Well, if Yormark misses out on the 4C schools, I could see him waiting it out until schools like Pitt/VaTech/UL/NCSU come available. That's what I think he means when he says, "the window won't be opened forever". If UO and UW leave in 2030, he may leave a schools like Utah and ASU on the sideline until he gets clarity on the ACC situation in a few years. That's the gamble ASU and Utah are taking. Do they want to risk ending up in a glorified WAC/MWC long term?

(05-05-2023 04:57 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(05-05-2023 12:16 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  How well does Fresno actually perform in the Sacramento market?

I have to think that determines a lot of their upside. For instance BU and Tech do really well in DFW, Houston, Austin, and San Antonio and better than some of the schools based there despite their "home" market not being the biggest. However has Fresno ever been a big factor in Sacramento? I know college sports isn't likely as deep of a market penetration in that state.

I don't think a TV network is realistically going to give Fresno State credit for the Sacramento market if that's what you're asking. Like the vast majority of G5 schools, Fresno is going to have to rely solely upon its direct home market for TV purposes (even if they may have an argument that there's a wider group of fans beyond that home market - lots of G5 schools try to make that argument but the networks simply don't price them that way).

Just goes to show how little you know about the Valley. Modesto which is 90 minutes from Fresno is in the Sacramento DMA and is already pretty strong Fresno Country. As is Bakersfield which is 90 minutes south. The Networks already know these facts which is why the put Fresno on as much as they do compared to say UNLV.

(05-06-2023 04:25 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 03:50 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 03:30 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 02:42 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(05-05-2023 07:36 PM)MattBrownEP Wrote:  No, not really. Vegas may be growing, but the Vegas TV market is still pretty small...it's smaller than places like Milwaukee, Hartford, Greenville/Spartanburg, and West Palm Beach. The *quality* of the TV market also matters for a team like UNLV, that hasn't had a meaningful hold over local fans in a good 20 years...and now that market is even more full of transplants who have no reason to care about UNLV.

Vegas is an important part of a conference footprint for many reasons, but not because anybody absolutely HAS to have those 880,000 TV eyeballs.

As for the OP, everything I've heard on the Big 12/industry side is that Fresno is substantially more interested in the Big 12 than the Big 12 is with them

I read that article last month in which FSU's President was talking about flirtations with the big 12. It sure seemed to me that he was playing it up in order to solicit donations from the boosters.

They need money to renovate their football stadium and other venues. To do that, they have to go before the public and ask for taxes to be increased.

If so, IMO this is a non-starter. I think things have changed in Florida, it used to be that FSU and UF could each reach in to the tax till, each side agreeing to not oppose the other's cash-grab. But with the rise of other universities in the state, there is IMO less willingness by the peninsula to treat FSU as a natural national representative of the state.

Fortunately for them, IMO they do have boosters who seem to be able to raise very large sums of money when it is needed.

And I agree, it is needed. If I was the FSU president, I would push my boosters hard for a massive investment in what you mention, with the pitch that we need to tide ourselves over for the next 10 years, when we can start collecting much fatter SEC checks.

Our deal to develop the Mission Valley site did not involve any increases in taxes or student fees. It never would have been approved if it had. The university purchased the land for a bit over $90M when they had offered the Chargers a 99 year lease for $1/year to keep them here. It has actually been popular in town, given SDSU is paying over $50M to develop a river park and a new bridge over it. We do have bonds issued on the project but the stadium and development around it will cover those costs and generate a profit.

This is a very good point, and something that we hardly talk about here. San Diego lost their NFL team to LA. LA just got the Rams back a few years ago, too. Now it's a 2 NFL team city, while San Diego and its 3m people has 0, and it has football-loving fans thirsty for a team to support.

(05-07-2023 10:51 PM)Gitanole Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 03:50 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 03:30 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 02:42 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(05-05-2023 07:36 PM)MattBrownEP Wrote:  No, not really. Vegas may be growing, but the Vegas TV market is still pretty small...it's smaller than places like Milwaukee, Hartford, Greenville/Spartanburg, and West Palm Beach. The *quality* of the TV market also matters for a team like UNLV, that hasn't had a meaningful hold over local fans in a good 20 years...and now that market is even more full of transplants who have no reason to care about UNLV.

