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Rice MBB v WKU
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RiceLad15 Online
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Post: #41
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-18-2018 12:50 AM)mrbig Wrote:  
(02-17-2018 11:56 PM)Wiessman Wrote:  
(02-17-2018 11:44 PM)mrbig Wrote:  The good news is that next year’s team basically trades out Mency for the TCU transfer and 4 incoming freshmen, plus a year of development for everyone else. Almost impossible given that (predicted) turnover and how crappy we have been this year. I want Pera to succeed and think his pedigree of winning HS state championships in 2 big basketball states says he is a quality coach. But need a big bounce-back from this year’s disaster!

My point of reference is 2014-15, the first season with Rhoades.

I was at the game against UTSA at Tudor that season. We had already improved quite a bit from the previous campaign. It was clear that Rhoades knew what he was doing, even before Gearhart started going off. I don't see that same kind of progress with Pera's players. And that is why I think he gets just next year to prove that he can move this program in the right direction.

The counter-point is that most of this year’s team had already been coached by Rhoades/Pera, and so were playing at a higher level coming into 2017-18 than guys like Gearhart and Jackson were going into 2014-15. While none of the returning players have blossomed like Gearhart and Jackson did in 2014-15, Cashaw and Adams have taken the reigns and no one is worse. Rice just lost a ton of talent with the transfers, more than I appreciated coming into the season. Hope next year’s freshmen come in ready to contribute!

I think we lost a lot more talent than many of us (or at least I) wanted to admit. We knew losing Evans and Egor would hurt, but I think I misunderstood how much of role the others (Jackson, MLE, Lott) played. I knew we lost four starters, but I didn’t recognize the talent gap that appeared to exist between them and their reserves.

But I would agree that leashes need to be kept short, marked improvement in both wins and the eye test next year - no more Brauning it.
02-18-2018 07:37 AM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
For whatever reason, promotions from within have a pretty poor track record. I think the best chance for success this year was to keep as many players as possible, and I think that was the reason behind the Pera hire. Unfortunately, that did not work. With the talent we lost, I think this is a predictable falloff. Unless there are signs of problems of which I am not aware, I do think Pera deserves more time. I would hope to see significant improvement next year, and build on that in the third year. If not, then we cut bait.
02-18-2018 07:56 AM
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Post: #43
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-17-2018 10:44 PM)Wiessman Wrote:  
(02-17-2018 10:40 PM)Hilltopper2K Wrote:  
(02-17-2018 10:23 PM)Wiessman Wrote:  UTEP. The only MBB team in our conference with any real history to speak of...

Number 18?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_te...basketball

UTEP won a national title. And Don Haskins was a legendary coach; hugely progressive in his worldview too. Tim Hardaway, Tiny Archibald... I respect UTEP much more in basketball.

It would mean something for our conference for UTEP to be good again.

We had a final four in 1971, one elite 8, six sweet-sixteen appearances. There's only about 7 programs in the country that have had more 20 win seasons than us. It would mean something for our conference if we were good again as well.

You mentioned Haskins... he was great, great coach to be sure. But he was 719-353 (67.9%) all time. WKU coach Edgar Diddle was 759-302 (71.5%). He wasn't bad either.
02-18-2018 08:20 AM
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ranfin Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-18-2018 07:56 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  For whatever reason, promotions from within have a pretty poor track record. I think the best chance for success this year was to keep as many players as possible, and I think that was the reason behind the Pera hire. Unfortunately, that did not work. With the talent we lost, I think this is a predictable falloff. Unless there are signs of problems of which I am not aware, I do think Pera deserves more time. I would hope to see significant improvement next year, and build on that in the third year. If not, then we cut bait.

After last season’s defections, this year was predictable. We were terrible at the start. Now, we are playing closer to potential, which is not all that high. Next year will be better. The key to success, for us, will be recruiting and keeping good players and our coach.
02-18-2018 10:21 AM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-18-2018 10:21 AM)ranfin Wrote:  
(02-18-2018 07:56 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  For whatever reason, promotions from within have a pretty poor track record. I think the best chance for success this year was to keep as many players as possible, and I think that was the reason behind the Pera hire. Unfortunately, that did not work. With the talent we lost, I think this is a predictable falloff. Unless there are signs of problems of which I am not aware, I do think Pera deserves more time. I would hope to see significant improvement next year, and build on that in the third year. If not, then we cut bait.
After last season’s defections, this year was predictable. We were terrible at the start. Now, we are playing closer to potential, which is not all that high. Next year will be better. The key to success, for us, will be recruiting and keeping good players and our coach.

