(04-09-2020 12:20 AM)33laszlo99 Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 12:14 AM)Erictelevision Wrote:  What "geography problem" does Buffalo present?

The AAC will keep the twelve spot open until the dust settles on the Big 12 implosion. Then they will rescue a grateful West Virginia.

I can see them going after WV if that happens and the Big 10 or ACC are not interested.

(04-09-2020 12:14 AM)Erictelevision Wrote:  What "geography problem" does Buffalo present?

Most AAC teams are in the south.

(04-09-2020 02:57 AM)CoastalVANDAL Wrote:  Air Force football only keep basketball at eleven.

I highly doubt it. Where would Air Force play its other sports? The MWC works well for them in all sports.

(04-09-2020 12:45 AM)CoachMaclid Wrote:  How in the frack is Marshall, which is one of the largest organic revenue generating programs around the G5 and one of the few programs in the G5 with both an NCAA Basketball Tournament win and a football Top 25 finish in the past 5 seasons, not on this list?

Location, location, location. They are in the smallest state by population of any viable candidate out there, it's a worthless market, and Cincinnati is the only school close enough to drive to. I don't know who would be better, Marshall or Appalachian State. Both are in the middle of nowhere. Then again, is Birmingham really that much better? OK it is but it would be a bottom feeder city in the AAC.

(04-08-2020 07:10 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 06:18 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 06:02 PM)schmolik Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 05:45 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:34 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  The AAC will remain at 11, but if we had to pick one of those schools, i would vote for Appalachian State.

I do not want another west/Texas type school, to me the conference has begun to list too heavily in that direction. So a school on the eastern seaboard. Georgia Southern (why are they not listed?) or Georgia State would work as next choices.

The AAC is moving their headquarters to Irving Texas. Conferences follow money. But, the opening is in the eastern division, and I doubt the eastern members would want a team west of the Mississippi, unless it was a MWC football only invite.

Navy can always move to the East, isn't that where they belong? Maybe the new team even if it is an Eastern team has to go to the West has so Navy can go back East. Why should Navy be punished? If someone's getting in, let them deal with the West, they should be happy they're getting in. Assuming it's UAB, they'd be with Memphis and Tulane so it wouldn't be so bad.

Navy *wants* to be in the West. Puts them in with private schools and increases their exposure in Texas, both of which are big deals to them.

And since they are FB only, it really isn't that big of a deal WHAT division they are in.

Temple and ECU are the only drivable Eastern teams, and they would be hosting one yearly, so a flight is a flight. Being in the west adds ONE whole conference flight vs drive

Georgia Southern is another Marshall/Appalachian State, their market (Savannah) isn't relevant. If you're going to take a Georgia school of course you're going to take the one in Atlanta plus it's by far a larger student body and ranked higher academically.

If UAB is the 12th team, both UAB and Navy might want to be in the West (UAB will want to be with Memphis). Will the other West Division schools (Houston, SMU, Tulane, Tulsa, Memphis) rather keep Navy or prefer UAB? UAB, Memphis, and Tulane were founding members of C-USA and Houston joined the following year after the SWC broke up. I can see the other Western teams preferring UAB in their division than Tulsa as it would save them travel to Annapolis.

(04-09-2020 06:18 AM)schmolik Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 12:45 AM)CoachMaclid Wrote:  How in the frack is Marshall, which is one of the largest organic revenue generating programs around the G5 and one of the few programs in the G5 with both an NCAA Basketball Tournament win and a football Top 25 finish in the past 5 seasons, not on this list?

Location, location, location. They are in the smallest state by population of any viable candidate out there, it's a worthless market, and Cincinnati is the only school close enough to drive to. I don't know who would be better, Marshall or Appalachian State. Both are in the middle of nowhere. Then again, is Birmingham really that much better? OK it is but it would be a bottom feeder city in the AAC.

Location isn't necessarily correlated with Brand Value, which is the real determinant. Some big brands are in small towns while some nobodies are in huge metroplexes.

I'd take App State from that list. They have far more notoriety than most, they are known nationally. I mean, I know that Georgia State has 40,000 students in the heart of Atlanta, but basically nobody but them and their close relatives have ever heard of them. I only know it because a couple of earnest G-State folks have told us so on this forum. Potential? Sure. But not anywhere close yet.

Really see the AAC staying with 11 FB and 11 Olympic Sport members as long as possible. After the waiver ends Aresco tries for a legislative change with the NCAA to stand pat as is with a FB Championship Game.

If the members get over the hard feelings of UConn leaving the conference could re-admit UConn for FB only to balance the league at 12 FB members to retain the Championship Game if Aresco cannot get an NCAA legislative change. That probably won't happen.

