you are not thinking about the whole picture here. not saying that memphis wouldn't leave anyways, but once you lose your BCS status (if that happens), then you are almost leveling the playing fields in terms of finances VS. Conf. USA. The BCS is basically what is seperating the two conferences right now in terms of finances.

Funny how everyone keeps running over here saying the Big East will lose their BCS bid. You mean, the way the Big East lost it a few months ago? As far as the BCS status being the difference between the finanances of the Big East, and C-USA. compare the Big East's basketball package to C-USA's. I'm willing to bet the Big East's is bigger.

Cat's Claw, I believe these the comments are "if" the BE loses it BCS status. It's not a certainty anymore since it's contigent on keeping a team in the Top 12 for the next 4 years (calculations could be off a little). Yes you still have it for now but it could change down the line. Which is why I said that the BE can't continue to feed off CUSA teams to maintain that status. And it is contradictary to add CUSA teams but not think CUSA isn't BCS worthy. That is why I said that if that continues to happen then the BCS committee has to look at either making CUSA a BCS conference or ask themselves is the BE still BCS worthy with the potential of having 5 former CUSA teams in their conference.

Memphis is a national name basketball wise but football doesn't carry that same clout. If it did, Memphis would have been added instead of USF. Louisville and Cincy were the centerpiece of CUSA as well but CUSA will survive them leaving. It will survive Memphis leaving as well. But I would bet CUSA is more prepared to handle Memphis leaving than the BE would be if Syracuse, Pitt or West Virginia left. Not that it's going to happen but would this conference still be BCS worthy if any of those teams left?

Yes the only difference between the New BE, CUSA and MWC is the BCS status. But that is a huge difference and one that I'm sure the BE will do everything within its powers to hang onto.

"Memphis is a national name basketball wise but football doesn't carry that same clout. If it did, Memphis would have been added instead of USF. Louisville and Cincy were the centerpiece of CUSA as well but CUSA will survive them leaving. "


--CUSA really did the smart thing...they expanded west and away for the Big East....so whatever happens with the BE split...CUSA is still going to have at least 8 schools....The only problem with that strategy is that it is basically two leauges in one.....IF Memphis were to leave at the end of the decade....I could see a huge battle coming about who woul be the 12th team to replace them...who would it be?? New Mexico? North Texas? The eastern schools will be more angery about that then they will be with UTEP this time around....I don't think an East/West split is impossible....its probably unlikely....but not impossible


Jackson

I would say the next school to be invited to CUSA if anyone else left would be La Tech. If two left then add North Texas. If three left then add (IMHO) Troy.

Matter of fact, I think Troy is a hidden gem. What they lack in location they make up for it in everything else. They have always had good football teams and their basketball team has performed very well and even made the Dance two years ago and was close to that achievement again this year.

HiddenDragon Wrote:Cat's Claw, I believe these the comments are "if" the BE loses it BCS status. It's not a certainty anymore since it's contigent on keeping a team in the Top 12 for the next 4 years (calculations could be off a little). Yes you still have it for now but it could change down the line. Which is why I said that the BE can't continue to feed off CUSA teams to maintain that status. And it is contradictary to add CUSA teams but not think CUSA isn't BCS worthy. That is why I said that if that continues to happen then the BCS committee has to look at either making CUSA a BCS conference or ask themselves is the BE still BCS worthy with the potential of having 5 former CUSA teams in their conference.

Yes the only difference between the New BE, CUSA and MWC is the BCS status. But that is a huge difference and one that I'm sure the BE will do everything within its powers to hang onto.

Hidden Dragon, Master of Delusion

The New BE is much better than the CUSA fundamentally. The NBE went out and expanded for Football with the second Division 1-A school in New England (UConn), the very powerful second Division 1-A school from Kentucky(Louisville), the second largest Division 1-A school from Ohio (Cinncinati), and a school from the second largest market in Florida (South Florida). Then the cut the weakest program in the Big East (Temple) which was the third Division 1-A program in Pennsylvannia after Pitt and Penn State.

In case you haven't noticed, in most states of regular size there is two BCS programs.... IowaSt/Iowa,OrgeonSt/Oregon...... Pitt/PennSt. Then having Louisville/Kentucky, and Cinncinati/OhioSt fits that profile. UConn is the only BCS program in Connecuit. Then South Florida is like a TCU, the biggest program in a very large market.

CUSA's expansion is leftover heavy. Marshall is the second school in West Virginia, but that state is too small for two BCS programs. UCF is in a medium sized market with Orlando. UTEP another medium sized market. Those are your better additions. SMU is a second tier program in the Dallas/FTWorth area, and Rice is second tier Houston.