Agree. I have a difficult time blaming Pera. He probably did about as well as anyone could with what he had. Let's see where we are a year and two years from now. If we have not improved significantly, then it will be time to pull the trigger.
02-18-2018 01:49 PM
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Post: #46
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-18-2018 01:49 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(02-18-2018 10:21 AM)ranfin Wrote:  
(02-18-2018 07:56 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  For whatever reason, promotions from within have a pretty poor track record. I think the best chance for success this year was to keep as many players as possible, and I think that was the reason behind the Pera hire. Unfortunately, that did not work. With the talent we lost, I think this is a predictable falloff. Unless there are signs of problems of which I am not aware, I do think Pera deserves more time. I would hope to see significant improvement next year, and build on that in the third year. If not, then we cut bait.
After last season’s defections, this year was predictable. We were terrible at the start. Now, we are playing closer to potential, which is not all that high. Next year will be better. The key to success, for us, will be recruiting and keeping good players and our coach.

Agree. I have a difficult time blaming Pera. He probably did about as well as anyone could with what he had. Let's see where we are a year and two years from now. If we have not improved significantly, then it will be time to pull the trigger.

Just like Bloomgren, I am willing to give him some time.
02-18-2018 02:50 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-18-2018 02:50 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  
(02-18-2018 01:49 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(02-18-2018 10:21 AM)ranfin Wrote:  
(02-18-2018 07:56 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  For whatever reason, promotions from within have a pretty poor track record. I think the best chance for success this year was to keep as many players as possible, and I think that was the reason behind the Pera hire. Unfortunately, that did not work. With the talent we lost, I think this is a predictable falloff. Unless there are signs of problems of which I am not aware, I do think Pera deserves more time. I would hope to see significant improvement next year, and build on that in the third year. If not, then we cut bait.
After last season’s defections, this year was predictable. We were terrible at the start. Now, we are playing closer to potential, which is not all that high. Next year will be better. The key to success, for us, will be recruiting and keeping good players and our coach.
Agree. I have a difficult time blaming Pera. He probably did about as well as anyone could with what he had. Let's see where we are a year and two years from now. If we have not improved significantly, then it will be time to pull the trigger.
Just like Bloomgren, I am willing to give him some time.

Let's see what things look like a year from now. He's been successful at several levels in several locations, so obviously he has coaching ability. Some compared him to George Carlisle, who succeeded in HS but failed at Rice, but Carlisle didn't have the breadth of success and experience that Pera has had. I'm willing to give him time. But three years is enough to determine if we are headed in the right direction.
02-18-2018 03:28 PM
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Antarius Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-18-2018 01:49 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  
(02-18-2018 10:21 AM)ranfin Wrote:  
(02-18-2018 07:56 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  For whatever reason, promotions from within have a pretty poor track record. I think the best chance for success this year was to keep as many players as possible, and I think that was the reason behind the Pera hire. Unfortunately, that did not work. With the talent we lost, I think this is a predictable falloff. Unless there are signs of problems of which I am not aware, I do think Pera deserves more time. I would hope to see significant improvement next year, and build on that in the third year. If not, then we cut bait.
After last season’s defections, this year was predictable. We were terrible at the start. Now, we are playing closer to potential, which is not all that high. Next year will be better. The key to success, for us, will be recruiting and keeping good players and our coach.

Agree. I have a difficult time blaming Pera. He probably did about as well as anyone could with what he had. Let's see where we are a year and two years from now. If we have not improved significantly, then it will be time to pull the trigger.

My question is - does this team look like it is playing at the upper end of its talent level? To me, the answer is no. We are not maximizing our potential (even if our potential is less due to less talent)

And yes, we may be able to plug some more talent to paper over the cracks for a while, but until we improve our fundamentals, this MBB team and regime remind me of the killer B's than Rhoades or Langley.

