01-29-2018 08:21 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  While I agree that presidents are always going to buy as much house as they can afford you still have to make the mortgage payment.

No you don't. The house is paid for.

Quote:I think it is very plausible that La Salle cannot afford a budget that is competitive.

Then they won't be competitive. They'll still be in the A-10 though.

The house is not paid for.
They annually award scholarships in 25 sports. Those cost money. That’s roughly 250 student athletes paying either discounted tuition or none at all.
Those sports travel. They have recruiting budgets. They have to pay reasonably competitive salaries.

I don’t have any doubts that La Salle currently spends more than it can afford.
A10 apparently only requires schools to sponsor men’s and women’s hoops and may have a minimum conference sport requirement since everyone plays at least 15.

If I were laying money I’d bet the talk of leaving A10 is floating to make dropping sports more palatable. La Salle offers 21 conference sports and appear to be the only school playing every league sport. They also play non-league sports of men’s and women’s water polo, women’s golf and treat non-NCAA men’s rowing as a varsity sport so there is room for cuts.


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(01-30-2018 01:05 AM)arkstfan Wrote:  

(01-29-2018 11:18 PM)johnbragg Wrote:  

(01-29-2018 08:21 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  While I agree that presidents are always going to buy as much house as they can afford you still have to make the mortgage payment.

No you don't. The house is paid for.

Quote:I think it is very plausible that La Salle cannot afford a budget that is competitive.

Then they won't be competitive. They'll still be in the A-10 though.

The house is not paid for.
They annually award scholarships in 25 sports. Those cost money. That’s roughly 250 student athletes paying either discounted tuition or none at all.
Those sports travel. They have recruiting budgets. They have to pay reasonably competitive salaries.

I don’t have any doubts that La Salle currently spends more than it can afford.
A10 apparently only requires schools to sponsor men’s and women’s hoops and may have a minimum conference sport requirement since everyone plays at least 15.

If I were laying money I’d bet the talk of leaving A10 is floating to make dropping sports more palatable. La Salle offers 21 conference sports and appear to be the only school playing every league sport. They also play non-league sports of men’s and women’s water polo, women’s golf and treat non-NCAA men’s rowing as a varsity sport so there is room for cuts.


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They have not only A-10 sports, but Big 5 sports. Last thing LaSalle wants is to lose their Big 5 designation. It what separates them from Drexel.

(01-29-2018 11:30 PM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  That's what would be interesting to see in the study. Do you save net money by dropping to the MAAC? The real problem is that IIRC, the A-10 has some pretty strong requirements for athletic department budgets.

I don't think they would, the MAAC is actually a little more spread out than at first glance and a clear step down. While the A-10 is more spread out, all of it's members are close to a nice sized airport except maybe Bonnie, which is still reasonably close to Buffalo.

Northeast Conference sounds the most likely if the goal is to downgrade.

Musical Chairs.....

NEC (LaSalle)
A10 (Siena)
MAAC (New Jersey Tech)

That would get everyone into a more appropriate conference IMO.

(01-30-2018 01:37 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  They have not only A-10 sports, but Big 5 sports. Last thing LaSalle wants is to lose their Big 5 designation. It what separates them from Drexel.

What separates them from Drexel is their well known, granted, mostly ancient history in basketball. They're not fooling anyone with a trained eye. Same goes for Saint Joe's, who also pretty much has history and nothing else going for it. What separates Penn is history and that Ivy deal.

Unfortunately, one fluke run aside, La Salle's history is ancient. They may be able to rack up more wins and NCAA Tournament appearances with a drop in competition. Sometimes you have to swallow your pride.

(01-30-2018 02:08 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Northeast Conference sounds the most likely if the goal is to downgrade.

Musical Chairs.....

NEC (LaSalle)
A10 (Siena)
MAAC (New Jersey Tech)

That would get everyone into a more appropriate conference IMO.

