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I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
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SuperFlyBCat Offline
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Post: #1
I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424...87092.html
To break even, the U.S. Treasury would need to sell its remaining stake—about 500 million shares—at $53 apiece. GM closed off 27 cents a share at $29.97 in 4 p.m. trading Monday on the New York Stock Exchange, hitting a new low since its $33-a-share November initial public offering.
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"Planning for the sale of our remaining GM stock is still at an early stage, and the IPO lock-up does not expire until late May," a Treasury spokesperson said. "At that point, we will consider all of our options, based on our twin goals of protecting taxpayers' interests and exiting as soon as practicable."

Shares have been hurt by rising fuel prices, industry production disruptions and management turnover. At Monday's price, and taking into account shares sold during the IPO, taxpayers would lose more than $11 billion on the rescue if the government dumped the rest of its stake now
 
04-20-2011 03:25 PM
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Post: #2
RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
i cannot believe that there remain voices in the wilderness pretending that a government intervention of this size and nature could be anything but harmful.

duh! it's the government. how well does it perform operations entrusted to government? that's a good insight into how well it can perform in the private sector, where results are not only expected, but demanded. just ask S&P.

Quote:The well-known inefficiencies of government operation are not empirical accidents, resulting perhaps from the lack of a civil-service tradition. They are inherent in all government enterprise, and the excessive demand fomented by free and other underpriced services is just one of the many reasons for this condition.

http://mises.org/daily/1471
 
04-20-2011 05:07 PM
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chicago bearcat Offline
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
I fully expect GM to reach $50 within a year.
 
04-20-2011 07:19 PM
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
(04-20-2011 07:19 PM)chicago bearcat Wrote:  I fully expect GM to reach $50 within a year.

If you don't mind I am going to quote that line verbatim in meetings
 
04-22-2011 07:55 AM
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
GM likely to retake No. 1 sales spot from Toyota

Published - Apr 22 2011 05:23PM EST

By TOM KRISHER and SHARON SILKE CARTY - AP Auto Writers

DETROIT — General Motors is almost certain to claim the title of world's biggest automaker this year, retaking the top spot from Toyota, which has been hurt by production problems since the Japanese earthquake and still can't escape the shadow of major safety recalls.

The No. 1 title, a morale booster for the winner's employees and managers, would cap GM's remarkable comeback from bankruptcy.

GM's sales are up, mainly in China and the U.S, the world's top two markets. Its cars are better than in the past, especially small ones.

But even though GM came within 30,000 sales of Toyota last year and began strong in 2011, any sales victory this year has more to do with Toyota's problems.

First, a series of big recalls has ballooned to 14 million vehicles worldwide and damaged Toyota's reputation for reliability. That has spurred loyal buyers to look at other brands.

Second, a March 11 earthquake and tsunami in Japan curbed Toyota's car production. On Friday, Toyota Motor Corp. said its factories worldwide won't return to full production until November or December. That means buyers across the globe may not be able to get the models they want. Already the crisis has cost the company production of 260,000 vehicles.

Last year, Toyota sold 8.42 million cars and trucks, barely ahead of a resurgent GM, which sold 8.39 million. GM held the No. 1 spot from 1932 until 2008.

Here's why GM is almost a lock to retake the lead this year:

A BETTER GM: General Motors Co. was dysfunctional three years ago, hobbled by enormous debt and a giant bureaucracy. Its quality was suspect, it lost billions, and it had few products other than pickups that buyers found appealing. After a government bailout, a leaner GM emerged from a 2009 bankruptcy with new vehicles and a focus on Chevrolet, Buick, GMC and Cadillac. Since then, GM has come up with hits including the Chevrolet Equinox small SUV, the Buick LaCrosse luxury car, and the Chevrolet Cruze compact. Its quality is better. Sales so far this year are up 25 percent in the U.S. and 10 percent in China. The efficient Cruze compact and Chevrolet Volt car both hit the market as U.S. gasoline prices started rising.

TOYOTA TROUBLES: Bad publicity from the recalls, mainly for cars that can accelerate without warning, was hurting Toyota long before the earthquake. The recalls began late in 2009, and came just as GM, Ford, Hyundai, and others introduced more competitive cars and trucks. With a bunch of nice alternatives and doubts about quality, customers who once dutifully returned to Toyota started considering other brands. Many Toyota models look old and need upgrades. Despite rebates and low-interest financing, Toyota was the only major automaker with lower U.S. sales last year. Sales are up 12.5 percent so far in 2011, but only at half the growth of GM.