If we continue like this next year, I think we should pull the plug though, IMO. Inability to execute fundamentals is doomed to fail - we have plenty of examples from the last decade showing us that.
(This post was last modified: 02-18-2018 03:44 PM by Antarius.)
02-18-2018 03:36 PM
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Post: #49
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
I would disagree with the assessment that there has been no improvement with this team during the 2017/2018 campaign. Malik Osborne looks like a legitimate D-1 forward and his game has improved significantly over the season. Najja Hunter is improving and should be able to take up serious starters minutes next year. Coach Pera is smart to put him in the starting line-up, even though his minutes have varied from game to game. The Sophomore class has not improved at the level I would have hoped, but none of the players that stayed from that class were more than part time bench players in 2016/2017. There is a reason Bishop Mency only averaged 4 minutes a game last year, he was not as talented as Lecher-Ellis or Koulechov. Bishop has performed at a level that is probably at his maximum ability this season. There is quite frankly not a great deal of talent on this club.

Coach Pera has used his bench well throughout the season and seems to make offensive adjustments that allow his team to compete in most games, with some notable exceptions. It is particularly tough when there are no top notch 3-point shooters on this club. I have been concerned about his ability to get his team to effectively adjust defensively in games like North Texas, Marshall, and last Saturday's loss to WKU.

If the buzz about the 2018/2019 recruits is true, this coaching staff can recruit effectively (I have no way to judge this until we see them play next year). I was not impressed with either A.J. or Dylan Jones as graduate transfers. I am interested to see if Josh Parrish can contribute effectively. Assuming the hype out of high school was accurate, if Parrish would have been eligible this year, Rice would have won at least 3-4 more games to-date.

I will be watching to see if Coach Pera and his staff can keep the current group of players from transferring (If Malik Osborne was to transfer at the end of the season that would be a huge sign that there is a problem with the program's direction). All of the last 4 regular seasons games should be competitive so I am hoping for the best.
02-19-2018 11:43 AM
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Post: #50
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-19-2018 11:43 AM)Kayjay Wrote:  I would disagree with the assessment that there has been no improvement with this team during the 2017/2018 campaign. Malik Osborne looks like a legitimate D-1 forward and his game has improved significantly over the season. Najja Hunter is improving and should be able to take up serious starters minutes next year. Coach Pera is smart to put him in the starting line-up, even though his minutes have varied from game to game. The Sophomore class has not improved at the level I would have hoped, but none of the players that stayed from that class were more than part time bench players in 2016/2017. There is a reason Bishop Mency only averaged 4 minutes a game last year, he was not as talented as Lecher-Ellis or Koulechov. Bishop has performed at a level that is probably at his maximum ability this season. There is quite frankly not a great deal of talent on this club.

Coach Pera has used his bench well throughout the season and seems to make offensive adjustments that allow his team to compete in most games, with some notable exceptions. It is particularly tough when there are no top notch 3-point shooters on this club. I have been concerned about his ability to get his team to effectively adjust defensively in games like North Texas, Marshall, and last Saturday's loss to WKU.

If the buzz about the 2018/2019 recruits is true, this coaching staff can recruit effectively (I have no way to judge this until we see them play next year). I was not impressed with either A.J. or Dylan Jones as graduate transfers. I am interested to see if Josh Parrish can contribute effectively. Assuming the hype out of high school was accurate, if Parrish would have been eligible this year, Rice would have won at least 3-4 more games to-date.

I will be watching to see if Coach Pera and his staff can keep the current group of players from transferring (If Malik Osborne was to transfer at the end of the season that would be a huge sign that there is a problem with the program's direction). All of the last 4 regular seasons games should be competitive so I am hoping for the best.

This seems to be more inline with my thoughts on this season. They haven’t quit and I think there’s definitely been improvement from the players you mentioned. When you have a guy getting significant minutes who was going to be a walk on you know it’s going to be a long year.
02-19-2018 11:55 AM
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Antarius Offline
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Post: #51
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-19-2018 11:55 AM)cr11owl Wrote:  
(02-19-2018 11:43 AM)Kayjay Wrote:  I would disagree with the assessment that there has been no improvement with this team during the 2017/2018 campaign. Malik Osborne looks like a legitimate D-1 forward and his game has improved significantly over the season. Najja Hunter is improving and should be able to take up serious starters minutes next year. Coach Pera is smart to put him in the starting line-up, even though his minutes have varied from game to game. The Sophomore class has not improved at the level I would have hoped, but none of the players that stayed from that class were more than part time bench players in 2016/2017. There is a reason Bishop Mency only averaged 4 minutes a game last year, he was not as talented as Lecher-Ellis or Koulechov. Bishop has performed at a level that is probably at his maximum ability this season. There is quite frankly not a great deal of talent on this club.

