I'm going to start this, and I may regret it. What is your stance on it? Topics include:

-Religion as a force for good or bad
-... in politics
-... in world affairs
-... in the lives of everyday people, and how far it should govern them.
-... in response to the receding trends of the newer generations, i.e. Less and less young people associate with any faith and more older generations are claiming lack of any faith

Try to keep it civilized.

(03-12-2012 06:04 PM)Kruciff Wrote:  I'm going to start this, and I may regret it. What is your stance on it? Topics include:

-Religion as a force for good or bad
-... in politics
-... in world affairs
-... in the lives of everyday people, and how far it should govern them.
-... in response to the receding trends of the newer generations, i.e. Less and less young people associate with any faith and more older generations are claiming lack of any faith

Try to keep it civilized.

I'm going to be generic as possible...

Politics: bad
World Affairs: bad
in lives of everyday events n so on: good
religion going away: good and bad

Personally I think religion is a good thing. It develops a road map on how we should live our basic lives and creates morals. Over the past 40 years, morals has been disappearing and we're seeing more and more teen pregnancies and other things. I can see how a simple thing like waiting till your married to have sex is a great thing. Where I don't like religion is when politicians let their religion affect the way they govern. Religion-other than women- has been the root cause of the majority of the wars throughout history.

(03-12-2012 06:25 PM)ClairtonPanther Wrote:  I'm going to be generic as possible...

Politics: bad
World Affairs: bad
in lives of everyday events n so on: good
religion going away: good and bad

Personally I think religion is a good thing. It develops a road map on how we should live our basic lives and creates morals. Over the past 40 years, morals has been disappearing and we're seeing more and more teen pregnancies and other things. I can see how a simple thing like waiting till your married to have sex is a great thing. Where I don't like religion is when politicians let their religion affect the way they govern. Religion-other than women- has been the root cause of the majority of the wars throughout history.

Aha! Playing devil's advocate here, do you imply that religion is the foundation of morality? Without religion can one not be moral? I propose the following scenarios: Considering that Christianity, the assumed case of religion in this case, did not arise to prominence until the latter portion of the roman empire, what of the civilizations that existed before them? Were they all immoral pigs? The Chinese, Japanese, Zoraostrinists (sp?), Greek, Native Americans, Aztecs, Mayans, Saxons, Africans (and their many sects), etc...

Mayhaps the advent of loser morals, in comparison to previous years of stricter family values, is a result of a faster paced world, wherein the average family is significantly more busy and more involved in their life (work, school, hobby) and simply does not place as much emphasis on family values for lack of time / energy? This result is a direct correlation of the information era, I believe, of the late 80's / 90's / 2000's / to today.

Naw, I'm not saying that the Greeks, and the so called Pagans(Celtics, Saxons, and Vikings) was immoral pigs at all. I'm pretty sure their society's had such things as family values and general unwritten laws that everyone followed.

But you do bring up a fair point about families having less time to raise their kids due to both parents working compared to 40 years ago when only 1 parent was needed to supply income for a family.

Religion is a fine thing - taken in moderation...

Religion, like everything else, has more to do with the individual people involved and the leaders of the group. I've seen atheists/agnostics with good morals and some with with bad morals. Ive seen devout Catholics with good morals and some with bad morals. I've seen religious Baptists with good morals and some with bad morals. The same for Muslims, Methodists, Lutherans, Presbyterians, Taoists, Buddhists, etc.

Basically, people will believe what they want to believe and justify things if they want to. The truly moral person will usually have higher standards for himself and, though he may not be able to attain them, he keeps trying. The immoral person may have high standards, just for everyone else; or he may have no standards, to which he lives up to on a regular basis.

If people are truly interested in this topic, there is a wonderful (if rather one-sided, at no fault to the organizers) debate on the argument of religion (in this case the catholic church, specifically) as a force for good in the world.

If you have the time to watch them all, please do.

part 1




part 2




part 3




part 4




part 5




All told, it is ~45 minutes long

I'd like to hear the opinions of the people who actually watched them

When I think back on all the bad the Catholic Church is responsible for, the first thing that comes to my mind is the Crusades. The Church subjugated half the known world, killed the other half, and destroyed the accumulated knowledge in the world by burning all the great libraries of the world, because they disputed the word of God (or so they said)...

That threw civilization backward 1000 years, and who knows what knowledge was lost forever. It also gave rise to the Dark Ages, where death and disease ran rampant for 1000 years...

The Spanish Inquisition comes to mind too. Over 700 years of torturing anyone who disagreed with the church tends to remain in the memory of man...

The child molestation cases that started cropping up in the church in the 1970s, when people finally stopped closing their eyes to what the church was doing to their children comes to mind as well. The church's response - moving the guilty priests to a new, unsuspecting parish - was a real Godly move too...

Don't give me any of that about the church being a force for good. The church still has centuries of misery to attone for...

(03-13-2012 09:35 AM)bitcruncher Wrote:  When I think back on all the bad the Catholic Church is responsible for, the first thing that comes to my mind is the Crusades. The Church subjugated half the known world, killed the other half, and destroyed the accumulated knowledge in the world by burning all the great libraries of the world, because they disputed the word of God (or so they said)...

