(03-12-2024 10:43 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 09:17 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I wouldn’t be too proud of those 3 expansion schools. They only add value for tier 3 revenue and will sink T1 and T2 value if there’s still an ACC around for the next contract negotiation. Realistically, we’re talking about 3 programs for whom landing in the middle third of the conference standings would be considered a good season. They aren’t quality adds.

I've posted before, but Stanford was the most successful Pac football program for a decade. They've got a top 30 class coming in. They are a WORLD renowned university. They are a gem. Cal is their travel partner, and I've heard a pretty good school as well. SMU is paying to play and they have deep NIL collectives. They will be more competitive than you think and will rise to the level of the Big XII Texas schools.

All three create an ACC after dark option. So more flexible time slots hurt only the ACC I suppose.

The ACC is shaping itself into what it will be, schools which have a like-minded approach to the new reality of college athletics and Notre Dame will play a huge role whether Big Ten fans want to accept that or not. Will Carolina be a part? I'm not sure. Carolina 100% deserves to be making more money than the majority of the SEC and Big Ten, so I'm really not concerned, it will unfold the way it unfolds. I can say I have zero desire to watch the Heels play a bunch of cold weather Midwestern teams and I don't think the Big Ten offers us the 100 year conference. That would be the SEC if it came down to it. It would be a terrible mistake to do what Maryland did to their athletic dept.

Carolina can't bring more Football eyeballs than about half the 16 team Big 12, and also nearly half of their own ACC. They're UCLA, though far easier to replace for the P2 b/c of all the nearby schools. Would I prefer FSU/Clemson/Miami + UNC instead of VT or Kansas as the 4th? Yes. But I don't HAVE to have that. Would the B1G prefer UNC to Stanford? Um, probably, but nether of them is making the B1G any money. The SEC wants UNC more for the long term potential from basketball and geography rather than the short term poor football return, but we seem to be doing just fine without them. Clemson is only 272 miles from Chapel Hill, and Blacksburg is less than 200. Duke is more like 10. I think we could grab a couple of those and dare the B1G to take any of our leftovers, assuming UNC decides to be difficult ofc. But they won't, they'll jump at any offer to remain relevant.

(03-12-2024 11:49 AM)random asian guy Wrote:  If I were Clemson, I would wait for at least a couple of months to see some initial legal decisions.

See, the ACC filed a lawsuit against FSU in North Carolina (which they later amended). FSU filed a Motion To Dismiss/Stay, because they argue that FSU’s FL lawsuit should be the primary lawsuit here. The ACC has now filed a Opposition to that Motion. This is set for March 22, 2024 in North Carolina. The ACC has filed a similar motion in FL and it is set for April 9, 2024. It strikes me that the FL Judge may follow what the NC Judge does. For example, if the NC Judge denies FSU’s motion (allowing NC to proceed), the FL Judge may stay the FL matter. It would be a bit weird if both matters were allowed to proceed, although that may occur.

So, this hearing on 3.22.24 could decide FSU’s legal challenge in one fell swoop. If it causes the FL matter to be stayed, FSU’s legal adventure is over before it barely began. This FSU Motion, thus, is extremely important.

https://writeforcalifornia.com/p/guest-p...sis-of-the

Yeah, no need to weigh in right now when FSU is doing all the heavy lifting. Ditto for UNC. Do they want to leave? Yes. Do they want to leave at any cost? Probably not. Figure out the cost first, then decide if you want to with them or wait until 2036.

(03-12-2024 11:10 AM)Scoochpooch1 Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 08:26 AM)PeteTheChop Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 08:10 AM)Gamenole Wrote:  Those schools are followers not leaders, and they know they're likely to lose their longtime north star, UNC. Appears they're going to convert and become devout disciples of the leprechaun.

"QUICK! Somebody find me a shillelagh..." (overheard on Tobacco Road)

Meanwhile, Poor Jim Phillips to his constituents:

It should be fine for another 2 years then the party is over.

FIFY

(03-12-2024 04:27 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 10:43 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 09:17 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I wouldn’t be too proud of those 3 expansion schools. They only add value for tier 3 revenue and will sink T1 and T2 value if there’s still an ACC around for the next contract negotiation. Realistically, we’re talking about 3 programs for whom landing in the middle third of the conference standings would be considered a good season. They aren’t quality adds.

I've posted before, but Stanford was the most successful Pac football program for a decade. They've got a top 30 class coming in. They are a WORLD renowned university. They are a gem. Cal is their travel partner, and I've heard a pretty good school as well. SMU is paying to play and they have deep NIL collectives. They will be more competitive than you think and will rise to the level of the Big XII Texas schools.

