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Proposal to let athletes transfer instantly after a coaching change picks up steam
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dbackjon Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Proposal to let athletes transfer instantly after a coaching change picks up steam
(01-31-2018 07:31 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 06:36 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 04:09 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 02:36 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 01:36 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  As much as I am opposed to instant eligibility in general (to prevent smaller schools from becoming defacto farm systems), these proposals make sense.


If coaches have the freedom to come and go without penalty, so athletes if the coach leaves.

And coaches NEVER should have been able to block transfers to certain schools.

I don't agree with never. I believe that a coach should be able to block a transfer to any scheduled opponents during the span of eligibility for competitive reasons. If a player wants to transfer from East Central State the ECS coach should be able to block them from going to Middle Northern Tech if Middle Northern Tech is on their schedule every year.

That would be the only blocking I would be in favor of.

Why should a coach be able to take a new job with a school that is a scheduled opponent of their current school, but a player can't do the same?

Dan Mullen and Florida play Mississippi State NEXT YEAR. To be fair with Kaplony, Florida needs to forfeit the game.

You might have a point if Mississippi State was locked in to playing the exact same style of ball they played when Mullen was there, but with a new coaching staff comes a new style of play so you don't.

A player leaving a team to go to an opponent provides an unnatural insight into how a team is going to do things.

But as the former HC, he has knowledge of what his PLAYERS strengths and weaknesses are, far more than a single player would be able to help a new coach.
01-31-2018 07:39 PM
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Wedge Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Proposal to let athletes transfer instantly after a coaching change picks up steam
(01-31-2018 02:23 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  What I think is interesting is the potential for abuse by the new coach. Hey I'm not going to renew your scholarship at Enormous State University but the coach at Northeastsouthwest Tech has said if you transfer there you have a scholarship waiting on you. Makes it easier for the new coach to clean house and recruit his own people.

This happens all the time anyway. It's most prominent in basketball, where some newly-hired coaches make it a condition of accepting the job that the school agrees the new coach can non-renew any or all players who are on the roster when he is hired.
01-31-2018 07:43 PM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Proposal to let athletes transfer instantly after a coaching change picks up steam
(01-31-2018 07:28 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 04:09 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 02:36 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 01:36 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  As much as I am opposed to instant eligibility in general (to prevent smaller schools from becoming defacto farm systems), these proposals make sense.


If coaches have the freedom to come and go without penalty, so athletes if the coach leaves.

And coaches NEVER should have been able to block transfers to certain schools.

I don't agree with never. I believe that a coach should be able to block a transfer to any scheduled opponents during the span of eligibility for competitive reasons. If a player wants to transfer from East Central State the ECS coach should be able to block them from going to Middle Northern Tech if Middle Northern Tech is on their schedule every year.

That would be the only blocking I would be in favor of.

Why should a coach be able to take a new job with a school that is a scheduled opponent of their current school, but a player can't do the same?

Typically a coach takes his strategy, etc. with him when he goes and it's replaced by the next coach. He doesn't change his coaching strategy when a player leaves.

Yes, but that coach also takes very detailed knowledge of the abilities and tendencies of the players he leaves behind. His knowledge is likely much broader and deeper than that of a player who leaves.

I daresay that if both Dabo Swinney and Clemson's starting right defensive end both left Clemson this year, the former for FSU, the latter for South Carolina, FSU would know a whole lot more about Clemson's team next year than would SC.
01-31-2018 07:43 PM
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JRsec Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Proposal to let athletes transfer instantly after a coaching change picks up steam
I've thought about this after reading the thread.

I'm for letting the kids move anywhere they want to including to a rival. I have one exception. They shouldn't be permitted to move to the old coach's new school.

I also agree with Attack Coug about raising the signing cap limit for the season affected by transfers.

My objection to transferring to the old coach's new school is that this is where the real danger is. A coach leaving could gut key personnel if they were permitted to travel to the coach's new school. I think that needs to be nipped. Other than that the kids should be free to play anywhere else.
01-31-2018 11:01 PM
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Kaplony Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Proposal to let athletes transfer instantly after a coaching change picks up steam
(01-31-2018 07:43 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 07:28 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 04:09 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 02:36 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 01:36 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  As much as I am opposed to instant eligibility in general (to prevent smaller schools from becoming defacto farm systems), these proposals make sense.


If coaches have the freedom to come and go without penalty, so athletes if the coach leaves.

And coaches NEVER should have been able to block transfers to certain schools.

