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Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
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Yoda Offline
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Post: #361
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
(12-27-2012 01:12 PM)SergiofromFresno Wrote:  I think you've really misjudged the attitude our Fanbase towards the Big East. Originally it was close to the UNLV/UNM "You'll Crawl back to us/Good Riddance" attitude, and it has steadily evolved towards the "I wouldn't mind it, as long as certain conditions are met(Western All Sports, +UNLV, Nice Bump in Money). You know as well as me that of we are the likeliest MW School to jump and join the Big East, and I do think this is what is going to happen in the next few weeks.

Here is one thread that was referring to the change in perception of the MW

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=164&f=1686&t=11100197

This Poll for example regarding FS to the Big East:
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=164&f=1686&t=11084154
Would have been somewhere between 10-15% in favor of a move a few months back is now at 40%. I think this trend will continue, and this disillusionment towards the percieved weakness of the Mountain West was amplified in the aftermath of the Hawaii Bowl and very well could continue. Next year the MWC will be weaker than ever, and the reality will begin to sink in to more and more members of our fanbase that the future is brighter East. Just take a random trifecta of Big East schools like UCF/Tulane/Temple have far more potential and promise than SJSU/Utah St/New Mexico. I think Fresno's interests are to align with the Big East.

I'm less sure that this is about what people want so much as it is a poll on which side is winning combined with wanting to be on the winning side.

Yoda out...
12-27-2012 01:20 PM
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SergiofromFresno Offline
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Post: #362
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
(12-27-2012 01:20 PM)Yoda Wrote:  
(12-27-2012 01:12 PM)SergiofromFresno Wrote:  I think you've really misjudged the attitude our Fanbase towards the Big East. Originally it was close to the UNLV/UNM "You'll Crawl back to us/Good Riddance" attitude, and it has steadily evolved towards the "I wouldn't mind it, as long as certain conditions are met(Western All Sports, +UNLV, Nice Bump in Money). You know as well as me that of we are the likeliest MW School to jump and join the Big East, and I do think this is what is going to happen in the next few weeks.

Here is one thread that was referring to the change in perception of the MW

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=164&f=1686&t=11100197

This Poll for example regarding FS to the Big East:
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=164&f=1686&t=11084154
Would have been somewhere between 10-15% in favor of a move a few months back is now at 40%. I think this trend will continue, and this disillusionment towards the percieved weakness of the Mountain West was amplified in the aftermath of the Hawaii Bowl and very well could continue. Next year the MWC will be weaker than ever, and the reality will begin to sink in to more and more members of our fanbase that the future is brighter East. Just take a random trifecta of Big East schools like UCF/Tulane/Temple have far more potential and promise than SJSU/Utah St/New Mexico. I think Fresno's interests are to align with the Big East.

I'm less sure that this is about what people want so much as it is a poll on which side is winning combined with wanting to be on the winning side.

Yoda out...

With what happened in 1998 and whats taking place right now with the seperation of the Big4 with the rest- can you really blame them? The Best Case Realistic scenario for us, is if A loaded MWC gets close to equal footing with a gutted ACC, and the 2 conferences get Tweener Status and tag along with the Big 4 if they do actually separate from the NCAA.
(This post was last modified: 12-27-2012 01:29 PM by SergiofromFresno.)
12-27-2012 01:27 PM
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CardFan1 Offline
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Post: #363
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
except the ACC won't get gutted. A basically 3 state conference like the Big 12 would get hit first by the PAC or SEC for the Texahoma group leaving a shell of wannabes outside of WVU which would also be taken in by SEC or ACC.
12-27-2012 01:44 PM
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SergiofromFresno Offline
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Post: #364
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
(12-27-2012 01:44 PM)CardFan1 Wrote:  except the ACC won't get gutted. A basically 3 state conference like the Big 12 would get hit first by the PAC or SEC for the Texahoma group leaving a shell of wannabes outside of WVU which would also be taken in by SEC or ACC.

If the B1G & SEC go to 16, the ACC will be the target. The Big 12 will take whatever is left. The ACC then would backfill with nBE schools.

