... saying Wake might end Division 1 or FBS if it had to actually pay players.

BULLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLPUCKY.



I'd be ashamed to be on the side of the NCAA in perpetuating one of the biggest organized scams in non-governmental modern history.

If it is ruled that all players must be paid and be paid equally, then you'll see many teams leave D1. Yes, even teams like Wake.

(03-15-2013 04:49 PM)BeliefBlazer Wrote:  If it is ruled that all players must be paid and be paid equally, then you'll see many teams leave D1. Yes, even teams like Wake.

They'll institute a pay cap.

The people it would really ding would be non-revenue sports.

The kids are already getting a free ride through college that's WAY more than enough. The tuition at Syracuse is $39k a year.

(03-15-2013 05:22 PM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  The kids are already getting a free ride through college that's WAY more than enough. The tuition at Syracuse is $39k a year.

For the sake of simple math and to guarantee an underestimate ... we'll assume the total football scholarship players is 100 and the basketball scholarship players is 20.

Each school's share of TV revenue is $19m/year. That's before you talk about ticket sales, concessions, rebroadcast rights, radio rights, merchandise, parking, etc.

Just off TV rights ... those 120 scholarship players are generating $158,333/yr. Uh... yea.



And I'd argue it isn't enough. You get these players coming from DIRT POOR families and the NCAA prohibits even covering travel/lodging for their family to see them play? Or even some other huge perk to a poor family like good health insurance while they play?

Unpaid apprenticeships are still legal. I think college sports are similar. You get taught a skill and get free education as well.

(03-15-2013 05:26 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(03-15-2013 05:22 PM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  The kids are already getting a free ride through college that's WAY more than enough. The tuition at Syracuse is $39k a year.

For the sake of simple math and to guarantee an underestimate ... we'll assume the total football scholarship players is 100 and the basketball scholarship players is 20.

Each school's share of TV revenue is $19m/year. That's before you talk about ticket sales, concessions, rebroadcast rights, radio rights, merchandise, parking, etc.

Just off TV rights ... those 120 scholarship players are generating $158,333/yr. Uh... yea.



And I'd argue it isn't enough. You get these players coming from DIRT POOR families and the NCAA prohibits even covering travel/lodging for their family to see them play? Or even some other huge perk to a poor family like good health insurance while they play?

These kids get free rides through expensive universities. Many of these kids wouldn't qualify academically for these schools without their athletic abilities. They also get tutoring. Other kids who have enough money to get through college, and that have superior grades, get turned away to make room for the athletes. They are damn fortunate, and well rewarded for their abilities as is.

(03-15-2013 05:32 PM)4x4hokies Wrote:  Unpaid apprenticeships are still legal. I think college sports are similar. You get taught a skill and get free education as well.

That's a very good point as well.

Free tuition, free tutoring, free housing, free food, free clothes, free athletic training, free medical help, free exposure to potential future employers, preferential treatment when it comes to getting into high-demand classes and high-demand dormitories/apartments, private locker rooms, private workout rooms, private study rooms.

Need I go on?

(03-15-2013 05:26 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(03-15-2013 05:22 PM)OrangeCrush22 Wrote:  The kids are already getting a free ride through college that's WAY more than enough. The tuition at Syracuse is $39k a year.

For the sake of simple math and to guarantee an underestimate ... we'll assume the total football scholarship players is 100 and the basketball scholarship players is 20.

Each school's share of TV revenue is $19m/year. That's before you talk about ticket sales, concessions, rebroadcast rights, radio rights, merchandise, parking, etc.

Just off TV rights ... those 120 scholarship players are generating $158,333/yr. Uh... yea.



And I'd argue it isn't enough. You get these players coming from DIRT POOR families and the NCAA prohibits even covering travel/lodging for their family to see them play? Or even some other huge perk to a poor family like good health insurance while they play?