Vegas is an important part of a conference footprint for many reasons, but not because anybody absolutely HAS to have those 880,000 TV eyeballs.

As for the OP, everything I've heard on the Big 12/industry side is that Fresno is substantially more interested in the Big 12 than the Big 12 is with them

I read that article last month in which FSU's President was talking about flirtations with the big 12. It sure seemed to me that he was playing it up in order to solicit donations from the boosters.

They need money to renovate their football stadium and other venues. To do that, they have to go before the public and ask for taxes to be increased.

If so, IMO this is a non-starter. I think things have changed in Florida, it used to be that FSU and UF could
....

The reference was to Fresno State University in California. I recommend we use 'Fresno' as the short form here. Six letters, gets the job done, no reaching for the shift key.

Yeah, sorry guys. I agree with "Fresno".

(05-09-2023 11:27 AM)Sactowndog Wrote:  

(05-05-2023 12:16 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  How well does Fresno actually perform in the Sacramento market?

I have to think that determines a lot of their upside. For instance BU and Tech do really well in DFW, Houston, Austin, and San Antonio and better than some of the schools based there despite their "home" market not being the biggest. However has Fresno ever been a big factor in Sacramento? I know college sports isn't likely as deep of a market penetration in that state.

I think it depends where in the “Sacramento” market you are discussing. People don’t realize how large the Sacramento DMA is. Modesto is part of the Sacramento DMA and is already owned by Fresno. Stockton residents are included as part of the Fresno local area by the Cal State System. So the part of the DMA that is in the San Joaquin Valley is easily captured by Fresno.

Once you move into Sac the answer starts to be it depends:
* Elk Grove and Folsom areas south of 50 maybe.
* Davis Area and west never in a million years
* downtown Sac area same
* South Placer County possible.
* Truckee Tahoe never ever.
* Yolo and Butte redneckville so maybe

The other factor people miss is the difficulty getting into a public or private school with P5 sports. Fresno will pull in a large number of those people which will again expand the Big 12 reach.

That's only hard in some places. In California and much of the B1G states? Yeah, some of them only have 1 p5 school in the entire state. In the South? You can't throw a rock in any direction in Texas without hitting a P5 school. Texas Tech is the easiest to get into, they have a 69% admission rate and average SAT of 1155. For comparison, Fresno is 1000 miles from anyone other than BYU, average SAT is 1010, and they have an acceptance rate of 97.3%. You guys need to worry about catching up to Memphis, then Texas Tech, then maybe a P5 conference will look at you seriously.

(05-09-2023 12:03 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  Obviously hindsight is 20/20, but I wonder had the Big 12 just backfilled OUT with Houston/UC, what could they have been looking at in terms of expansion candidates today. I think current PAC 12 teams sans USCLA would be no less willing to jump to that 10-team Big 12, especially with UCF and BYU removed from the equation. But Yormark could have been set up to add the 4C and still remain at 14 schools. I don't think Utah would have been gung-ho about keeping the PAC schools together with the opportunity of moving to a BYU-less Big 12. I was against them adding UCF and BYU in 2021.

UCF and BYU are both above the academic average in the big 12, and they'll both be able to hit the ground running athletically. BYU has national reach as a poor-man's ND, while UCF gets them a strong presence in Florida. I think that they were both excellent choices for the big 12, and evidently, Fox and ESPN agree with me.

As for Utah? Why are they a better school to have than BYU? Hint: they're not. Utah is #2 in their own State, and BYU has far more national reach on top of that. Utah has been feasting on Pac programs during down cycles, and it's raised their national profile, but that would change if they joined the big 12. I don't blame them for trying to keep the Pac together, they can actually win there. If they join the big 12 then they're following their historical "big brother" BYU and joining a conference with 12 teams that are a threat to beat them every single week.