SEC-NC St/VaTech
B1G-UVA/GaTech
B12-Miami, FSU.........
ACC-USF, UConn, Cincy, Temple
12-27-2012 01:49 PM
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CollegeCard Offline
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Post: #365
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
(12-26-2012 10:48 PM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:31 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 08:26 PM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 05:45 PM)CincyBro Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 03:51 PM)texasflood Wrote:  As i said, if we look at current success/status as a brand (say the past 25 or so years), Cincy is surely a top 30 program. Arguably closer to 20 than 30. That does stack up rather well. 04-cheers

I can agree with this.04-cheers

Top 25 in the Last 25 Years or so:

1. Duke
2. Kentucky
3. North Carolina
4. Kansas
5. Connecticut
6. Florida
7. Michigan State
8. Arizona
9. UCLA
10. Arkansas
11. Michigan
12. Indiana
13. Louisville
14. Syracuse
15. UNLV
16. Georgetown
17. Maryland
18. Villanova
19. Ohio State
20. Oklahoma
21. Butler
22. Georgia Tech
23. Oklahoma State
24. Memphis
25. LSU

Nova, LSU Gtech and no UC....lol sure

Yeah, I stretched the 25 years a little for Nova and Georgetown because the original post I was reacting to said "25 years or so." So, since 1984 (29 years):

As an aside, if you are taking it back to 1984 then UofL has a title in your timeframe, and I see no rational way of having schools such as Arkansas and Michigan ahead of Louisville. At that point what advantage would those other schools have over UofL? None that I can see.
12-27-2012 01:54 PM
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SleepingGiantsFan Offline
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Post: #366
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
(12-27-2012 01:12 PM)SergiofromFresno Wrote:  I think you've really misjudged the attitude our Fanbase towards the Big East. Originally it was close to the UNLV/UNM "You'll Crawl back to us/Good Riddance" attitude, and it has steadily evolved towards the "I wouldn't mind it, as long as certain conditions are met(Western All Sports, +UNLV, Nice Bump in Money). You know as well as me that of we are the likeliest MW School to jump and join the Big East, and I do think this is what is going to happen in the next few weeks.

Here is one thread that was referring to the change in perception of the MW

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=164&f=1686&t=11100197

This Poll for example regarding FS to the Big East:
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=164&f=1686&t=11084154

That poll is hilarious. As fangdog (one of the minority of Fresno fans with a 3-digit IQ) put it, most of votes must have come from guys who live under a park bench.
12-27-2012 03:37 PM
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Melky Cabrera Offline
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Post: #367
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
(12-27-2012 01:54 PM)CollegeCard Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:48 PM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:31 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 08:26 PM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 05:45 PM)CincyBro Wrote:  I can agree with this.04-cheers

Top 25 in the Last 25 Years or so:

1. Duke
2. Kentucky
3. North Carolina
4. Kansas
5. Connecticut
6. Florida
7. Michigan State
8. Arizona
9. UCLA
10. Arkansas
11. Michigan
12. Indiana
13. Louisville
14. Syracuse
15. UNLV
16. Georgetown
17. Maryland
18. Villanova
19. Ohio State
20. Oklahoma
21. Butler
22. Georgia Tech
23. Oklahoma State
24. Memphis
25. LSU

Nova, LSU Gtech and no UC....lol sure

Yeah, I stretched the 25 years a little for Nova and Georgetown because the original post I was reacting to said "25 years or so." So, since 1984 (29 years):

As an aside, if you are taking it back to 1984 then UofL has a title in your timeframe, and I see no rational way of having schools such as Arkansas and Michigan ahead of Louisville. At that point what advantage would those other schools have over UofL? None that I can see.

I saw Arkansas, Michigan, Indiana, and Louisville all pretty tightly bunched. I listed Arkansas and Michigan ahead of Louisville specifically becuas they established their bona fides during the 25 year time frame and Louisville after them because I had to stretch back beyond that to get to their best accomplishment.

