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Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - MrCincy - 01-01-2019 11:38 PM
Obviously: Notre Dame should not have been selected to play in the College Football Playoffs. Oklahoma was also a weak selection. Ohio State would have been a better selection and ( UCF if their starting QB was healthy.) We need an 8 team playoff. ( Sec, ACC, Big 10, Pac 12, AAC, Mtn.-West. and Big 12 Champions and one At-Large selection.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - HeartOfDixie - 01-01-2019 11:40 PM
Well, the team considered the strongest contender to be in over them is getting beat by a 4 loss Texas.
OSU’s bad loss to Purdue knocked them out.
I think ND was the right team for the spot.
UCF, while popular among G5 fans, had no argument for inclusion.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - ohio1317 - 01-01-2019 11:58 PM
I actually disagree. They had a major power schedule and went undefeated. They deserved to be in as one of the top 3. The 4th spot in my view could have justifiably been given to either Ohio State or Oklahoma and I probably would have chose Oklahoma too.
I don't personally think Georgia should have been seriously considered though despite my thinking in early December that they would beat OSU or OU. With an extra loss, no conference championship, and being beat pretty thoroughly by LSU, there wasn't a merit reason to put them in over the Big Ten or Big 12 champs in my view. They looked superior, but the resume wasn't as strong in my view and that should be the primary factor. (Note: I do think putting Alabama in last year and Ohio State 2 years ago were justified).
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - SuperFlyBCat - 01-02-2019 12:00 AM
Texas calling UGA over rated lol.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - toddjnsn - 01-02-2019 01:43 AM
Quote:Obviously: Notre Dame should not have been selected to play in the College Football Playoffs.
No, it's not obvious. And most would say they Did deserve to have a spot in the Top 4. You could make the argument they'd be #4 instead of #3, but that's about it. They were undefeated -- while having a P5-level schedule.
- Played no FCS teams
- Only played 4 teams under .500; the two G5s (BSU & Navy) + Florida State + USC
- Beat #7 Michigan
- Crushed #20 Syracuse
- Beat #22 @Northwestern
- They whipped 8-4 Stanford
- Beat 6-6 Vandy
- Crushed 6-6 Wake Forrest
- Crushed 6-6 VA-Tech
- They beat ACC Division Leader (albeit Pitt)
And didn't lose a game. Unless Ohio State was undefeated, or Georgia upset Alabama and Alabama moved down to bump ND out or something -- you can't make a case that ND should have been placed at #5 or lower.
Quote:Oklahoma was also a weak selection.
At first you could think they're a weak selection, but Oklahoma lost to Texas. Ohio State got THUMPED by 6-6 Purdue. Ohio State was too skitzo during the season + Oklahoma had a tougher opponent in their CCG, revenge on Texas, where Ohio State just had to play a feisty NW team in comparison. That said, I will agree that Ohio State is the #1 team I'd want facing Clemson or Alabama. Biggest chance to beat them, and are on their level -- IF they bring their A-game. But your ranking is based on what unfolded. Not Vegas betting odds right-now-if-playing.
Quote:and ( UCF if their starting QB was healthy.) We need an 8 team playoff. ( Sec, ACC, Big 10, Pac 12, AAC, Mtn.-West. and Big 12 Champions and one At-Large selection.
No, even with their healthy QB, they shouldn't have. They were ranked the same as if they had their healthy QB and didn't need a crazy comeback to win their CCG against no-defense-Memphis. They Would however, yes, get into an 8-team playoff. And I believe they should even if they were ranked the same as last year (#12) this year, as I do see UCF better last year than this year. HOWEVER...
