The leftist know all to well. They can’t enslave us as long as we can shoot back.

If you think the NRA should be accountable for mass shooters then CNN editors should be accountable for ISIS videos shown on social media and Democrats should be held accountable for violent crimes by illegal aliens.

To me the NRA is simply another lobbyist group. They actually work for the firearms industry and are a conduit for gun industry money to the politicians. The gun industrys love this stuff because after many shootings gun sales sky rocket.
Responsibility for these shootings has to be shared. If we continue pointing at others, we are playing the role of victim and not taking responsibility for our part.
The NRA plays a role, that's all. They are not responsible, we all are.

(02-16-2018 12:04 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  To me the NRA is simply another lobbyist group. They actually work for the firearms industry and are a conduit for gun industry money to the politicians. The gun industrys love this stuff because after many shootings gun sales sky rocket.
Responsibility for these shootings has to be shared. If we continue pointing at others, we are playing the role of victim and not taking responsibility for our part.
The NRA plays a role, that's all. They are not responsible, we all are.

Could listen to your point of view until “we all are”. The shooter has complete guilt in all cases. No one else pulled the trigger.

The fact that we need an organization like the NRA to lobby for rights already granted to us justifies the work that the NRA does.

Next car crash, I say we go after the UAW.

The NRA is a group of citizens exercisung their rights of freedom of association to exercise their rights of freedom of expression and right to redress of grievances collectively. Exactly the same as Planned Parenthood, a labor union, the Sierra Club, etc.

Remington, Winchester, etc. are also collections of shareholders or private owners who are also exercising their rights collectively. No different than the shareholders of Facebook, Amazon, Tesla, Wind Farm Inc., Target, or Starbucks when they lobby. The citizens who own shares in these companies have exactly the same rights to association, speech, and redress as non-shareholders.

When people do not like that speech, or think that speech is too influential, or getting more traction than their speech, the first cry is for THEIR collective rights to be hamstrung.



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(02-16-2018 12:19 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  The fact that we need an organization like the NRA to lobby for rights already granted to us justifies the work that the NRA does.

If the NRA didn't exist, do you really think the 2nd amendment would have been repealed by now?

5 million members, 0 mass shooters

If only every one was the model NRA member.

(02-16-2018 12:09 PM)SoMs Eagle Wrote:  

(02-16-2018 12:04 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  To me the NRA is simply another lobbyist group. They actually work for the firearms industry and are a conduit for gun industry money to the politicians. The gun industrys love this stuff because after many shootings gun sales sky rocket.
Responsibility for these shootings has to be shared. If we continue pointing at others, we are playing the role of victim and not taking responsibility for our part.
The NRA plays a role, that's all. They are not responsible, we all are.

Could listen to your point of view until “we all are”. The shooter has complete guilt in all cases. No one else pulled the trigger.

I am saying we are all guilty by allowing the conditions to exist and persist that created this situation. Maybe I should have said negligent. Of course the shooter is solely guilty of committing the act, but I believe we are negligent by not doing more to change the culture that has historically tacitly approved of violence.

(02-16-2018 12:35 PM)fsquid Wrote:  

(02-16-2018 12:19 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  The fact that we need an organization like the NRA to lobby for rights already granted to us justifies the work that the NRA does.

If the NRA didn't exist, do you really think the 2nd amendment would have been repealed by now?

No but motards like this woman would probably be regulating guns .

https://youtu.be/7pT50mZ0QQU

Infringe is a pretty simple word.

(02-16-2018 12:35 PM)fsquid Wrote:  

(02-16-2018 12:19 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  The fact that we need an organization like the NRA to lobby for rights already granted to us justifies the work that the NRA does.

If the NRA didn't exist, do you really think the 2nd amendment would have been repealed by now?

You ended up with a 5-4 Supreme Court ruling in Heller. Who knows what the Supreme Court makeup would have been without NRA to speak up. Too close for comfort.

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(02-16-2018 12:35 PM)fsquid Wrote:  

(02-16-2018 12:19 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  The fact that we need an organization like the NRA to lobby for rights already granted to us justifies the work that the NRA does.

If the NRA didn't exist, do you really think the 2nd amendment would have been repealed by now?

Repealed? No.

But I have no doubt whatsoever it would be about as effective as the 10th Amendment is today without them.

(02-16-2018 12:35 PM)fsquid Wrote:  

(02-16-2018 12:19 PM)Kaplony Wrote:  The fact that we need an organization like the NRA to lobby for rights already granted to us justifies the work that the NRA does.

If the NRA didn't exist, do you really think the 2nd amendment would have been repealed by now?

I don’t have that much respect for the NRA. But I do think there are many who would seek to repeal the Second Amendment, and I hope they fail because I would not want to live in this country if that happened.

I like to separate groups from their leaders. There are very few groups whose leaders (or those who want to be leaders) I respect these days. The NRA included.