Here's how those 3 schools compare when matched up side by side since 1984:

Louisville - 22 tournaments, 12 Sweet 16's, 6 Elite 8's, 3 FInal Fours, 1 NC
Arkansas - 18 tournaments, 6 Sweet 16's, 4 Elite 8's, 3 Final Fours, 1 NC
Michigan - 15 tournaments, 5 Sweet 16's, 4 Elite 8's, 3 Final Fours, 1 NC

You're absolutely right. When we look at the full 29 years, Louisville was easily the better program. When we look only at the 25 year time frame, all 3 programs lose 2 tournament appearances apiece, but Arkansas and Michigan lose nothing else. Louisville loses 2 Sweet 16's and 1 from each of the other categories, so their record now looks like this:

Louisville - 20 tournaments, 10 Sweet 16's, 5 Elite 8's, 2 Final Fours, 0 NC's

Significantly more tournament appearances and Sweet 16's and 1 more Elite 8, but one less FF and no championship. Louisville was the more consistent program, but the other 2 reached greater heights with the extra FF and NC. Both put together a lot of very good seasons if not as many as Louisville, so they weren't one year wonders a few times. Obviously my emphasis went in the direction of those who had reached the greater heights.

I admit that my priorities in the ranking of those 3 was fairly arbitrary, so I would have no argument with rearranging them. I saw them all as fairly close. Simply put, I thought that all 3 belonged somewhere in the 10-15 range in whatever order anyone wants to put them and clearly were not at the same level as the schools ahead of them.

Thanks for forcing me to rebook at them. You make a good point. If I were looking at them on a different day, I might have gone with a different order.
(This post was last modified: 12-27-2012 05:22 PM by Melky Cabrera.)
12-27-2012 05:19 PM
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Melky Cabrera Offline
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Post: #368
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
(12-26-2012 11:30 PM)bearcatlawjd Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:48 PM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:31 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 08:26 PM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 05:45 PM)CincyBro Wrote:  I can agree with this.04-cheers

Top 25 in the Last 25 Years or so:

1. Duke
2. Kentucky
3. North Carolina
4. Kansas
5. Connecticut
6. Florida
7. Michigan State
8. Arizona
9. UCLA
10. Arkansas
11. Michigan
12. Indiana
13. Louisville
14. Syracuse
15. UNLV
16. Georgetown
17. Maryland
18. Villanova
19. Ohio State
20. Oklahoma
21. Butler
22. Georgia Tech
23. Oklahoma State
24. Memphis
25. LSU

Nova, LSU Gtech and no UC....lol sure

Yeah, I stretched the 25 years a little for Nova and Georgetown because the original post I was reacting to said "25 years or so." So, since 1984 (29 years):

Cincinnati ---- 16 tournaments, 4 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 1 FF, 0 NC
Villanova ----- 17 tournaments, 5 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 2 FF, 1 NC
Georgetown -- 20 tournaments, 9 Sweet 16's, 6 Elite 8's, 3 FF, 1 NC
Georgia Tech - 15 tournaments, 6 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 2 FF, 0 NC

Where does Cincinnati have the edge over any of the 3 teams you're complaining about?

Let me throw out someone who didn't make my list:

Temple ------- 22 tournaments, 5 Sweet 16's, 5 Elite 8's, 0 FF, 0 NC

I had a very tough time leaving Temple off the list. Except for their 1 Final four, where does Cincinnati have any advantage over Temple? If you want to talk about body of work, Temple had 22 seasons in 29 years that were good enough to get them into the tournament and were ranked #1 for a good part of the year in at least one of those seasons. I'd say that's a pretty good body of work.

29 years is different from 25. If you start at the 1990's Cincinnati belongs in the top 25 easy. What schools had more conference championship than Cincinnati during that period. Cincinnati during its Great Midwest and C-USA days competed with Marquette, Memphis, Louisville (C-USA only), and out classed them all from 1992-2002. Check out the number of top 25 and 15 finishes for Cincinnati during that period too.

I would have put Temple on the list too because I value consistency.