Coach Pera has used his bench well throughout the season and seems to make offensive adjustments that allow his team to compete in most games, with some notable exceptions. It is particularly tough when there are no top notch 3-point shooters on this club. I have been concerned about his ability to get his team to effectively adjust defensively in games like North Texas, Marshall, and last Saturday's loss to WKU.

If the buzz about the 2018/2019 recruits is true, this coaching staff can recruit effectively (I have no way to judge this until we see them play next year). I was not impressed with either A.J. or Dylan Jones as graduate transfers. I am interested to see if Josh Parrish can contribute effectively. Assuming the hype out of high school was accurate, if Parrish would have been eligible this year, Rice would have won at least 3-4 more games to-date.

I will be watching to see if Coach Pera and his staff can keep the current group of players from transferring (If Malik Osborne was to transfer at the end of the season that would be a huge sign that there is a problem with the program's direction). All of the last 4 regular seasons games should be competitive so I am hoping for the best.

This seems to be more inline with my thoughts on this season. They haven’t quit and I think there’s definitely been improvement from the players you mentioned. When you have a guy getting significant minutes who was going to be a walk on you know it’s going to be a long year.

No disagreement, but remember, in 2013-2014 Gearhart averaged 6.8 points per game while Peera played 129 minutes ALL season and averaged 0.3 points. Fast forward a season and Gearhart averaged 16 ppg while Peera averaged 3.2 ppg and played 516 minutes.

On paper I do not believe this squad is less talented than our 2014 squad. Quite frankly, I had never seen a less talented D1 squad on paper than the 2014 one. The difference is one executed well and one hasn't.

The issue is the fundamentals of the team are poor so far. Turnovers, FT shooting etc. These don't magically solved by slightly better players. Unless we pick up another James Harden who is so so much better than everyone else on the court - unless we tighten up shop we aren't going to the promised land. We may go from 5 wins to 10.. but that's still not even close to what Rice needs to make this revenue and long term program sustainable.
(This post was last modified: 02-19-2018 12:59 PM by Antarius.)
02-19-2018 12:58 PM
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Post: #52
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-19-2018 12:58 PM)Antarius Wrote:  
(02-19-2018 11:55 AM)cr11owl Wrote:  
(02-19-2018 11:43 AM)Kayjay Wrote:  I would disagree with the assessment that there has been no improvement with this team during the 2017/2018 campaign. Malik Osborne looks like a legitimate D-1 forward and his game has improved significantly over the season. Najja Hunter is improving and should be able to take up serious starters minutes next year. Coach Pera is smart to put him in the starting line-up, even though his minutes have varied from game to game. The Sophomore class has not improved at the level I would have hoped, but none of the players that stayed from that class were more than part time bench players in 2016/2017. There is a reason Bishop Mency only averaged 4 minutes a game last year, he was not as talented as Lecher-Ellis or Koulechov. Bishop has performed at a level that is probably at his maximum ability this season. There is quite frankly not a great deal of talent on this club.

Coach Pera has used his bench well throughout the season and seems to make offensive adjustments that allow his team to compete in most games, with some notable exceptions. It is particularly tough when there are no top notch 3-point shooters on this club. I have been concerned about his ability to get his team to effectively adjust defensively in games like North Texas, Marshall, and last Saturday's loss to WKU.

If the buzz about the 2018/2019 recruits is true, this coaching staff can recruit effectively (I have no way to judge this until we see them play next year). I was not impressed with either A.J. or Dylan Jones as graduate transfers. I am interested to see if Josh Parrish can contribute effectively. Assuming the hype out of high school was accurate, if Parrish would have been eligible this year, Rice would have won at least 3-4 more games to-date.

I will be watching to see if Coach Pera and his staff can keep the current group of players from transferring (If Malik Osborne was to transfer at the end of the season that would be a huge sign that there is a problem with the program's direction). All of the last 4 regular seasons games should be competitive so I am hoping for the best.

This seems to be more inline with my thoughts on this season. They haven’t quit and I think there’s definitely been improvement from the players you mentioned. When you have a guy getting significant minutes who was going to be a walk on you know it’s going to be a long year.

No disagreement, but remember, in 2013-2014 Gearhart averaged 6.8 points per game while Peera played 129 minutes ALL season and averaged 0.3 points. Fast forward a season and Gearhart averaged 16 ppg while Peera averaged 3.2 ppg and played 516 minutes.