Comparing the NBE, MWC, CUSA, and MAC top to bottom:

NBE:
Syracuse-First Tier NY State
UConn-First Tier Conn.
Rutgers-First Tier New Jersey
WestVA-Fist Tier West Virginia
Pitt-Second Tier Pennsylvania
Cinncy-Second Tier Ohio
Louisville-Second Tier Kentucky
South Florida-First Tier Tampa Market

MWC:
BYU-First Tier Utah
New Mexico-First Tier New Mexico
Wyoming-First Tier Wyoming
UNLV-First Tier Nevada
Utah-Second Tier Utah
ColoradoSt-Second Tier Colorado
Air Force-Service Academy
TCU-First Tier Dallas/Ft Worth Market
SDSU-First Tier SanDiego Market

CUSA:
Memphis-Second Tier Tennesse
Tulane-Second Tier Louisana
Marshall-Second Tier West Virginia
Southern Miss-Third Tier Mississippi
East Carolina-Third Tier North Carolina
UAB-Third Tier Alabama
Tulsa-Third Tier Oklahoma
Houston-First Tier Houston Market
SMU-Second Tier Dallas/FtWorth Market
Rice-Second Tier Houston Market
UCF-Medium Size Market
UTEP-Medium Size Market

MAC:
Northern Ill-Third Tier Illinios
BallSt-Third Tier Indiana
WMU-Third Tier Michigan
CMU-Third Tier Michigan
Bowling Green-Third Tier Ohio
Ohio-Third Tier Ohio
Kent St-First Tier Cleveland/Akron Market
EMU-Second Tier Detroit Market
MiamiU-Second Tier Cinncinatti/Dayton Market
Buffalo-Medium Size Market
Toledo-Medium Size Market
Akron-Medium Size Market


The Big East and the MWC look almost identical with first/second tier programs and I could see the MWC as just as deserving as the Big East to having a BCS bid. But CUSA? CUSA looks just slightly better than the MAC. The only thing CUSA has over the MAC is Memphis. Move them to the Big East and the best bowl of CUSA is the GMAC which is MAC vs. CUSA.

"would say the next school to be invited to CUSA if anyone else left would be La Tech. If two left then add North Texas. If three left then add (IMHO) Troy."



--I forget about La Tech....why weren't they added this past yr...I think they make a lot more sense geographically then UTEP does


Jackson

Jackson1011 Wrote:--I forget about La Tech....why weren't they added this past yr...I think they make a lot more sense geographically then UTEP does


Jackson

Because geography is about where the positives end.

Jackson1011 Wrote:The eastern schools will be more angery about that then they will be with UTEP this time around....I don't think an East/West split is impossible....its probably unlikely....but not impossible

Believe it or not, but the eastern schools were the main proponents of UTEP. The western schools favored Louisiana Tech.

Tech's biggest drawbacks are their small market, bad men's basketball, mediocre football, bad facilities, and poor fan support in northern Louisiana. Compare that to UTEP who has a medium sized market, decent to good men's basketball, bad football (but they do have M. Price now), good facilities, and excellent fan support.

Kit-Cat Wrote:

HiddenDragon Wrote:Cat's Claw, I believe these the comments are "if" the BE loses it BCS status.  It's not a certainty anymore since it's contigent on keeping a team in the Top 12 for the next 4 years (calculations could be off a little).  Yes you still have it for now but it could change down the line.  Which is why I said that the BE can't continue to feed off CUSA teams to maintain that status.  And it is contradictary to add CUSA teams but not think CUSA isn't BCS worthy.  That is why I said that if that continues to happen then the BCS committee has to look at either making CUSA a BCS conference or ask themselves is the BE still BCS worthy with the potential of having 5 former CUSA teams in their conference. 

Yes the only difference between the New BE, CUSA and MWC is the BCS status.  But that is a huge difference and one that I'm sure the BE will do everything within its powers to hang onto.

Hidden Dragon, Master of Delusion

The New BE is much better than the CUSA fundamentally. The NBE went out and expanded for Football with the second Division 1-A school in New England (UConn), the very powerful second Division 1-A school from Kentucky(Louisville), the second largest Division 1-A school from Ohio (Cinncinati), and a school from the second largest market in Florida (South Florida). Then the cut the weakest program in the Big East (Temple) which was the third Division 1-A program in Pennsylvannia after Pitt and Penn State.