The schools that the AAC see value in are not coming. BYU and Army are remaining independent. The MWC schools are not leaving their conference short of a major realignment with the P5 conferences and that is not happening either. Texas and Oklahoma will remain in the B12 for an easier path to the National Championship and remain the big fish in a little pond. They will find other ways of maximizing revenue to keep up with the other conferences and stay put.

If Aresco cannot get a legislative change to keep the FB Championship game and has to return to 12 FB members, then the AAC will have to raid the other G5 conferences for an all sports member with the greatest marketing value, or take on one of the remaining independents for FB only (UMass, Liberty, NMST). The only other alternative would be getting an FCS school like James Madison to move up to fill the void in the Eastern Division. Helps to keep travel costs down in the region for Temple, ECU, and Cinn with the conference stretched into Florida and the South West.

(04-08-2020 09:55 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 05:45 PM)Side Show Joe Wrote:  

(04-08-2020 10:34 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  The AAC will remain at 11, but if we had to pick one of those schools, i would vote for Appalachian State.

I do not want another west/Texas type school, to me the conference has begun to list too heavily in that direction. So a school on the eastern seaboard. Georgia Southern (why are they not listed?) or Georgia State would work as next choices.

The AAC is moving their headquarters to Irving Texas.

Believe me, I'm well aware of that. That's part of the "listing" i am talking about. Adding Wichita State while losing UConn is more of it. As a fan of an east coast school, I want someone else in the east.

Moving to Irving was to save overhead costs and to be closer to other conference headquarters - zero bearing on a new add if there is one.

(04-09-2020 07:02 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 06:18 AM)schmolik Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 12:45 AM)CoachMaclid Wrote:  How in the frack is Marshall, which is one of the largest organic revenue generating programs around the G5 and one of the few programs in the G5 with both an NCAA Basketball Tournament win and a football Top 25 finish in the past 5 seasons, not on this list?

Location, location, location. They are in the smallest state by population of any viable candidate out there, it's a worthless market, and Cincinnati is the only school close enough to drive to. I don't know who would be better, Marshall or Appalachian State. Both are in the middle of nowhere. Then again, is Birmingham really that much better? OK it is but it would be a bottom feeder city in the AAC.

Location isn't necessarily correlated with Brand Value, which is the real determinant. Some big brands are in small towns while some nobodies are in huge metroplexes.

I'd take App State from that list. They have far more notoriety than most, they are known nationally. I mean, I know that Georgia State has 40,000 students in the heart of Atlanta, but basically nobody but them and their close relatives have ever heard of them. I only know it because a couple of earnest G-State folks have told us so on this forum. Potential? Sure. But not anywhere close yet.

Pick your poison. Take an Appalachian State, Marshall, or UAB who's good in athletics from an irrelevant market or a Georgia State or Florida International/Atlantic or who is in a desirable market but isn't as good. Are any of the undesirable market schools so good that they can overcome their market? Remember they have good records now vs. lesser competition. I highly doubt teams winning C-USA/Sun Belt are just going to come in and win the AAC in the first 2-3 years.

(04-09-2020 07:02 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  Location isn't necessarily correlated with Brand Value, which is the real determinant. Some big brands are in small towns while some nobodies are in huge metroplexes.

Quite. Georgia State in FB would be fourth place at best even if they put some runs on the board, behind the Falcons, Bulldogs, and Georgia Tech, two of those three right in their home city.

A small town won't support a big national brand all on it's own, but a core heartland where they are the number-one big deal can help a lot.

Rice would really be a nice add. They have great academics, a great stadium with free parking, great baseball, decent basketball, and they are in the great state of Texas. All they need is commitment to a football program and they could compete nicely in the AAC.

(04-07-2020 05:55 PM)schmolik Wrote:  There was discussion about Old Dominion being unhappy about Conference USA and that they wanted to be the American Athletic Conference's 12th member. I highly doubt they would be first on their list. So who would be? Who will they add (if anyone at all)? Will it be a football only member or an all sports member?

Your discussion begins with, seemingly the reason you are asking the poll question, ODU's desire to join the AAC, yet you don't include them in the poll. You need a GFY option...

(04-09-2020 08:37 AM)SMUstang Wrote:  Rice would really be a nice add. They have great academics, a great stadium with free parking, great baseball, decent basketball, and they are in the great state of Texas. All they need is commitment to a football program and they could compete nicely in the AAC.

Wha a group of privates that would be, Tulane, Rice, SMU, Tulsa, and Navy. That would just about be the Ivy League of the South.

(04-09-2020 09:08 AM)MONARCHSWIN Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 05:55 PM)schmolik Wrote:  There was discussion about Old Dominion being unhappy about Conference USA and that they wanted to be the American Athletic Conference's 12th member. I highly doubt they would be first on their list. So who would be? Who will they add (if anyone at all)? Will it be a football only member or an all sports member?