To put it another way, UCF and BYU are a large part of the reason that the big 12 is even a consideration for most of the Pac schools, while Utah will have some reservations about joining BYU that other schools would not need to consider. If UCF and BYU end up keeping some Pac schools from joining the big 12, then they can regroup and focus Eastward going forward, allowing the West to slowly wither and die.

(05-09-2023 12:07 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 04:12 AM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 03:41 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 02:31 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(05-05-2023 12:16 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  How well does Fresno actually perform in the Sacramento market?

I have to think that determines a lot of their upside. For instance BU and Tech do really well in DFW, Houston, Austin, and San Antonio and better than some of the schools based there despite their "home" market not being the biggest. However has Fresno ever been a big factor in Sacramento? I know college sports isn't likely as deep of a market penetration in that state.

Fresno spends at about the average of the MWC. Their academics are significantly weaker than Memphis'. The only thing they have to hang their hat on is that they've been slightly above average in football for the past few years. If Yormark sincerely wanted to expand out West rather than just to send coded messages to the 4c, he would consider SDSU and Boise St and then just stop considering anyone else b/c the rest of them aren't ready for a P5 conference. Not UNLV. Not Fresno. Not UNM. Not Reno. They're all very good schools with strong Athletics programs and good brands, but they all have some growing to do to get a big 12 or Pac level.

SDSU also has an offer from the B12, not sure if that is going with PAC schools or a couple other MWC schools. According to my source (who I do trust with information on SDSU) the deal would take 3 years before reaching full status. There is a rumor, that ESPN and FOX have agreed to add SDSU at a full share but I have to believe that would be in combination with some PAC schools. That last rumor was out there in the public realm and not from my source so take that for what its worth.

Unless the PAC really craps the bed with their deal, that is were we will be going. It's just a better fit culturally and geographically and it will do a lot to improve us academically. We will be R1 by 2024 and part of our $3B expansion in Mission Valley is building an "Innovation District" to increase our research capabilities. We are partnered with Qualcomm already on that and UCSD has expressed an interest in participating though they are also looking at South Country.

No offense to your inside man, I'm sure he's very well-connected, but nobody knows right now who's going where, or even if anybody is. Kliavkoff could have signed in blood that you guys are getting imminently invited, but if the guys at Apple won't pay for it and Stanford mobilizes a group to veto then you're not getting in, regardless of how stupid a move that would be for the Pac to make. And the big 12? Yormark at least could make that decision, his Presidents aren't going to get in his way when he's proven to have the Magic Touch thus far. It's possible that you'd get an invite if there's an odd number of Pac schools requesting to join the big 12, but that's hardly a guarantee, and Yormark may just decide to go for one of WSU/OSU instead of you. He could also wait for more Pac or ACC schools to call him up and run for a few years with an odd number, though if he raids the Pac and then doesn't take SDSU then that certainly increases your odds of a Pac invite.

We have a "binding agreement" with the PAC that goes back to November. Again, there is a reason why JD Wicker is staying at SDSU and it isn't because the humidity in Mississippi is terrible.

Ok. PSU had an agreement to join the B1G, then the B1G Presidents spent 6 months dithering on it and almost blew the deal up. I'm not saying that you guys won't join the Pac, I think it's very likely that you will, but it won't be because of some mysterious document from 6 months ago that nobody has heard about except 1 anonymous source.

FYI, Dan Patrick announced 6 months ago that he was told you would be joining the Pac "as soon as next week". I bet he got wind of that same document that you're referencing. Maybe Kliavkoff thought he had his media deal all sorted back then, or maybe he couldn't get his Presidents to sign off on the "binding agreement" at that time, I don't know. But something has put a kink in the works b/c it's been 6 months and you're still in limbo.

(05-09-2023 01:08 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 11:27 AM)Sactowndog Wrote:  

(05-05-2023 12:16 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  How well does Fresno actually perform in the Sacramento market?

I have to think that determines a lot of their upside. For instance BU and Tech do really well in DFW, Houston, Austin, and San Antonio and better than some of the schools based there despite their "home" market not being the biggest. However has Fresno ever been a big factor in Sacramento? I know college sports isn't likely as deep of a market penetration in that state.