On paper I do not believe this squad is less talented than our 2014 squad. Quite frankly, I had never seen a less talented D1 squad on paper than the 2014 one. The difference is one executed well and one hasn't.

The issue is the fundamentals of the team are poor so far. Turnovers, FT shooting etc. These don't magically solved by slightly better players. Unless we pick up another James Harden who is so so much better than everyone else on the court - unless we tighten up shop we aren't going to the promised land. We may go from 5 wins to 10.. but that's still not even close to what Rice needs to make this revenue and long term program sustainable.

Don't really disagree with you but I think Max Guercy's importance to the 2014 team is vastly understated. Even though he struggled scoring the ball, he was extremely good at breaking down defenses which is a big reason why Jackson, Peera, and Gearhart improved their games so much. I'm not saying a player in his mold would make this year's team too much better, but if we had a really quick, shifty PG then I do think there'd be a noticeable difference. And that's not a slight towards Ako who I think has shown gradual improvement.
02-19-2018 01:23 PM
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Post: #53
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-19-2018 12:58 PM)Antarius Wrote:  
(02-19-2018 11:55 AM)cr11owl Wrote:  
(02-19-2018 11:43 AM)Kayjay Wrote:  I would disagree with the assessment that there has been no improvement with this team during the 2017/2018 campaign. Malik Osborne looks like a legitimate D-1 forward and his game has improved significantly over the season. Najja Hunter is improving and should be able to take up serious starters minutes next year. Coach Pera is smart to put him in the starting line-up, even though his minutes have varied from game to game. The Sophomore class has not improved at the level I would have hoped, but none of the players that stayed from that class were more than part time bench players in 2016/2017. There is a reason Bishop Mency only averaged 4 minutes a game last year, he was not as talented as Lecher-Ellis or Koulechov. Bishop has performed at a level that is probably at his maximum ability this season. There is quite frankly not a great deal of talent on this club.

Coach Pera has used his bench well throughout the season and seems to make offensive adjustments that allow his team to compete in most games, with some notable exceptions. It is particularly tough when there are no top notch 3-point shooters on this club. I have been concerned about his ability to get his team to effectively adjust defensively in games like North Texas, Marshall, and last Saturday's loss to WKU.

If the buzz about the 2018/2019 recruits is true, this coaching staff can recruit effectively (I have no way to judge this until we see them play next year). I was not impressed with either A.J. or Dylan Jones as graduate transfers. I am interested to see if Josh Parrish can contribute effectively. Assuming the hype out of high school was accurate, if Parrish would have been eligible this year, Rice would have won at least 3-4 more games to-date.

I will be watching to see if Coach Pera and his staff can keep the current group of players from transferring (If Malik Osborne was to transfer at the end of the season that would be a huge sign that there is a problem with the program's direction). All of the last 4 regular seasons games should be competitive so I am hoping for the best.

This seems to be more inline with my thoughts on this season. They haven’t quit and I think there’s definitely been improvement from the players you mentioned. When you have a guy getting significant minutes who was going to be a walk on you know it’s going to be a long year.

No disagreement, but remember, in 2013-2014 Gearhart averaged 6.8 points per game while Peera played 129 minutes ALL season and averaged 0.3 points. Fast forward a season and Gearhart averaged 16 ppg while Peera averaged 3.2 ppg and played 516 minutes.

On paper I do not believe this squad is less talented than our 2014 squad. Quite frankly, I had never seen a less talented D1 squad on paper than the 2014 one. The difference is one executed well and one hasn't.

The issue is the fundamentals of the team are poor so far. Turnovers, FT shooting etc. These don't magically solved by slightly better players. Unless we pick up another James Harden who is so so much better than everyone else on the court - unless we tighten up shop we aren't going to the promised land. We may go from 5 wins to 10.. but that's still not even close to what Rice needs to make this revenue and long term program sustainable.

I agree that Seth had a breakout year for that team. What I seem to remember is that Coach Rhoades encouraged a more uptempo game which allowed Seth to drive to the basket far more than the opportunities he had under Coach Braun, where he was asked to be more of a a mid-range shooter. Seth also had Max Guercy and Marcus Jackson as team mates who could execute more effectively on the offensive end than this 2017/2018 edition of the Owls. Both teams had the services of Bishop Mency. I will submit that the 2016/17 edition of Bishop is a little better than the 2014 freshman version, as you would expect.

