Have G'Town or St. John's ever considered making the jump to 1A? Has DePaul ever played football or thought of reviving or starting a program? Imagine, that would add NYC, D.C., and Chicago. That should satisfy the "keep the northeast footprint" crowd and the "look at those markets" crowd. As a UofL fan, I wouldn't even be opposed to that. Sounds like fun road trips to me.

To my knowledge the only "bball onlys" that have considered the jump have been Uconn and Nova......Uconn has been very successful and Nova has resisted making the plunge despite repeated attemps by the BE office to get them to do so

-- I doubt St Johns and Depaul have the financial resouces to field a 1a football team...increased scholorships and staduim improvments can get pricey


Jackson

Quote:Jackson1011 Posted on Jul 19 2005, 08:06 PM
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To my knowledge the only "bball onlys" that have considered the jump have been Uconn and Nova......Uconn has been very successful and Nova has resisted making the plunge despite repeated attemps by the BE office to get them to do so

-- I doubt St Johns and Depaul have the financial resouces to field a 1a football team...increased scholorships and staduim improvments can get pricey


Jackson 

Correct. Nova is the only non-D1A school in the BE that could still possibly make the move up. And even they are a remote possibility at this point in time.

When the split comes, the D-1A schools will not be looking at BE teams as expansion candidates.

Cheers,
Neil

I had heard of Marquette looking into adding I-AA football in a few years...but I don't know much about that. I doubt they would suddenly make a jump to I-A in the same breath. Kinda interesting though.

Army56Mike Wrote:Have G'Town or St. John's ever considered making the jump to 1A? Has DePaul ever played football or thought of reviving or starting a program? Imagine, that would add NYC, D.C., and Chicago. That should satisfy the "keep the northeast footprint" crowd and the "look at those markets" crowd. As a UofL fan, I wouldn't even be opposed to that. Sounds like fun road trips to me.

Chicago's in the Northeast, that's news to this Northeastern boy. Sure its a great city that I've always wanted to visit and is certainly more akin to New York and Boston than to Indianapolis and Louisville. As for having a non-scholarship D-1AA and two schools w/o programs step up that makes no sense. Footprint is one thing but realistic candidates are another.

I read that Georgetown is constructing a new on-campus stadium; however, it does not meet D-1A standards. If they made the jump, they would have to play in RFK or Redskins stadium. They would also have to get local support, which seems to be divided in the DC area among Maryland, UVA, VT, Navy, and the Redskins. Also, they have to deal with big high school football games, from what I read and understand, are played on Saturday afternoons instead of Friday nights.

Nova has a realistic shot at moving up, but will need to increase the money going to their football program and increase fan support. Hard to sell college football in a big city.

I have not read or heard anything about DePaul or Marquette est. a football program.

St. John's had a program in NYC for years; however, they never had the fan support to really make strides in football, so their program was dropped.

The only other D-1AA teams with good chances to move to D-1A are Delaware, Georgia Southern, and Montana.

Quote:I had heard of Marquette looking into adding I-AA football in a few years...but I don't know much about that. I doubt they would suddenly make a jump to I-A in the same breath. Kinda interesting though.

-- Hopefully we will be long gone by then


Jackson

Hey, MU and WV are old rivals. We have played 3 times. We have played UC, UL and Pitt too. In fact, MU last game was against UC, I believe. We have a winning streak against BC. MU even played in the Cotton Bowl.

Seriously, Milwaukee is the largest metro area without any D-1 football team or an NFL team. It is football crazy. The arena team drew 15,000 in its first year despite not winning a game. (The team is on leave after being kicked out of the Bradley Center. The owner will not let the AFL put another team in Milwaukee without buying his franchise rights) If MU started football, it would draw very well. Heck, the hoops team has drawn over 10,000 every year but one since the mid 60's. Unfortunately, there is no place to play football in Milwaukee. Miller Park was designed so that football would not be played there. The next largest stadium seats around 6000-8000. There is talk of a new downtown stadium for an MLS team that MU could use. There is an alumni group interested in restarting football. However, the University has balked at the idea, for now. If MU did restart football, I would bet that the BE or any split off conference would give them serious consideration. Big market and decent fan base.

