(01-29-2020 08:37 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(01-29-2020 08:17 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  Gottfried also left the program with an NCAA investigation that I guess is still going on... idk I really don’t keep up with it. Seems relevant though.

Eh. It's only relevant when a team gets punished. I don't see that having any impact on recruiting or Keatts' ability to win games.

I think it had an impact on recruiting his first couple years but certainly none on the winning games part. If they gave Sidney Lowe 5 years, Keatts will certainly get 5 years. His seat is not hot from the administration side, just their delusional fans on twitter.

State fans can't get past losing to Carolina for whatever reason and if they beat Carolina at Carolina all will be forgiven for now. If they lose in Chapel Hill and don't make the NCAA tournament it might start the chatter. I don't really understand the obsession with Carolina because they have been beating them forever it seems like and Rory has a ridiculous record vs State. I was not a big fan of Herb Sendek but he won games,went to the NCAA tourney,lost to UNC and ended up getting fired.

(01-29-2020 09:19 AM)jumpinmullet Wrote:  State fans can't get past losing to Carolina for whatever reason and if they beat Carolina at Carolina all will be forgiven for now. If they lose in Chapel Hill and don't make the NCAA tournament it might start the chatter. I don't really understand the obsession with Carolina because they have been beating them forever it seems like and Rory has a ridiculous record vs State. I was not a big fan of Herb Sendek but he won games,went to the NCAA tourney,lost to UNC and ended up getting fired.

From a State fans point of view, they want to compete with the big dogs. In their minds, this is the coach that they hired to get them there, and, he hasn't. Thus, the disappointment. There was a time when Duke wasn't much of a rival for UNC either , then K arrived. Rival landscapes change all the time.

On a different note, a bad look for Duke having K telling the student section to shut up. In a time of dwindling attendance to sporting events, that is not a good look, even for a legend.

(01-29-2020 09:41 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(01-29-2020 09:19 AM)jumpinmullet Wrote:  State fans can't get past losing to Carolina for whatever reason and if they beat Carolina at Carolina all will be forgiven for now. If they lose in Chapel Hill and don't make the NCAA tournament it might start the chatter. I don't really understand the obsession with Carolina because they have been beating them forever it seems like and Rory has a ridiculous record vs State. I was not a big fan of Herb Sendek but he won games,went to the NCAA tourney,lost to UNC and ended up getting fired.

From a State fans point of view, they want to compete with the big dogs. In their minds, this is the coach that they hired to get them there, and, he hasn't. Thus, the disappointment. There was a time when Duke wasn't much of a rival for UNC either , then K arrived. Rival landscapes change all the time.

I'm sure Keatts was fully aware what he was getting himself into... He talked a big game when he got there too so it's on him to start beating the big boys. Also, at the same time it's kind of unreasonable to think he'd have them there already. Herb didn't have any charisma, but he was a good basketball mind. He recruited players that fit his system well too. At the end of the day he wasn't technically fired. I think the school was fine with him as their coach, but I do think he was took the Arizona State job because of the unreasonable expectations of the fan base.

(01-29-2020 09:49 AM)dan10 Wrote:  On a different note, a bad look for Duke having K telling the student section to shut up. In a time of dwindling attendance to sporting events, that is not a good look, even for a legend.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2858...krzyzewski

This link has the video for anyone that wants to see it.

Might be time for the old man to hang it up if he's getting that tweaked out about a "sit with us" chant. They were literally half-ass honoring him and jeering him at the same time.

Coach K lost his mind there for no good reason.

(01-29-2020 09:49 AM)dan10 Wrote:  On a different note, a bad look for Duke having K telling the student section to shut up. In a time of dwindling attendance to sporting events, that is not a good look, even for a legend.

Idk... To chant at an alumni that had a big part in 2015 national championship is pretty lame if you ask me. I respect Coach K for standing up for his guy. There will not be a dwindling attendance at Cameron Indoor because of it.

(01-29-2020 10:00 AM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  

(01-29-2020 09:49 AM)dan10 Wrote:  On a different note, a bad look for Duke having K telling the student section to shut up. In a time of dwindling attendance to sporting events, that is not a good look, even for a legend.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2858...krzyzewski

This link has the video for anyone that wants to see it.

Might be time for the old man to hang it up if he's getting that tweaked out about a "sit with us" chant. They were literally half-ass honoring him and jeering him at the same time.

Coach K lost his mind there for no good reason.

If the chant is honoring him then I'm ok with it. I just didn't get what in world it meant lol.

(01-29-2020 09:49 AM)dan10 Wrote:  He talked a big game when he got there too so it's on him to start beating the big boys. Also, at the same time it's kind of unreasonable to think he'd have them there already.