I think it depends where in the “Sacramento” market you are discussing. People don’t realize how large the Sacramento DMA is. Modesto is part of the Sacramento DMA and is already owned by Fresno. Stockton residents are included as part of the Fresno local area by the Cal State System. So the part of the DMA that is in the San Joaquin Valley is easily captured by Fresno.

Once you move into Sac the answer starts to be it depends:
* Elk Grove and Folsom areas south of 50 maybe.
* Davis Area and west never in a million years
* downtown Sac area same
* South Placer County possible.
* Truckee Tahoe never ever.
* Yolo and Butte redneckville so maybe

The other factor people miss is the difficulty getting into a public or private school with P5 sports. Fresno will pull in a large number of those people which will again expand the Big 12 reach.

That's only hard in some places. In California and much of the B1G states? Yeah, some of them only have 1 p5 school in the entire state. In the South? You can't throw a rock in any direction in Texas without hitting a P5 school. Texas Tech is the easiest to get into, they have a 69% admission rate and average SAT of 1155. For comparison, Fresno is 1000 miles from anyone other than BYU, average SAT is 1010, and they have an acceptance rate of 97.3%. You guys need to worry about catching up to Memphis, then Texas Tech, then maybe a P5 conference will look at you seriously.

Yeah I am talking about CA specifically.

And I’m not going to argue to what extent the Big 12 is or is not looking at Fresno. It’s all speculation. But I can talk factually about the things I do know about in terms of Valley population and affinity.

(05-09-2023 11:43 AM)1845 Bear Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 11:27 AM)Sactowndog Wrote:  

(05-05-2023 12:16 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  How well does Fresno actually perform in the Sacramento market?

I have to think that determines a lot of their upside. For instance BU and Tech do really well in DFW, Houston, Austin, and San Antonio and better than some of the schools based there despite their "home" market not being the biggest. However has Fresno ever been a big factor in Sacramento? I know college sports isn't likely as deep of a market penetration in that state.

I think it depends where in the “Sacramento” market you are discussing. People don’t realize how large the Sacramento DMA is. Modesto is part of the Sacramento DMA and is already owned by Fresno. Stockton residents are included as part of the Fresno local area by the Cal State System. So the part of the DMA that is in the San Joaquin Valley is easily captured by Fresno.

Once you move into Sac the answer starts to be it depends:
* Elk Grove and Folsom areas south of 50 maybe.
* Davis Area and west never in a million years
* downtown Sac area same
* South Placer County possible.
* Truckee Tahoe never ever.
* Yolo and Butte redneckville so maybe

The other factor people miss is the difficulty getting into a public or private school with P5 sports. Fresno will pull in a large number of those people which will again expand the Big 12 reach.

Approaching it like a broadcast company- what % of the total DMA's tv sets will tune in?

Well I don’t have a break-out of the Sac DMA by metro area. I’m sure the networks do.

I do have population for metro areas:

San Joaquin Valley MSA’s not in Fresno DMA
Bakersfield MSA 730,000 (Bakersfield DMA)
Modesto MSA 422,000. (Sacramento DMA)
Stockton MSA 793, 229. (Sacramento DMA)

————————————————
Sacramento Valley some possible Fresno penetration
Sacramento Roseville Folsom 2.41M

—————————————-
Sacramento DMA unlikely penetration
Truckee MSA 99k
Vallejo Fairfield 414k
Yuba City 182K


The broadcasters know the TV’s in each of these areas. I am sure they have shared those numbers with Yormark. It’s not just the Fresno DMA nor is it all of Sacramento/Stockton/Modesto.

the data above highlights how geographically and culturally spread out the SAC DMA is. It’s why the Kings are considered a small market team despite the size of their DMA. Modesto an Ag town has little in common with Truckee a mountain town, or Sac a government town or Fairfield a military Bay Area suburb. It’s why any blanket statement about Fresno either will or will not penetrate the entire Sac DMA is just ignorant.