I know Chicago isn't northeast but the last time I checked, NYC was, and well, D.C. isn't really either, but I'm sure you might consider them that way. Chicago is very midwest, ver very large midwest. I knew these teams would never play football, I was just playing the what it game. I would find them to be the best fits for me. That said, I'll bring my head out of dreamland and into reality and say we should fill out the conference with Memphis, S. Miss, Tulane, and ECU. That is reality. It's not quite like those dream road trips to NYC, Chicago, and D.C. But New Orleans is a fun place to go, and Memphis is nice.

Army56Mike Wrote:I know Chicago isn't northeast but the last time I checked, NYC was, and well, D.C. isn't really either, but I'm sure you might consider them that way.  Chicago is very midwest, ver very large midwest.  I knew these teams would never play football, I was just playing the what it game.  I would find them to be the best fits for me.  That said, I'll bring my head out of dreamland and into reality and say we should fill out the conference with Memphis, S. Miss, Tulane, and ECU.  That is reality.  It's not quite like those dream road trips to NYC, Chicago, and D.C.  But New Orleans is a fun place to go, and Memphis is nice.

DC is very much Northeastern in my view. Does it resemble a Sun Belt city? No. Does it resemble a midwestern city? No. Does it resemble European cities? Yes to an extent. Does it resember other NE cities? Again yes to an extent. Many aspects of the city's modern planning echoes of Boston. Another thing to be noted is most Sun Belt cities are sprawled out over large areas needlessly while Frost Belt cities particularly Northeastern cities are very contained. As an Urban Studies major I know that centralization in a city is not only a dying theme but also an ineffective way of planning. However, sprawl isn't the correct answer to decentralization. New York/New Jersey/Connecticut is likely the best example we have available of what to do. We have satellites in Hudson County, Newark, New Brunswick, Stamford, Bridgeport, White Plains, etc. Washington also has a track record of implementing mass transportation expansions before necessary and doing so in a comprehensive way. Southern California is an example of what not to do. The Los Angeles area is sprawled out unnecessarily and has truly inadequate rapid transit/regional rail options. They are the Southern end of the Northeast Corridor region, rail line, etc. This is the southern anchor of BosWash aka the Megalopolis encompassing Washington, DC (yes including the Metro areas of it in VA and WV), Baltimore, Philadelphia, Wilmington, DE, Newark, NJ, New York, New Haven-Hartford, CT, Providence, RI, and Boston (again including the suburbs in NH and ME).

With the strength and market of Nova hoops, and talks of a split, IMO I would like to see NOVA make the jump to D1 with the football and join us.

Just my thoughts.

brista21 Wrote:They are the Southern end of the Northeast Corridor region, rail line, etc. This is the southern anchor of BosWash aka the Megalopolis encompassing Washington, DC (yes including the Metro areas of it in VA and WV), Baltimore, Philadelphia, Wilmington, DE, Newark, NJ, New York, New Haven-Hartford, CT, Providence, RI, and Boston (again including the suburbs in NH and ME).

When I look at a map (from the South to North), Washington is the last "southern city" (some may say Baltimore is the last southern city). From my history, Washington's location was a compromise to locate the capital "south".

From North to South, we may look at the cities as.... Boston, New York, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Washington, and Richmond (VA). Once we get past Richmond, the cities get farther away.

I include Richmond because Richmond is 90 miles from DC.

Richmond to Raleigh is a 3 (may 3 1/2) hour drive. (Raleigh, Greensboro, Charlotte, Greenville (SC), Atlanta isn't the same as the northeast.)

chess Wrote:

brista21 Wrote:They are the Southern end of the Northeast Corridor region, rail line, etc. This is the southern anchor of BosWash aka the Megalopolis encompassing Washington, DC (yes including the Metro areas of it in VA and WV), Baltimore, Philadelphia, Wilmington, DE, Newark, NJ, New York, New Haven-Hartford, CT, Providence, RI, and Boston (again including the suburbs in NH and ME).

When I look at a map (from the South to North), Washington is the last "southern city". From my history, Washington's location was a compromise to locate the capital "south".

From North to South, we may look at the cities as.... Boston, New York, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Washington, and Richmond (VA). Once we get past Richmond, the cities get farther away.

I include Richmond because Richmond is 90 miles from DC.

Richmond to Raleigh is a 3 (may 3 1/2) hour drive. (Raleigh, Greensboro, Charlotte, Greenville (SC), Atlanta isn't the same as the northeast.)