Toyota is scrambling to keep factories open after the earthquake, and U.S. dealers expect to run out of some models. Already dealers are reporting shortages of the Prius gas-electric hybrid, a high-demand model because of gas prices.

Merle Gothard, general manager of North Park Toyota in San Antonio, says he's not worried about GM retaking the title because it still has a tarnished image from bankruptcy.

"It's important from a marketing standpoint," he says. "But Toyota has other things going for it." He notes that Toyota is still profitable and never took a dime of stimulus money from the government.

THE CHINA FACTOR: Toyota has nowhere near GM's presence in China, now the world's largest auto market. Through March, Toyota sold 208,000 vehicles there, but GM and its joint ventures sold more than three times that number. Growth in China by itself probably would have moved GM ahead of Toyota in worldwide sales. Toyota's lead was only about one day's worth of sales for GM.

CAVEATS: Toyota still has a loyal customer base that believes the cars are safe and will last forever. Many Toyotas run for hundreds of thousands of miles with little more than routine maintenance. It also has a reputation for fuel efficiency, led by the Prius.

GM would have to run into major problems to let No. 1 slip away this year. So far it has not been seriously hurt by parts shortages, but if some key electronic components from Japan can't be made elsewhere, the company could run short of models. A new management team also is pushing to speed up introduction of new models, and that could hurt quality.

If GM takes No. 1 this year, it won't crow much, says Jesse Toprak, vice president of industry trends and insights for TrueCar.com, an auto price tracking website.

"It's because of (factory) capacity restrictions, and that's not something they want to brag about," he says.

http://www.rr.com/news/topic/article/rr/...yota/full/
 
04-22-2011 05:56 PM
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chicago bearcat Offline
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Post: #6
RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
(04-22-2011 07:55 AM)SeniorBearcat Wrote:  
(04-20-2011 07:19 PM)chicago bearcat Wrote:  I fully expect GM to reach $50 within a year.

If you don't mind I am going to quote that line verbatim in meetings

Ha I dont mind Im pretty confident about that assessment. What business do you work in/company?
 
04-23-2011 02:07 PM
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AZBCAT Offline
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
Including, no doubt, investment in plants and new jobs in Ohio - home of Kasich and Boehner, fierce opponents of the auto bailout.

Quote:GM to Invest $2 Billion in 17 US Plants
Published: Tuesday, 10 May 2011 | 2:14 PM ET Text Size

General Motors said on Tuesday it will invest about $2 billion in 17 U.S. plants, including a facility here that makes transmissions for small cars, as the automaker shifts from recovery mode to investing in future products.

GM said the plans will create or preserve more than 4,000 jobs as it retools the plants in eight states. The company employs 202,000 people globally, including 77,000 in the United States.

"We are doing this because we are confident about demand for our vehicles and the economy," GM Chief Executive Daniel Akerson said in a statement.

Investors and analysts have speculated on GM's plans for its growing pile of cash as the company's liquidity has reached $36.5 billion. It earned $3.2 billion in the first quarter after posting net income of $4.7 billion for all of last year, its first full-year profit since 2004.

GM did not disclose the timeline for the investments or in what other facilities it will invest other than to say more announcements will be made "over the next few months."

Executives previously signaled GM's focus on building cars would only grow, as shown by last week's announcement to invest $131 million revamping a Kentucky factory for a new version of the iconic Chevrolet Corvette sports car. The Kentucky announcement is part of the $2 billion plan.

Another key issue as GM adds jobs is how many will be in the so-called second-tier wages that are about half those of veteran union-represented employees. The lower wage will figure prominently as major U.S. automakers face labor talks with the United Auto Workers this summer.

GM filed for bankruptcy in 2009 after the U.S. housing downturn and a spike in gasoline prices the year before that caused consumers to turn away from its high-profit but fuel-hungry trucks.

The U.S. automaker emerged from bankruptcy 40 days later thanks to a $52 billion taxpayer-funded bailout and sold shares in an initial public offering last November. Since exiting bankruptcy, GM said it has invested $3.4 billion in its U.S. plants, creating or retaining more than 9,000 jobs.

The investment is not a surprise and by delaying the details of the specific plants affected GM maximizes the attention it will receive as it works to assure taxpayers the bailout was money well-spent, said Mirko Mikelic, senior portfolio manager with Fifth Third Asset Management.