(05-09-2023 12:54 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 04:25 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 03:50 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 03:30 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 02:42 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  I read that article last month in which FSU's President was talking about flirtations with the big 12. It sure seemed to me that he was playing it up in order to solicit donations from the boosters.

They need money to renovate their football stadium and other venues. To do that, they have to go before the public and ask for taxes to be increased.

If so, IMO this is a non-starter. I think things have changed in Florida, it used to be that FSU and UF could each reach in to the tax till, each side agreeing to not oppose the other's cash-grab. But with the rise of other universities in the state, there is IMO less willingness by the peninsula to treat FSU as a natural national representative of the state.

Fortunately for them, IMO they do have boosters who seem to be able to raise very large sums of money when it is needed.

And I agree, it is needed. If I was the FSU president, I would push my boosters hard for a massive investment in what you mention, with the pitch that we need to tide ourselves over for the next 10 years, when we can start collecting much fatter SEC checks.

Our deal to develop the Mission Valley site did not involve any increases in taxes or student fees. It never would have been approved if it had. The university purchased the land for a bit over $90M when they had offered the Chargers a 99 year lease for $1/year to keep them here. It has actually been popular in town, given SDSU is paying over $50M to develop a river park and a new bridge over it. We do have bonds issued on the project but the stadium and development around it will cover those costs and generate a profit.

This is a very good point, and something that we hardly talk about here. San Diego lost their NFL team to LA. LA just got the Rams back a few years ago, too. Now it's a 2 NFL team city, while San Diego and its 3m people has 0, and it has football-loving fans thirsty for a team to support.

Once the Rams were moving back to LA we never had a chance to keep the Chargers and the NFL didn't want them to leave. We don't consider we "lost" them, they didn't want to be here. This is what was on the table for them.

1. A 99 year lease of the Mission Valley site AND Murphy Canyon practice facility at $1/year. SDSU bought the main property, not the practice site, for $90M+ though 34 acres of that go to a new city owned park that the university is funding to the tune of $40M. They are also paying between $10-$20M on the Fenton Parkway Bridge that the city has wanted for decades.
2. The city was looking to put up $350M to keep the chargers here.
3. The county was up for another $100M at least.
4. The NFL was going to give them two $200M low interest loans, one is normal.
5. Whatever SDSU would have been willing to pay.

That is more than $900M before the Chargers even open up their wallet.

Most here in SD have said good riddance to the Chargers and the Spani are persona non grata. Heck, they are a terrible tenant at Kronke's wonder palace up the road. I don't think Spanos is well liked among his peers nowadays. At some point, that team will end up in London or San Antonio but without the Spani as owners. San Diego has had its share of crappy owners, Klein and Spanos of the Chargers, Donald Sterling of the Clippers, Tom Werner of the Padres. Given the fact that LA considers San Diego as part of its market is is difficult to get an NHL or NBA franchise.

What we are getting is something that is going to put much more money back into the local economy, SDSU's current budget is over $1B annually and once the Innovation District and other development is finished that will climb significantly higher. It is also one reason, maybe the biggest, why we prefer the PAC over the B12, the academic and research growth we would see with a PAC membership. Every school in it has benefited from that association. From what I have heard, SDSU's presentation as to our research abilities and goals to the PAC presidents was impressive. In just one year our research went from $107M to $163M. In a county of 3.3M people there are only two research universities, UCSD and SDSU. Oh, it should be announced in the next couple of weeks that we are getting the MLS expansion team to play at Snapdragon.

(05-09-2023 01:20 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 12:07 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 04:12 AM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 03:41 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 02:31 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  Fresno spends at about the average of the MWC. Their academics are significantly weaker than Memphis'. The only thing they have to hang their hat on is that they've been slightly above average in football for the past few years. If Yormark sincerely wanted to expand out West rather than just to send coded messages to the 4c, he would consider SDSU and Boise St and then just stop considering anyone else b/c the rest of them aren't ready for a P5 conference. Not UNLV. Not Fresno. Not UNM. Not Reno. They're all very good schools with strong Athletics programs and good brands, but they all have some growing to do to get a big 12 or Pac level.

