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Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
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KnightLight Offline
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Post: #61
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-30-2012 11:56 AM)SMUstang Wrote:  It doesn't really matter what we think on this message board. What matters is what the school presidents, AD's, and the conference commissioner thinks.

True...but even this poll of message board users seems to be that of the same of those in the Big East (i.e. they went after Air Force well before even considering Fresno St).

Both could be fine additions to the conf, but one would most likely help bring much larger TV revenue than the other.
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2012 11:59 AM by KnightLight.)
03-30-2012 11:58 AM
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SoCalValleyDog Offline
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Post: #62
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-27-2012 09:45 AM)monty Wrote:  AFA won't change with a step-up, they'll be a consistent 7 game winner and fade at the end of the year (more so with better teams with more funding).

Fresno since Sweeney has been a solid winning program, a step-up will do wonders for them, the Central Valley is a huge area and there's good talent to be mined there; AFA is just another school surrounding denver and there is not a lot of D1 talent in Denver.

Fresno and SDSU stepping up a level will put a dent in tweener areas like Sacramento and Southern Orange County that are equidistant between the Pac and new Big East

Fresno offer the most upside and over the last 30 years has already done as much as AFA - so, Fresno

Just a quick correction. I agree with the rest of your post, btw.

1922: 6-1-3
1923: 7-2-0
1924: 7-2-0
1926: 5-3-1
1930: 8-0-0
1933: 5-4-0
1934: 7-2-1
1935: 6-3-0
1936: 5-3-1
1937: 8-1-1
1938: 7-3-0
1939: 10-1-0
1940: 9-2-1
1941: 4-3-2
1942: 9-1-0
1943: No team
1946: 8-4-0
1952: 8-2-0
1954: 7-3-0
1955: 9-1-0
1956: 8-2-0
1959: 7-3-0
1960: 9-1-0
1961: 10-0-0
1962: 7-3-0
1965: 6-4-0
1966: 7-3-0
1968: 7-4-0
1969: 6-4-0
1970: 8-4-0
1971: 6-5-0
1972: 6-4-1
1976: Sweeney era begins
03-30-2012 03:38 PM
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The Brown Bull Offline
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Post: #63
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
So is it settled yet?
03-30-2012 03:47 PM
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TrojanCampaign Offline
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Post: #64
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-30-2012 11:56 AM)SMUstang Wrote:  It doesn't really matter what we think on this message board. What matters is what the school presidents, AD's, and the conference commissioner thinks. And the Big East has already approached the AFA once. Probably because of the matchup with Navy and the more national audience.

Very true however, you must consider when Air Force was approached. You guys offered Army, Navy, and Air Force all at once and were pretty much turned down by all three of them and got a "solid verbal" from Navy later on. This was a time when the Big East was quickly losing credibility and just about every team was pretty much begging to get out.

I think the Big East made the moves it should have after but you have to be realistic on the Air Force thing. Sure, they would complement Navy and give the two an in conference objective to beat each other. But, like I mentioned earlier in 20 years the population in the Fresno/Valley area may have increased by 500,000+ people and there probably will be 1-10 more high schools playing football and supplying recruits.

If you think my theory about this is wrong look no further than the Pac-12. Back in the day USC, UCLA, and Washington cherry picked their California recruits. Cal and Stanford would land some good guys every now and then. But after that the California talent was....

Now pretty much every Pac-12, MWC, and anyone next to Texas gets a good bit of their recruits from California. Fresno is eventually going to start landing those local 4 star guys and Air Force is still going to be running kinky offenses. It's not ideal for right now and Technically you can wait because Fresno isn't going anywhere but Air Force is never going to have the talent to compete with top 25 teams week to week. Sure they will get upsets every now and then but that's not a great way to remain part of the big six.
03-30-2012 06:10 PM
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KnightLight Offline
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Post: #65
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-30-2012 06:10 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  It's not ideal for right now and Technically you can wait because Fresno isn't going anywhere but Air Force is never going to have the talent to compete with top 25 teams week to week. Sure they will get upsets every now and then but that's not a great way to remain part of the big six.

I think you are slightly confused.