In case you haven't noticed, in most states of regular size there is two BCS programs.... IowaSt/Iowa,OrgeonSt/Oregon...... Pitt/PennSt. Then having Louisville/Kentucky, and Cinncinati/OhioSt fits that profile. UConn is the only BCS program in Connecuit. Then South Florida is like a TCU, the biggest program in a very large market.

CUSA's expansion is leftover heavy. Marshall is the second school in West Virginia, but that state is too small for two BCS programs. UCF is in a medium sized market with Orlando. UTEP another medium sized market. Those are your better additions. SMU is a second tier program in the Dallas/FTWorth area, and Rice is second tier Houston.

Comparing the NBE, MWC, CUSA, and MAC top to bottom:

NBE:
Syracuse-First Tier NY State
UConn-First Tier Conn.
Rutgers-First Tier New Jersey
WestVA-Fist Tier West Virginia
Pitt-Second Tier Pennsylvania
Cinncy-Second Tier Ohio
Louisville-Second Tier Kentucky
South Florida-First Tier Tampa Market

MWC:
BYU-First Tier Utah
New Mexico-First Tier New Mexico
Wyoming-First Tier Wyoming
UNLV-First Tier Nevada
Utah-Second Tier Utah
ColoradoSt-Second Tier Colorado
Air Force-Service Academy
TCU-First Tier Dallas/Ft Worth Market
SDSU-First Tier SanDiego Market

CUSA:
Memphis-Second Tier Tennesse
Tulane-Second Tier Louisana
Marshall-Second Tier West Virginia
Southern Miss-Third Tier Mississippi
East Carolina-Third Tier North Carolina
UAB-Third Tier Alabama
Tulsa-Third Tier Oklahoma
Houston-First Tier Houston Market
SMU-Second Tier Dallas/FtWorth Market
Rice-Second Tier Houston Market
UCF-Medium Size Market
UTEP-Medium Size Market

MAC:
Northern Ill-Third Tier Illinios
BallSt-Third Tier Indiana
WMU-Third Tier Michigan
CMU-Third Tier Michigan
Bowling Green-Third Tier Ohio
Ohio-Third Tier Ohio
Kent St-First Tier Cleveland/Akron Market
EMU-Second Tier Detroit Market
MiamiU-Second Tier Cinncinatti/Dayton Market
Buffalo-Medium Size Market
Toledo-Medium Size Market
Akron-Medium Size Market


The Big East and the MWC look almost identical with first/second tier programs and I could see the MWC as just as deserving as the Big East to having a BCS bid. But CUSA? CUSA looks just slightly better than the MAC. The only thing CUSA has over the MAC is Memphis. Move them to the Big East and the best bowl of CUSA is the GMAC which is MAC vs. CUSA.

Kit-Cat what were you responding too? Certainly not my post. Your rant with comparing schools were boring, slanted and insignificant at best. I didn't say CUSA was better than the NBE.

READ THIS COMMENT: THE BE CANT CONTINUE TO FEED OFF CUSA SCHOOLS AND STILL CONSIDER THEMSELVES BCS WORTHY.

Call me delusional all you want, come up with stats about the BE that make you feel secure about your conference all you want. But the truth is the truth. The BE future is just slightly more secured than CUSA. While we talk about what teams the BE can take from CUSA you may should be worry about what teams the Big 10+1 can take from the BE. Or what the SEC or ACC can get from the BE. Because if a scenario ever took place where Syracuse, Pitt or West Virginia left for stronger BCS conferences the BE is done.

Enjoy what you got because it could be gone before you know it.

HiddenDragon Wrote:But the truth is the truth.  The BE future is just slightly more secured than CUSA.....Enjoy what you got because it could be gone before you know it.

The truth is the new CUSA will be crappy, while the new Big East will get through these adjustments, and then thrive.

Dragon, I got one simple question for you:
We all know why UofL, Cinci, and USF left CUSA, but why do you think TCU decided to leave afterwards? (answer: because they know what the future of CUSA will be).

"We all know why UofL, Cinci, and USF left CUSA, but why do you think TCU decided to leave afterwards? (answer: because they know what the future of CUSA will be). "


-- I have to agree with Cardhouse here...before TCU left...didn't they go to Memphis officials and asked the Tigers to gurantee they would not leave CUSA to join the BE football schools at the end of the decade...and when Memphis could not make that promise....TCU left


Jackson

and because cardhouse says C-USA is a crappy conference now, its fact...i'm gonna go home and cry now. :bang:

Jackson1011 Wrote:-- I have to agree with Cardhouse here...before TCU left...didn't they go to Memphis officials and asked the Tigers to gurantee they would not leave CUSA to join the BE football schools at the end of the decade...and when Memphis could not make that promise....TCU left

Yup...TCU's AD asked RJ Johnson (Memphis's AD) if Memphis would guarantee that it would stay in CUSA if the BE splits. RJ said he couldn't promise that and TCU said "See Ya!"