When I did the research, it surprised me that the assists for both teams are about the same on a per game basis while the 2014 team turned the ball over about once more per game that this group of Owls. The 2014 team shot 6% better from the charity stripe than the 2017/18 version, although this year's team gets to the line more often and scores more from the free throw line per game. The most telling statistic for this team is their 3 point shooting accuracy. If the current Owls could shoot 3-pointers at a .362 rate, instead of the current .325 clip, this team might have won 10 games this season, as did Coach Rhoades first team.
02-19-2018 01:51 PM
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Post: #54
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-19-2018 12:58 PM)Antarius Wrote:  
(02-19-2018 11:55 AM)cr11owl Wrote:  
(02-19-2018 11:43 AM)Kayjay Wrote:  I would disagree with the assessment that there has been no improvement with this team during the 2017/2018 campaign. Malik Osborne looks like a legitimate D-1 forward and his game has improved significantly over the season. Najja Hunter is improving and should be able to take up serious starters minutes next year. Coach Pera is smart to put him in the starting line-up, even though his minutes have varied from game to game. The Sophomore class has not improved at the level I would have hoped, but none of the players that stayed from that class were more than part time bench players in 2016/2017. There is a reason Bishop Mency only averaged 4 minutes a game last year, he was not as talented as Lecher-Ellis or Koulechov. Bishop has performed at a level that is probably at his maximum ability this season. There is quite frankly not a great deal of talent on this club.

Coach Pera has used his bench well throughout the season and seems to make offensive adjustments that allow his team to compete in most games, with some notable exceptions. It is particularly tough when there are no top notch 3-point shooters on this club. I have been concerned about his ability to get his team to effectively adjust defensively in games like North Texas, Marshall, and last Saturday's loss to WKU.

If the buzz about the 2018/2019 recruits is true, this coaching staff can recruit effectively (I have no way to judge this until we see them play next year). I was not impressed with either A.J. or Dylan Jones as graduate transfers. I am interested to see if Josh Parrish can contribute effectively. Assuming the hype out of high school was accurate, if Parrish would have been eligible this year, Rice would have won at least 3-4 more games to-date.

I will be watching to see if Coach Pera and his staff can keep the current group of players from transferring (If Malik Osborne was to transfer at the end of the season that would be a huge sign that there is a problem with the program's direction). All of the last 4 regular seasons games should be competitive so I am hoping for the best.

This seems to be more inline with my thoughts on this season. They haven’t quit and I think there’s definitely been improvement from the players you mentioned. When you have a guy getting significant minutes who was going to be a walk on you know it’s going to be a long year.

No disagreement, but remember, in 2013-2014 Gearhart averaged 6.8 points per game while Peera played 129 minutes ALL season and averaged 0.3 points. Fast forward a season and Gearhart averaged 16 ppg while Peera averaged 3.2 ppg and played 516 minutes.

On paper I do not believe this squad is less talented than our 2014 squad. Quite frankly, I had never seen a less talented D1 squad on paper than the 2014 one. The difference is one executed well and one hasn't.

The issue is the fundamentals of the team are poor so far. Turnovers, FT shooting etc. These don't magically solved by slightly better players. Unless we pick up another James Harden who is so so much better than everyone else on the court - unless we tighten up shop we aren't going to the promised land. We may go from 5 wins to 10.. but that's still not even close to what Rice needs to make this revenue and long term program sustainable.

The coach leaving (given what transpired when he poached his own ex-players, I dont think I will give him the respect of using his name, to be honest) and the ensuing exodus was a serious kick to the nads for the program.

Given the history before the ex-coach, I just hope Rice has it in them for a rebuild of the sort that the ex-coach engineered. This season has me excrutiatingly anxious about that, almost sick to my stomach at the path prior and result after the ex-coach left and the Diaspora. Maybe the result of the football season set the table for it.

Really hoping for a ray of light somewhere in this athletic year. Women's BB seems to be about the only bright spot amongst revenue sports. And perhaps my 'Rice sports gloom' has extended too harshly to baseball without any tangible actual results to this point (only less than a handful of games).