Since when has the Big East had Top 25 teams "week to week to week?"

Did you mean Air Force couldn't compete in the SEC?

I might agree with ya there...but we are talking about the Big East...a good conf...but one that has never had many and lately, barely ANY teams in most Top 25 polls.
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2012 06:28 PM by KnightLight.)
03-30-2012 06:27 PM
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fresnostatebulldogfan Offline
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Post: #66
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-30-2012 06:27 PM)KnightLight Wrote:  
(03-30-2012 06:10 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  It's not ideal for right now and Technically you can wait because Fresno isn't going anywhere but Air Force is never going to have the talent to compete with top 25 teams week to week. Sure they will get upsets every now and then but that's not a great way to remain part of the big six.

I think you are slightly confused.

Since when has the Big East had Top 25 teams "week to week to week?"

Did you mean Air Force couldn't compete in the SEC?

I might agree with ya there...but we are talking about the Big East...a good conf...but one that has never had many and lately, barely ANY teams in most Top 25 polls.

This is exactly why Boise is being added to give this conference some credibility after losing all the more successful teams to the ACC and Big 12.

There seem to be discussion on two different levels. Some are talking National Recognization or TV dollars... in other words what a team would bring as far as money or potential TV deal and some that are making a point by saying what team would be a better add to the long term success of the BE and it's credibility as an AQ conference or powerhouse while attracting some moderate money (initially).

Initially I think if you go short term TV money then AF would be the add but like I have said before people will watch success more than demographics or popularity. Take Boise... Boise is located in Nowhere USA really not much there but potatoe farmers, and some cattle but due to their success they have a national following. AFA will have some national following just how much is yet to be determined. I think Navy and Army out draw them on that one. AFA, Army and Navy wont be successful wins for this conference long term. It appears that BE is more interested in doing less.

If BE wants to put creditiblity back into the BE as a deserved AQ conference than it has to have a potential team like Fresno State that is located in a Urban City and has a hell lot more potential in winning and recruiting than AFA. Fresno State can be as popular not only California but the Nation if it should become the next Boise.

AFA and Navy will never be able to recruit players to be the next boise and their football is frankly boring! They will be limited to fans of that specific team and most likely just focus on a couple of games. Nobody wants to see a service academy get their Arses handed to them should that gap increase.
03-30-2012 07:32 PM
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Gray Avenger Offline
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Post: #67
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-30-2012 07:32 PM)fresnostatebulldogfan Wrote:  AFA and Navy will never be able to recruit players to be the next boise and their football is frankly boring!

Not boring to me - in fact, I like option offenses better than the current spread fad. I particularly hate offenses in which every play is run from a shotgun formation.
03-30-2012 08:17 PM
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fresnostatebulldogfan Offline
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Post: #68
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-30-2012 08:17 PM)Gray Avenger Wrote:  
(03-30-2012 07:32 PM)fresnostatebulldogfan Wrote:  AFA and Navy will never be able to recruit players to be the next boise and their football is frankly boring!

Not boring to me - in fact, I like option offenses better than the current spread fad. I particularly hate offenses in which every play is run from a shotgun formation.

I think that the majority football fans would disagree with you... that's why you dont see triple options in the NFL and most colleges have learned that option is boring and slow.
03-30-2012 08:28 PM
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The Brown Bull Offline
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Post: #69
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-30-2012 06:10 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  Very true however, you must consider when Air Force was approached. You guys offered Army, Navy, and Air Force all at once and were pretty much turned down by all three of them and got a "solid verbal" from Navy later on. This was a time when the Big East was quickly losing credibility and just about every team was pretty much begging to get out.

That seems like a little revisionist history there. Both Navy and AFA were on board with coming to the Big East prior to Pitt and SU announcing their move to the ACC.

Then they both backed off saying they would have to wait and see how things played out.

Then in October the AFA AD basically said they were joining the BE. Then in December, his boss, overruled him and said no we are staying in the MWC. Navy still joining had been made pretty clear since October and it was officially announced in late january.

Army said no from the outset, but there was hopes that AFA and Navy would be able to persuade them otherwise.