CardHouse Wrote:

HiddenDragon Wrote:But the truth is the truth.  The BE future is just slightly more secured than CUSA.....Enjoy what you got because it could be gone before you know it.

The truth is the new CUSA will be crappy, while the new Big East will get through these adjustments, and then thrive.

Dragon, I got one simple question for you:
We all know why UofL, Cinci, and USF left CUSA, but why do you think TCU decided to leave afterwards? (answer: because they know what the future of CUSA will be).

I'm sure TCU left because they felted it was in their best interest to do so. And I believe contrary to what was reported they wanted nothing to do with SMU. Whether or not Memphis couldn't promise TCU they would stay in CUSA I think was a small factor in their decision to leave if any.

My question to you is how you know the New CUSA will be crappy and the New BE will make adjustments and thrive? Did you guys get this from Miss Cleo? Truth is no one knows the future of anything.

I've said all along what separates the new BE, CUSA and MWC is simply BCS status. And that is huge. But IMO that status doesn't secure your future and it will not stop other BCS conferences from coming in to invite teams from your league if they expand or wanted to replace current teams from their conference. But it's good to have BCS status regardless and I'm sure Tran will do his best to ensure the BE keeps it.

I can make statements about your conference without all the slanted talk and name calling. This is what I know to be true:

The New BE is inferior (football wise) to the Old BE. The New CUSA is inferior (basketball wise) to the Old CUSA. And the New BE has BCS inclusion while the New CUSA and MWC don't. Other than that, everything else is just speculation.

Quote:The New BE is inferior (football wise) to the Old BE. The New CUSA is inferior (basketball wise) to the Old CUSA. And the New BE has BCS inclusion while the New CUSA and MWC don't. Other than that, everything else is just speculation.

That is very true dragon...also...NC-USA has a great chance to become a great conference...right now i can say for sure it is better than the WAC, Sun Belt, MAC...and i would say it is between us and MWC for #1 non-BCS...but as far as basketball goes...with Memphis, UAB, Tulsa, and UTEP...i would say C-USA is a better basketball conference than the Mount. West...Football...MWC wins...but...NC-USA has a very...VERY bright future...with or without Memphis.

Go Tigers!!!
Drew

HiddenDragon Wrote:

Kit-Cat Wrote:

HiddenDragon Wrote:Cat's Claw, I believe these the comments are "if" the BE loses it BCS status.  It's not a certainty anymore since it's contigent on keeping a team in the Top 12 for the next 4 years (calculations could be off a little).  Yes you still have it for now but it could change down the line.  Which is why I said that the BE can't continue to feed off CUSA teams to maintain that status.  And it is contradictary to add CUSA teams but not think CUSA isn't BCS worthy.  That is why I said that if that continues to happen then the BCS committee has to look at either making CUSA a BCS conference or ask themselves is the BE still BCS worthy with the potential of having 5 former CUSA teams in their conference. 

Yes the only difference between the New BE, CUSA and MWC is the BCS status.  But that is a huge difference and one that I'm sure the BE will do everything within its powers to hang onto.

Hidden Dragon, Master of Delusion

The New BE is much better than the CUSA fundamentally. The NBE went out and expanded for Football with the second Division 1-A school in New England (UConn), the very powerful second Division 1-A school from Kentucky(Louisville), the second largest Division 1-A school from Ohio (Cinncinati), and a school from the second largest market in Florida (South Florida). Then the cut the weakest program in the Big East (Temple) which was the third Division 1-A program in Pennsylvannia after Pitt and Penn State.

In case you haven't noticed, in most states of regular size there is two BCS programs.... IowaSt/Iowa,OrgeonSt/Oregon...... Pitt/PennSt. Then having Louisville/Kentucky, and Cinncinati/OhioSt fits that profile. UConn is the only BCS program in Connecuit. Then South Florida is like a TCU, the biggest program in a very large market.

CUSA's expansion is leftover heavy. Marshall is the second school in West Virginia, but that state is too small for two BCS programs. UCF is in a medium sized market with Orlando. UTEP another medium sized market. Those are your better additions. SMU is a second tier program in the Dallas/FTWorth area, and Rice is second tier Houston.