The NEC would be too steep of a drop. The MAAC or CAA would be ideal. They could still garner an at-large bid in either. Good luck getting anything higher than a 14-seed out of the NEC in a typical year.

And I agree, Siena belongs in the A-10.

(01-30-2018 02:08 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Northeast Conference sounds the most likely if the goal is to downgrade.

Musical Chairs.....

NEC (LaSalle)
A10 (Siena)
MAAC (New Jersey Tech)

That would get everyone into a more appropriate conference IMO.

The Metro Atlantic consists entirely of private schools with enrollments under 10K, that’s an identity that the front office intentionally plans and keeps, and is probably what could make the league attractive for LaSalle again. The NEC and CAA are football leagues without much else in common among their members. The MAAC would never take NJIT, although America East might if they felt pinched for members. I’d like to see Siena get into the A-10, but if that can’t happen, I like LaSalle as #12 in the MAAC.

(01-30-2018 01:37 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  They have not only A-10 sports, but Big 5 sports. Last thing LaSalle wants is to lose their Big 5 designation. It what separates them from Drexel.

Big 5 is only for hoops.

Assuming the A10 needs 3/4 to expand if LaSalle leaves, what candidate could garner 10 votes out of the 13 remaining schools
If it is 2/3, 9 votes will be needed.

I think they would just sit pat at 13

(01-30-2018 08:54 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Assuming the A10 needs 3/4 to expand if LaSalle leaves, what candidate could garner 10 votes out of the 13 remaining schools
If it is 2/3, 9 votes will be needed.

I think they would just sit pat at 13

Its possible they expand. Its also possible they sit at 13. They don't lose much if LaSalle bolts. Olympic sports work just fine with 13 teams.

I think Siena would be given first go at it if the league decides to expand.

(01-30-2018 09:34 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(01-30-2018 08:54 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Assuming the A10 needs 3/4 to expand if LaSalle leaves, what candidate could garner 10 votes out of the 13 remaining schools
If it is 2/3, 9 votes will be needed.

I think they would just sit pat at 13

Its possible they expand. Its also possible they sit at 13. They don't lose much if LaSalle bolts. Olympic sports work just fine with 13 teams.

I think Siena would be given first go at it if the league decides to expand.

Here is who I see definitely being against Siena but please correct me if you disagree
UMass, URI, VCU, GMU, Davidson

I dont see the big public schools wanting another small NY private that doesn't bring that much to the table. Davidson will join in to try to get someone close to Charlotte.

If those 5 are against it, expansion cannot happen unless its simple majority rules.

(01-30-2018 09:37 AM)solohawks Wrote:  

(01-30-2018 09:34 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(01-30-2018 08:54 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Assuming the A10 needs 3/4 to expand if LaSalle leaves, what candidate could garner 10 votes out of the 13 remaining schools
If it is 2/3, 9 votes will be needed.

I think they would just sit pat at 13

Its possible they expand. Its also possible they sit at 13. They don't lose much if LaSalle bolts. Olympic sports work just fine with 13 teams.

I think Siena would be given first go at it if the league decides to expand.

Here is who I see definitely being against Siena but please correct me if you disagree
UMass, URI, VCU, GMU, Davidson

I dont see the big public schools wanting another small NY private that doesn't bring that much to the table. Davidson will join in to try to get someone close to Charlotte.

If those 5 are against it, expansion cannot happen unless its simple majority rules.

URI and UMass really don't act much like a traditional public school. And Siena helps them shift the conference a bit further north. It also stops a run at BU/Northeastern, which they most certainly DO NOT want.

I think you might want to subtract UMass and URI from the no votes on Siena and add (perhaps) add St Louis and Dayton to the no votes on Siena.

Preface this by saying 1) I don't believe that LaSalle actually leaves the A10 and 2) if LaSalle actually did leave it seems like the perfect opportunity for the A10 to consolidate a bit - there's no reason for them to be at 14. That being said, I'm a little surprised Vermont doesn't get mentioned a bit more in these theoreticals. Reasonably-sized public flagship in a good college town that seems to have outgrown their conference a bit. Geography works too.