I haven't seen one report where it was said Navy turned the Big East down when they were offered.
03-30-2012 09:03 PM
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The Brown Bull Offline
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Post: #70
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
AFA and Navy will not be the next Boise....not because of their offenses....but because of their millitary commitment and what joining the Millitary Academies means versus commiting to Boise.

I would add....a lot of kids on BSU roster probably don't have the grades to get into Army, Navy of AFA.
03-30-2012 09:06 PM
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BSUTOP25 Offline
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Post: #71
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
Why does it have to be one or the other? Let's take both. With a Big East schedule, Fresno's attendance will be greater than 40k per game.
03-30-2012 09:32 PM
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fresnostatebulldogfan Offline
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Post: #72
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-30-2012 09:32 PM)BSUTOP25 Wrote:  Why does it have to be one or the other? Let's take both. With a Big East schedule, Fresno's attendance will be greater than 40k per game.

If two schools were to be added right away I would say those are the two that would be good additions.
03-31-2012 12:51 AM
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KnightLight Offline
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Post: #73
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-30-2012 07:32 PM)fresnostatebulldogfan Wrote:  
(03-30-2012 06:27 PM)KnightLight Wrote:  
(03-30-2012 06:10 PM)TrojanCampaign Wrote:  It's not ideal for right now and Technically you can wait because Fresno isn't going anywhere but Air Force is never going to have the talent to compete with top 25 teams week to week. Sure they will get upsets every now and then but that's not a great way to remain part of the big six.

I think you are slightly confused.

Since when has the Big East had Top 25 teams "week to week to week?"

Did you mean Air Force couldn't compete in the SEC?

I might agree with ya there...but we are talking about the Big East...a good conf...but one that has never had many and lately, barely ANY teams in most Top 25 polls.

This is exactly why Boise is being added to give this conference some credibility after losing all the more successful teams to the ACC and Big 12.

Huh?

Syracuse hasn't finished a season ranked in any Top 25 poll since 2001.

Pitt hasn't finished a season ranked in the Top 10 since 1982 and has finished ranked in both Top 25 polls just twice over the last 22 years.

It's pretty obvious by some of your statements that you haven't followed much in regards to Big East Football over the past few years.
03-31-2012 07:22 AM
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KnightLight Offline
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Post: #74
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-30-2012 08:17 PM)Gray Avenger Wrote:  
(03-30-2012 07:32 PM)fresnostatebulldogfan Wrote:  AFA and Navy will never be able to recruit players to be the next boise and their football is frankly boring!

Not boring to me - in fact, I like option offenses better than the current spread fad. I particularly hate offenses in which every play is run from a shotgun formation.

Agree.

Seems that the Fresno fan is upset that the Big East Presidents and now fans on this board voted to invite AF first over Fresno.

I enjoy watching AF & Navy play because they are DIFFERENT and use DIFFERENT styles of play vs "most other teams"...plus, add in the factor that the young men playing for the academy teams are the future leaders of the nation's military, it just makes it extra special to watch them perform.
03-31-2012 07:25 AM
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fresnostatebulldogfan Offline
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Post: #75
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-31-2012 07:25 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  
(03-30-2012 08:17 PM)Gray Avenger Wrote:  
(03-30-2012 07:32 PM)fresnostatebulldogfan Wrote:  AFA and Navy will never be able to recruit players to be the next boise and their football is frankly boring!

Not boring to me - in fact, I like option offenses better than the current spread fad. I particularly hate offenses in which every play is run from a shotgun formation.

Agree.

Seems that the Fresno fan is upset that the Big East Presidents and now fans on this board voted to invite AF first over Fresno.

I enjoy watching AF & Navy play because they are DIFFERENT and use DIFFERENT styles of play vs "most other teams"...plus, add in the factor that the young men playing for the academy teams are the future leaders of the nation's military, it just makes it extra special to watch them perform.

how did you come up with the idea that I was "upset"? That's not the case, just discussing a topic like most other people on this board but if you need to think I am upset in order to somehow make you feel superior? ok... I get that!
03-31-2012 10:23 AM
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BigEastHomer Offline
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Post: #76
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
Watching this old clip of 10th ranked Penn State versus 9th ranked Houston circa 1977, has me ready to see some more option football. At the time, UH had built its national reputation by running the Veer option. It's amazing how much our identity has changed, since the Jack Pardee Run and Shoot years. Having Air Force in the conference would bring some compelling stylistic matchups.





