Owl 3-14-09 This is the case close one I remember.

RE: Is Obama a Natural Born Citizen? Constititional Crisis Looms
Here are the possible outcomes:
1. He was born in Hawaii. Lex solis. Case closed.
2. He was born in Kenya (or anywhere else outside the states) and his mother met the requirements to confer lex sanguinis citizenship. Case closed.
3. He was born ouside the US and his mother did not meet the lex sanguinis requirement. If presented with this case, my best guess is that the Supreme Court would hold the provisions of the law that invalidated his birth citizenship to be unconstitutional. They're not going to go against the will of the people.

So, basically, the legal issue is moot. Any way you slice it, Obama is going to win. Given that, my question is why would he not release all the documents. Two possibilities that I can think of:
1. He wasn't born in Hawaii, and although the citizenship test is met, there would likely be some political fallout. Since this administration is far more into political expedience than reality, this is not a chance they would take.
2. He was born in Hawaii, but he (and/or his advisors) think this is a great issue to take people's minds off the sweeping agenda they are ramming down our throats. Once that agenda is safely through, they'll come clean.

I'm guessing 2.

(01-08-2016 11:43 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:41 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:34 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:28 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Years ago I would have been in the you have to be born in the USA camp. But the citizenship by blood is the right way to go.
If Obama was born abroad it should not matter. Both of his parents were citizens, Mom and Frank Marshall Davis.

A hah hah hah hah

That is so ******* funny I can hardly contain myself.

Are you here all week? Should I try the veal?

But on a serious note. That's so ******* stupid that you should be ashamed to even post it. If you had any shame. Idiot. Oh sorry...you're not an idiot...you're just a water carrier for the certifiably insane. That's allowed round here!

I have posted multiple times in multiple threads over months that this is the better model.
Thanks for calling me an idiot, violation of forum rules.

Jus sanguinis (Latin: right of blood) is a principle of nationality law by which citizenship is not determined by place of birth but by having one or both parents who are citizens of the state.

Go **** your forum rule wanna be moderator dude, I don't give a ****!

And I didn't call you an idiot. As usual, you took it out of context from it's following sentence.

Reading..try it sometime.

You are a very angry person Tom. You probably need some counseling and I hope you get the help that you need.

(01-08-2016 11:43 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:41 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:34 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:28 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Years ago I would have been in the you have to be born in the USA camp. But the citizenship by blood is the right way to go.
If Obama was born abroad it should not matter. Both of his parents were citizens, Mom and Frank Marshall Davis.

A hah hah hah hah

That is so ******* funny I can hardly contain myself.

Are you here all week? Should I try the veal?

But on a serious note. That's so ******* stupid that you should be ashamed to even post it. If you had any shame. Idiot. Oh sorry...you're not an idiot...you're just a water carrier for the certifiably insane. That's allowed round here!

I have posted multiple times in multiple threads over months that this is the better model.
Thanks for calling me an idiot, violation of forum rules.

Jus sanguinis (Latin: right of blood) is a principle of nationality law by which citizenship is not determined by place of birth but by having one or both parents who are citizens of the state.

Go **** your forum rule wanna be moderator dude, I don't give a ****!

And I didn't call you an idiot. As usual, you took it out of context from it's following sentence.

Reading..try it sometime.

Every time I read your posts, I want to call you an arrogant prick. But I won't, it's a violation of board rules.

Paul M and Soaf drove the train but Hambone shaded it a little. he thought the guy might have been born in Kenya circa 2009.

(01-08-2016 11:48 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Paul M and Soaf drove the train but Hambone shaded it a little. he thought the guy might have been born in Kenya circa 2009.

His grandmother in Kenya said he was born in Kenya.

That in of itself would not invalidate his natural born citizenship. The issue they may have had was whether his "free spirit" mom recanted her citizenship prior to him being born in Kenya. That would have been the problem.

(01-08-2016 11:48 AM)QuestionSocratic Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:43 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:41 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:34 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:28 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Years ago I would have been in the you have to be born in the USA camp. But the citizenship by blood is the right way to go.
If Obama was born abroad it should not matter. Both of his parents were citizens, Mom and Frank Marshall Davis.

A hah hah hah hah

That is so ******* funny I can hardly contain myself.

Are you here all week? Should I try the veal?