All three create an ACC after dark option. So more flexible time slots hurt only the ACC I suppose.

The ACC is shaping itself into what it will be, schools which have a like-minded approach to the new reality of college athletics and Notre Dame will play a huge role whether Big Ten fans want to accept that or not. Will Carolina be a part? I'm not sure. Carolina 100% deserves to be making more money than the majority of the SEC and Big Ten, so I'm really not concerned, it will unfold the way it unfolds. I can say I have zero desire to watch the Heels play a bunch of cold weather Midwestern teams and I don't think the Big Ten offers us the 100 year conference. That would be the SEC if it came down to it. It would be a terrible mistake to do what Maryland did to their athletic dept.

Carolina can't bring more Football eyeballs than about half the 16 team Big 12, and also nearly half of their own ACC. They're UCLA, though far easier to replace for the P2 b/c of all the nearby schools. Would I prefer FSU/Clemson/Miami + UNC instead of VT or Kansas as the 4th? Yes. But I don't HAVE to have that. Would the B1G prefer UNC to Stanford? Um, probably, but nether of them is making the B1G any money. The SEC wants UNC more for the long term potential from basketball and geography rather than the short term poor football return, but we seem to be doing just fine without them. Clemson is only 272 miles from Chapel Hill, and Blacksburg is less than 200. Duke is more like 10. I think we could grab a couple of those and dare the B1G to take any of our leftovers, assuming UNC decides to be difficult ofc. But they won't, they'll jump at any offer to remain relevant.

Keep telling yourself that, Bryan the aTm fan.

Carolina is easily the second best brand outside the Big Ten and SEC. Hint: the first is not Florida State.

(03-12-2024 05:37 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 04:27 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 10:43 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 09:17 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I wouldn’t be too proud of those 3 expansion schools. They only add value for tier 3 revenue and will sink T1 and T2 value if there’s still an ACC around for the next contract negotiation. Realistically, we’re talking about 3 programs for whom landing in the middle third of the conference standings would be considered a good season. They aren’t quality adds.

I've posted before, but Stanford was the most successful Pac football program for a decade. They've got a top 30 class coming in. They are a WORLD renowned university. They are a gem. Cal is their travel partner, and I've heard a pretty good school as well. SMU is paying to play and they have deep NIL collectives. They will be more competitive than you think and will rise to the level of the Big XII Texas schools.

All three create an ACC after dark option. So more flexible time slots hurt only the ACC I suppose.

The ACC is shaping itself into what it will be, schools which have a like-minded approach to the new reality of college athletics and Notre Dame will play a huge role whether Big Ten fans want to accept that or not. Will Carolina be a part? I'm not sure. Carolina 100% deserves to be making more money than the majority of the SEC and Big Ten, so I'm really not concerned, it will unfold the way it unfolds. I can say I have zero desire to watch the Heels play a bunch of cold weather Midwestern teams and I don't think the Big Ten offers us the 100 year conference. That would be the SEC if it came down to it. It would be a terrible mistake to do what Maryland did to their athletic dept.

Carolina can't bring more Football eyeballs than about half the 16 team Big 12, and also nearly half of their own ACC. They're UCLA, though far easier to replace for the P2 b/c of all the nearby schools. Would I prefer FSU/Clemson/Miami + UNC instead of VT or Kansas as the 4th? Yes. But I don't HAVE to have that. Would the B1G prefer UNC to Stanford? Um, probably, but nether of them is making the B1G any money. The SEC wants UNC more for the long term potential from basketball and geography rather than the short term poor football return, but we seem to be doing just fine without them. Clemson is only 272 miles from Chapel Hill, and Blacksburg is less than 200. Duke is more like 10. I think we could grab a couple of those and dare the B1G to take any of our leftovers, assuming UNC decides to be difficult ofc. But they won't, they'll jump at any offer to remain relevant.

Keep telling yourself that, Bryan the aTm fan.

Carolina is easily the second best brand outside the Big Ten and SEC. Hint: the first is not Florida State.

Doesn't mean the conferences can monetize it even if UNC can sell a lot of Tshirts and caps. FSU and Clemson are worth a lot more to the SEC and Big 10 than Carolina.

(03-12-2024 06:10 AM)LeeNobody Wrote:  I am gearing up to swat down more wish casting.

Do people not understand what met independently means.

The M7 does not exist, anymore than people with a library card are an organized entity

Library card holders, unite! Lest we lose our books.

