Saturday, July 2, 2005
Last modified at 12:00 a.m. on Saturday, July 2, 2005
The Lubbock Avalanche-Journal

Big 12 examining new bowl affiliations

BY JEFF WALKER
AVALANCHE-JOURNAL

The Big 12 Conference is closer to having a new bowl arrangement for the 2006 season.

Conference commissioner Kevin Weiberg confirmed Thursday that talks with the Gator, Insight and Sun bowls have progressed and the Big 12 could have a formal announcement in the coming weeks.

"We're continuing to work on it," Weiberg said. "We're fortunate that bowls like the Gator, Insight and Sun find us appealing and are willing to negotiate. We could have something in the next several weeks. We're close to resolving it, but we're not there yet."

Weiberg didn't set a timetable, but the Big 12 football media days are July 19-21 in Houston, and he has his annual state of the conference address scheduled for July 20.

The Big 12 is in its final season of a contract with eight bowls - the Fiesta, Cotton, Holiday, Alamo, Independence, Champs Sports, Houston and Fort Worth bowls.

The Gator Bowl is played at Alltel Stadium in Jacksonville, Fla., home of the NFL's Jaguars and last year's Super Bowl. The Gator Bowl traditionally has paired a team from the Big East against a team from the Atlantic Coast Conference, but the loss of Miami, Virginia Tech and Boston College have perhaps made the Big East appear like a questionable partner conference.

The Big East also has an affiliation with the Insight Bowl, which is played at the Bank One Ballpark in Phoenix. If the Big 12 reaches an agreement with the Insight Bowl, it could have a similar matchup as the Holiday Bowl: Big 12 vs. Pac-10.

The Sun Bowl in El Paso matches a team from the Pac-10 and Big Ten. The Big 12 has had history with the Sun Bowl. Tech played in the first televised Sun Bowl when NBC broadcast the game against Georgia in 1964.

The Red Raiders have appeared in the Sun Bowl nine times since 1937, most recently in 1993 in a 41-10 loss to Oklahoma prior to the formation of the Big 12.

If the Big 12 reaches agreements with the three new bowls, Weiberg said the conference would replace existing affiliates

The Gator Bowl would likely replace the Champs Sports Bowl.

A Tech official told The A-J last year that the conference loses money any time it sends a Big 12 school to the Champs Sports Bowl in Orlando, because the expenses are more than the payout.

The Gator Bowl, however, had a payout of $1.6 million last year, nearly double the $850,000 payout by the Champs Sports Bowl.

The Sun Bowl payout last year was $1.425 million, while the Insight Bowl payout was $750,000.

The Plains Capital Fort Worth Bowl also had a payout of $750,000, while the Houston Bowl paid $1.1 million and the Independence paid $1.2 million.

"We've been affiliated with some good bowls, with good groups and good partners," Weiberg said. "If we can put ourselves in other areas of the country and maybe get some more exposure, we have to look at it. It's a balancing act to try and do what's best."


To comment on this story:

jeff.walker@lubbockonline.com 766-8736

I bet the Liberty Bowl is looking better to the Big East. I understand these bowls want schools that travel well, but I would think that the northeast tv market would make the Big East schools attractive? Why are these bowls not interested in the Big East?

Well a point that the article doesn't mention is that the Champs bowl's payouts will increase with the next contract so there won't be a huge monetary difference between the gator and Champs bowl...What the BE teams have to be especially worried about is what kind of access ND gets...if the Gator wants unfettered access that will probably mean ND would be going most yrs so you might as well sign with the Champs who is not making such a demand (at least not publicly)

-- the Insight bowl has always been a horrible fit for the BE....even WVU and VT didn't send large crowds to Phoenix...I can understand why they want to sign with a western league

-- As for the Liberty bowl...I would be very suprised if the powers that be in Memphis would allow a liberty bowl/BE marriage....that bowl game is a big time carrot Memphis can offer the BE football schools to invite the Tigers if the all sports league comes into being....if the Liberty bowl would make such a deal with the BE now that would undercut a signficant part of what UM could offer the new league when the time comes


Jackson

Jackson, Does the Gator think the B-12 will bring more fans? I might be wrong, but I just don't think many B-12 fans will flock to Florida unless it's a BCS bowl. As far as the Liberty goes, who knows? If the Big East would send their #2 team, it would be hard for the Liberty to pass up such an opportunity. I'm sure that there is a close relationship between Memphis & the Liberty, but last I checked, the bowls want to make money. The Sun Bowl doesn't seem to have a problem taking conferences of which UTEP is not a member. I'm sure the Liberty would love to have ND playing in it's bowl.

Forget the cold weather Liberty Bowl. It's time for the Big East to start shaping its own destiny. The league needs to sign with the Champs Sports Bowl, replacing the Big 12 in that alignment. Then hang on to the Meineke Muffler Bowl for the time being. Those events, plus the BCS, give the league three bowls.

Then the Big East and the MAC need to get started in earnest on revising their Toronto Bowl bid, making sure they do everything to get it passed by the NCAA this time. Finally, talk with George Steinbrenner and/or some corporations to pony up for a second Tampa Bowl, controlled by USF and the Big East.

Adding those two would bring the league to five bowls. There still might be a possibility of working something out with the SEC and the Music City Bowl as well, unless those negotiations are now dead. Plus there might be another possibility of doing something with the Independence Bowl. The Big East has options.

KK, It's too bad the Tire Bowl was changed to the Muffler Bowl. If that warm weather Toronto Bowl came about, the Big East could have bowl tie-ins to the Tire Bowl in Charlotte and the Snow Tire Bowl in Toronto.