SDSU also has an offer from the B12, not sure if that is going with PAC schools or a couple other MWC schools. According to my source (who I do trust with information on SDSU) the deal would take 3 years before reaching full status. There is a rumor, that ESPN and FOX have agreed to add SDSU at a full share but I have to believe that would be in combination with some PAC schools. That last rumor was out there in the public realm and not from my source so take that for what its worth.

Unless the PAC really craps the bed with their deal, that is were we will be going. It's just a better fit culturally and geographically and it will do a lot to improve us academically. We will be R1 by 2024 and part of our $3B expansion in Mission Valley is building an "Innovation District" to increase our research capabilities. We are partnered with Qualcomm already on that and UCSD has expressed an interest in participating though they are also looking at South Country.

No offense to your inside man, I'm sure he's very well-connected, but nobody knows right now who's going where, or even if anybody is. Kliavkoff could have signed in blood that you guys are getting imminently invited, but if the guys at Apple won't pay for it and Stanford mobilizes a group to veto then you're not getting in, regardless of how stupid a move that would be for the Pac to make. And the big 12? Yormark at least could make that decision, his Presidents aren't going to get in his way when he's proven to have the Magic Touch thus far. It's possible that you'd get an invite if there's an odd number of Pac schools requesting to join the big 12, but that's hardly a guarantee, and Yormark may just decide to go for one of WSU/OSU instead of you. He could also wait for more Pac or ACC schools to call him up and run for a few years with an odd number, though if he raids the Pac and then doesn't take SDSU then that certainly increases your odds of a Pac invite.

We have a "binding agreement" with the PAC that goes back to November. Again, there is a reason why JD Wicker is staying at SDSU and it isn't because the humidity in Mississippi is terrible.

Ok. PSU had an agreement to join the B1G, then the B1G Presidents spent 6 months dithering on it and almost blew the deal up. I'm not saying that you guys won't join the Pac, I think it's very likely that you will, but it won't be because of some mysterious document from 6 months ago that nobody has heard about except 1 anonymous source.

FYI, Dan Patrick announced 6 months ago that he was told you would be joining the Pac "as soon as next week". I bet he got wind of that same document that you're referencing. Maybe Kliavkoff thought he had his media deal all sorted back then, or maybe he couldn't get his Presidents to sign off on the "binding agreement" at that time, I don't know. But something has put a kink in the works b/c it's been 6 months and you're still in limbo.

Yep, my "anonymous" source said it in November (might have been late October) as well, though he preceded Patrick by a couple of weeks. Have more than one source however. Another is a recent retire from the SDSU administration who collaborated that information. Neither are outsiders. Being in "limbo" would not be the term they would use. The PAC prefers to get their media deal finalized before announcing expansion. The PAC just cannot allow the loss of SoCal and if they don't follow through then we have a B12 offer as well. Yormark has said he wants to be in the Pacific time zone and if the PAC stays together but doesn't take SDSU then we go there. You think he is talking about Gonzaga? Inviting SDSU is a defensive move for the PAC. If Fresno had academics near that of SDSU they would be getting a look too.

(05-09-2023 03:27 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 01:20 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 12:07 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 04:12 AM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(05-06-2023 03:41 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  SDSU also has an offer from the B12, not sure if that is going with PAC schools or a couple other MWC schools. According to my source (who I do trust with information on SDSU) the deal would take 3 years before reaching full status. There is a rumor, that ESPN and FOX have agreed to add SDSU at a full share but I have to believe that would be in combination with some PAC schools. That last rumor was out there in the public realm and not from my source so take that for what its worth.

Unless the PAC really craps the bed with their deal, that is were we will be going. It's just a better fit culturally and geographically and it will do a lot to improve us academically. We will be R1 by 2024 and part of our $3B expansion in Mission Valley is building an "Innovation District" to increase our research capabilities. We are partnered with Qualcomm already on that and UCSD has expressed an interest in participating though they are also looking at South Country.