But on a serious note. That's so ******* stupid that you should be ashamed to even post it. If you had any shame. Idiot. Oh sorry...you're not an idiot...you're just a water carrier for the certifiably insane. That's allowed round here!

I have posted multiple times in multiple threads over months that this is the better model.
Thanks for calling me an idiot, violation of forum rules.

Jus sanguinis (Latin: right of blood) is a principle of nationality law by which citizenship is not determined by place of birth but by having one or both parents who are citizens of the state.

Go **** your forum rule wanna be moderator dude, I don't give a ****!

And I didn't call you an idiot. As usual, you took it out of context from it's following sentence.

Reading..try it sometime.

Every time I read your posts, I want to call you an arrogant prick. But I won't, it's a violation of board rules.

Whatever...like you guys have some moral ground to stand on! I want a better board here without this stuff. You and your ilk don't. I'm just playing in the shitbox you guys created. Deal with it.

I firmly believe that Obama was born outside the United States. But, I also believe that his parents were smart enough to work the system in order for it to not matter.

Hawaii was handing out birth certificates at the time he was supposedly born there to anybody who walked through the door because they had just become a state. So, they went and got one. The end result is that he is a U.S. born citizen, even though it was a backdoor.

Hey, I'm a firm believe that everybody is entitled to game the system as best they can; and they did it masterfully.

(01-08-2016 12:04 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:  I firmly believe that Obama was born outside the United States. But, I also believe that his parents were smart enough to work the system in order for it to not matter.

Hawaii was handing out birth certificates at the time he was supposedly born there to anybody who walked through the door because they had just become a state. So, they went and got one. The end result is that he is a U.S. born citizen, even though it was a backdoor.

Hey, I'm a firm believe that everybody is entitled to game the system as best they can; and they did it masterfully.

Really? I thought you were somewhat intelligent. Guess I have to rethink that. Wow!

Obama has done exactly what He has wanted to do. After all, He is the Chosen One. And only He can make You believe anything He says or does is True. With His power He holds over the world. He probably will get His way and make an executive decision to make Himself the permanent leader of the New world Order. All Hail Obama ! A true legend in His and All Liberals Minds .

(01-08-2016 12:25 PM)CardFan1 Wrote:  Obama has done exactly what He has wanted to do. After all, He is the Chosen One. And only He can make You believe anything He says or does is True. With His power He holds over the world. He probably will get His way and make an executive decision to make Himself the permanent leader of the New world Order. All Hail Obama ! A true legend in His and All Liberals Minds .

You don't happen to live in Flint, MI do you?

(01-08-2016 11:43 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:41 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:34 AM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 11:28 AM)SuperFlyBCat Wrote:  Years ago I would have been in the you have to be born in the USA camp. But the citizenship by blood is the right way to go.
If Obama was born abroad it should not matter. Both of his parents were citizens, Mom and Frank Marshall Davis.

A hah hah hah hah

That is so ******* funny I can hardly contain myself.

Are you here all week? Should I try the veal?

But on a serious note. That's so ******* stupid that you should be ashamed to even post it. If you had any shame. Idiot. Oh sorry...you're not an idiot...you're just a water carrier for the certifiably insane. That's allowed round here!

I have posted multiple times in multiple threads over months that this is the better model.
Thanks for calling me an idiot, violation of forum rules.

Jus sanguinis (Latin: right of blood) is a principle of nationality law by which citizenship is not determined by place of birth but by having one or both parents who are citizens of the state.

Go **** your forum rule wanna be moderator dude, I don't give a ****!

And I didn't call you an idiot. As usual, you took it out of context from it's following sentence.

Reading..try it sometime.

Do you have any guns Tom? You seem angry and may make somebody here feel threatened.

Obama is a citizen and so is Cruz. Both had a mother with US citizenship. That is all that is necessary.

(01-08-2016 12:30 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 12:25 PM)CardFan1 Wrote:  Obama has done exactly what He has wanted to do. After all, He is the Chosen One. And only He can make You believe anything He says or does is True. With His power He holds over the world. He probably will get His way and make an executive decision to make Himself the permanent leader of the New world Order. All Hail Obama ! A true legend in His and All Liberals Minds .

You don't happen to live in Flint, MI do you?

No but I did stay in a Holiday Express !