Your discussion begins with, seemingly the reason you are asking the poll question, ODU's desire to join the AAC, yet you don't include them in the poll. You need a GFY option...

It's not a valid poll without ODU.

The poll should've been:
- Buffalo
- ODU
- Charlotte
- Appalachian St
- Georgia St
- UAB
- Rice
- Other

I cannot conceivably see any sub-MWC school besides those 7 getting the next spot.

(04-09-2020 07:43 AM)schmolik Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 07:02 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 06:18 AM)schmolik Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 12:45 AM)CoachMaclid Wrote:  How in the frack is Marshall, which is one of the largest organic revenue generating programs around the G5 and one of the few programs in the G5 with both an NCAA Basketball Tournament win and a football Top 25 finish in the past 5 seasons, not on this list?

Location, location, location. They are in the smallest state by population of any viable candidate out there, it's a worthless market, and Cincinnati is the only school close enough to drive to. I don't know who would be better, Marshall or Appalachian State. Both are in the middle of nowhere. Then again, is Birmingham really that much better? OK it is but it would be a bottom feeder city in the AAC.

Location isn't necessarily correlated with Brand Value, which is the real determinant. Some big brands are in small towns while some nobodies are in huge metroplexes.

I'd take App State from that list. They have far more notoriety than most, they are known nationally. I mean, I know that Georgia State has 40,000 students in the heart of Atlanta, but basically nobody but them and their close relatives have ever heard of them. I only know it because a couple of earnest G-State folks have told us so on this forum. Potential? Sure. But not anywhere close yet.

Pick your poison. Take an Appalachian State, Marshall, or UAB who's good in athletics from an irrelevant market or a Georgia State or Florida International/Atlantic or who is in a desirable market but isn't as good. Are any of the undesirable market schools so good that they can overcome their market? Remember they have good records now vs. lesser competition. I highly doubt teams winning C-USA/Sun Belt are just going to come in and win the AAC in the first 2-3 years.

Well, better not to pick any poison if you can help it, which is why i voted for "stay at 11".

But if the AAC *had* to add a team from that list, then I would choose the App State poison, LOL.

(04-09-2020 09:46 AM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 09:08 AM)MONARCHSWIN Wrote:  

(04-07-2020 05:55 PM)schmolik Wrote:  There was discussion about Old Dominion being unhappy about Conference USA and that they wanted to be the American Athletic Conference's 12th member. I highly doubt they would be first on their list. So who would be? Who will they add (if anyone at all)? Will it be a football only member or an all sports member?

Your discussion begins with, seemingly the reason you are asking the poll question, ODU's desire to join the AAC, yet you don't include them in the poll. You need a GFY option...

It's not a valid poll without ODU.

The poll should've been:
- Buffalo
- ODU
- Charlotte
- Appalachian St
- Georgia St
- UAB
- Rice
- Other

I cannot conceivably see any sub-MWC school besides those 7 getting the next spot.

I also said "I highly doubt they would be first on their list."

I guess when it comes to markets we can put Norfolk and Birmingham in the B-List category with Atlanta and Miami in the A-List category and Huntington C-List and I don't even know what market Boone is. If we do athletics, Old Dominion isn't App State.

Last 10 C-USA Football Champions: UCF, Southern Miss, Tulsa, Rice, Marshall, W. Kentucky, W. Kentucky, Florida Atlantic, UAB, Florida Atlantic

Last 10 C-USA Men's Basketball Champions: Houston, Memphis, Memphis, Memphis, Tulsa, UAB, Middle Tennessee, Middle Tennessee, Marshall, Old Dominion

Last 10 Sun Belt Football Champions (no Championship Game pre-2010): Florida International (won HTH vs. Troy), Arkansas State, Georgia Southern, Arkansas State Arkansas State, Arkansas State, Arkansas State and Appalachian State didn't play each other, Appalachian State and Troy didn't play each other, Appalachian State, Appalachian State

Last 10 Sun Belt Men's Basketball Champions: North Texas, Arkansas Little Rock, W. Kentucky, W. Kentucky, Louisiana, Georgia State, Little Rock, Troy, Georgia State, Georgia State

If we do football, Appalachian State's the clear #1 but then again is the Sun Belt below Conference USA? Arkansas State's pretty solid in the Sun Belt but they're just as bad market wise as App State. I have no idea where Jonesboro is. Florida Atlantic has won 2 of 3 in C-USA. In men's basketball, Georgia State is about as good as anyone lately (3 of last 5 Sun Belt titles, won a game in 2015). The problem is Ron Hunter left (ironically to current AAC team Tulane). Buffalo also has a great men's b-ball team (four in five years, wins in 2018 and 2019) but they also lost their head coach to Alabama.