... I do Not agree with an unconditional Conf Champ auto-selection. Especially (lol) *always* giving one to the AAC and MW no matter what. The MAC twice in somewhat recent years has had their Conf Champ better than even the improved AAC (Big East), and MW. The latter one helped prevent the "oh sh!t, there's not a good enough G5 to get the auto-bid without talks about removing it" ('16).
a) The AAC & MW aren't going to produce a high level Conf Champ every year.
b) Even the P5 Champs, when we're talking about an ELITE 8-team Playoff (not even grand bowls but PLAYOFFs; pickier) -- aren't necessarily going to be ranked all That high
Best way to do it is to forget about G5 vs P5: A max of 6 auto-bids for Conf Champs, Conditional with a max of 2 ranked lower than 8, but ranked above #x, where x is "close enough" to 8. Like #12 or #13 as the line drawn. Once in a great while, a P5 Champ will miss out. Half the years, the G5s will miss out. One in a great while, two G5s could get in (P5 conf champ upset as winner jumps up only to #15; UCF/Houston #8, other-G5-undefeated #12).
But you AVOID clear Wrongs: You can't give an auto-bid to a Conference Winner to a PLAYOFF who's *still ranked lower* than another Conference Winner who doesn't get to go. You could make a case for bowls, which is for $$ & viewership. Not for Actual Playoffs. It's a lot pickier, and understandably so.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - BadgerMJ - 01-02-2019 07:31 AM
(01-01-2019 11:38 PM)MrCincy Wrote: Obviously: Notre Dame should not have been selected to play in the College Football Playoffs. Oklahoma was also a weak selection. Ohio State would have been a better selection and ( UCF if their starting QB was healthy.) We need an 8 team playoff. ( Sec, ACC, Big 10, Pac 12, AAC, Mtn.-West. and Big 12 Champions and one At-Large selection.
Hindsight is 20/20.
At the TIME the selections were made, the Irish were the choice and even if we were to do it now, they'd still be one of the favorites to be "in".
Take care of your business in the regular season and it won't be an issue. tOSU took an ass-kicking from Purdue. You can't get destroyed by a 6-7 team and cry about not "getting in". ND was undefeated and OU had a quality loss to TX, that's why the call was made.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - quo vadis - 01-02-2019 08:41 AM
(01-01-2019 11:38 PM)MrCincy Wrote: Obviously: Notre Dame should not have been selected to play in the College Football Playoffs. Oklahoma was also a weak selection. Ohio State would have been a better selection and ( UCF if their starting QB was healthy.) We need an 8 team playoff. ( Sec, ACC, Big 10, Pac 12, AAC, Mtn.-West. and Big 12 Champions and one At-Large selection.
UCF was thoroughly dominated by an LSU team that was missing its entire secondary and all-American defensive lineman, way more NFL talent than Milton McKenzie and whoever UCF was missing.
So UCF in the playoffs is a resounding joke.
Just because Notre Dame was nowhere near as good as Clemson doesn't mean they didn't belong in the playoffs. They did. They had a much better resume than Ohio State - and remember, Ohio State has gotten wiped out by Clemson in the playoffs too.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - Gamecock - 01-02-2019 08:45 AM
ND deserved to make it in
Should have been the 4th seed instead of Oklahoma though.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - quo vadis - 01-02-2019 09:07 AM
(01-02-2019 08:45 AM)Gamecock Wrote: ND deserved to make it in
Should have been the 4th seed instead of Oklahoma though.
Remember, Oklahoma got blown out Alabama a lot worse than ND did by Clemson. The Clemson/ND game wasn't over until the last two minutes before halftime. Oklahoma was beaten halfway through the first quarter.
Don't let garbage time/letup points fool you.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - The Cutter of Bish - 01-02-2019 09:27 AM
(01-02-2019 09:07 AM)quo vadis Wrote:(01-02-2019 08:45 AM)Gamecock Wrote: ND deserved to make it in
Should have been the 4th seed instead of Oklahoma though.
Remember, Oklahoma got blown out Alabama a lot worse than ND did by Clemson. The Clemson/ND game wasn't over until the last two minutes before halftime. Oklahoma was beaten halfway through the first quarter.
Don't let garbage time/letup points fool you.
LOL...says you.
Sure, a team with 248 total yards to one with 471. Totally all "garbage time."
