usffan Wrote:If you are angry about the selection, don't blame the candidate, blame the people who made the decision. 

USFFan

I'm not upset with USF being in the BE. I'm confused as to why USF is in the BE. No one, I mean no one here or in any press releases from the BE or press conferences as stated a valid and decent reason as to why USF is in the BE, except for location.

You USF people may believe that I think Memphis deserved a BE invite, not necessairly so. I do believe USF did not deserve a BE invite. What is... is, what isn't... isn't. The BE will survive, but in spite of USF not because of USF.

So let it be written, so let it be done.

Derby Wrote:

usffan Wrote:If you are angry about the selection, don't blame the candidate, blame the people who made the decision. 

USFFan

I'm not upset with USF being in the BE. I'm confused as to why USF is in the BE. No one, I mean no one here or in any press releases from the BE or press conferences as stated a valid and decent reason as to why USF is in the BE, except for location.

You USF people may believe that I think Memphis deserved a BE invite, not necessairly so. I do believe USF did not deserve a BE invite. What is... is, what isn't... isn't. The BE will survive, but in spite of USF not because of USF.

So let it be written, so let it be done.

Well, you were the one who "wished Louisville and Cincinnati well," then provided a dissertation about why USF was undeserving. Inferred was that you did NOT wish USF well. Easy to infer that you are indeed "upset with USF."

I agree that the Big East will be fine, and I believe that USF will be a good and competitive member of the Big East. I also believe that Memphis could and would have done the same, but I didn't make that call.

USFFan

usffan Wrote:

Derby Wrote:

usffan Wrote:If you are angry about the selection, don't blame the candidate, blame the people who made the decision. 

USFFan

I'm not upset with USF being in the BE. I'm confused as to why USF is in the BE. No one, I mean no one here or in any press releases from the BE or press conferences as stated a valid and decent reason as to why USF is in the BE, except for location.

You USF people may believe that I think Memphis deserved a BE invite, not necessairly so. I do believe USF did not deserve a BE invite. What is... is, what isn't... isn't. The BE will survive, but in spite of USF not because of USF.

So let it be written, so let it be done.

Well, you were the one who "wished Louisville and Cincinnati well," then provided a dissertation about why USF was undeserving. Inferred was that you did NOT wish USF well. Easy to infer that you are indeed "upset with USF."

I agree that the Big East will be fine, and I believe that USF will be a good and competitive member of the Big East. I also believe that Memphis could and would have done the same, but I didn't make that call.

USFFan

Fair enough.

Folks, let it all play out on the field. Also we know there is more then likely another shakeup with the conferences. Memphis, ECU, Temple, UCF and Marshall know what they need to do. IMO those 3 schools if the Big East ever decides to expand are the list we will be looking at.

I would love to get a Penn State, Notre Dame or a Maryland but that is not being realistic. I would settle for a Temple for the Philly Market and the Linc and Memphis as long as they bring the Liberty Bowl with them.

South Florida will be fine. They were a good pick for the Big East, and whether or not a school "deserves" an invite is a moot point. What has SMU or Tulsa done to "deserve" an invite to C-USA? Why did South Florida deserve an invite to C-USA but not the Big East? And how can you prove that you deserve an invitation or not? Bottomline, South Florida is in the Big East, they worked hard to get in there, all the petty b*tching about them is getting old and tired. For all the people who claim that South Florida fans have big heads and are getting out of control all I see are waves and waves of C-USA fans trashing South Florida. And someone talked about how South Florida fans were getting rowdy on a South Florida messageboard. *Gasp*. Rowdy fans on their own message board? Say it ain't so!

Quote:USF is nothing but small child given a huge opportunity. They have done nothing whatsoever to deserve a Big East invite and I'm not saying Memphis deserved one either. Football and basketball drive the gravy train in college athletics, now you have to throw in location as well.

Let me ask this of all BE fans here... If Memphis was in a better geographical postion, who would you have picked? USF or Memphis? My bet is that Memphis would win hands down. If ECU had better quality basketball and attendance to go with it, who would you (as BE fans) picked? USF or ECU? My bet is that ECU would win, however with a smaller percentage than the previous question.

Louisville and Cincinnati are proven commodities. They deserved their respective invites. USF did not. I wish the Cards and Bearcats well. USF is a BE welfare case.

In 10 years Florida Atlantic will have outpaced both USF and UCF. Just wait. That's where the true "potential" of a non-big three Florida school resides, not with USF.

Sour grages you say? Maybe. But tell me what one thing USF has over Memphis (besides location)? Football? Where? Basketball? You've got to be kidding. Attendance? You've got to be kidding? Athletic budget? Nope. Tradition? Don't make me laugh. The old University of Tampa has more football and basketball tradition than USF. Location? OK, you've got me there.