I picked up on your sugestion and I looked back, starting in the 1990's and I agree that in that time frame Cincinnati belongs in the top 25. Here's my top 30 for 1990-2012:

1. Kentucky
2. North Carolina
3. Duke
4. UConn
5. Kansas
6. Michigan State
7. Florida
8. UCLA
9. Arizona
10. Arkansas
11. Syracuse
12. Louisville
13. Ohio State
14. Maryland
15. UNLV
16. Texas
17. Indiana
18. Oklahoma State
19. Memphis
20. Michigan
21. Wisconsin
22. Cincinnati
23. Butler
24. Georgia Tech
25. Oklahoma
26. Temple
27. Utah
28. Georgetown
29. West Virginia
30. Illinois
12-29-2012 01:00 AM
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CincyBro Offline
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Post: #369
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
(12-29-2012 01:00 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 11:30 PM)bearcatlawjd Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:48 PM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:31 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 08:26 PM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  Top 25 in the Last 25 Years or so:

1. Duke
2. Kentucky
3. North Carolina
4. Kansas
5. Connecticut
6. Florida
7. Michigan State
8. Arizona
9. UCLA
10. Arkansas
11. Michigan
12. Indiana
13. Louisville
14. Syracuse
15. UNLV
16. Georgetown
17. Maryland
18. Villanova
19. Ohio State
20. Oklahoma
21. Butler
22. Georgia Tech
23. Oklahoma State
24. Memphis
25. LSU

Nova, LSU Gtech and no UC....lol sure

Yeah, I stretched the 25 years a little for Nova and Georgetown because the original post I was reacting to said "25 years or so." So, since 1984 (29 years):

Cincinnati ---- 16 tournaments, 4 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 1 FF, 0 NC
Villanova ----- 17 tournaments, 5 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 2 FF, 1 NC
Georgetown -- 20 tournaments, 9 Sweet 16's, 6 Elite 8's, 3 FF, 1 NC
Georgia Tech - 15 tournaments, 6 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 2 FF, 0 NC

Where does Cincinnati have the edge over any of the 3 teams you're complaining about?

Let me throw out someone who didn't make my list:

Temple ------- 22 tournaments, 5 Sweet 16's, 5 Elite 8's, 0 FF, 0 NC

I had a very tough time leaving Temple off the list. Except for their 1 Final four, where does Cincinnati have any advantage over Temple? If you want to talk about body of work, Temple had 22 seasons in 29 years that were good enough to get them into the tournament and were ranked #1 for a good part of the year in at least one of those seasons. I'd say that's a pretty good body of work.

29 years is different from 25. If you start at the 1990's Cincinnati belongs in the top 25 easy. What schools had more conference championship than Cincinnati during that period. Cincinnati during its Great Midwest and C-USA days competed with Marquette, Memphis, Louisville (C-USA only), and out classed them all from 1992-2002. Check out the number of top 25 and 15 finishes for Cincinnati during that period too.

I would have put Temple on the list too because I value consistency.

I picked up on your sugestion and I looked back, starting in the 1990's and I agree that in that time frame Cincinnati belongs in the top 25. Here's my top 30 for 1990-2012:

1. Kentucky
2. North Carolina
3. Duke
4. UConn
5. Kansas
6. Michigan State
7. Florida
8. UCLA
9. Arizona
10. Arkansas
11. Syracuse
12. Louisville
13. Ohio State
14. Maryland
15. UNLV
16. Texas
17. Indiana
18. Oklahoma State
19. Memphis
20. Michigan
21. Wisconsin
22. Cincinnati
23. Butler
24. Georgia Tech
25. Oklahoma
26. Temple
27. Utah
28. Georgetown
29. West Virginia
30. Illinois
Your getting close Melky, nice to see someone take other opinions without getting all offensive, nice work.What about the Zags?
(This post was last modified: 12-29-2012 11:00 AM by CincyBro.)
12-29-2012 10:59 AM
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rosewater Offline
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Post: #370
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
(12-29-2012 10:59 AM)CincyBro Wrote:  
(12-29-2012 01:00 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 11:30 PM)bearcatlawjd Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:48 PM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:31 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  Nova, LSU Gtech and no UC....lol sure

Yeah, I stretched the 25 years a little for Nova and Georgetown because the original post I was reacting to said "25 years or so." So, since 1984 (29 years):

Cincinnati ---- 16 tournaments, 4 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 1 FF, 0 NC
Villanova ----- 17 tournaments, 5 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 2 FF, 1 NC
Georgetown -- 20 tournaments, 9 Sweet 16's, 6 Elite 8's, 3 FF, 1 NC
Georgia Tech - 15 tournaments, 6 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 2 FF, 0 NC

Where does Cincinnati have the edge over any of the 3 teams you're complaining about?