Making the tournament in year three is realistic, especially given this is the worst the ACC has been in a decade. Beating GT and a really bad Carolina team is reasonable. I'm not one to defend that fan base, and agree that they have unrealistic expectations, but I think they're rightly frustrated this year.

It's inexcusable to have multiple players state post game that they didn't read the scouting report. That is on Keatts.

Another angle to this is how it impacts Siddle and UNCW. If Bass was on the fence with him 3 years ago, is he really going to hire him if they continue to under perform?

(01-29-2020 10:02 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  

(01-29-2020 09:49 AM)dan10 Wrote:  On a different note, a bad look for Duke having K telling the student section to shut up. In a time of dwindling attendance to sporting events, that is not a good look, even for a legend.

Idk... To chant at an alumni that had a big part in 2015 national championship is pretty lame if you ask me. I respect Coach K for standing up for his guy. There will not be a dwindling attendance at Cameron Indoor because of it.

True, but Duke themselves have been trying to fight dwindling student turnout. Its not a good look. As most will attest, alum or not, you want your students jeering your opponents. That's what helps make a home court advantage. You can like a person and respect a person outside the court, even on the court for what they did, but when they come in as an outsider or opponent, they are fair game IMO. Never discourage students for getting after an opponent's coach or players (as long as its not vulgar and out of line)

(01-29-2020 10:04 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  

(01-29-2020 10:00 AM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  

(01-29-2020 09:49 AM)dan10 Wrote:  On a different note, a bad look for Duke having K telling the student section to shut up. In a time of dwindling attendance to sporting events, that is not a good look, even for a legend.

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2858...krzyzewski

This link has the video for anyone that wants to see it.

Might be time for the old man to hang it up if he's getting that tweaked out about a "sit with us" chant. They were literally half-ass honoring him and jeering him at the same time.

Coach K lost his mind there for no good reason.

If the chant is honoring him then I'm ok with it. I just didn't get what in world it meant lol.

From what I gathered last night, that chant is a Cameron Crazy standard, and they typically chant that to former players that come back to see the team play. I really think Coach K thought they were saying something else to get as upset as he did.

I can't comment on Coach K with any semblance of objectivity, so that is all that I'll say

(01-29-2020 10:07 AM)bricksnivy Wrote:  

(01-29-2020 09:49 AM)dan10 Wrote:  He talked a big game when he got there too so it's on him to start beating the big boys. Also, at the same time it's kind of unreasonable to think he'd have them there already.

Making the tournament in year three is realistic, especially given this is the worst the ACC has been in a decade. Beating GT and a really bad Carolina team is reasonable. I'm not one to defend that fan base, and agree that they have unrealistic expectations, but I think they're rightly frustrated this year.

It's inexcusable to have multiple players state post game that they didn't read the scouting report. That is on Keatts.

Another angle to this is how it impacts Siddle and UNCW. If Bass was on the fence with him 3 years ago, is he really going to hire him if they continue to under perform?

That was not my quote, but I agree with you. They have been up and down aka inconsistent and have not gotten over the peak against the big boys. Poor defense (as seen at UNCW) is certainly prone to inconsistencies. Not working hard or having the right work ethic will certainly hamper a team as well

(01-29-2020 10:07 AM)bricksnivy Wrote:  

(01-29-2020 09:49 AM)dan10 Wrote:  He talked a big game when he got there too so it's on him to start beating the big boys. Also, at the same time it's kind of unreasonable to think he'd have them there already.

Making the tournament in year three is realistic, especially given this is the worst the ACC has been in a decade. Beating GT and a really bad Carolina team is reasonable. I'm not one to defend that fan base, and agree that they have unrealistic expectations, but I think they're rightly frustrated this year.

It's inexcusable to have multiple players state post game that they didn't read the scouting report. That is on Keatts.

Another angle to this is how it impacts Siddle and UNCW. If Bass was on the fence with him 3 years ago, is he really going to hire him if they continue to under perform?

You're right... There's something wrong with that team. Whether it's chemistry or coaching, it's definitely not lack of talent. I get why the fan base is frustrated, but I wouldn't say he's on the hot seat by any means.

(01-29-2020 10:13 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  You're right... There's something wrong with that team. Whether it's chemistry or coaching, it's definitely not lack of talent. I get why the fan base is frustrated, but I wouldn't say he's on the hot seat by any means.

I agree there. There is zero chance he is fired this year based on performance, and really hard to envision a scenario where he'd get anything short of two more years, 5 years total.