Louisville and Cincinnati were the right choices. Memphis football came of age too late, shame on us. USF football hasn't even left the womb. Memphis basketball has 50 years of success and tradition written all over it. USF basketball... well, let's just leave it there.

Louisville and Cincinnati gained admittance the right way. USF gained admittance by hopping up and down like a foolish contestant on the Price is Right. Pick me, pick me...!!!

"South Florida! Come on down, your the next member of the Big East". All this while ECU and Memphis got "zonked" like on Let's Make a Dea

-- Expansion these days is all about location, location, location...let's set the BE/CUSA stuff aside for a moment. Why do you think BC got invited to the ACC over West Virginia? WVU has dominated BC in football for yrs, WVU has ready made rivalries in the ACC with Maryland/Virginia tech and a lesser extent UVA, WVU was once in the same conference with UNC, Duke, NC State etc so there is a historical tie, WVU has thousands of alums and transplants living in NC so every time the Moutaineers play in the state of North Carolina the host school can expect a big crowd...so with all those advantages why did the ACC treat WVU like it had the plague? Its all about location and TV markets

-- the real loser is all of this is ECU....if the BE football schools had formed an all sports league in the early 90s...ECU would have been the 9th school no questiones asked....but politics with the bball onlys prevented there invite....if VT and not SU were still in the BE then ECU would probably be in the BE now....

-- What exactly has UCF down to warrent there CUSA invite.....there were constently the worst team in the MAC while there were in that league and have probably been one of the worst football programs in D1 football over the past few yrs....what have they down to warrent the invite over Miami, Oh, Toldeo, La Tech, or North Texas?? I find it very odd that you are complaining about the BE favoring a Flordia school when CUSA did exactly the same thing with UCF

--Again its all location.....and again I hate to tell you this friend but if its down to Memphis and UCF for the 9th spot in the all sports league and both have about the same advantages...UCF will get the call just because of the whole location factor... I know it sucks, but that is the way of things these days

Jackson

usffan Wrote:

Watauga9 Wrote:yea that winning tradition really faded quick when you couldnt recruit partial qualifiers!!

made you come back down to earth didnt it? :wave:

Can you please provide a list of partial qualifiers who helped USF to finish tied for 3rd in 2003?

I didn't think so.

USFFan

USF never made it big on partial qualifiers, they do take as many as they can get but it is severely limited by the state of Florida legislature. They are allowed two partials on the football team total same as UF, FSU, and UCF. The reason USF was able to do well in the beginning was 1AA transition to 1A. They could accept 1A transfers and the transfers didn't have to sit out a full year. If you look at the most talented players on the USF squad for the 2003 season, many were transfers. IIRC, that includes Kawika Mitchell.

This thread has gotten way out of hand. :bang:

MichiganTiger Wrote:This thread has gotten way out of hand. :bang:

Maybe, but I'm tired of watching unsubstantiated swipes at my alma mater and posers pretending to be fans to further stir up crap. If you don't want to read it, nobody's forcing you to do so, but if you manage to rein in some of your fans who are on here taking potshots the thread would die.

Back to the topic, I believe that rumors of the Big East's demise are greatly exaggerated. We still haven't even played a down of football or a second of basketball in our current iteration. At the end of the day, each of the conferences listed in the original post will only have a finite number of teams that can go to bowls, and I feel certain that the Big East will manage to secure our share of bowl slots.

USFFan

Again Memphis will be the 9th team!

I guess the Big East needed a doormat on the beach

Watauga9 Wrote:I guess the Big East needed a doormat on the beach

Pot, kettle, black. Memphis isn't that far removed from being a doormat themselves. Two winning seasons. South Florida has only had one losing season.

First let me say that for the CUSA posters stating their case for their school to be included in the BE; what is the purpose of doing that?

Second, USF is no more of a logical choice for the BE than Miami was. Geographic wise it doesn't make sense. The BE needs to focus on rebuilding their football identity in the Northeast instead of worrying about Florida. That said, the BE has given USF a tremendous opportunity to enhance their program and hopefully the Bulls will take advantage of it.

Third, the BE was very fortunate to keep their BCS status. No flame or insult. Just a fact. Mike Tran is to be commended for that. But it would be great for BE posters not to wield that BCS card around like it's Thor's Hammer. I chuckle when I read comments like "you know what you need to do to get invite" and "keep improving and you may eventually get a invite". Well, you guys got work to do to keep that status and it shouldn't be assumed in 4 years you'll still have it or the fact that maybe it will be full inclusion in the BCS for the other 5 conference or possibly no BCS at all.

No before someone say that I'm envious because UAB wasn't invited or that I'm a CUSA fan that have nothing good to say about the BE, I know the BE is in a far better position to succeed than CUSA. And what happened to the BE wasn't not fair or right.