If I had to choose between ODU and UAB, I'd rather have ODU for distance reasons. If most of the AAC teams had to choose, more of them are closer to UAB and ODU isn't that much better than UAB athletics wise. If it was between ODU and App State, ODU is in a better market but is Norfolk relevant enough for it to matter or would they take the clearly better team?

If I had to choose between ODU and UAB or App State, I'd stay at 11.

App State made their bones on a single game that was, what, 10 years ago?

The A-markets are Charlotte, Georgia St (ATL), & Rice (HOU) but the 3 are flawed in lacking the athletic success the AAC is looking for. But Charlotte and Rice have a history with AAC schools, Rice has top echelon academics, & Georgia St has an A+ market for college football.

The B-markets are Buffalo, ODU (Norfolk), & UAB (Birmingham). Buffalo has the flagship designation in their pocket but geography/FB success working against them. ODU has the budget and resources but FB success working against them. UAB has geography, facilities, and history with AAC members in their favor, but budget working against them.

Appalachian St is the only small market, IMO, with a chance because of the state they're in and FB success. But it's conceivable the Boone market singlehandedly excludes them.

I think the likelihood of AAC voting in a non-MWC/Army member is as follows:
1 UAB
2 ODU
3 Rice
4 Georgia St
5 Appalachian St
6 Charlotte
7 Buffalo

Everyone else is DOA be it location (Marshall), budget (Southern Miss), market redundancy (UNT -- Rice can overcome this because of academics), politics (Liberty), minimal athletic success/history, or a combination of those factors.

The AAC has been very clear that it wants a school that won’t water down the brand. You’re not going to see a project school with potential in 10+ years get added. We want a brand that’s going to add value now or we’ll stay at 11. If the waiver expires without a rule change and we don’t have anyone worthy of adding we can always play with uneven divisions to keep the CCG.

Right now I think everyone is just waiting to see what the Big 12 does when they finally expand. Odds are it’s with 2 AAC programs.

I don't have a dog in this fight, but...

If the goal of the AAC is to become P6, none of these schools help them get there. I voted that they stay at 11.

(04-09-2020 07:43 AM)schmolik Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 07:02 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 06:18 AM)schmolik Wrote:  

(04-09-2020 12:45 AM)CoachMaclid Wrote:  How in the frack is Marshall, which is one of the largest organic revenue generating programs around the G5 and one of the few programs in the G5 with both an NCAA Basketball Tournament win and a football Top 25 finish in the past 5 seasons, not on this list?

Location, location, location. They are in the smallest state by population of any viable candidate out there, it's a worthless market, and Cincinnati is the only school close enough to drive to. I don't know who would be better, Marshall or Appalachian State. Both are in the middle of nowhere. Then again, is Birmingham really that much better? OK it is but it would be a bottom feeder city in the AAC.

Location isn't necessarily correlated with Brand Value, which is the real determinant. Some big brands are in small towns while some nobodies are in huge metroplexes.

I'd take App State from that list. They have far more notoriety than most, they are known nationally. I mean, I know that Georgia State has 40,000 students in the heart of Atlanta, but basically nobody but them and their close relatives have ever heard of them. I only know it because a couple of earnest G-State folks have told us so on this forum. Potential? Sure. But not anywhere close yet.

Pick your poison. Take an Appalachian State, Marshall, or UAB who's good in athletics from an irrelevant market or a Georgia State or Florida International/Atlantic or who is in a desirable market but isn't as good. Are any of the undesirable market schools so good that they can overcome their market? Remember they have good records now vs. lesser competition. I highly doubt teams winning C-USA/Sun Belt are just going to come in and win the AAC in the first 2-3 years.

Football only, I think App makes a lot of sense if AAC wants to go for the best available program (assuming Boise, BYU and Army say no). With our talent ID, coaching network, facilities, I think with the access to the slightly higher ranked athlete and extra $$$ we're a good fit. Personal opinion, 2018 and 2019 App are competing for AAC title, maybe not winning, but at the top.

All sports, we have a lot of work to do. Although i think this is a little bit chicken or egg type argument. How much easier is it to convince a top kid to come to your school when your home conference schedule is Memphis, Cincy, UCF, etc rather than ULM, Coastal and UTA?

The market is the market. Boone is a small town smack dab in the most beautiful part of God's green earth. However, our largest alumni &fan base is Charlotte. The beauty (and to App's benefit and the large metro schools detriment) of online streaming is ESPN et al are collecting data of direct eyeballs on screen, in a much better way than ever before. Now it really matters how many fans you actually have, not how many people live within X miles of your campus. I think once you take out the in state and traditional P5 powers- App is the biggest college football brand in Charlotte.

ECU still has a very large and passionate fanbase- they are just concentrated in Raleigh and eastern part of the state.