Let me throw out someone who didn't make my list:

Temple ------- 22 tournaments, 5 Sweet 16's, 5 Elite 8's, 0 FF, 0 NC

I had a very tough time leaving Temple off the list. Except for their 1 Final four, where does Cincinnati have any advantage over Temple? If you want to talk about body of work, Temple had 22 seasons in 29 years that were good enough to get them into the tournament and were ranked #1 for a good part of the year in at least one of those seasons. I'd say that's a pretty good body of work.

29 years is different from 25. If you start at the 1990's Cincinnati belongs in the top 25 easy. What schools had more conference championship than Cincinnati during that period. Cincinnati during its Great Midwest and C-USA days competed with Marquette, Memphis, Louisville (C-USA only), and out classed them all from 1992-2002. Check out the number of top 25 and 15 finishes for Cincinnati during that period too.

I would have put Temple on the list too because I value consistency.

I picked up on your sugestion and I looked back, starting in the 1990's and I agree that in that time frame Cincinnati belongs in the top 25. Here's my top 30 for 1990-2012:

1. Kentucky
2. North Carolina
3. Duke
4. UConn
5. Kansas
6. Michigan State
7. Florida
8. UCLA
9. Arizona
10. Arkansas
11. Syracuse
12. Louisville
13. Ohio State
14. Maryland
15. UNLV
16. Texas
17. Indiana
18. Oklahoma State
19. Memphis
20. Michigan
21. Wisconsin
22. Cincinnati
23. Butler
24. Georgia Tech
25. Oklahoma
26. Temple
27. Utah
28. Georgetown
29. West Virginia
30. Illinois
Your getting close Melky, nice to see someone take other opinions without getting all offensive, nice work.What about the Zags?

Why is Oklahoma State so high
12-29-2012 11:19 AM
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Melky Cabrera Offline
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Post: #371
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
(12-29-2012 10:59 AM)CincyBro Wrote:  
(12-29-2012 01:00 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 11:30 PM)bearcatlawjd Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:48 PM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:31 PM)Bearcats#1 Wrote:  Nova, LSU Gtech and no UC....lol sure

Yeah, I stretched the 25 years a little for Nova and Georgetown because the original post I was reacting to said "25 years or so." So, since 1984 (29 years):

Cincinnati ---- 16 tournaments, 4 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 1 FF, 0 NC
Villanova ----- 17 tournaments, 5 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 2 FF, 1 NC
Georgetown -- 20 tournaments, 9 Sweet 16's, 6 Elite 8's, 3 FF, 1 NC
Georgia Tech - 15 tournaments, 6 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 2 FF, 0 NC

Where does Cincinnati have the edge over any of the 3 teams you're complaining about?

Let me throw out someone who didn't make my list:

Temple ------- 22 tournaments, 5 Sweet 16's, 5 Elite 8's, 0 FF, 0 NC

I had a very tough time leaving Temple off the list. Except for their 1 Final four, where does Cincinnati have any advantage over Temple? If you want to talk about body of work, Temple had 22 seasons in 29 years that were good enough to get them into the tournament and were ranked #1 for a good part of the year in at least one of those seasons. I'd say that's a pretty good body of work.

29 years is different from 25. If you start at the 1990's Cincinnati belongs in the top 25 easy. What schools had more conference championship than Cincinnati during that period. Cincinnati during its Great Midwest and C-USA days competed with Marquette, Memphis, Louisville (C-USA only), and out classed them all from 1992-2002. Check out the number of top 25 and 15 finishes for Cincinnati during that period too.

I would have put Temple on the list too because I value consistency.

