Jackson, I would think ND would want to play all the BE schools. USF offers an opportunity to play in front of recruits. The other BE schools offer quality opponents & fertile recruiting areas to showcase ND's football team.

When I look at the BE in it's current form, I think that there is no way for it to stay together. Then when I think about the BE splitting, it appears as if it will be almost impossible to make all the members happy. Do you think the BE Commish has what it takes to put together a split?

Quote:Jackson, I would think ND would want to play all the BE schools. USF offers an opportunity to play in front of recruits. The other BE schools offer quality opponents & fertile recruiting areas to showcase ND's football team.

-- Brick City...you are not taking into account NDs holier then thou attitude....there is no way USF with its lack of football history/success will be playing the Irish in football....The Irish feel that playing the Bulls ( and many others) is beneth them...

Quote:Then when I think about the BE splitting, it appears as if it will be almost impossible to make all the members happy. Do you think the BE Commish has what it takes to put together a split?

--Well considering a lot of members aren't happy now...I don't think a split is going to make them more distraught....everyone one this board knows why the football schools are unhappy...but again...let's look at this from St Johns angle...do you think there fans really care about playing USF, West Virginia, Rutgers in basketball? Especially when you consider playing those three may prevent games against old rivals Seton Hall or Georgetown....the 16 game league is going to be a mess with old rivals seeing less and less of each other because of the increased number of conference members...and again....that is not taking into account the major problems that are already rising on the football side

-- Tranghese has said that he will resign if a split occurs.....the real question is do the football presidents have what it takes to put together a split?


Jackson

Jackson, I found an old article discussing Notre Dame. The Irish certainly have benefited from being a member of the BE. I'm sure the status quo suits them fine.

It probably doesn't mean anything, but Gene Corrigan has been on the ECU payroll. He was hired a couple of years ago to do some trouble shooting for ECU.


<a href='http://www.bonesville.net/Articles/OtherArticles/AP/051703_Irish_Ponder_Expansion.htm' target='_blank'>http://www.bonesville.net/Articles/OtherAr...r_Expansion.htm</a>

You're missing my point. The fact that Notre Dame even has to resort to this tells me that things are leaning towards a split. Prior to conference expansion the Big East came close to agreeing to play a partial schedule against the Big East since the Big East was seriously considering splitting, but that fell apart after Boston College left. Now, all of a sudden, Notre Dame wants to play a partial schedule again after rumors of unrest among the Big East football schools and the talk of the Gator Bowl leaving? That tells me that Notre Dame knows they're losing their grip on the 16 team conference and the possibility of a split is around the corner. Just my opinion.

Well Cat, it is no secret that ECU wants to be part of the BE. If a split occurs, it should increase ECU's chances. Like it or not, ND has some mystic influence that the average fan doesn't understand. As the article I linked shows, ND has really benefited from partial BE membership. I would think that the unknown a split would cause, has ND really worried. I just hope that most of the posters on this board are correct that a split date was decided before the 16 team setup was agreed upon.

Brick City Pirate Wrote:Well Cat, it is no secret that ECU wants to be part of the BE. If a split occurs, it should increase ECU's chances. Like it or not, ND has some mystic influence that the average fan doesn't understand. As the article I linked shows, ND has really benefited from partial BE membership. I would think that the unknown a split would cause, has ND really worried. I just hope that most of the posters on this board are correct that a split date was decided before the 16 team setup was agreed upon.

I agree. I guess Notre Dame feels that keeping their traditional basketball rivals and the rest of the schools benefit them. Also, with the 16 team conference together, they have better control over the situation. The best for everybody would be a split, the 8 football schools going their separate way, scooping up East Carolina and Memphis and going to 10, allowing Notre Dame to join in All-Sports except football, where they would play a partial schedule, convince Navy to come on in football-only, and there you go you have enough teams for a championship game without going to 12 officially and still leave room for Penn State to join down the road and Notre Dame to join full-time. Win-win for everybody. All it would take is for Notre Dame to see this and push for the split with the football schools.

Quote:As the article I linked shows, ND has really benefited from partial BE membership. I would think that the unknown a split would cause, has ND really worried. I just hope that most of the posters on this board are correct that a split date was decided before the 16 team setup was agreed upon.