(01-30-2018 09:42 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(01-30-2018 09:37 AM)solohawks Wrote:  

(01-30-2018 09:34 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(01-30-2018 08:54 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Assuming the A10 needs 3/4 to expand if LaSalle leaves, what candidate could garner 10 votes out of the 13 remaining schools
If it is 2/3, 9 votes will be needed.

I think they would just sit pat at 13

Its possible they expand. Its also possible they sit at 13. They don't lose much if LaSalle bolts. Olympic sports work just fine with 13 teams.

I think Siena would be given first go at it if the league decides to expand.

Here is who I see definitely being against Siena but please correct me if you disagree
UMass, URI, VCU, GMU, Davidson

I dont see the big public schools wanting another small NY private that doesn't bring that much to the table. Davidson will join in to try to get someone close to Charlotte.

If those 5 are against it, expansion cannot happen unless its simple majority rules.

URI and UMass really don't act much like a traditional public school. And Siena helps them shift the conference a bit further north. It also stops a run at BU/Northeastern, which they most certainly DO NOT want.

I think you might want to subtract UMass and URI from the no votes on Siena and add (perhaps) add St Louis and Dayton to the no votes on Siena.

But you don't need to expand to avoid adding BU/Northeastern. I think UMass and URI would rather stand pat and wait than expand with another small private catholic based school.

If I were URI or UMass and really wanted to expand, I would look at Vermont before Siena.

If you really wanted to have fun with it, if Vermont left to join the A10, I wouldn't be surprised to see the A East make a play for Delaware, Towson, Drexel, and Northeastern. Getting Delaware and Towson would allow the A East to take over the football league from the CAA. With Drexel and Northeastern coming along as well, there is something in it for the non Football schools as well.

(01-30-2018 02:08 AM)Kittonhead Wrote:  Northeast Conference sounds the most likely if the goal is to downgrade.

Musical Chairs.....

NEC (LaSalle)
A10 (Siena)
MAAC (New Jersey Tech)

That would get everyone into a more appropriate conference IMO.

It's NJIT. Nobody calls it New Jersey Tech.

(01-30-2018 09:55 AM)solohawks Wrote:  

(01-30-2018 09:42 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(01-30-2018 09:37 AM)solohawks Wrote:  

(01-30-2018 09:34 AM)Tom in Lazybrook Wrote:  

(01-30-2018 08:54 AM)solohawks Wrote:  Assuming the A10 needs 3/4 to expand if LaSalle leaves, what candidate could garner 10 votes out of the 13 remaining schools
If it is 2/3, 9 votes will be needed.

I think they would just sit pat at 13

Its possible they expand. Its also possible they sit at 13. They don't lose much if LaSalle bolts. Olympic sports work just fine with 13 teams.

I think Siena would be given first go at it if the league decides to expand.

Here is who I see definitely being against Siena but please correct me if you disagree
UMass, URI, VCU, GMU, Davidson

I dont see the big public schools wanting another small NY private that doesn't bring that much to the table. Davidson will join in to try to get someone close to Charlotte.

If those 5 are against it, expansion cannot happen unless its simple majority rules.

URI and UMass really don't act much like a traditional public school. And Siena helps them shift the conference a bit further north. It also stops a run at BU/Northeastern, which they most certainly DO NOT want.

I think you might want to subtract UMass and URI from the no votes on Siena and add (perhaps) add St Louis and Dayton to the no votes on Siena.

But you don't need to expand to avoid adding BU/Northeastern. I think UMass and URI would rather stand pat and wait than expand with another small private catholic based school.

If I were URI or UMass and really wanted to expand, I would look at Vermont before Siena.

I agree with you about BU/Northeastern. I don't think the A-10 really is interested in making a play. And BU appears to be happy in the Patriot.

I'd prefer Vermont to Siena. But that's just me. But I think that if LaSalle leaves, the best solution is....nothing.