(03-12-2024 05:37 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 04:27 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 10:43 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 09:17 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I wouldn’t be too proud of those 3 expansion schools. They only add value for tier 3 revenue and will sink T1 and T2 value if there’s still an ACC around for the next contract negotiation. Realistically, we’re talking about 3 programs for whom landing in the middle third of the conference standings would be considered a good season. They aren’t quality adds.

I've posted before, but Stanford was the most successful Pac football program for a decade. They've got a top 30 class coming in. They are a WORLD renowned university. They are a gem. Cal is their travel partner, and I've heard a pretty good school as well. SMU is paying to play and they have deep NIL collectives. They will be more competitive than you think and will rise to the level of the Big XII Texas schools.

All three create an ACC after dark option. So more flexible time slots hurt only the ACC I suppose.

The ACC is shaping itself into what it will be, schools which have a like-minded approach to the new reality of college athletics and Notre Dame will play a huge role whether Big Ten fans want to accept that or not. Will Carolina be a part? I'm not sure. Carolina 100% deserves to be making more money than the majority of the SEC and Big Ten, so I'm really not concerned, it will unfold the way it unfolds. I can say I have zero desire to watch the Heels play a bunch of cold weather Midwestern teams and I don't think the Big Ten offers us the 100 year conference. That would be the SEC if it came down to it. It would be a terrible mistake to do what Maryland did to their athletic dept.

Carolina can't bring more Football eyeballs than about half the 16 team Big 12, and also nearly half of their own ACC. They're UCLA, though far easier to replace for the P2 b/c of all the nearby schools. Would I prefer FSU/Clemson/Miami + UNC instead of VT or Kansas as the 4th? Yes. But I don't HAVE to have that. Would the B1G prefer UNC to Stanford? Um, probably, but nether of them is making the B1G any money. The SEC wants UNC more for the long term potential from basketball and geography rather than the short term poor football return, but we seem to be doing just fine without them. Clemson is only 272 miles from Chapel Hill, and Blacksburg is less than 200. Duke is more like 10. I think we could grab a couple of those and dare the B1G to take any of our leftovers, assuming UNC decides to be difficult ofc. But they won't, they'll jump at any offer to remain relevant.

Keep telling yourself that, Bryan the aTm fan.

Carolina is easily the second best brand outside the Big Ten and SEC. Hint: the first is not Florida State.

You really think most college football fans want to watch Tar Heel football than any P2 team plus ND? Because that is what you are saying.

(03-12-2024 04:51 AM)Gitanole Wrote:  Original report by Ross Dellenger. Check the ACC subheading.
https://sports.yahoo.com/with-college-fo...19343.html

As their television deal falls further financially behind the Power Two, seven ACC schools — FSU, Clemson, Miami, North Carolina, NC State, Virginia and Virginia Tech — met independently last year to explore a potential exit strategy from the ACC’s grant-of-rights. Leading the expedition were Florida State and Clemson, the two most disgruntled and, perhaps, valuable programs seeking a new conference. FSU took an initial step in its exit strategy in December, making a legal filing...

Attorneys for Clemson have spent the last several months gearing up for legal action of their own.

Focused report about Clemson
https://clemsonwire.usatoday.com/2024/03...-acc-exit/

I always enjoyed Pat Paulsen. His run for president was a hoot. He gave you a theoretical choice Nixon? Humphrey? Wallace? or Paulsen? And in '68 if Wallace had won and then been shot Curtis LeMay would have been president. I mean his slogan was truly, "How I stopped worrying and learned to love the Bomb!" Strangelove had nothing on LeMay! What a year! I think the French would have called it "Merde!"

Now that aside, has it occurred to anyone how great a stall the FSU lawsuit has been? ESPN is going to offer a price for the next two years of the playoffs and then worry about the byes and slots. Doesn't this smell fishy to anyone else? The Mouse, the company that goes into Defcon 5 before every contract is leaving loose ends? That's novel!

Petitti and Sankey are working out the workings of an upper tier and how to comply and likely coming into agreement on what if anything they will ask Congress to do for them, or everyone else. Does anyone else realize that these two guys don't waste time on anything unless it's vital? This has "Something's gon'na happen written all over it!"

Meanwhile the men's and women's conference tournaments have and will be played, and March Madness will get under way giving them into mid-April to work things out.

Part of me expects some big news by the end of April, and part says it may come in the Dog Days.

Any way I look at it there's too much that needs to be settled for all parties. The Big 10 and SEC need to make preparations for 2026 and know how many conference games need to be scheduled and whether or not to break into divisions again. The ACC and Big 12 need to be clued in so they can respond appropriately. FOX and ESPN need to cement the CFP, possibly brainstorm a new hoops tourney and take a serious look at inventory demands and streaming options. And everyone needs to get ready for an "employee status" in the Johnson case to emerge.