To be honest, this frigging athletic year cant end soon enough for my tastes..... (may baseball prove me absolutely and fundamentally wrong).
02-19-2018 02:06 PM
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Ranger Offline
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Post: #55
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-19-2018 02:06 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  
(02-19-2018 12:58 PM)Antarius Wrote:  
(02-19-2018 11:55 AM)cr11owl Wrote:  
(02-19-2018 11:43 AM)Kayjay Wrote:  I would disagree with the assessment that there has been no improvement with this team during the 2017/2018 campaign. Malik Osborne looks like a legitimate D-1 forward and his game has improved significantly over the season. Najja Hunter is improving and should be able to take up serious starters minutes next year. Coach Pera is smart to put him in the starting line-up, even though his minutes have varied from game to game. The Sophomore class has not improved at the level I would have hoped, but none of the players that stayed from that class were more than part time bench players in 2016/2017. There is a reason Bishop Mency only averaged 4 minutes a game last year, he was not as talented as Lecher-Ellis or Koulechov. Bishop has performed at a level that is probably at his maximum ability this season. There is quite frankly not a great deal of talent on this club.

Coach Pera has used his bench well throughout the season and seems to make offensive adjustments that allow his team to compete in most games, with some notable exceptions. It is particularly tough when there are no top notch 3-point shooters on this club. I have been concerned about his ability to get his team to effectively adjust defensively in games like North Texas, Marshall, and last Saturday's loss to WKU.

If the buzz about the 2018/2019 recruits is true, this coaching staff can recruit effectively (I have no way to judge this until we see them play next year). I was not impressed with either A.J. or Dylan Jones as graduate transfers. I am interested to see if Josh Parrish can contribute effectively. Assuming the hype out of high school was accurate, if Parrish would have been eligible this year, Rice would have won at least 3-4 more games to-date.

I will be watching to see if Coach Pera and his staff can keep the current group of players from transferring (If Malik Osborne was to transfer at the end of the season that would be a huge sign that there is a problem with the program's direction). All of the last 4 regular seasons games should be competitive so I am hoping for the best.

This seems to be more inline with my thoughts on this season. They haven’t quit and I think there’s definitely been improvement from the players you mentioned. When you have a guy getting significant minutes who was going to be a walk on you know it’s going to be a long year.

No disagreement, but remember, in 2013-2014 Gearhart averaged 6.8 points per game while Peera played 129 minutes ALL season and averaged 0.3 points. Fast forward a season and Gearhart averaged 16 ppg while Peera averaged 3.2 ppg and played 516 minutes.

On paper I do not believe this squad is less talented than our 2014 squad. Quite frankly, I had never seen a less talented D1 squad on paper than the 2014 one. The difference is one executed well and one hasn't.

The issue is the fundamentals of the team are poor so far. Turnovers, FT shooting etc. These don't magically solved by slightly better players. Unless we pick up another James Harden who is so so much better than everyone else on the court - unless we tighten up shop we aren't going to the promised land. We may go from 5 wins to 10.. but that's still not even close to what Rice needs to make this revenue and long term program sustainable.

The coach leaving (given what transpired when he poached his own ex-players, I dont think I will give him the respect of using his name, to be honest) and the ensuing exodus was a serious kick to the nads for the program.

Given the history before the ex-coach, I just hope Rice has it in them for a rebuild of the sort that the ex-coach engineered. This season has me excrutiatingly anxious about that, almost sick to my stomach at the path prior and result after the ex-coach left and the Diaspora. Maybe the result of the football season set the table for it.

Really hoping for a ray of light somewhere in this athletic year. Women's BB seems to be about the only bright spot amongst revenue sports. And perhaps my 'Rice sports gloom' has extended too harshly to baseball without any tangible actual results to this point (only less than a handful of games).

To be honest, this frigging athletic year cant end soon enough for my tastes..... (may baseball prove me absolutely and fundamentally wrong).

Following up on a point made in this post.

I was one of the biggest fans of the ex-coach. He was supposed to build a program. He apparently only built up personal loyalty to himself. He left the program perhaps a micron better than when he found it. Toad, despicable as he was, did not leave the football program in a shambles and did not run off with key players.
02-19-2018 04:49 PM
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WRCisforgotten79 Offline
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Post: #56
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-19-2018 04:49 PM)Ranger Wrote:  Following up on a point made in this post.

I was one of the biggest fans of the ex-coach. He was supposed to build a program. He apparently only built up personal loyalty to himself. He left the program perhaps a micron better than when he found it. Toad, despicable as he was, did not leave the football program in a shambles and did not run off with key players.