"They probably underinvested in some of these plants for the last few years," said Mikelic, whose firm has held GM bonds and preferred securities in the past and still follows the stock.

"They were keeping a handle on their cash. For years, in terms of R&D, they've been behind particularly Toyota."

The U.S. government still owns 32 percent of GM's common shares and many investors see that as an overhang on the stock.

Last month, sources said the Treasury could sell a significant portion of its GM shares by fall.

GM shares were [GM 31.54 0.15 (+0.48%) ] trading around $31.47 on Tuesday afternoon, compared with their IPO price last November of $33.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/42976627
 
05-10-2011 02:08 PM
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AZBCAT Offline
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
Oh and wouldn't you know it, Kasich now is taking trips to take credit for the results of the auto bailout he opposed...

What's new though? Republican governors have been taking credit for policies they oppose (particularly stimulus projects) for the last couple of years.

Quote:GM plans to spend $260M at Powertrain

Company expected to hire 250 to 400 new employees
BY LARRY P. VELLEQUETTE
BLADE BUSINESS WRITER

General Motors Co., state, and local officials are to visit the company’s Toledo Powertrain Plant on Tuesday where they are expected to announce plans to invest an additional $260 million and hire up to 400 additional employees to produce new fuel-efficient eight-speed transmissions for upcoming products.

Dan Akerson, GM’s chairman and chief executive officer, is expected to join Toledo Mayor Mike Bell and Ohio Gov. John Kasich in the plant at 1455 West Alexis Rd. for the announcement, scheduled to begin at 1:30 p.m. It was unclear whether the new transmission would be a front-wheel or rear-wheel-drive product or what new models might use it, because GM was not providing details before the announcement.

No GM noncommercial domestic vehicle has a transmission with more than six speeds, although the automaker did reveal a concept SUV, the Buick Envision, last month in Shanghai that it said had an eight-speed transmission.

The Toledo plant, cited repeatedly by the prestigious Harbour Report as the most productive transmission plant in North America, has 1,635 hourly and salaried employees and currently builds six-speed rear-wheel and front-wheel-drive transmissions for a variety of GM products, including the hot-selling, high-volume Chevrolet Cruze and Chevrolet Malibu.

The plant’s front-wheel-drive line, which began production in 2010, has two shifts and could add a third shift soon, bringing an additional 80 to 110 jobs into the mix, if sales of the Cruze and Malibu continue at their current pace, officials with the United Auto Workers have said.

Plant and union officials have said they expect 250 to 400 new jobs. At least some would be new workers because the plant has exhausted its hiring list of laid-off employees from regional plants. The new hires would make $14 an hour, or half the wage of a veteran GM worker as negotiated with the UAW when the company headed into bankruptcy two years ago.

The local announcement is part of the automaker’s expected $2 billion in investment in plants in eight states. GM awarded $504 million to the Toledo Powertrain Plant in 2006 to build six-speed, rear-wheel-drive transmissions and invested an addition $350 million in the plant in 2007 to build a new front-wheel-drive, six-speed transmission.

The transmission unveiled in Shanghai last month was different from most vehicles in that it was augmented by a pair of electric motor generators in its dual automatic/manual design. A plug-in hybrid, the Envision would run solely on electric power when it is being started, is parked, or is running at low speeds, GM said.

When the vehicle needs more power or the battery is running low, the engine automatically kicks in to provide a smart charge for its lithium-ion battery.

When greater power is required, such as during sudden acceleration and uphill driving, the engine serves as the main power source, with the generator providing additional power.

It was unclear whether the eight-speed transmission detailed for the Envision concept is the product to be announced in Toledo today.

As domestic automakers have aggressively pursued higher fuel efficiency for their vehicles, they have focused increasingly on engine and transmission technology to do so.

Chrysler Group LLC, for example, has said it plans to introduce a nine-speed transmission in its upcoming models.

Additional gears in an automatic transmission allow an automobile a wider range of ratios to choose from to more efficiently supply torque to the wheels at lower revolutions from the engine, increasing fuel economy.

Automakers also have employed continuously variable transmissions — which do not shift so much as they smoothly transition across a power spectrum — to increase fuel economy, but consumers have been less than enthusiastic about the performance and driving dynamics of those transmissions.