I don't agree with never. I believe that a coach should be able to block a transfer to any scheduled opponents during the span of eligibility for competitive reasons. If a player wants to transfer from East Central State the ECS coach should be able to block them from going to Middle Northern Tech if Middle Northern Tech is on their schedule every year.

That would be the only blocking I would be in favor of.

Why should a coach be able to take a new job with a school that is a scheduled opponent of their current school, but a player can't do the same?

Typically a coach takes his strategy, etc. with him when he goes and it's replaced by the next coach. He doesn't change his coaching strategy when a player leaves.

Yes, but that coach also takes very detailed knowledge of the abilities and tendencies of the players he leaves behind. His knowledge is likely much broader and deeper than that of a player who leaves.

I daresay that if both Dabo Swinney and Clemson's starting right defensive end both left Clemson this year, the former for FSU, the latter for South Carolina, FSU would know a whole lot more about Clemson's team next year than would SC.

Actually they would both have the same level of information, almost nothing, because the new coach is going to have a totally new strategy and approach to a game. They can tell them what they did the year before all they want and it's not going to help very much because of a new style of offense/defense/etc.
02-01-2018 12:26 AM
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chiefsfan Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Proposal to let athletes transfer instantly after a coaching change picks up steam
Never been a fan of free transfers. You commit to the school, not to the coach. My fear is that larger schools will use this to their advantage to gut smaller schools of top players every coaching change.

Imagine if schools had the freedom to gut Central Florida's roster because Frost left and the players earned immediate transfer eligibility. Even if Nebraska couldn't come and do it, that wouldn't stop anyone else.

I just don't like the idea of a system that is athlete friendly. It should be school friendly.
02-01-2018 02:46 AM
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The Cutter of Bish Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Proposal to let athletes transfer instantly after a coaching change picks up steam
If the coaches can walk around freely, so should the kids. The fact that it hasn't been implemented yet shows there is no honor among the thieves, still.

This will happen for the kids...but not until there's a solution for schools losing the scholarship. And since there never was a firm adoption of the full-commitment from schools to kids no matter who the coach was, this alternative seems disingenuous and self-serving. It allows the "not my kid" practice of house-cleaning to remain, and by giving the kids some more freedom, also allows the school who sheds the kids to invest less in supporting them finding alternatives.

You'll still have that unspoken rule thing about taking certain programs' guys in places...that will never change.
02-01-2018 04:38 AM
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EmeryZach Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Proposal to let athletes transfer instantly after a coaching change picks up steam
This could possibly devastate teams, especially basketball. I really hope it doesn't happen.
02-01-2018 08:27 AM
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Post: #29
RE: Proposal to let athletes transfer instantly after a coaching change picks up steam
(01-31-2018 07:43 PM)Wedge Wrote:  
(01-31-2018 02:23 PM)arkstfan Wrote:  What I think is interesting is the potential for abuse by the new coach. Hey I'm not going to renew your scholarship at Enormous State University but the coach at Northeastsouthwest Tech has said if you transfer there you have a scholarship waiting on you. Makes it easier for the new coach to clean house and recruit his own people.

This happens all the time anyway. It's most prominent in basketball, where some newly-hired coaches make it a condition of accepting the job that the school agrees the new coach can non-renew any or all players who are on the roster when he is hired.

But it is very rare in football because of the 25 newcomer limit and 76.5 minimum scholarship requirements.

When Blake Anderson was hired as the 5th coach in five year at AState he couldn't run anyone off and was actively trying to keep some marginal guys with bad attitudes from quitting to avoid falling under the minimum scholarship limits.

The only deterrent in basketball is APR. When Central Arkansas hired their coach they were already in APR trouble so the new coach flushed the team and started over.
02-01-2018 10:04 AM
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Post: #30
RE: Proposal to let athletes transfer instantly after a coaching change picks up steam
(01-31-2018 11:01 PM)JRsec Wrote:  I've thought about this after reading the thread.

I'm for letting the kids move anywhere they want to including to a rival. I have one exception. They shouldn't be permitted to move to the old coach's new school.

I also agree with Attack Coug about raising the signing cap limit for the season affected by transfers.

My objection to transferring to the old coach's new school is that this is where the real danger is. A coach leaving could gut key personnel if they were permitted to travel to the coach's new school. I think that needs to be nipped. Other than that the kids should be free to play anywhere else.
That's in the proposal.
The interesting thing is when a coach leaves for a bigger job, usually having access to more assistant money means not every assistant gets to go to the new school. I'm curious if an assistant who lands at a school other than the head coach's new school will be covered.
02-01-2018 10:07 AM
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