Whatever it takes to help you feel better, I suppose. I do think, however, that this Alabama team has not been playing whistle to whistle for whatever reason. Their style all season has been to step on the gas and then back off. Other teams come back to some degree (or don't), and then Alabama just plays well enough to keep control. But, that's not a positive trait. If people weren't so sensitive about 50+ point margins in games, this Alabama team should have beaten ALL of its opponents handily with brutal scores.
I think it's a flaw for this Alabama team. I don't think there's another team good enough to get the better of it (I doubt Clemson does) this year, so, but a GOAT tag to this team? **** that.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - bullet - 01-02-2019 09:31 AM
(01-02-2019 09:07 AM)quo vadis Wrote:(01-02-2019 08:45 AM)Gamecock Wrote: ND deserved to make it in
Should have been the 4th seed instead of Oklahoma though.
Remember, Oklahoma got blown out Alabama a lot worse than ND did by Clemson. The Clemson/ND game wasn't over until the last two minutes before halftime. Oklahoma was beaten halfway through the first quarter.
Don't let garbage time/letup points fool you.
31-20 going into the 4th quarter??? Over???
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - GoldenWarrior11 - 01-02-2019 10:00 AM
If this year's bowl games and playoffs (in addition to regular season results) have shown anything, it's that the CFP do not need to be expanded beyond four teams. Notre Dame, who was absolutely deserving of a playoff spot going 12-0 with their schedule, got blown out by Clemson; Oklahoma, while keeping it respectable, was never really close to Alabama. Purdue, who trounced Ohio State in the regular season, got embarrassed by Auburn. UCF, an undefeated team that played a G5 schedule, gave up over 500 yards of offense to LSU, who was playing many of their backups. Texas also took it to Georgia, who was by all appearances, the #5 team in the the country headed into bowl games.
The other big point is how important it is for the CFP committee to not award automatic berths to conferences. All conferences are, without question, not created equal. The current format is definitely an improvement from the BCS era, and it is incredibly rare that any team outside the top-5 would ever compete for a national championship.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - NIU007 - 01-02-2019 10:06 AM
(01-02-2019 10:00 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote: If this year's bowl games and playoffs (in addition to regular season results) have shown anything, it's that the CFP do not need to be expanded beyond four teams. Notre Dame, who was absolutely deserving of a playoff spot going 12-0 with their schedule, got blown out by Clemson; Oklahoma, while keeping it respectable, was never really close to Alabama. Purdue, who trounced Ohio State in the regular season, got embarrassed by Auburn. UCF, an undefeated team that played a G5 schedule, gave up over 500 yards of offense to LSU, who was playing many of their backups. Texas also took it to Georgia, who was by all appearances, the #5 team in the the country headed into bowl games.
The other big point is how important it is for the CFP committee to not award automatic berths to conferences. All conferences are, without question, not created equal. The current format is definitely an improvement from the BCS era, and it is incredibly rare that any team outside the top-5 would ever compete for a national championship.
Right now you only have a couple teams that can compete. But I'm sure that's partly because you don't have a real playoff.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - TopperCard - 01-02-2019 10:07 AM
No, they certainly deserved to be in the CFP. The only argument against it is they don't have to play a conference championship game. Make the playoff 8 teams, everyone has to be in a conference. Five P5 conference champions, auto-bid for best G5 champion, two at-larges.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - Gamecock - 01-02-2019 10:10 AM
(01-02-2019 09:07 AM)quo vadis Wrote:(01-02-2019 08:45 AM)Gamecock Wrote: ND deserved to make it in
Should have been the 4th seed instead of Oklahoma though.
Remember, Oklahoma got blown out Alabama a lot worse than ND did by Clemson. The Clemson/ND game wasn't over until the last two minutes before halftime. Oklahoma was beaten halfway through the first quarter.
Don't let garbage time/letup points fool you.
