(03-11-2018 08:00 PM)bubbapt Wrote:  

(03-11-2018 07:57 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  

(03-11-2018 07:46 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  People are freaking out about tariffs but ultimately those imposed are not punitive or even really protectionist.

If the consumer ultimately pays them, what difference does it make what you call them?

Corporations just got a 10% bump in earnings thanks to the Trump tax cuts. Are they really whining about this?

Corporations aren't paying the tariff, you and I are.

(03-12-2018 07:10 AM)Old Dominion Wrote:  

(03-11-2018 08:00 PM)bubbapt Wrote:  

(03-11-2018 07:57 PM)Old Dominion Wrote:  

(03-11-2018 07:46 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  People are freaking out about tariffs but ultimately those imposed are not punitive or even really protectionist.

If the consumer ultimately pays them, what difference does it make what you call them?

Corporations just got a 10% bump in earnings thanks to the Trump tax cuts. Are they really whining about this?

Corporations aren't paying the tariff, you and I are.

... not if the product is American.

(03-11-2018 09:37 AM)Fo Shizzle Wrote:  

(03-11-2018 03:43 AM)Bull_Is_Back Wrote:  

(03-10-2018 11:23 AM)stinkfist Wrote:  

(03-10-2018 11:13 AM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  I support the tariffs entirely.

why?

Let's start with the fact our goods have been the victim of tariffs and vat taxes around the world for a good long time while we have embraced "free trade" and work our way from there.

Did you know when NAFTA went into effect there was a provision put in *SPECIFICALLY* banning American trucks from crossing the border back into the US with Cargo?

An American truck could take goods into Canada but not bring any back. There was no such provision against Canadian or Mexican Truckers.

We have not, for decades, negotiated in the interest of our people when it comes to trade.

Id prefer we fix the trade deals instead of resorting to tariffs.

I think the second is a means to achieve the first.

(03-12-2018 07:53 AM)smudge12 Wrote:  FWIW, we have a mechanical project for a historic building delayed while the County re-evaluates if they want to proceed. Estimates were done a month ago and funding was allocated, but they're waiting to see how the tariff will affect prices of galvanized steel and aluminum HVAC equipment. At best, they'll go back with a new estimate and the board finds immediate funding; at worst it gets cancelled.

In fact, we have multiple projects (both public and private) where funding is already allocated based on estimates created long before the tariffs, but haven't started up yet. We just haven't heard how those project managers want to proceed.

Regardless, I have a hunch the construction industry is about to get hit (just not sure how much)....architects, engineers, construction managers, and tradesmen.

Brother works for a company that designs and builds these large industrial heat exchanger's systems. Had to explain to him couple of days ago your exact scenario where these relatively few jobs being protected can cause his company and many others a larger number of offsetting jobs. They must buy some of their metals imported because there's no domestic source. And the adjusted prices for the remainder. They adjust bids, lose work, retirement doesn't look so secure. Eat higher costs, their goes HIS bonuses.

(03-12-2018 08:22 AM)Paul M Wrote:  

(03-12-2018 07:53 AM)smudge12 Wrote:  FWIW, we have a mechanical project for a historic building delayed while the County re-evaluates if they want to proceed. Estimates were done a month ago and funding was allocated, but they're waiting to see how the tariff will affect prices of galvanized steel and aluminum HVAC equipment. At best, they'll go back with a new estimate and the board finds immediate funding; at worst it gets cancelled.

In fact, we have multiple projects (both public and private) where funding is already allocated based on estimates created long before the tariffs, but haven't started up yet. We just haven't heard how those project managers want to proceed.

Regardless, I have a hunch the construction industry is about to get hit (just not sure how much)....architects, engineers, construction managers, and tradesmen.

Brother works for a company that designs and builds these large industrial heat exchanger's systems. Had to explain to him couple of days ago your exact scenario where these relatively few jobs being protected can cause his company and many others a larger number of offsetting jobs. They must buy some of their metals imported because there's no domestic source. And the adjusted prices for the remainder. They adjust bids, lose work, retirement doesn't look so secure. Eat higher costs, their goes HIS bonuses.

The end is nigh.

End? No. Unnecessary hardship completely avoidable? Certainly.

Will steel cost more? most likely, at least on the front end. But will it cost more over the next 10, 25, 50, years when it comes to making major and expensive repairs?

A lot of that **** is below at right at safe building steel. If theres one area in this buy today, replace in 6 months, because problems start showing up, that shouldn't be that way....buildings and bridges.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industr...ength-test

Tony Dickens, project director of the joint venture, said quality issues were identified shortly after the steel arrived in February and strength tests were conducted.

The batch of below-strength steel forced a design rethink for two bridges along the section.

