(03-05-2018 10:02 AM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(03-05-2018 09:53 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(03-04-2018 11:38 AM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(03-04-2018 11:26 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(03-04-2018 11:12 AM)ark30inf Wrote:  No cartel gives up their advantages out of the goodness of their heart.

Your post is all about competing businesses. But we are a single subdivision under shared governance.

What you continuously miss is that FBS is not and never was designed to be a "league" in that sense that the say the NFL is. It was solely designed to accommodate those schools that did not want to participate in NCAA sponsored football playoffs. That's it, that's all FBS means: We'd rather play bowl games than play in the NCAA sponsored playoffs.

And that's why entry to the FBS is open-ended: Average 15,000 fans a year for two years, and give out 85 (?) football scholarships, and University of Phoenix can call itself "FBS" too.

Would the NFL or NBA or MLB ever have that kind of entry system? Of course not, because the hallmark of an actual league is very tight control over entry, with no automatic entry marks but rather voting by league members case by case or the awarding of league franchises.

In the NFL, the divisions whose champs automatically make the playoffs have zero control over anything, including even their membership. If the NFL wants to move the NY Giants out of the NFC East and move the Miami Dolphins in, they just vote on it and it's done, the division has no say.

In contrast, can the NCAA determine the membership of the SEC or C-USA? Can it vote to move school A from the SEC to the Sun Belt and school B the reverse? Of course not.

That tells you that the NCAA-FBS is in no way a "league" of competitors like the NBA or NFL. It's just an administrative category for bowl-playing teams, and those teams can leave or change their status whenever they want. The actual leagues are the conferences. The SEC is a league, so is the Sun Belt. FBS isn't, obviously.

Heck, if the AFC East wanted to negotiate a separate TV deal for itself, do you think any court would allow it? It would be absurd, because the NFL teams truly are a single league under shared governance, they can dissolve the AFC East any time they want. But the court ruled the opposite when the SEC and Big 8 wanted to sign their own TV deals.

You basically lost the "same league" argument 34 years ago. Sorry about that.

As I said, you want to be in the same pot when it comes to filling schedules for football and non-revenue sports, making rules and governing. But want to be considered totally seperate when talking about cash and post-season access and things like that.

The best of both worlds.

Just because you want things that way does not make it a rational system. It is a self-serving self-referential argument.

We understand that this is how you want it to be and how it has been. Neither of those are really going to change my views that the system is not a rational or healthy setup for FBS football.

Don't confuse P5 "indifference" about G5 clinging to the same pot with the P5 in some areas with "want". Nobody in the P5 cares whether the G5 conferences are in the 'same pot' for scheduling or making rules or governing or any of that or not. Most P5 would probably like to break away, that's what 'autonomy' was trying to mimic, and nobody would object if the G5 decided to break away and form its own division, inside or outside of the NCAA. That's important.

Your views on cash and playoff access have been shown to be irrational, and shown to be based on a selfish/self-interested desire for ARK-ST to get more stuff without earning it, by piggybacking on the big P5 brands. Cash distribution corresponds to market value, as it should. G5 will get paid more when they build their brands and become more valuable. But you can't expect the P5 to enact welfare policies to do that for you.

There is no FBS football 'league', so there is no necessary basis for a playoff system that includes champs from all FBS conferences. But even if it was, money ultimately drives playoff structure, in all leagues. E.g., when the NFL adds wild-card rounds, it's not because it is rational, it's because TV offers more money.

When it becomes clear that an 8-team playoff will make more money than the CFP, we will get an 8-team playoff.

This is tiresome. I've countered these arguments multiple times in this thread. You just ignore and keep repeating your mantra.

It's tiresome, because you are close-minded, or at least blinded by your sense of self-interest.

Nobody has repeated any mantra, all of you arguments have been systematically addressed and found lacking.

If that's tiresome to you, too bad.