That threw civilization backward 1000 years, and who knows what knowledge was lost forever. It also gave rise to the Dark Ages, where death and disease ran rampant for 1000 years...

The Spanish Inquisition comes to mind too. Over 700 years of torturing anyone who disagreed with the church tends to remain in the memory of man...

The child molestation cases that started cropping up in the church in the 1970s, when people finally stopped closing their eyes to what the church was doing to their children comes to mind as well. The church's response - moving the guilty priests to a new, unsuspecting parish - was a real Godly move too...

Don't give me any of that about the church being a force for good. The church still has centuries of misery to attone for...

Kinda makes you wonder what that makes modern christianity when it's source was so corrupt...

IMO the church is a group that wants to control the thoughts and lives of mankind, and the predicted holy war to come is to determine which group of holier than thou control freaks end up in charge...

Religion can be used for justification of actions and ideas that people will follow with blind faith, pun intended. This is why I see the use of religion in politics as dangerous and typically exploitive. Unfortunately, American politics are full of this.

Individually, if someone needs religion to be a better person, then I am all for it.

That depends on whether they're really a better person, or just giving lip service to it, while maintaining a false face...

(03-14-2012 07:47 PM)bitcruncher Wrote:  That depends on whether they're really a better person, or just giving lip service to it, while maintaining a false face...

i became an agnostic when one night after saying my prayers i thought, "this is a chore." and i didn't feel bad. if i ever become religious again, i've decided that i will become a follower of the Bahá'í Faith. this is what i've thought all along. since every religion is basically the same, certain disciples were dispatched throughout the world to spread the word of god. but then again, i ain't religious.

my buddy and i went to the Bahá'í temple in chicago just to sight see. we were en route to milwaukee to go on a bender. this was a few months ago. and i was very intrigued.

What is religion? (serious question)

How you define it (and everybody defines it differently) makes all the difference in answering the question.

(03-22-2012 12:12 PM)johnnylightnin Wrote:  What is religion? (serious question)

How you define it (and everybody defines it differently) makes all the difference in answering the question.

a collective with shared beliefs who listen to a man once a week and the rest of the week forget about that one day of the week until they're forced to attend to that nuisance that is sunday. at least that's how i perceive it. at least that's the commercialized attempt i've gathered.

Why is the only religion being discussed when there are thousands of religions? Quite honestly, my first post was more of a generalization on all religions rather than just Christianity. Hence the reason why I stopped posting here.

(03-22-2012 02:09 PM)ClairtonPanther Wrote:  Why is the only religion being discussed when there are thousands of religions? Quite honestly, my first post was more of a generalization on all religions rather than just Christianity. Hence the reason why I stopped posting here.

It's because people are unable to step outside their small circle of experience, Joey, unless they've been exposed to the world. The vast majority of humanity has not had such exposure. Therefore their focus is extremely narrow...

(03-22-2012 02:09 PM)ClairtonPanther Wrote:  Why is the only religion being discussed when there are thousands of religions? Quite honestly, my first post was more of a generalization on all religions rather than just Christianity. Hence the reason why I stopped posting here.

man, you're right. sorry. a collective who share the same beliefs. some listen to a man preach once a week. some listen to their hearts, everyday.







all the others are going to hell.

(03-22-2012 02:36 PM)Lush Wrote:  

(03-22-2012 02:09 PM)ClairtonPanther Wrote:  Why is the only religion being discussed when there are thousands of religions? Quite honestly, my first post was more of a generalization on all religions rather than just Christianity. Hence the reason why I stopped posting here.

man, you're right. sorry. a collective who share the same beliefs. some listen to a man preach once a week. some listen to their hearts, everyday.







all the others are going to hell.

LMFAO...

You're onto something.

(03-12-2012 06:36 PM)Kruciff Wrote:  

(03-12-2012 06:25 PM)ClairtonPanther Wrote:  I'm going to be generic as possible...

Politics: bad
World Affairs: bad
in lives of everyday events n so on: good
religion going away: good and bad

Personally I think religion is a good thing. It develops a road map on how we should live our basic lives and creates morals. Over the past 40 years, morals has been disappearing and we're seeing more and more teen pregnancies and other things. I can see how a simple thing like waiting till your married to have sex is a great thing. Where I don't like religion is when politicians let their religion affect the way they govern. Religion-other than women- has been the root cause of the majority of the wars throughout history.

Aha! Playing devil's advocate here, do you imply that religion is the foundation of morality? Without religion can one not be moral? I propose the following scenarios: Considering that Christianity, the assumed case of religion in this case, did not arise to prominence until the latter portion of the roman empire, what of the civilizations that existed before them? Were they all immoral pigs? The Chinese, Japanese, Zoraostrinists (sp?), Greek, Native Americans, Aztecs, Mayans, Saxons, Africans (and their many sects), etc...

Mayhaps the advent of loser morals, in comparison to previous years of stricter family values, is a result of a faster paced world, wherein the average family is significantly more busy and more involved in their life (work, school, hobby) and simply does not place as much emphasis on family values for lack of time / energy? This result is a direct correlation of the information era, I believe, of the late 80's / 90's / 2000's / to today.

playing a BIGGER devil's advocate here.
Religion is man's attempt to define God. Christianity is the ONLY belief system, where God defines who HE is to us. In that sense, Christianity is not a religion.