Comparing the NBE, MWC, CUSA, and MAC top to bottom:

NBE:
Syracuse-First Tier NY State
UConn-First Tier Conn.
Rutgers-First Tier New Jersey
WestVA-Fist Tier West Virginia
Pitt-Second Tier Pennsylvania
Cinncy-Second Tier Ohio
Louisville-Second Tier Kentucky
South Florida-First Tier Tampa Market

MWC:
BYU-First Tier Utah
New Mexico-First Tier New Mexico
Wyoming-First Tier Wyoming
UNLV-First Tier Nevada
Utah-Second Tier Utah
ColoradoSt-Second Tier Colorado
Air Force-Service Academy
TCU-First Tier Dallas/Ft Worth Market
SDSU-First Tier SanDiego Market

CUSA:
Memphis-Second Tier Tennesse
Tulane-Second Tier Louisana
Marshall-Second Tier West Virginia
Southern Miss-Third Tier Mississippi
East Carolina-Third Tier North Carolina
UAB-Third Tier Alabama
Tulsa-Third Tier Oklahoma
Houston-First Tier Houston Market
SMU-Second Tier Dallas/FtWorth Market
Rice-Second Tier Houston Market
UCF-Medium Size Market
UTEP-Medium Size Market

MAC:
Northern Ill-Third Tier Illinios
BallSt-Third Tier Indiana
WMU-Third Tier Michigan
CMU-Third Tier Michigan
Bowling Green-Third Tier Ohio
Ohio-Third Tier Ohio
Kent St-First Tier Cleveland/Akron Market
EMU-Second Tier Detroit Market
MiamiU-Second Tier Cinncinatti/Dayton Market
Buffalo-Medium Size Market
Toledo-Medium Size Market
Akron-Medium Size Market


The Big East and the MWC look almost identical with first/second tier programs and I could see the MWC as just as deserving as the Big East to having a BCS bid. But CUSA? CUSA looks just slightly better than the MAC. The only thing CUSA has over the MAC is Memphis. Move them to the Big East and the best bowl of CUSA is the GMAC which is MAC vs. CUSA.

Kit-Cat what were you responding too? Certainly not my post. Your rant with comparing schools were boring, slanted and insignificant at best. I didn't say CUSA was better than the NBE.

READ THIS COMMENT: THE BE CANT CONTINUE TO FEED OFF CUSA SCHOOLS AND STILL CONSIDER THEMSELVES BCS WORTHY.

Call me delusional all you want, come up with stats about the BE that make you feel secure about your conference all you want. But the truth is the truth. The BE future is just slightly more secured than CUSA. While we talk about what teams the BE can take from CUSA you may should be worry about what teams the Big 10+1 can take from the BE. Or what the SEC or ACC can get from the BE. Because if a scenario ever took place where Syracuse, Pitt or West Virginia left for stronger BCS conferences the BE is done.

Enjoy what you got because it could be gone before you know it.

kitkat is a mac fan, don't pay him/her no mind, she/he supports ohio university.

HiddenDragon Wrote:

CardHouse Wrote:

HiddenDragon Wrote:But the truth is the truth.  The BE future is just slightly more secured than CUSA.....Enjoy what you got because it could be gone before you know it.

The truth is the new CUSA will be crappy, while the new Big East will get through these adjustments, and then thrive.

Dragon, I got one simple question for you:
We all know why UofL, Cinci, and USF left CUSA, but why do you think TCU decided to leave afterwards? (answer: because they know what the future of CUSA will be).

My question to you is how you know the New CUSA will be crappy and the New BE will make adjustments and thrive? Did you guys get this from Miss Cleo? Truth is no one knows the future of anything.

......I can make statements about your conference without all the slanted talk and name calling.

Of course it's only my "opinion"; I thought you could figure that out.

Your "statements" are just a disguise to dog the Big East. When I'm on the CUSA boards, I show restraint and respect and don't give my "opinions". But when you come to a Big East board and degrade the new BE, then I will give you my opinion of the new CUSA:

The new CUSA will have the same problem it's always had, but even worse: Too much fat!

The current CUSA basketball was just starting to shake some of this image by sending 6 out of 14 teams to the NCAA's; the new CUSA basketball will be terrible when you take the conference as a whole.

For football, you are not replacing what is leaving, and now you will have a 12-team league with a few decent programs and also a whole bunch of fat tagging along year after year.

Just my opinion.