No offense to your inside man, I'm sure he's very well-connected, but nobody knows right now who's going where, or even if anybody is. Kliavkoff could have signed in blood that you guys are getting imminently invited, but if the guys at Apple won't pay for it and Stanford mobilizes a group to veto then you're not getting in, regardless of how stupid a move that would be for the Pac to make. And the big 12? Yormark at least could make that decision, his Presidents aren't going to get in his way when he's proven to have the Magic Touch thus far. It's possible that you'd get an invite if there's an odd number of Pac schools requesting to join the big 12, but that's hardly a guarantee, and Yormark may just decide to go for one of WSU/OSU instead of you. He could also wait for more Pac or ACC schools to call him up and run for a few years with an odd number, though if he raids the Pac and then doesn't take SDSU then that certainly increases your odds of a Pac invite.

We have a "binding agreement" with the PAC that goes back to November. Again, there is a reason why JD Wicker is staying at SDSU and it isn't because the humidity in Mississippi is terrible.

Ok. PSU had an agreement to join the B1G, then the B1G Presidents spent 6 months dithering on it and almost blew the deal up. I'm not saying that you guys won't join the Pac, I think it's very likely that you will, but it won't be because of some mysterious document from 6 months ago that nobody has heard about except 1 anonymous source.

FYI, Dan Patrick announced 6 months ago that he was told you would be joining the Pac "as soon as next week". I bet he got wind of that same document that you're referencing. Maybe Kliavkoff thought he had his media deal all sorted back then, or maybe he couldn't get his Presidents to sign off on the "binding agreement" at that time, I don't know. But something has put a kink in the works b/c it's been 6 months and you're still in limbo.

Yep, my "anonymous" source said it in November (might have been late October) as well, though he preceded Patrick by a couple of weeks. Have more than one source however. Another is a recent retire from the SDSU administration who collaborated that information. Neither are outsiders. Being in "limbo" would not be the term they would use. The PAC prefers to get their media deal finalized before announcing expansion. The PAC just cannot allow the loss of SoCal and if they don't follow through then we have a B12 offer as well. Yormark has said he wants to be in the Pacific time zone and if the PAC stays together but doesn't take SDSU then we go there. You think he is talking about Gonzaga? Inviting SDSU is a defensive move for the PAC. If Fresno had academics near that of SDSU they would be getting a look too.

Very unlikely SDSU has a commitable offer, to either conference, but certainly not from Big 12

(05-09-2023 12:22 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  Well, if Yormark misses out on the 4C schools, I could see him waiting it out until schools like Pitt/VaTech/UL/NCSU come available. That's what I think he means when he says, "the window won't be opened forever". If UO and UW leave in 2030, he may leave a schools like Utah and ASU on the sideline until he gets clarity on the ACC situation in a few years. That's the gamble ASU and Utah are taking. Do they want to risk ending up in a glorified WAC/MWC long term?

And if the ACC looses just Clemson, UNC, FSU and Notre Dame they will be backfilling with B12 teams.

(05-09-2023 04:31 PM)Big 12 fan too Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 03:27 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 01:20 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 12:07 PM)Aztecgolfer Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 04:12 AM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  No offense to your inside man, I'm sure he's very well-connected, but nobody knows right now who's going where, or even if anybody is. Kliavkoff could have signed in blood that you guys are getting imminently invited, but if the guys at Apple won't pay for it and Stanford mobilizes a group to veto then you're not getting in, regardless of how stupid a move that would be for the Pac to make. And the big 12? Yormark at least could make that decision, his Presidents aren't going to get in his way when he's proven to have the Magic Touch thus far. It's possible that you'd get an invite if there's an odd number of Pac schools requesting to join the big 12, but that's hardly a guarantee, and Yormark may just decide to go for one of WSU/OSU instead of you. He could also wait for more Pac or ACC schools to call him up and run for a few years with an odd number, though if he raids the Pac and then doesn't take SDSU then that certainly increases your odds of a Pac invite.