"The solution we have implemented includes a redesign of the steel tube piles, which are now being used as reinforced concrete piles for two of the bridges due to time constraints," Dickens said in a statement.

The roading contractor has since asked Steel & Tube to find replacement steel piles for two other bridges.

Dickens said the NZ Transport Agency was alerted to concerns about the steel's quality "as soon as it was discovered".

The roading contractor will cover the cost of buying the replacement steel.

Kaye Clark, NZ Transport Agency's Hamilton highways manager, said New Zealand takes only a small fraction of Chinese steel, with the product sourced from different manufacturing plants.

It was "very unlikely" that one batch of steel would supply more than one project in New Zealand.

"In the event that did happen, the stringent quality assurance process which the transport agency requires its contractors to follow, would identify the problem, as it has in this case," Clark said.

Steel & Tube said the batch of steel was subject to independent testing, including a pre-export inspection by SGS - a global inspection and verification company.

Asked if test results could have been altered, Clark said that was something for the supplier and the relevant regulatory authorities to determine.

"The most important thing is that there will be no financial impact on the taxpayer," Clark said.

(03-12-2018 09:58 AM)Paul M Wrote:  End? No. Unnecessary hardship completely avoidable? Certainly.

Well god forbid your brother misses out on a bonus. I'll pray for his future.

So bonuses don't matter now lol.

Wasn't speaking of my brother, was referring to all of us.

(03-12-2018 10:12 AM)Paul M Wrote:  So bonuses don't matter now lol.

Wasn't speaking of my brother, was referring to all of us.

I'm betting that in the end, we'll all be just fine, including your brother who's at the mercy of that evil Trump.

The Price of ‘Made in China’
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/05/opinio...china.html

Consider the safety issue: a scary one, indeed, because China has a very well-deserved reputation for producing inferior and often dangerous products. Such products are as diverse as lead-filled toys, sulfurous drywall, pet food spiked with melamine and heparin tainted with oversulfated chondroitin sulfate.

In the specific case of bridges, six have collapsed across China since July 2011. The official Xinhua news agency has acknowledged that shoddy construction and inferior building materials were contributing factors. There is also a cautionary tale much closer to home.

When California bought Chinese steel to renovate and expand the San Francisco-Oakland Bay Bridge, for a project that began in 2002, problems like faulty welds by a Chinese steel fabricator delayed the project for months and led to huge cost overruns. Those delays eroded much of the savings California was banking on when it opted for the “cheap” Chinese steel.




The M.T.A. has ignored not only the social costs but also the broader impact on the environment and human rights. Chinese steel plants emit significantly more pollution and greenhouse gases per ton of steel produced than plants in the United States. This not only contributes to global warming but also has a direct negative impact on American soil, since an increasing amount of China’s pollution is crossing the Pacific Ocean on the jet stream.

Finally, when American companies and government agencies opt for Chinese over American steel, they are tacitly supporting an authoritarian regime that prohibits independent labor unions from organizing — one of many grim ironies in today’s People’s Republic. As a result, American

(03-12-2018 10:15 AM)TechRocks Wrote:  

(03-12-2018 10:12 AM)Paul M Wrote:  So bonuses don't matter now lol.

Wasn't speaking of my brother, was referring to all of us.

I'm betting that in the end, we'll all be just fine, including your brother who's at the mercy of that evil Trump.

Probably. Odds are even Trump will realize what a colossal boneheaded move this was and end it soon. He walks it farther and farther back every day so someone's getting through to him.

My brother thought it was great by the way, another blind Trumper, thus my reason for having to hold his hand and explain to him how he will be one of those harmed. And how that goes down the line to the rest of us.


But a few steel workers. LOL. Please.

(03-12-2018 07:53 AM)smudge12 Wrote:  FWIW, we have a mechanical project for a historic building delayed while the County re-evaluates if they want to proceed. Estimates were done a month ago and funding was allocated, but they're waiting to see how the tariff will affect prices of galvanized steel and aluminum HVAC equipment. At best, they'll go back with a new estimate and the board finds immediate funding; at worst it gets cancelled.

In fact, we have multiple projects (both public and private) where funding is already allocated based on estimates created long before the tariffs, but haven't started up yet. We just haven't heard how those project managers want to proceed.

Regardless, I have a hunch the construction industry is about to get hit (just not sure how much)....architects, engineers, construction managers, and tradesmen.

like I said from day 1 before the pundits on your screen.....

I know MFG like the back of my hand and lived through the impact ~15 yrs ago when China started fk'n with us.....

(03-12-2018 10:12 AM)Paul M Wrote:  So bonuses don't matter now lol.

Wasn't speaking of my brother, was referring to all of us.

it's a rob peter to pay paul (no pun intended)....