I picked up on your sugestion and I looked back, starting in the 1990's and I agree that in that time frame Cincinnati belongs in the top 25. Here's my top 30 for 1990-2012:

1. Kentucky
2. North Carolina
3. Duke
4. UConn
5. Kansas
6. Michigan State
7. Florida
8. UCLA
9. Arizona
10. Arkansas
11. Syracuse
12. Louisville
13. Ohio State
14. Maryland
15. UNLV
16. Texas
17. Indiana
18. Oklahoma State
19. Memphis
20. Michigan
21. Wisconsin
22. Cincinnati
23. Butler
24. Georgia Tech
25. Oklahoma
26. Temple
27. Utah
28. Georgetown
29. West Virginia
30. Illinois
Your getting close Melky, nice to see someone take other opinions without getting all offensive, nice work.What about the Zags?

Yeah, focusing on the 1990's and beyond highlights the Huggins era, which put Cincy back on the map. All of us have hard luck stories, but the #1 ranked Kenyon Martin team has to be one of the worst "breaks" a program could have. That team was expected to go all the way. Even if it was upset somewhere along the way. I'm sure it would have gone deep into the tournament. Such a run would certainly have changed the résumé and may have boosted the program enough that the future would have been even better than it was.

Zags are a great mid major story, but their best tournament finish was that Elite 8 in 1999. They've never matched that and everyone else on my list has accomplished more.
(This post was last modified: 12-29-2012 05:25 PM by Melky Cabrera.)
12-29-2012 11:45 AM
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Melky Cabrera Offline
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Post: #372
RE: Blaudschun: BIG EAST will make more moves after holidays
(12-29-2012 11:19 AM)rosewater Wrote:  
(12-29-2012 10:59 AM)CincyBro Wrote:  
(12-29-2012 01:00 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 11:30 PM)bearcatlawjd Wrote:  
(12-26-2012 10:48 PM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  Yeah, I stretched the 25 years a little for Nova and Georgetown because the original post I was reacting to said "25 years or so." So, since 1984 (29 years):

Cincinnati ---- 16 tournaments, 4 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 1 FF, 0 NC
Villanova ----- 17 tournaments, 5 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 2 FF, 1 NC
Georgetown -- 20 tournaments, 9 Sweet 16's, 6 Elite 8's, 3 FF, 1 NC
Georgia Tech - 15 tournaments, 6 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 2 FF, 0 NC

Where does Cincinnati have the edge over any of the 3 teams you're complaining about?

Let me throw out someone who didn't make my list:

Temple ------- 22 tournaments, 5 Sweet 16's, 5 Elite 8's, 0 FF, 0 NC

I had a very tough time leaving Temple off the list. Except for their 1 Final four, where does Cincinnati have any advantage over Temple? If you want to talk about body of work, Temple had 22 seasons in 29 years that were good enough to get them into the tournament and were ranked #1 for a good part of the year in at least one of those seasons. I'd say that's a pretty good body of work.

29 years is different from 25. If you start at the 1990's Cincinnati belongs in the top 25 easy. What schools had more conference championship than Cincinnati during that period. Cincinnati during its Great Midwest and C-USA days competed with Marquette, Memphis, Louisville (C-USA only), and out classed them all from 1992-2002. Check out the number of top 25 and 15 finishes for Cincinnati during that period too.

I would have put Temple on the list too because I value consistency.

I picked up on your sugestion and I looked back, starting in the 1990's and I agree that in that time frame Cincinnati belongs in the top 25. Here's my top 30 for 1990-2012:

1. Kentucky
2. North Carolina
3. Duke
4. UConn
5. Kansas
6. Michigan State
7. Florida
8. UCLA
9. Arizona
10. Arkansas
11. Syracuse
12. Louisville
13. Ohio State
14. Maryland
15. UNLV
16. Texas
17. Indiana
18. Oklahoma State
19. Memphis
20. Michigan
21. Wisconsin
22. Cincinnati
23. Butler
24. Georgia Tech
25. Oklahoma
26. Temple
27. Utah
28. Georgetown
29. West Virginia
30. Illinois
Your getting close Melky, nice to see someone take other opinions without getting all offensive, nice work.What about the Zags?

Why is Oklahoma State so high

Here is OK State's resume for the 23 years in question:

15 tournaments, 6 Sweet 16's, 3 Elite 8's, 2 Final Fours
(This post was last modified: 12-29-2012 11:49 AM by Melky Cabrera.)
12-29-2012 11:48 AM
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