Too many things need to be decided by 2026 for can kicking. And the recent moratorium on real news pertaining to any of it is reminiscent of the quiet before the last two storms after a lot of buildup, nada, and then bombshell. So, what the hell, LeMay may have been dangerous in '68 but his ghost could make a welcome appearance this Summer to drop another big one!

(03-12-2024 08:54 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 05:37 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 04:27 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 10:43 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 09:17 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I wouldn’t be too proud of those 3 expansion schools. They only add value for tier 3 revenue and will sink T1 and T2 value if there’s still an ACC around for the next contract negotiation. Realistically, we’re talking about 3 programs for whom landing in the middle third of the conference standings would be considered a good season. They aren’t quality adds.

I've posted before, but Stanford was the most successful Pac football program for a decade. They've got a top 30 class coming in. They are a WORLD renowned university. They are a gem. Cal is their travel partner, and I've heard a pretty good school as well. SMU is paying to play and they have deep NIL collectives. They will be more competitive than you think and will rise to the level of the Big XII Texas schools.

All three create an ACC after dark option. So more flexible time slots hurt only the ACC I suppose.

The ACC is shaping itself into what it will be, schools which have a like-minded approach to the new reality of college athletics and Notre Dame will play a huge role whether Big Ten fans want to accept that or not. Will Carolina be a part? I'm not sure. Carolina 100% deserves to be making more money than the majority of the SEC and Big Ten, so I'm really not concerned, it will unfold the way it unfolds. I can say I have zero desire to watch the Heels play a bunch of cold weather Midwestern teams and I don't think the Big Ten offers us the 100 year conference. That would be the SEC if it came down to it. It would be a terrible mistake to do what Maryland did to their athletic dept.

Carolina can't bring more Football eyeballs than about half the 16 team Big 12, and also nearly half of their own ACC. They're UCLA, though far easier to replace for the P2 b/c of all the nearby schools. Would I prefer FSU/Clemson/Miami + UNC instead of VT or Kansas as the 4th? Yes. But I don't HAVE to have that. Would the B1G prefer UNC to Stanford? Um, probably, but nether of them is making the B1G any money. The SEC wants UNC more for the long term potential from basketball and geography rather than the short term poor football return, but we seem to be doing just fine without them. Clemson is only 272 miles from Chapel Hill, and Blacksburg is less than 200. Duke is more like 10. I think we could grab a couple of those and dare the B1G to take any of our leftovers, assuming UNC decides to be difficult ofc. But they won't, they'll jump at any offer to remain relevant.

Keep telling yourself that, Bryan the aTm fan.

Carolina is easily the second best brand outside the Big Ten and SEC. Hint: the first is not Florida State.

You really think most college football fans want to watch Tar Heel football than any P2 team plus ND? Because that is what you are saying.

Actually that’s not what I said at all

(03-12-2024 05:37 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 04:27 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 10:43 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 09:17 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I wouldn’t be too proud of those 3 expansion schools. They only add value for tier 3 revenue and will sink T1 and T2 value if there’s still an ACC around for the next contract negotiation. Realistically, we’re talking about 3 programs for whom landing in the middle third of the conference standings would be considered a good season. They aren’t quality adds.

I've posted before, but Stanford was the most successful Pac football program for a decade. They've got a top 30 class coming in. They are a WORLD renowned university. They are a gem. Cal is their travel partner, and I've heard a pretty good school as well. SMU is paying to play and they have deep NIL collectives. They will be more competitive than you think and will rise to the level of the Big XII Texas schools.

All three create an ACC after dark option. So more flexible time slots hurt only the ACC I suppose.

The ACC is shaping itself into what it will be, schools which have a like-minded approach to the new reality of college athletics and Notre Dame will play a huge role whether Big Ten fans want to accept that or not. Will Carolina be a part? I'm not sure. Carolina 100% deserves to be making more money than the majority of the SEC and Big Ten, so I'm really not concerned, it will unfold the way it unfolds. I can say I have zero desire to watch the Heels play a bunch of cold weather Midwestern teams and I don't think the Big Ten offers us the 100 year conference. That would be the SEC if it came down to it. It would be a terrible mistake to do what Maryland did to their athletic dept.