Don't get me wrong, Alabama and Clemson are the two best teams and the outcome likely doesn't change regardless. But I think Oklahoma just had a better resume and more talent, despite their one loss to UT.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - GoldenWarrior11 - 01-02-2019 10:21 AM
(01-02-2019 10:06 AM)NIU007 Wrote:(01-02-2019 10:00 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote: If this year's bowl games and playoffs (in addition to regular season results) have shown anything, it's that the CFP do not need to be expanded beyond four teams. Notre Dame, who was absolutely deserving of a playoff spot going 12-0 with their schedule, got blown out by Clemson; Oklahoma, while keeping it respectable, was never really close to Alabama. Purdue, who trounced Ohio State in the regular season, got embarrassed by Auburn. UCF, an undefeated team that played a G5 schedule, gave up over 500 yards of offense to LSU, who was playing many of their backups. Texas also took it to Georgia, who was by all appearances, the #5 team in the the country headed into bowl games.
The other big point is how important it is for the CFP committee to not award automatic berths to conferences. All conferences are, without question, not created equal. The current format is definitely an improvement from the BCS era, and it is incredibly rare that any team outside the top-5 would ever compete for a national championship.
Right now you only have a couple teams that can compete. But I'm sure that's partly because you don't have a real playoff.
So expanding the playoff to include more teams will suddenly allow and grant more teams to be competitive? Sorry, but no.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - TexanMark - 01-02-2019 10:25 AM
(01-01-2019 11:38 PM)MrCincy Wrote: Obviously: Notre Dame should not have been selected to play in the College Football Playoffs. Oklahoma was also a weak selection. Ohio State would have been a better selection and ( UCF if their starting QB was healthy.) We need an 8 team playoff. ( Sec, ACC, Big 10, Pac 12, AAC, Mtn.-West. and Big 12 Champions and one At-Large selection.
No
8 team:. 5 P5, 3 at large with caveat
Highest G5 taken if it finishes in Top 12
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - NIU007 - 01-02-2019 10:30 AM
(01-02-2019 10:21 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote:(01-02-2019 10:06 AM)NIU007 Wrote:(01-02-2019 10:00 AM)GoldenWarrior11 Wrote: If this year's bowl games and playoffs (in addition to regular season results) have shown anything, it's that the CFP do not need to be expanded beyond four teams. Notre Dame, who was absolutely deserving of a playoff spot going 12-0 with their schedule, got blown out by Clemson; Oklahoma, while keeping it respectable, was never really close to Alabama. Purdue, who trounced Ohio State in the regular season, got embarrassed by Auburn. UCF, an undefeated team that played a G5 schedule, gave up over 500 yards of offense to LSU, who was playing many of their backups. Texas also took it to Georgia, who was by all appearances, the #5 team in the the country headed into bowl games.
The other big point is how important it is for the CFP committee to not award automatic berths to conferences. All conferences are, without question, not created equal. The current format is definitely an improvement from the BCS era, and it is incredibly rare that any team outside the top-5 would ever compete for a national championship.
Right now you only have a couple teams that can compete. But I'm sure that's partly because you don't have a real playoff.
So expanding the playoff to include more teams will suddenly allow and grant more teams to be competitive? Sorry, but no.
Not suddenly. Over time.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - colohank - 01-02-2019 10:33 AM
It doesn't bother me if ND wins its way into the championship series and then gets thumped. It's what they do.
Too bad, though, that some other team that's worthy of consideration is displaced and left out.
RE: Notre Dame Should not have been in the CFP's - Kittonhead - 01-02-2019 10:34 AM
(01-02-2019 10:07 AM)TopperCard Wrote: No, they certainly deserved to be in the CFP. The only argument against it is they don't have to play a conference championship game. Make the playoff 8 teams, everyone has to be in a conference. Five P5 conference champions, auto-bid for best G5 champion, two at-larges.
Autobids won't happen because its an unfair advantage. That was how the old BCS system worked.
CFP issued contracts for its non-playoff games to ensure bowl and network partners of their value and a contract for a floater top G5 representative. But it wasn't autobids to the playoff, the real championship tier at this moment.