Quote:Tenth-ranked Penn State began its 1977 season with a home date against No. 9 Houston. The Nittany Lions were lead by eventual All-American quarterback Chuck Fusina, and would finish the year 11-1. Penn State won this game 31-14, holding off strong efforts by the dynamic Cougars offense
03-31-2012 10:49 AM
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Ring of Black Offline
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Post: #77
RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-30-2012 03:47 PM)The Brown Bull Wrote:  So is it settled yet?

Well, at this point, it seems as if the voters have settled it - Air Force by a 2.5:1 ratio over Fresno State.
03-31-2012 11:39 AM
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Ring of Black Offline
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RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-27-2012 10:32 AM)goodknightfl Wrote:  
(03-27-2012 07:23 AM)TOGC Wrote:  BYU

This

As long as "this" is a realistic possibility, than "this" is what "this" is 03-lmfao
03-31-2012 11:42 AM
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dogman144 Offline
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RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-31-2012 10:23 AM)fresnostatebulldogfan Wrote:  
(03-31-2012 07:25 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  
(03-30-2012 08:17 PM)Gray Avenger Wrote:  
(03-30-2012 07:32 PM)fresnostatebulldogfan Wrote:  AFA and Navy will never be able to recruit players to be the next boise and their football is frankly boring!

Not boring to me - in fact, I like option offenses better than the current spread fad. I particularly hate offenses in which every play is run from a shotgun formation.

Agree.

Seems that the Fresno fan is upset that the Big East Presidents and now fans on this board voted to invite AF first over Fresno.

I enjoy watching AF & Navy play because they are DIFFERENT and use DIFFERENT styles of play vs "most other teams"...plus, add in the factor that the young men playing for the academy teams are the future leaders of the nation's military, it just makes it extra special to watch them perform.

how did you come up with the idea that I was "upset"? That's not the case, just discussing a topic like most other people on this board but if you need to think I am upset in order to somehow make you feel superior? ok... I get that!

Bulldogfan it is starting to feel that the fans here are somewhat similar to the fans of the PAC12,mainly UCLA fans. They have that elitest attitude that we don't belong, but if you look at the record that our Dogs have against the old Big East they shouldn't be talking. What are we 2-1 in the last 5 years. You and I both know that we could hang with them and more so than not beat them. They will learn real fast with Boise in there what we already know. BSU will kill there A***, SDSU I am sure they (Big East) will have there way with them. ASSTICKS are no better than the UC schools attitude wise, and except for the last 2 years are as good as WAshington State which sucks....Let them do what they want I have know problem with AFA they are a decent team. The Bulldogs though in the long run as many people have said have more upside.
03-31-2012 12:24 PM
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fresnostatebulldogfan Offline
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RE: Settle this once and for All: Fresno or AFA
(03-31-2012 10:49 AM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  Watching this old clip of 10th ranked Penn State versus 9th ranked Houston circa 1977, has me ready to see some more option football. At the time, UH had built its national reputation by running the Veer option. It's amazing how much our identity has changed, since the Jack Pardee Run and Shoot years. Having Air Force in the conference would bring some compelling stylistic matchups.



Quote:Tenth-ranked Penn State began its 1977 season with a home date against No. 9 Houston. The Nittany Lions were lead by eventual All-American quarterback Chuck Fusina, and would finish the year 11-1. Penn State won this game 31-14, holding off strong efforts by the dynamic Cougars offense
Here's a game from 2005 against #1 USC at USC where we took over 20K fans to USC stadium we ended up losing 42-50 but USC had Reggie Bush won the Hiesmen Trophy what some say because of the game against Fresno State. USC had all 4-5 star recruits where we had 2-3 stars at best.





(This post was last modified: 03-31-2012 01:04 PM by fresnostatebulldogfan.)
03-31-2012 01:00 PM
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