Carolina can't bring more Football eyeballs than about half the 16 team Big 12, and also nearly half of their own ACC. They're UCLA, though far easier to replace for the P2 b/c of all the nearby schools. Would I prefer FSU/Clemson/Miami + UNC instead of VT or Kansas as the 4th? Yes. But I don't HAVE to have that. Would the B1G prefer UNC to Stanford? Um, probably, but nether of them is making the B1G any money. The SEC wants UNC more for the long term potential from basketball and geography rather than the short term poor football return, but we seem to be doing just fine without them. Clemson is only 272 miles from Chapel Hill, and Blacksburg is less than 200. Duke is more like 10. I think we could grab a couple of those and dare the B1G to take any of our leftovers, assuming UNC decides to be difficult ofc. But they won't, they'll jump at any offer to remain relevant.

Keep telling yourself that, Bryan the aTm fan.

Carolina is easily the second best brand outside the Big Ten and SEC. Hint: the first is not Florida State.

I would consider UNC the third best brand outside the SEC and the B1G. FSU, to me, is #2, with the ever infamous Notre Dame Fighting Fairies at #1.

(03-12-2024 10:09 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 08:54 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 05:37 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 04:27 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 10:43 AM)esayem Wrote:  I've posted before, but Stanford was the most successful Pac football program for a decade. They've got a top 30 class coming in. They are a WORLD renowned university. They are a gem. Cal is their travel partner, and I've heard a pretty good school as well. SMU is paying to play and they have deep NIL collectives. They will be more competitive than you think and will rise to the level of the Big XII Texas schools.

All three create an ACC after dark option. So more flexible time slots hurt only the ACC I suppose.

The ACC is shaping itself into what it will be, schools which have a like-minded approach to the new reality of college athletics and Notre Dame will play a huge role whether Big Ten fans want to accept that or not. Will Carolina be a part? I'm not sure. Carolina 100% deserves to be making more money than the majority of the SEC and Big Ten, so I'm really not concerned, it will unfold the way it unfolds. I can say I have zero desire to watch the Heels play a bunch of cold weather Midwestern teams and I don't think the Big Ten offers us the 100 year conference. That would be the SEC if it came down to it. It would be a terrible mistake to do what Maryland did to their athletic dept.

Carolina can't bring more Football eyeballs than about half the 16 team Big 12, and also nearly half of their own ACC. They're UCLA, though far easier to replace for the P2 b/c of all the nearby schools. Would I prefer FSU/Clemson/Miami + UNC instead of VT or Kansas as the 4th? Yes. But I don't HAVE to have that. Would the B1G prefer UNC to Stanford? Um, probably, but nether of them is making the B1G any money. The SEC wants UNC more for the long term potential from basketball and geography rather than the short term poor football return, but we seem to be doing just fine without them. Clemson is only 272 miles from Chapel Hill, and Blacksburg is less than 200. Duke is more like 10. I think we could grab a couple of those and dare the B1G to take any of our leftovers, assuming UNC decides to be difficult ofc. But they won't, they'll jump at any offer to remain relevant.

Keep telling yourself that, Bryan the aTm fan.

Carolina is easily the second best brand outside the Big Ten and SEC. Hint: the first is not Florida State.

You really think most college football fans want to watch Tar Heel football than any P2 team plus ND? Because that is what you are saying.

Actually that’s not what I said at all

In conference realignment, Brand means Football Brand, so that is what you were saying.

The main reason UNC is so desired is not so much its football, or even its basketball.brands, or its academics or that UNC is located in a state not yet a part of either the SEC or the B1G, though all of those attributes are highly significant. The main reason UNC is so valuable is that it is the capstone of the conference due to historical rivalries. Whichever conference gets UNC, also gets UVA, any NC it wants and most likely Clemson, GT or VT, if desired. Only the Florida schools could go to a different P2 conference and not really care much about not being in the same conference as any of their former conference mates, except FSU and Clemson would miss playing each other. Miami and FSU would continue playing each other no matter what. It's not your brand. it's your historical rivalries, then everything else.

(03-13-2024 12:02 AM)Lurker Above Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 10:09 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 08:54 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 05:37 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 04:27 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  Carolina can't bring more Football eyeballs than about half the 16 team Big 12, and also nearly half of their own ACC. They're UCLA, though far easier to replace for the P2 b/c of all the nearby schools. Would I prefer FSU/Clemson/Miami + UNC instead of VT or Kansas as the 4th? Yes. But I don't HAVE to have that. Would the B1G prefer UNC to Stanford? Um, probably, but nether of them is making the B1G any money. The SEC wants UNC more for the long term potential from basketball and geography rather than the short term poor football return, but we seem to be doing just fine without them. Clemson is only 272 miles from Chapel Hill, and Blacksburg is less than 200. Duke is more like 10. I think we could grab a couple of those and dare the B1G to take any of our leftovers, assuming UNC decides to be difficult ofc. But they won't, they'll jump at any offer to remain relevant.