Fo-

I read through the entire 80 pages and I'm proud of you. You are constant consistent well balanced agent for the forces of good. You are a gem my friend.

(01-08-2016 01:46 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Fo-

I read through the entire 80 pages and I'm proud of you. You are constant consistent well balanced agent for the forces of good. You are a gem my friend.

I honestly never saw anything that would lead me to believe the Birther nonsense. The Constitution is pretty clear on this issue in regard to citizenship as it now stands.

(05-01-2011 12:32 AM)SumOfAllFears Wrote:  

Quote:Chief Justice Marshall provided only one exception to this rule, "such construction is inadmissible, unless the words require it". The words "natural born citizen" don't require the clause to be construed to mean the same thing as the word "citizen". The exact opposite is true. The plain text of the Constitution shows that the framers allowed persons to become Senators and Representatives if they were "Citizens", but as to the office of President they required a "natural born citizen". So the exception is irrelevant here.
Marbury v. Madison creates a standing presumption against any interpretation that would render the "natural born citizen" clause to have no effect independent of being a "citizen". Chief Justice Marshall insisted such a construction is inadmissible.
... What is the independent effect attributed to the "natural born citizen" clause? The effect is that just being a "citizen" isn't enough to satisfy the requirement of Article 2 Section 1 Clause 5 which demands that the President of the United States be a "natural born citizen".
This means that under current United States law, the "natural born citizen" clause is presumed to mean something other than a "14th Amendment citizen". And no other construction is even admissible. (Leo Donofrio, SCOTUS has no Original Jurisdiction, 2009, italics and boldface are as they appear in the original)

None of which, in any way, states that the president must have been born in the USA, nor supports such an assertion.

(01-08-2016 11:46 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Owl 3-14-09 This is the case close one I remember.
RE: Is Obama a Natural Born Citizen? Constititional Crisis Looms
Here are the possible outcomes:
1. He was born in Hawaii. Lex solis. Case closed.
2. He was born in Kenya (or anywhere else outside the states) and his mother met the requirements to confer lex sanguinis citizenship. Case closed.
3. He was born ouside the US and his mother did not meet the lex sanguinis requirement. If presented with this case, my best guess is that the Supreme Court would hold the provisions of the law that invalidated his birth citizenship to be unconstitutional. They're not going to go against the will of the people.
So, basically, the legal issue is moot. Any way you slice it, Obama is going to win. Given that, my question is why would he not release all the documents. Two possibilities that I can think of:
1. He wasn't born in Hawaii, and although the citizenship test is met, there would likely be some political fallout. Since this administration is far more into political expedience than reality, this is not a chance they would take.
2. He was born in Hawaii, but he (and/or his advisors) think this is a great issue to take people's minds off the sweeping agenda they are ramming down our throats. Once that agenda is safely through, they'll come clean.
I'm guessing 2.

I think there are ones older than that, maybe even somewhat stronger. I know I had posts that made the statement even stronger, and someone pointed out the statutory issue, which I had not considered since I looked only at the current statute. As I indicated here, I don't see that as a problem. My point #3 above tells me that this one was posted after I had that conversation. Maybe they were on the Memphis political/religious board instead of here.

I'm still not convinced, either way, on 1 or 2. I simply don't trust anything the lying SOB says.

I've always thought natural born citizen meant "born a citizen" versus someone who applied for and received citizenship.

You can be born anywhere and be a natural born citizen.

And just because you were born in the US does not mean you are a citizen.

(01-08-2016 05:41 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  I've always thought natural born citizen meant "born a citizen" versus someone who applied for and received citizenship.
You can be born anywhere and be a natural born citizen.
And just because you were born in the US does not mean you are a citizen.

Precisely.

(01-08-2016 05:50 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(01-08-2016 05:41 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  I've always thought natural born citizen meant "born a citizen" versus someone who applied for and received citizenship.
You can be born anywhere and be a natural born citizen.
And just because you were born in the US does not mean you are a citizen.

Precisely.

"And just because you were born in the US does not mean you are a citizen." I totally agree. I do not believe that being born in the US automatically makes you a citizen and the Constitution did not intend that. THIS is something that the SCOTUS should be forced to rule on. I don't think it has ever been challenged. That is why we have the anchor baby issue.