“That’s a big trend that we’ve been seeing over the last few years. It wasn’t that long ago that a four speed or even a three-speed automatic was all we ever needed,” said Ed Kim, of industry consultant AutoPacific Inc., in Tustin, Calif. “The reason for all these gears is mainly focused around fuel efficiency. The more gears you have, the more likely you can have the engine run at the most efficient speed for the given task.

“Right now, the highest number of gears GM has in a production car is six, and they’ve done a good job in getting their six speeds proliferated across their lineup, whereas there are other manufacturers out there that may offer transmissions with more gears, but they haven’t gotten them as spread across the lineup as GM has,” Mr. Kim said.

http://www.toledoblade.com/Automotive/20...ain-2.html
 
05-10-2011 02:12 PM
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QSECOFR Offline
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Post: #9
RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
BTW, the $131mm for the Corvette plant is to tool up for the C7. They also make the Cadillac XLR at that plant.
 
05-10-2011 02:19 PM
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
GM was all over the local Toledo news because of this announcement...CNBC live from Toledo. So they have under-invested in their factories for years and now because of government handouts, they can give some back :towel:

The market has done 10.2% through the first 4 months...
~GM started the year at 36.86 and currently sits at 31.53...time for some good news eh
 
05-10-2011 02:20 PM
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
Senior, over the last several decades, GM has invested well in their plants. Where their investment was lacking was in engineering. The design and build quality of the F5 is beyond what I ever thought I would see from GM. It is designed and built every bit as well as a C6.
 
05-10-2011 02:22 PM
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AZBCAT Offline
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
Senior - are you rooting for the failure of this great American company which employs hundreds of thousand of middle class Americans, just to satisfy yourself that your own ideological viewpoints about government intervention are proven correct?
 
05-10-2011 02:48 PM
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
(05-10-2011 02:22 PM)QSECOFR Wrote:  Senior, over the last several decades, GM has invested well in their plants. Where their investment was lacking was in engineering. The design and build quality of the F5 is beyond what I ever thought I would see from GM. It is designed and built every bit as well as a C6.

I think GM was just a simple case of greed coming back to bite you in the behind. They moved their plants out of the country for cheaper labor and bought out their workforce and rehired at lower wages.

CEO's got fat bonuses for cutting cost. They didn't lower the price of their cars (ugly) and trucks (overpriced). and their most loyal customers (GM employees) could no longer afford them.
 
05-10-2011 03:11 PM
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
(05-10-2011 02:48 PM)AZBCAT Wrote:  Senior - are you rooting for the failure of this great American company which employs hundreds of thousand of middle class Americans, just to satisfy yourself that your own ideological viewpoints about government intervention are proven correct?

Absolutely...and I also like torturing animals and the elderly to boot...come on now. GM made it's bed, since when does the government get to decide winners and losers? I still know some very good brokers from Merrill Lynch...Merrill Lynch was a valuable asset that was bought out...do think GM would be a worthwhile investment at a discount? Still over 15 thousand ML brokers (still the world's largest brokerage)...was ML not a failure of "this great American company..."

My dad’s older brother worked for GM for over 30 years; mostly here in Toledo…his account is slightly different of the $$$ invested in the factory. GM employees and others invested $$$ in companies like GM and got burnt. I’m a little more skeptical about the "New GM"…how does that old saying go, fool me once…
 
05-10-2011 03:17 PM
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
b, with all due respect, I don't agree with you. GM's biggest problem was that they allowed the "bean counters" to dictate product direction instead of having "car guys" make those decisions. What got GM back on the right track was luring Bob Lutz away from Chrysler. GM's current improvement was in play before the bailout.

Remember the Cadillac Cimarron? It was a Chevy Cavalier with extra trim parts and an slightly upgraded interior. That product came directly from the "bean counters". Remember the Pontiac Aztec? They sold a couple of thousand units. The Chevy Equinox exists solely because GM invested $1.2b in the development of the Aztec chassis and didn't want to write off that investment. Equinox is probably the best Cross Over vehicle on the planet.

My hope is that the Car Czar stays the heck out of the way and allows the car guys at GM to keep going down the path they are currently on.

BTW, GM needs to get rid of OnStar. It is the worst of GM from the 70's and 80's all wrapped up into a completely dysfunctional division.
 
05-10-2011 03:20 PM
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
(05-10-2011 03:20 PM)QSECOFR Wrote:  b, with all due respect, I don't agree with you. GM's biggest problem was that they allowed the "bean counters" to dictate product direction instead of having "car guys" make those decisions. What got GM back on the right track was luring Bob Lutz away from Chrysler. GM's current improvement was in play before the bailout.