-- Brick City...personally I think ND has exactly what they want in the post split BE....they have Catholic schools, Depaul and Marquette, and a ton of schools in regions that are heavy with there alums....they also have a home for there bball and olympic sports without any pressure to join for football

-- If one looks closer...there really isn't anything specatular with the 3 game announcment...One of the three is going to be against Pitt everyear...ND has almost always played 2 BE games yearly so that's no extrodinary either....really....the only news to come out of this is ND wanting to play in the meadowland against Navy or a BE foe on a yearly basis...as I said above this move seems to reaffirm NDs indpendence rather then being a first step towards conference membership

Quote:allowing Notre Dame to join in All-Sports except football, where they would play a partial schedule, convince Navy to come on in football-only, and there you go you have enough teams for a championship game without going to 12

-- Personally...what I would like to see happen is just the additons of Memphis and ECU and then stopping...if that comes to pass we are gong to have brand new league that is going to have form a brand new identity....the most important thing that needs to be accomplished is to establish a league format/memberhsip that is going to be in place for the longhaul...I'm not sure thats possible with football only members and partial schedules....an all sports league is the only answer


Jackson

I just don't see 12 teams as being viable, even after a split.

9 or 10 teams tops, imho.

From the BE boards:

Quote:Kevin White stated yesterday that he would love to see Notre Dame play Miami, Florida State, and the University of Florida in either Orlando or Jacksonville.&nbsp; Playing these schools at their home locations would not generate as much money as would playing the Irish in at a neutral site in the State of Florida.&nbsp; NBC executives have stated that these schools would reap greater financial benifits from a primetime match up with the Irish in Orlando or Jacksonville. The University of Florida already plays their annual game against the University of Georgia in Jacksonville.&nbsp; Some officials from the University of Florida, the University of Miami, and Florida State have expressed playing the Irish in either Orlando or Tampa rather than Jacksonville since Jacksonville will be the host of the ACC Championship Game and host of the world’s largest cocktail party.&nbsp; As White put it, “it would be great for our program, and would feature a mini-bowl game between two great football programs.&nbsp; We are also looking at playing LSU or another school in New Orleans, Northwestern, Illinois, or another mid-western school in Chicago, a Big East match up in New York, and a Big 12 or even a Conference USA match up in Dallas."&nbsp; White has stated publicly that the Irish will play three Big East teams a year once the 12 game season schedule is set.&nbsp; “We look to continue our long relationship with West Virginia, Pittsburg, Syracuse, and the Big East Conference in the near future.

in the "near" future.

What about the "far" future?

That seems like codewords for "we'll play a few Big East schools for a couple of years". The near future.

As for ND playing USF to get in front of recruits? Come on, that's why the play FLORIDA in Florida. Or Florida St. Or Miami. Not USF. Agree with the poster who says ND think USF is barely worthy of licking their boots.

As for Cincy, yes, we have tons of ND fans here too. And they would stuff PBS to see a ND vs Cincy game. But I don't think it'll happen. ND thinks that Cincy is not good enough to play them either.

Jackson, you mention that the BE post split will need to establish an identity. One good thing about adding ECU & Memphis is there is an already established rivalry with many of the current & future BE schools. Memphis/ECU/Cincy/Louisville/USF have had some memorable games in both football & basketball over the years. ECU has been letting WVU set rushing records against us for the past several years. ECU has also had games against Syracuse & Pitt. ECU even beat Rutgers a few years ago in basketball. All of these schools are already very familar with one another. It will not take long for some heated rivalries to occur.

Quote:a Big East match up in New York

I assume he means Jersey, unless we'll be playing at the Bills stadium. Of course the new Manhattan stadium would work too. Which might be built by the time they actually start playing 3 Big East teams a year, if it gets built at all.

Quote:Jackson, you mention that the BE post split will need to establish an identity. One good thing about adding ECU & Memphis is there is an already established rivalry with many of the current & future BE schools. Memphis/ECU/Cincy/Louisville/USF have had some memorable games in both football & basketball over the years. ECU has been letting WVU set rushing records against us for the past several years. ECU has also had games against Syracuse & Pitt. ECU even beat Rutgers a few years ago in basketball. All of these schools are already very familar with one another. It will not take long for some heated rivalries to occur.