I would think the Big East # 2 playing CUSA # 1 would be better than a Big East-MAC matchup.

Since the Toronto Bowl would be played INDOORS at the Rogers Centre (Skydome), the temperature would end up being very WARM indeed.

Ask the Big East #2 team if they prefer playing in Orlando or Memphis. Ask the Big East #3 team if they prefer playing in Charlotte or Memphis.

I'm sure if Conference USA wanted to send a squad to Tampa, however, something might be able to be worked out with the Big East #4 team.

Meanwhile, the Big East #5 and MAC #3 can deliver American college football to a curious, new, and supportive audience in a major world city.

I would think that there would be more to do in Memphis than Charlotte, unless you are into banking. It might not be snowing inside that domed stadium in Toronto, but fans would still have to deal with the weather. I guess they could find a lake & do some ice fishing while they wait for the game. I might be wrong, but I thought northerners like to come south for the winter. On top of that, if the NFL thought any Canadian City would support a franchise, wouldn't they have put one in the "Great White North"? Hockey is the only sport the Canadians really support.

IF the Big 12 gets the Insight and Gator Bowls then the Big East needs to secure the Champ Sports and Independence Bowl.

Needless to say, I still worry about our bowl future, although some of you are much more optimistic. Here is last seasons BE bowls we played in:


**********************
Champs: ACC vs. Big 12
Syracuse played Georgia Tech because Big 12 didn't have enough teams.

Motor City: MAC vs. Big Ten
Connecticut played Toledo because Big 10 didn't have enough teams.

Insight: Pac-10 vs. Big East or Notre Dame
Notre Dame vs Oregon State; Notre Dame takes one of the BE slots.

Continental: ACC vs. Big East
Boston College vs North Carolina

Gator ACC vs. Big East or Notre Dame
West Virginia vs Florida State

BCS
**********************

The first two bowls, we don't even have an affiliation with, but we were lucky to get teams in because other conferences could fulfill, but we can't always count on this.

Also, Notre Dame took another bowl from the Big East. So please correct me if I'm wrong, but it looks like going into next season, besides the BCS, we have three guaranteed bowls with Notre Dame possibly taking one of them (or have we added any more?)

The year after, it doesn't look good right now. I truly think we have lost the Gator already, and now we will probably lose the Insight too. I know lots of talks are going on for replacements, but until I see some things finalized, I'm going to be concerned.

Finally, the BE sending it's #2 to the Liberty Bowl would we a little depressing for Card fans. We could conceivably go 10-1 (with the only loss to the BE champ) and the reward would be back to the Liberty Bowl.




<span style='color:red'>The University of Louisville, BCS National Champions for the 2005 season </span>

"Whether you think you can do a thing, or can't do a thing, you are right". - Henry Ford

Quote:Finally, the BE sending it's #2 to the Liberty Bowl would we a little depressing for Card fans. We could conceivably go 10-1 (with the only loss to the BE champ) and the reward would be back to the Liberty Bowl.

-- The BE #2 will be playing a bowl game in Flordia against the ACC...now it could be the gator or the Champs but it will be one of the two...I have not read a thing about the BE and the Liberty bowl hooking up

-- The Big12 talks with the Insight could be part of the deal that was reported awhile back where the BE was goingt to "share" the music city and insight bowls with that conference

Quote:It might not be snowing inside that domed stadium in Toronto, but fans would still have to deal with the weather. I guess they could find a lake & do some ice fishing while they wait for the game. I might be wrong, but I thought northerners like to come south for the winter. On top of that, if the NFL thought any Canadian City would support a franchise, wouldn't they have put one in the "Great White North"? Hockey is the only sport the Canadians really support.

-- Its all about forming a bowl that you control...like what the ACC has with the Tire bowl...the BE will never have to worry about the Toronot bowl going to another league....and UConn, Syracuse and Rutgers can finally have a short drive to a bowl game and we can actually have a bowl in our region so to speak


Jackson

Jackson1011 Wrote:-- The BE #2&nbsp; will be playing a bowl game in Flordia against the ACC...now it could be the gator or the Champs but it will be one of the two...

The Champs is still in discussion, so I don't consider it a bowl until it becomes official; it's still another "maybe".

I should be fair and also use this logic in saying we still have the Gator until we officially lose it, but I really think we will lose it; I hope I'm wrong.

If the Champs bowl has the option of taking the #2 BE or ND they will jump on it....there will not be a better deal available to them....this is not something to worry about...our #2 will be playing in Flordia


Jackson

Jackson1011 Wrote:If the Champs bowl has the option of taking the #2 BE or ND they will jump on it....there will not be a better deal available to them....this is not something to worry about...our #2 will be playing in Flordia


Jackson

Soudns good to me!

Jackson, thanks for the back-up. It's amazing that some people will not listen to reason no matter what the facts are.

As I said previously, the Big East needs to shape its own destiny. If that means starting its own bowls in Toronto and Tampa, then they have to do it. Those will be bowls that nobody can take away from them.

No one is talking about the NFL in Toronto. The topic is a one-time American college football special event in late December. It will be supported as well as a CFL game. And there is plenty to do in Toronto.

If the Big 12 takes the Gator Bowl, they will have to drop another bowl. That would be either the Champs or the Independence. And the Champs director has already said they are interested in the Big East.

The Louisville fans here sure aren't too excited about the Liberty Bowl. I assume their administration knows this. They didn't leave Conference USA planning to end up with the same teams and bowls again.

All of the bowl ties are set for this fall anyway. Any changes will have to become effective in the 2006 season. A line-up then of BCS, Champs, Muffler, Insight/Music City, Tampa, and Toronto is still very strong.