Remember the Cadillac Cimarron? It was a Chevy Cavalier with extra trim parts and an slightly upgraded interior. That product came directly from the "bean counters". Remember the Pontiac Aztec? They sold a couple of thousand units. The Chevy Equinox exists solely because GM invested $1.2b in the development of the Aztec chassis and didn't want to write off that investment. Equinox is probably the best Cross Over vehicle on the planet.

My hope is that the Car Czar stays the heck out of the way and allows the car guys at GM to keep going down the path they are currently on.

BTW, GM needs to get rid of OnStar. It is the worst of GM from the 70's and 80's all wrapped up into a completely dysfunctional division.

I don't I'm that far off from what you are saying. They put cars on the back burner and focused on trucks and SUV's. But when your largest customer base goes from making 18-30 bucks an hour to around 10. they won't be able to buy those expensive trucks and as you pointed out (so did I) the cars were pretty sad.

I think if people can't afford to buy cars, the industry is just gonna fail.
 
05-10-2011 04:10 PM
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AZBCAT Offline
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Post: #17
RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
(05-10-2011 03:17 PM)SeniorBearcat Wrote:  
(05-10-2011 02:48 PM)AZBCAT Wrote:  Senior - are you rooting for the failure of this great American company which employs hundreds of thousand of middle class Americans, just to satisfy yourself that your own ideological viewpoints about government intervention are proven correct?

Absolutely...and I also like torturing animals and the elderly to boot...come on now. GM made it's bed, since when does the government get to decide winners and losers? I still know some very good brokers from Merrill Lynch...Merrill Lynch was a valuable asset that was bought out...do think GM would be a worthwhile investment at a discount? Still over 15 thousand ML brokers (still the world's largest brokerage)...was ML not a failure of "this great American company..."

My dad’s older brother worked for GM for over 30 years; mostly here in Toledo…his account is slightly different of the $$$ invested in the factory. GM employees and others invested $$$ in companies like GM and got burnt. I’m a little more skeptical about the "New GM"…how does that old saying go, fool me once…

Wait...you are using the Merrill Lynch deal as an example of a deal with no government involvement (and one free of massive fraud on top of that?)? You need to read more about that transaction my friend. The government backing of this makes the GM deal look paltry in comparison.

Read on...
http://www.foxbusiness.com/story/markets...arp-money/
 
05-10-2011 05:30 PM
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
(05-10-2011 03:17 PM)SeniorBearcat Wrote:  
(05-10-2011 02:48 PM)AZBCAT Wrote:  Senior - are you rooting for the failure of this great American company which employs hundreds of thousand of middle class Americans, just to satisfy yourself that your own ideological viewpoints about government intervention are proven correct?

Absolutely...and I also like torturing animals and the elderly to boot...come on now. GM made it's bed, since when does the government get to decide winners and losers? I still know some very good brokers from Merrill Lynch...Merrill Lynch was a valuable asset that was bought out...do think GM would be a worthwhile investment at a discount? Still over 15 thousand ML brokers (still the world's largest brokerage)...was ML not a failure of "this great American company..."

My dad’s older brother worked for GM for over 30 years; mostly here in Toledo…his account is slightly different of the $$$ invested in the factory. GM employees and others invested $$$ in companies like GM and got burnt. I’m a little more skeptical about the "New GM"…how does that old saying go, fool me once…

i'm with you senior.

i couldn't understand some of these posts any better if they were in korean.

english; do you speak it or write it? if yes, move on to economics 101.

b, i gotta tell ya, your messages get lost too often in the translation.
 
05-10-2011 05:51 PM
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RE: I guess that GM, besides being criminal, isn't all that
(05-10-2011 05:51 PM)gruehls Wrote:  b, i gotta tell ya, your messages get lost too often in the translation.

To be honest, Sometimes I go back and reread some of my old post and I'm as lost as you are.

I figured after all of this time, you guys would be able to decipher my post.

I'll try again. Maybe I'm over simplifying things but as I recall, GM used to pay it's workers a decent wage. That along with the discounts they gave allowed their employers to buy news cars every so often.

then they started building plants in mexico and overseas and shutting down the plants at home. The facilities they kept open, they bought out they higher paid workers and hired news at a significantly lower scale. The result being their most loyal customers can no longer afford to buy new vehicles.

That seems like economics 101 to me.
 
05-11-2011 11:09 AM
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