But the BE has a lot more to prove and a lot more to lose than CUSA. I also feel that schools like Memphis, UCF and ECU don't need to pimp their schools to the BE posters. I'm sure by now posters on this site are fully aware of ECU, UCF and ECU potential. Do it on the field and on the court and I'm sure at some point it will pay dividends.

Best of luck to the former CUSA schools and if Mike wants to send the BE #2 to LB, I'm sure CUSA programs will look forward to the matchup and the potential beatdown of the participating BE school! :D

Go UAB!

Hidden, agree with many of the sentiments you have. However, at this point if we were forced to go to 12 teams right now I'd like to take Temple, Southern Miss, Memphis, and ECU and be done with it. As soon as we split I feel we need 9 members for balance on all of the sports scheduling. I think Memphis would best suit our needs and vice versa.

I think we do need an all-sports conference and need to split ASAP. Idon't know if we have to go to 12, but I probably would. I do believe we need at least 10 to be competitive with the other BCS conferences. My first 2 picks would be Memphis and Navy. My next 2 picks would be ECU and S Miss. These could change, and I , of course, would support any schools that eventually landed in the conference.

Jim

brista21 Wrote:Hidden, agree with many of the sentiments you have. However, at this point if we were forced to go to 12 teams right now I'd like to take Temple, Southern Miss, Memphis, and ECU and be done with it. As soon as we split I feel we need 9 members for balance on all of the sports scheduling. I think Memphis would best suit our needs and vice versa.

Even if there is a split from the basketball only schools, the BE doesn't need or wouldn't be force to go to 12 teams. Personally, the BE need to strive for stability and not make the mistake CUSA made. What mistake? By spreading itself all over the country. Memphis, USM, Tulane and UCF does not fit the BE footprint. The same thing CUSA gets ridicule for is the same thing some of guys want for this conference and it just doesn't make sense.

And I hope by me saying this these schools don't think I'm hurting their chances of getting an BE invite. CUSA should had never went to 12 teams. Conference Championship games to me are way overrated and do more harm than good.

Again, USF is a stretch. ECU was right down the road. Marshall is in the general area. I don't know why Mike would want to go any further west than Louisville or any further south than North Carolina. Don't give me the market stuff either because schools like Auburn and Miss St seems to do well in their small towns. Yes they have history and tradition but they still play in small towns.

I think smarters head will prevail however. I would be really shoked if the BE went to 12 teams.

HiddenDragon Wrote:I chuckle when I read comments like "you know what you need to do to get invite" and "keep improving and you may eventually get a invite". Well, you guys got work to do to keep that status and it shouldn't be assumed in 4 years you'll still have it or the fact that maybe it will be full inclusion in the BCS for the other 5 conference or possibly no BCS at all.

Hey, I get just as big a laugh when C-USA fans immediately say they're better then the Big East when they haven't proven anything either. And how is it any different then C-USA fans telling Temple, or Louisiana Tech or North Texas or others what THEY have to do to join C-USA? It's not like you guys don't have work to do. I the case of the Big East, the conference needs teams who are improving thus the reason for Big East fans saying what those schools need to do to get in. You can chuckle all you want, the bottomline is that the Big East is a BCS conference and the smart thing is to act like a BCS conference. If people want to "chuckle" at the Big East and their fans for acting like that, tough, they'll have to live with it. But don't whine to Big East fans when they act like a BCS conference, because they are. Heck, you assume that bad thing can happen in 4 years, 4 years from now the Big East could have 2 Top 10 programs or 3 or 4 Top 25 programs, who knows.

HiddenDragon Wrote:Again, USF is a stretch. ECU was right down the road. Marshall is in the general area. I don't know why Mike would want to go any further west than Louisville or any further south than North Carolina. Don't give me the market stuff either because schools like Auburn and Miss St seems to do well in their small towns. Yes they have history and tradition but they still play in small towns.

Auburn and Mississippi State aren't the only ones in that market. Alabama and Ole Miss are also in that area, along with Arkansas. Market was obviously an issue, didn't you read the BCS' statement when talking about conferences having BCS access a few weeks ago? Market size was one of the issues.

I think market size only becomes an issue in the case of an appeal. The 1st 3 criteria have to do with rankings of the individual teams and of the conference on average. Some people think the appeal based on market size was added to aid the BE. That may be true. However, the B10 would also need that stipulation if last year's rankings are an indication.

Sometimes, when looking for good football teams, market size can be a liability. It seems to me that the colleges in the smaller markets are the ones who tend to have better attendance and more traveling fans.

JIM15068 Wrote:Sometimes, when looking for good football teams, market size can be a liability. It seems to me that the colleges in the smaller markets are the ones who tend to have better attendance and more traveling fans.

On the other hand though, a team like Rutgers with all of the people in the NY CSMA and Philly CSMA surrounding it, has a couple good seasons would draw very large crowds with an expansion to the stadium to about 60,000.