Keep telling yourself that, Bryan the aTm fan.

Carolina is easily the second best brand outside the Big Ten and SEC. Hint: the first is not Florida State.

You really think most college football fans want to watch Tar Heel football than any P2 team plus ND? Because that is what you are saying.

Actually that’s not what I said at all

In conference realignment, Brand means Football Brand, so that is what you were saying.

The main reason UNC is so desired is not so much its football, or even its basketball.brands, or its academics or that UNC is located in a state not yet a part of either the SEC or the B1G, though all of those attributes are highly significant. The main reason UNC is so valuable is that it is the capstone of the conference due to historical rivalries. Whichever conference gets UNC, also gets UVA, any NC it wants and most likely Clemson, GT or VT, if desired. Only the Florida schools could go to a different P2 conference and not really care much about not being in the same conference as any of their former conference mates, except FSU and Clemson would miss playing each other. Miami and FSU would continue playing each other no matter what. It's not your brand. it's your historical rivalries, then everything else.

Yes, there is all of that, and then there are the things that people don't see or hear about. Donors to UNC and the SEC who have shared ventures in business, regional political undertakings, and the desire to for the South as it grows to grow its research profile nationally. North Carolina is strategic to those endeavors, and people in both conferences are aware of where the synergy exists and where the associations would benefit an alien party more than North Carolina. I don't expect UNC to separate from Duke. I'm not sure how much they would like to be tied to N.C. State but there's that as well. UVa is only more likely to come to the SEC if UNC moves first.

The SEC wants a second Florida school. FSU delivers the most leverage, Miami a stronger presence in South Florida. My take about Georgia Tech is that they truly don't add much marketwise nor do they generate a lot of revenue. A defensive move for whatever reason is their only ticket to the SEC, but only if we want to solidify the SE. Atlanta is key to some of those businesses I mentioned.

Clemson, Duke, North Carolina, Virginia forms the hub. FSU or Miami makes. 5.

IMO it then depends upon what ESPN wants. Do they want to lock down Virginia and North Carolina. Maybe so. If so to 7 means N.C. State and Va Tech. ESPN has long wanted Kansas, and they have a massive value boost for winter sports if they take them with this set.

Do they want new markets in new time zones? If so, perhaps Arizona State and Colorado. Though I don't see them as good fits and Sankey might balk.

If the SEC lands Clemson and FSU it will have oodles of content value for football. Virginia Tech and N.C. State makes good mid-tier schools for football and are capable of making noise. Then the 4 hoops schools provide balance. If no Kansas, then Georgia Tech.

Football brands outside of P2
Notre Dame
Clemson
FSU
UNC
Arizona
BYU
Texas Tech
Oklahoma St
Miami
Va Tech

(03-13-2024 12:02 AM)Lurker Above Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 10:09 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 08:54 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 05:37 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 04:27 PM)bryanw1995 Wrote:  Carolina can't bring more Football eyeballs than about half the 16 team Big 12, and also nearly half of their own ACC. They're UCLA, though far easier to replace for the P2 b/c of all the nearby schools. Would I prefer FSU/Clemson/Miami + UNC instead of VT or Kansas as the 4th? Yes. But I don't HAVE to have that. Would the B1G prefer UNC to Stanford? Um, probably, but nether of them is making the B1G any money. The SEC wants UNC more for the long term potential from basketball and geography rather than the short term poor football return, but we seem to be doing just fine without them. Clemson is only 272 miles from Chapel Hill, and Blacksburg is less than 200. Duke is more like 10. I think we could grab a couple of those and dare the B1G to take any of our leftovers, assuming UNC decides to be difficult ofc. But they won't, they'll jump at any offer to remain relevant.

Keep telling yourself that, Bryan the aTm fan.

Carolina is easily the second best brand outside the Big Ten and SEC. Hint: the first is not Florida State.

You really think most college football fans want to watch Tar Heel football than any P2 team plus ND? Because that is what you are saying.

Actually that’s not what I said at all

In conference realignment, Brand means Football Brand, so that is what you were saying.