True the original ideas and intents were that way, but DC has not developed the way a Southern city has typically and is certainly far more linked in its infrastructure, planning, and culture to the Northeast. In my opinion there has never even been a hybrid style culture existing there in my lifetime. (I was born March 1985.) There certainly is talk of two emerging southern megalopolises in Florida with Tampa up to Orlando up to Jacksonville and also down the coast to the Palm Beaches, Ft. Lauderdale, and Miami and from the Research Triangle to Charlotte to Greenville to Knoxville to Atlanta. Their exists two other official megalopoises SanSan and ChiPitts. SanSan is obviously San Francisco to San Diego and ChiPitts is Chicago to Pittsburgh through Indianpolis, Cincinnati, Columbus, and Louisville.

My head hurts.

DC is just like Louisville as far as location is concerned...a Mason Dixon line city. It just isn't encumbered by a state so it can take on it's own personality. Louisville standing alone is thought of as midwestern, but when you say Louisville, KY it takes on a southern flavor. If DC were in Virginia for instance, it would be thought of as southern...Maryland, could go either way....but it stands alone so it's sort of a Chameleon taking on the characteristics of cities close to it such as Baltimore and other northeastern cities.

cardtopper Wrote:If DC were in Virginia for instance, it would be thought of as southern...Maryland, could go either way....but it stands alone so it's sort of a Chameleon taking on the characteristics of cities close to it such as Baltimore and other northeastern cities.

DC is also located in Virginia.

When you cross the Potomac, the Pentagon (DC address) is in Virginia. DC actually gave its Virginia land back to the commonwealth.

Washington, DC IS southern because that was the compromise when moving the capital from Philadelphia.

Maryland can be thought of as "southern" because Maryland was ready to secede during the Civil War. Baltimore was under Marshall Law throughout the war.

Our Rutgers friend is correct in saying that DC has "nothern" infrastructure. DC is an awesome city.

DePaul will not add a football team for a few reasons. Title IX is perhaps the biggest one, as there is not a sport that can be added on the women's side to be compliant. We have softball, golf, tennis, soccer, volleyball, track, cross country. Perhaps with the success of lacrosse at Northwestern, DePaul would give consideration to that. But that brings up another issue. Where would DePaul play football/lacrosse? We are located in the dead center of Chicago, and the only options currently open are Soldier Field and Northwestern's field. Neither are truly viable option. So DePaul would need to investigate building a stadium.... but first priority is a basketball arena. So yea.... we would need a HUGE tract of land where we could do both.

I'm sorry, but I don't buy the Title IX argument. There are over 700 NCAA schools playing football, large and small, and they're in compliance, so why couldn't DePaul and Marquette do the same?

Lincoln Park lacks room for any football facility, but there are options within the city as a whole--even NU plays a few miles from the campus. You don't need more than 2,000 seats or so to play nonscholarship I-AA ball, and there are certainly options in Chicago for that.

Whether schools could or would play I-A is a different question. I'm not sure how many Louisville or UC fans would want to give up non-conference games to play the Hoyas or Wildcats, much less the Demons or even those Warriors* up in Milwaukee.

Open question to those Big East I-A fans: would your school even consider scheduling a home game with a Villanova or a Georgetown, with no return game needed?

DFW HOYA Wrote:I'm sorry, but I don't buy the Title IX argument. There are over 700 NCAA schools playing football, large and small, and they're in compliance, so why couldn't DePaul and Marquette do the same?

Lincoln Park lacks room for any football facility, but there are options within the city as a whole--even NU plays a few miles from the campus. You don't need more than 2,000 seats or so to play nonscholarship I-AA ball, and there are certainly options in Chicago for that.

Whether schools could or would play I-A is a different question. I'm not sure how many Louisville or UC fans would want to give up non-conference games to play the Hoyas or Wildcats, much less the Demons or even those Warriors* up in Milwaukee.

Open question to those Big East I-A fans: would your school even consider scheduling a home game with a Villanova or a Georgetown, with no return game needed?

Rutgers has played Nova in the past and will do so again this year if that answers your question. Georgetown I don't believe they'd play because one of two requirements seem to need to be met for a 1-AA opponent, they are either one of our historical rivals like Lehigh, Princeton, Columbia, Lafayette, Colgate or they need to play high-end 1-AA ball like an A-10 school.

I just don't like to play 1aa schools--nothing to gain and everything to lose. Let's consider a hypothethical situation. One of the BE teams goes 6-5 this year, but one of those losses was to a 1aa school. I think the 1aa loss could knock one out of a bowl bid. Even playing a 1aa close drops a good team in the rankings.

Jim