As I've been saying ....
02-19-2018 04:52 PM
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Antarius Offline
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Post: #57
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-19-2018 04:52 PM)WRCisforgotten79 Wrote:  
(02-19-2018 04:49 PM)Ranger Wrote:  Following up on a point made in this post.

I was one of the biggest fans of the ex-coach. He was supposed to build a program. He apparently only built up personal loyalty to himself. He left the program perhaps a micron better than when he found it. Toad, despicable as he was, did not leave the football program in a shambles and did not run off with key players.

As I've been saying ....

We always new Rhoades was going to leave. You don't stay at Rice in a revenue sport unless no one wants you (see Exhibit B: Bailiff and Braun. Being fired by Rice was a coaching career ending situation. OG is an exception because baseball wasn't really a money sport and now does he really need to uproot and start over for a few hundred grand more?) So his departure was a matter of WHEN, not if.

As a result from day 1 there needed to be a contingency plan in case he succeeds (the failure case always requires a contingency). Part of that contingency is negotiating a non-compete or some form of succession plan that handles the expected departures or failing to do that, be prepared to lose your team and act accordingly. We seemed to be shocked by his departure, floundered around and in a panic move rushed the Pera hire with the sole attempt to stem the departures. That backfired spectacularly and now we are back to square 1.

we knew what we were getting with Rhoades. Do I think what he did was ****** - yes- am I surprised - absolutely not. Just like we knew what we were getting with Braun and Morcos; albeit different degrees. Rhoades' ultimate loyalty was to his career, which is true for most of us. If a competitor offered you 2x your salary and you didn't have a Non-compete wouldn't you leave your job and bring along your best people? A lot of people say no in the hypothetical, but nearly 100% of the time in reality it seems to play out exactly like this.

How the **** do we keep getting surprised by this over and over again?
(This post was last modified: 02-19-2018 05:46 PM by Antarius.)
02-19-2018 05:34 PM
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Post: #58
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
I actually think Rhoades was trying to build the program at Rice, but he didn't have the necessary experience to know how to. It's easy to bring in some highly touted 3-star recruits, but there's no way to build a culture at an institution like a Rice or an Ivy if you don't get kids who truly value the education. To me, it looked like Rhoades thought the way to change Rice was just to win. And that certainly helped. But he never recruited kids to Rice. He recruited kids to himself, to his assistants, to each other, and to winning. There's just no chance that will ever be the solution to building longevity.
02-19-2018 05:45 PM
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ranfin Offline
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Post: #59
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
The data shared in the last few posts doesn’t support the notion that Pera is the problem. Coaches don't shoot free throws or threes. I also don’t believe that Pera was hired primarily in an effort to stem departures. Seems unlikely to me. It will be interesting to see what is done or not done if there is no progress next year. I just think there will be a lot of progress, so we won’t have to go there.
02-19-2018 05:54 PM
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Antarius Offline
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Post: #60
RE: Rice MBB v WKU
(02-19-2018 05:54 PM)ranfin Wrote:  The data shared in the last few posts doesn’t support the notion that Pera is the problem. Coaches don't shoot free throws or threes. I also don’t believe that Pera was hired primarily in an effort to stem departures. Seems unlikely to me. It will be interesting to see what is done or not done if there is no progress next year. I just think there will be a lot of progress, so we won’t have to go there.

The timeline is why it seemed that way to me. If Pera was the HC-in-waiting, then he could and should have been announced immediately after Rhoades announced his departure. We didn't really have time in 6 days to mount a proper search.. so what exactly did we do in that time?

I see no benefit to waiting 6 days if Pera was originally the guy to be. The plausible scenario in my mind is a. Rhoades announces departure b. Rice begins to plan for replacement c. People start eyeing exits d. Rice tries to keep the crew together with Pera e. Everybody leaves. I am curious if anyone knows any more or has any alternate theories.

The broader issue is we as a University and department seem to like to wait until everything falls apart before acting or having a plan in place. We waited until Braun basically ruined the program before firing him. We waited far too long with Greenspan before kicking his sorry backside to the curb. We waiting for WTW for 4 years too many (same with Hatfield). Williams had to flounder for years before any change. Bailiff - 3-9 wasn't enough, so we had to hit rock bottom as the 3rd worst program in the country before making a change. Rhoades, we clearly didn't have a succession plan in place etc etc.

I just do not understand how and why it is so hard to act proactively.
(This post was last modified: 02-19-2018 06:14 PM by Antarius.)
02-19-2018 06:01 PM
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