(01-29-2020 09:54 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  

(01-29-2020 09:41 AM)Seahawkhoops Wrote:  

(01-29-2020 09:19 AM)jumpinmullet Wrote:  State fans can't get past losing to Carolina for whatever reason and if they beat Carolina at Carolina all will be forgiven for now. If they lose in Chapel Hill and don't make the NCAA tournament it might start the chatter. I don't really understand the obsession with Carolina because they have been beating them forever it seems like and Rory has a ridiculous record vs State. I was not a big fan of Herb Sendek but he won games,went to the NCAA tourney,lost to UNC and ended up getting fired.

From a State fans point of view, they want to compete with the big dogs. In their minds, this is the coach that they hired to get them there, and, he hasn't. Thus, the disappointment. There was a time when Duke wasn't much of a rival for UNC either , then K arrived. Rival landscapes change all the time.

I'm sure Keatts was fully aware what he was getting himself into... He talked a big game when he got there too so it's on him to start beating the big boys. Also, at the same time it's kind of unreasonable to think he'd have them there already. Herb didn't have any charisma, but he was a good basketball mind. He recruited players that fit his system well too. At the end of the day he wasn't technically fired. I think the school was fine with him as their coach, but I do think he was took the Arizona State job because of the unreasonable expectations of the fan base.

Sendek left just ahead of the pink slip and I think it is pretty obvious it was the right move for him. Keatts is a different personality as a coach and person and if you are gonna talk the talk you better walk the walk sooner rather than later. I don't see State fans giving him the benefit of the doubt as in 6 years to start winning or competing for ACC titles. The total lack of effort at home vs Carolina can't sit well with any State fan.

(01-29-2020 09:13 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  I think it had an impact on recruiting his first couple years but certainly none on the winning games part. If they gave Sidney Lowe 5 years, Keatts will certainly get 5 years. His seat is not hot from the administration side, just their delusional fans on twitter.

I agree that he'll get 5 years. But this idea that because Sendek didn't get to the NCAA Tournament his first 5 seasons somehow gives Keatts any latitude/guarantee beyond 5 years is simply false. It lacks context.

(01-29-2020 10:00 AM)CG_Hawk06 Wrote:  https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2858...krzyzewski

This link has the video for anyone that wants to see it.

Might be time for the old man to hang it up if he's getting that tweaked out about a "sit with us" chant. They were literally half-ass honoring him and jeering him at the same time.

Coach K lost his mind there for no good reason.

Yep. Why does K give a sh*t what the students are chanting in the first place? Focus on coaching your team. If his mind is on whatever the students are doing its not in the right place.

(01-29-2020 09:54 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  Herb didn't have any charisma, but he was a good basketball mind. He recruited players that fit his system well too. At the end of the day he wasn't technically fired. I think the school was fine with him as their coach, but I do think he was took the Arizona State job because of the unreasonable expectations of the fan base.

The fact that he entered his final season or 2 (not exactly sure what his contract situation was at the time) without an extension is basically like being fired. Not unlike the Brownell situation. He was run out of town.

It's certainly hard to argue he WASN'T treated unfairly by State. He won a lot of games coming off the awful Les Robinson era, and ran a squeaky clean program. But that wasn't enough, so State went searching for greener grass that just isn't there. And still might not be, if Keatts doesn't get things turned around by next year or so.

A failure for Keatts to take the program to the "next level" will be evidence that its just not that good of a job, and they'll never be able to compete at the top of the ACC like the fans and boosters want them to.

I mean hell, just look at the delusions NC State had during that 2006 coaching search. They went big-game hunting for the likes of Calipari, Tom Izzo and Rick Barnes, who all had zero interest. Their reported "secondary" candidates, like Tom Crean, Billy Gillespie, Sean Miller, etc weren't interested either. So they settled on Sidney Lowe. lol.

(01-29-2020 11:45 AM)Seahawk Nation 08 Wrote:  

(01-29-2020 09:54 AM)Gary Miller Wrote:  Herb didn't have any charisma, but he was a good basketball mind. He recruited players that fit his system well too. At the end of the day he wasn't technically fired. I think the school was fine with him as their coach, but I do think he was took the Arizona State job because of the unreasonable expectations of the fan base.

The fact that he entered his final season or 2 (not exactly sure what his contract situation was at the time) without an extension is basically like being fired. Not unlike the Brownell situation. He was run out of town.

It's certainly hard to argue he WASN'T treated unfairly by State.

That's not what I'm saying at all. I just stated the actual fact of what happened. Herb was good enough to not be fired, but not good enough to be embraced by the fan base. Keatts has been basically in the same boat since he got there. Lee Fowler was the AD back then, which he wasn't very good IMO. So that could've had something to do with it.