The main reason UNC is so desired is not so much its football, or even its basketball.brands, or its academics or that UNC is located in a state not yet a part of either the SEC or the B1G, though all of those attributes are highly significant. The main reason UNC is so valuable is that it is the capstone of the conference due to historical rivalries. Whichever conference gets UNC, also gets UVA, any NC it wants and most likely Clemson, GT or VT, if desired. Only the Florida schools could go to a different P2 conference and not really care much about not being in the same conference as any of their former conference mates, except FSU and Clemson would miss playing each other. Miami and FSU would continue playing each other no matter what. It's not your brand. it's your historical rivalries, then everything else.

I appreciate you telling me what I said, but you’re wrong. I said Carolina is the second best brand outside the SEC and Big Ten. The first is Notre Dame. Period. Not football, total brand. Carolina > FSU

(03-13-2024 06:47 AM)esayem Wrote:  I appreciate you telling me what I said, but you’re wrong. I said Carolina is the second best brand outside the SEC and Big Ten. The first is Notre Dame. Period. Not football, total brand. Carolina > FSU

he mad

(03-13-2024 06:50 AM)Gitanole Wrote:  

(03-13-2024 06:47 AM)esayem Wrote:  I appreciate you telling me what I said, but you’re wrong. I said Carolina is the second best brand outside the SEC and Big Ten. The first is Notre Dame. Period. Not football, total brand. Carolina > FSU

he mad

Last time I checked, Carolina sells a lot more apparel. Soooooo who mad?

(03-13-2024 06:47 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-13-2024 12:02 AM)Lurker Above Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 10:09 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 08:54 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 05:37 PM)esayem Wrote:  Keep telling yourself that, Bryan the aTm fan.

Carolina is easily the second best brand outside the Big Ten and SEC. Hint: the first is not Florida State.

You really think most college football fans want to watch Tar Heel football than any P2 team plus ND? Because that is what you are saying.

Actually that’s not what I said at all

In conference realignment, Brand means Football Brand, so that is what you were saying.

The main reason UNC is so desired is not so much its football, or even its basketball.brands, or its academics or that UNC is located in a state not yet a part of either the SEC or the B1G, though all of those attributes are highly significant. The main reason UNC is so valuable is that it is the capstone of the conference due to historical rivalries. Whichever conference gets UNC, also gets UVA, any NC it wants and most likely Clemson, GT or VT, if desired. Only the Florida schools could go to a different P2 conference and not really care much about not being in the same conference as any of their former conference mates, except FSU and Clemson would miss playing each other. Miami and FSU would continue playing each other no matter what. It's not your brand. it's your historical rivalries, then everything else.

I appreciate you telling me what I said, but you’re wrong. I said Carolina is the second best brand outside the SEC and Big Ten. The first is Notre Dame. Period. Not football, total brand. Carolina > FSU

I agree with this. IMO it is close, with UNC as #2 and FSU being #2A, it's close, but if you told me the SEC could have just one school, and given that Notre Dame isn't interested, it would be UNC.

What IMO some should consider is that, maybe paradoxically, FSU's clear-cut better football brand isn't a huge issue here, especially for the SEC. Yes, FSU's football brand is clearly better, but the SEC isn't desperate for football brands. It already has those in spades. With or without FSU the SEC is never going to be deficient by comparison with anyone, including the B1G, when it comes to football brands.

UNC provides valuable stuff that the SEC doesn't have in spades - blue blood hoops, elite academics, and presence in North Carolina. And it's a state flagship. None of those things characterize FSU, though it does come close with respect to academics (who knew?). That's largely true for the B1G too.

So looked at holistically, not just focusing on football, UNC is tops over FSU. And that IMO is how both of the P2 will view it, the SEC maybe a bit moreso.

Another way to think of it is IMO, if the B1G hadn't made the move to California, thus demonstrating that it will now go literally anywhere to get good brands, and is thus a threat to poach FSU, and if FSU was free of the ACC GOR of course, I think the SEC would be fine letting FSU simmer outside the conference longer. The primary drive to add FSU asap is the B1G threat to grab them. But while the SEC also would not like to see the B1G grab UNC in its backyard either, blocking that is not IMO the primary motivation to want UNC. The SEC would want to add UNC right now if it could, even if the B1G wasn't in the picture.

(03-13-2024 05:40 AM)Gemofthehills Wrote:  Football brands outside of P2
Notre Dame
Clemson
FSU
UNC
Arizona
BYU
Texas Tech
Oklahoma St
Miami
Va Tech

I would take Texas Tech and Arizona out of there. Arizona State is a bigger brand even than Arizona and TT is obscure.

(03-12-2024 10:43 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 09:17 AM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  I wouldn’t be too proud of those 3 expansion schools. They only add value for tier 3 revenue and will sink T1 and T2 value if there’s still an ACC around for the next contract negotiation. Realistically, we’re talking about 3 programs for whom landing in the middle third of the conference standings would be considered a good season. They aren’t quality adds.