-- That's true...ECU and Memphis do have ties already to the BE football schools...but I think it will take some time to get the Pirate and Tiger fans used to trips up north every year....I think it will also take some time for the northern schools to get used to the idea that NY, PA and New England will no longer be the heart/center of the conference...if the new leauge forms the new center will be in the Ohio Valley

-- Speaking of this new identity....I think it would be very wise to have UC/UL/Pitt/WVU to meet twice a year in basketball as long as we are in the 16 team league....the sooner those 4 schools gell together and see each other has rivals in every sport the better.


Jackson

Jackson1011 Wrote:-- Speaking of this new identity....I think it would be very wise to have UC/UL/Pitt/WVU to meet twice a year in basketball as long as we are in the 16 team league....the sooner those 4 schools gell together and see each other has rivals in every sport the better.


Jackson

If in fact the new bball schedule will consist of 3 mirror games, I'd agree that UL/Pitt/WVU would be a good choice for UC. Although somehow I think Depaul might replace Pitt or WVU.

Quote:If in fact the new bball schedule will consist of 3 mirror games, I'd agree that UL/Pitt/WVU would be a good choice for UC. Although somehow I think Depaul might replace Pitt or WVU.

-- Oh it won't happen...WVU basketball is not seen as being attractive enough by the BE office...MT and the other officials would see it as a waste to have WVU play two games against pitt, UC and UL....The Mountianeers will be playing home and homes with schools that are seen as being equally worthless...probably USF, Rutgers and either St Johns or Providence


-- I'm just saying that it would make sense for the future to have those 4 play as much as possible now

Jackson

Jackson1011 Wrote:

Quote:If in fact the new bball schedule will consist of 3 mirror games, I'd agree that UL/Pitt/WVU would be a good choice for UC. Although somehow I think Depaul might replace Pitt or WVU.

-- Oh it won't happen...WVU basketball is not seen as being attractive enough by the BE office...MT and the other officials would see it as a waste to have WVU play two games against pitt, UC and UL....The Mountianeers will be playing home and homes with schools that are seen as being equally worthless...probably USF, Rutgers and either St Johns or Providence


-- I'm just saying that it would make sense for the future to have those 4 play as much as possible now

Jackson

You're probably right about MT's vision of WVU....

If it were my choice I would form the teams into four divisions of four based on all sports or non-allsports:

Emerald Division
Connecticut
Rutgers
South Florida
Syracuse

Amethyst Division
Cincinnati
Louisville
Pitt
West Virginia

Zircon Division
Providence
Seton Hall
St John's
Villanova

Pyrite Division
DePaul
Georgetown
Marquette
Notre Dame

But I'm sure that would never happen because it would only further the togetherness and comradery of the All Sports schools, and the isolation of the bb schools.

Why would you put UCONN and CUSE in the same division as RU and USF? No way two of the best will want to be in the league with two of the worst.

SF Husky Wrote:Why would you put UCONN and CUSE in the same division as RU and USF? No way two of the best will want to be in the league with two of the worst.

Well, it evens out the division a bit, doesn't it?

I mean, you could put Rutgers, SF, Providence and St John's together I guess.

The point is that I was trying to segregate the football and non-football schools from each other. It makes no sense to have different rivalries in basketball than in football.

But...You could try this setup:

Northwest Division
DePaul
Marquette
Notre Dame
Syracuse

Southwest Division
Cincinnati
Louisville
Pitt
West Virginia

Northeast Division
Connecticut
Providence
Seton Hall
St Johns

Southeast Division
Georgetown
Rutgers
South Florida
Villanova

or perhaps this way?

The Good Division
Cincinnati
Connecticut
DePaul
Georgetown
Louisville
Marquette
Notre Dame
Pitt
Syracuse
Villanova
West Virginia

The Sucka$$ Division
Providence
Rutgers
Seton Hall
South Florida
St Johns

The Sucka$$ Division plays each other as much as they want. Who cares? And are not invited to the Big East tournament.

The Good Division plays each other once every third year and during leap years.

The point is that somebody's gonna have to be in a division with these guys.