We have a "binding agreement" with the PAC that goes back to November. Again, there is a reason why JD Wicker is staying at SDSU and it isn't because the humidity in Mississippi is terrible.

Ok. PSU had an agreement to join the B1G, then the B1G Presidents spent 6 months dithering on it and almost blew the deal up. I'm not saying that you guys won't join the Pac, I think it's very likely that you will, but it won't be because of some mysterious document from 6 months ago that nobody has heard about except 1 anonymous source.

FYI, Dan Patrick announced 6 months ago that he was told you would be joining the Pac "as soon as next week". I bet he got wind of that same document that you're referencing. Maybe Kliavkoff thought he had his media deal all sorted back then, or maybe he couldn't get his Presidents to sign off on the "binding agreement" at that time, I don't know. But something has put a kink in the works b/c it's been 6 months and you're still in limbo.

Yep, my "anonymous" source said it in November (might have been late October) as well, though he preceded Patrick by a couple of weeks. Have more than one source however. Another is a recent retire from the SDSU administration who collaborated that information. Neither are outsiders. Being in "limbo" would not be the term they would use. The PAC prefers to get their media deal finalized before announcing expansion. The PAC just cannot allow the loss of SoCal and if they don't follow through then we have a B12 offer as well. Yormark has said he wants to be in the Pacific time zone and if the PAC stays together but doesn't take SDSU then we go there. You think he is talking about Gonzaga? Inviting SDSU is a defensive move for the PAC. If Fresno had academics near that of SDSU they would be getting a look too.

Very unlikely SDSU has a commitable offer, to either conference, but certainly not from Big 12

And your source for that is?

(05-05-2023 11:02 AM)ken d Wrote:  

(05-05-2023 10:05 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  If the nB12 ends up adding Fresno State, then IMO the nB12's great western expansion campaign will have been an ipso fatso failure.

Was "fatso" an autocorrect, or did you mean that for emphasis?

On KU's home board, we would add that to the "Phog Lexicon," along with "for all intensive purposes" and the like.

(05-09-2023 12:22 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  Well, if Yormark misses out on the 4C schools, I could see him waiting it out until schools like Pitt/VaTech/UL/NCSU come available. That's what I think he means when he says, "the window won't be opened forever". If UO and UW leave in 2030, he may leave a schools like Utah and ASU on the sideline until he gets clarity on the ACC situation in a few years. That's the gamble ASU and Utah are taking. Do they want to risk ending up in a glorified WAC/MWC long term?

I still think Wash n or end up in B10. Though it may be in 5 years. If B12 doesn't get any Paction, there is no big hurry to take Fresno or anyone else for that matter.

How many times does it have to be said? No G5 team will be added to the Big 12 at this point. Cincy UCF Houston were the last to be admitted. BYU was an independent and not in a conference. Fresno can join the PAC with SMU if they want. We do not need nor want them. Come on down Colorado and AZ!

(05-09-2023 02:15 PM)Sactowndog Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 11:43 AM)1845 Bear Wrote:  

(05-09-2023 11:27 AM)Sactowndog Wrote:  

(05-05-2023 12:16 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  How well does Fresno actually perform in the Sacramento market?

The broadcasters know the TV’s in each of these areas. I am sure they have shared those numbers with Yormark. It’s not just the Fresno DMA nor is it all of Sacramento/Stockton/Modesto.

the data above highlights how geographically and culturally spread out the SAC DMA is. It’s why the Kings are considered a small market team despite the size of their DMA. Modesto an Ag town has little in common with Truckee a mountain town, or Sac a government town or Fairfield a military Bay Area suburb. It’s why any blanket statement about Fresno either will or will not penetrate the entire Sac DMA is just ignorant.

Agree 100%, Fresno would be a back up plan at best, TV people would tell what they are willing to pay for the next 6 years, and then Fresno would have to take some $$ less than that #. Example TV would pay 11.2 million now, and Fresno would take 10 million, Then the 12 current schools get 100k to help with travel, and gamble Fresno would help grow the pie in next TV deal.

It could work out great for both parties or be a huge mistake for the B12.