I've posted before, but Stanford was the most successful Pac football program for a decade. They've got a top 30 class coming in. They are a WORLD renowned university. They are a gem. Cal is their travel partner, and I've heard a pretty good school as well. SMU is paying to play and they have deep NIL collectives. They will be more competitive than you think and will rise to the level of the Big XII Texas schools.

All three create an ACC after dark option. So more flexible time slots hurt only the ACC I suppose.

The ACC is shaping itself into what it will be, schools which have a like-minded approach to the new reality of college athletics and Notre Dame will play a huge role whether Big Ten fans want to accept that or not. Will Carolina be a part? I'm not sure. Carolina 100% deserves to be making more money than the majority of the SEC and Big Ten, so I'm really not concerned, it will unfold the way it unfolds. I can say I have zero desire to watch the Heels play a bunch of cold weather Midwestern teams and I don't think the Big Ten offers us the 100 year conference. That would be the SEC if it came down to it. It would be a terrible mistake to do what Maryland did to their athletic dept.

What did Maryland do to their athletic department other than improve since joining the Big Ten? Athletic revenue is up. They’re spending more on football and the program has improved as a result. They’ve built and renovated athletic facilities, including performance centers and academic centers for athletes.

They’ve won more B1G championships and NCAA titles since joining the league than any team not named Michigan and Ohio State. And not just lacrosse and soccer. Baseball, men’s basketball, and women’s basketball have all won Big Ten championships.

Sure, there is more travel and new opponents but the Big Ten is a drastically better situation than the ACC was for Maryland. I don’t understand the random strays my alma mater catches on this board from ACC fans.

(03-13-2024 07:11 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(03-13-2024 06:47 AM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-13-2024 12:02 AM)Lurker Above Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 10:09 PM)esayem Wrote:  

(03-12-2024 08:54 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  You really think most college football fans want to watch Tar Heel football than any P2 team plus ND? Because that is what you are saying.

Actually that’s not what I said at all

In conference realignment, Brand means Football Brand, so that is what you were saying.

The main reason UNC is so desired is not so much its football, or even its basketball.brands, or its academics or that UNC is located in a state not yet a part of either the SEC or the B1G, though all of those attributes are highly significant. The main reason UNC is so valuable is that it is the capstone of the conference due to historical rivalries. Whichever conference gets UNC, also gets UVA, any NC it wants and most likely Clemson, GT or VT, if desired. Only the Florida schools could go to a different P2 conference and not really care much about not being in the same conference as any of their former conference mates, except FSU and Clemson would miss playing each other. Miami and FSU would continue playing each other no matter what. It's not your brand. it's your historical rivalries, then everything else.

I appreciate you telling me what I said, but you’re wrong. I said Carolina is the second best brand outside the SEC and Big Ten. The first is Notre Dame. Period. Not football, total brand. Carolina > FSU

I agree with this. IMO it is close, with UNC as #2 and FSU being #2A, it's close, but if you told me the SEC could have just one school, and given that Notre Dame isn't interested, it would be UNC.

What IMO some should consider is that, maybe paradoxically, FSU's clear-cut better football brand isn't a huge issue here, especially for the SEC. Yes, FSU's football brand is clearly better, but the SEC isn't desperate for football brands. It already has those in spades. With or without FSU the SEC is never going to be deficient by comparison with anyone, including the B1G, when it comes to football brands.

UNC provides valuable stuff that the SEC doesn't have in spades - blue blood hoops, elite academics, and presence in North Carolina. And it's a state flagship. None of those things characterize FSU, though it does come close with respect to academics (who knew?). That's largely true for the B1G too.

So looked at holistically, not just focusing on football, UNC is tops over FSU. And that IMO is how both of the P2 will view it, the SEC maybe a bit moreso.

Another way to think of it is IMO, if the B1G hadn't made the move to California, thus demonstrating that it will now go literally anywhere to get good brands, and is thus a threat to poach FSU, and if FSU was free of the ACC GOR of course, I think the SEC would be fine letting FSU simmer outside the conference longer. The primary drive to add FSU asap is the B1G threat to grab them. But while the SEC also would not like to see the B1G grab UNC in its backyard either, blocking that is not IMO the primary motivation to want UNC. The SEC would want to add UNC right now if it could, even if the B1G wasn't in the picture.

The SEC wants money. UNC doesn’t approach FSU or Clemson. 80% of the money is in football.