So the schools that can afford to pay - even with the salary cap you mention - will be the ones who are getting big-time TV revenue. The deck is already stacked against the schools that can't advance because their conferences get next to nothing compared to the tens of millions being raked in by schools in the elite conferences.

Louisville's fortunate to be included in the future ACC, but it's not so difficult to imagine that we might have been left behind while UConn got into the ACC. This, despite the fact that we're investing much, much more than some of the schools raking in the big TV bucks in the SEC. If schools are going to be able to pay their players, and it is expected that they pay them from their TV profits, then the schools that don't make the big TV profits won't be able to pay their players... either that or they'll have to choose between paying their players or maintaining or improving their facilities.

Or, God forbid, paying salaries to their athletes will mean less investment in the academic side of the equation.

Either way they're screwed, since they won't be able to recruit any of the better players, who will naturally go where they can be paid, or go where the facilities aren't falling apart.

The day Louisville starts paying its players salaries is the day I lose all interest in college sports.

Plus college grads earn 1-2 million more (lifetime) over non-college grads.

At minimum you should be able to extend travel and health care to the families. When you have people coming from dirt poor families and you're not allowed to help them in any way you're always going to have the tension to take gifts and go pro immediately.

(03-16-2013 01:26 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  At minimum you should be able to extend travel and health care to the families. When you have people coming from dirt poor families and you're not allowed to help them in any way you're always going to have the tension to take gifts and go pro immediately.

Giving the poor families' child a college education seems awfully generous to me. I'm spending about 20% of my yearly income putting my child through college. Actually I'm incurring home equity debt at a rate of about 20% of my yearly income to put her through school. Another 20% of my yearly income goes to medical costs. It is kind of hard for me to rationalize paying health care and travel expenses for family members of football players, much less paying them to play in college. Especially when many of them wouldn't otherwise qualify to attend that school.

(03-16-2013 01:26 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  At minimum you should be able to extend travel and health care to the families. When you have people coming from dirt poor families and you're not allowed to help them in any way you're always going to have the tension to take gifts and go pro immediately.

Obama has them covered now. Why would the schools pay for what the taxpayers already are?

IMO, providing health care (at the school's expense) for the immediate family of players is a humanitarian thing to do.
[Let him who is without health insurance cast the first stone]

Paying for travel to the games opens up a nasty can of worms, however, because it eliminates most of the built-in advantage of in-state recruiting if rich & powerful teams like Texas and Alabama can fly Johnny's family to every game...

(03-16-2013 02:42 PM)4x4hokies Wrote:  

(03-16-2013 01:26 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  At minimum you should be able to extend travel and health care to the families. When you have people coming from dirt poor families and you're not allowed to help them in any way you're always going to have the tension to take gifts and go pro immediately.

Obama has them covered now. Why would the schools pay for what the taxpayers already are?

Not here in NC. Our tea party General Assembly refused the medicare expansion.

(03-16-2013 01:56 PM)lazydawg58 Wrote:  Giving the poor families' child a college education seems awfully generous to me. I'm spending about 20% of my yearly income putting my child through college. Actually I'm incurring home equity debt at a rate of about 20% of my yearly income to put her through school. Another 20% of my yearly income goes to medical costs. It is kind of hard for me to rationalize paying health care and travel expenses for family members of football players, much less paying them to play in college. Especially when many of them wouldn't otherwise qualify to attend that school.

It is long term foolish to the NCAA to not do this to at least football, and likely football and basketball. If you don't ... then don't be surprised or shocked when NCAA football breeds the same one and done or straight to pro plague that NCAA basketball currently enjoys. You cannot expect a man coming from a DIRT POOR family to pass up a few million dollars to let his family remain dirt poor for several more years. It's okay that momma died because she couldn't afford that surgery, because I got a nicely framed piece of paper!

(03-16-2013 02:42 PM)4x4hokies Wrote:  Obama has them covered now. Why would the schools pay for what the taxpayers already are?

I cannot disagree with this enough. ObamaCare is appalling. And some states have rightfully stopped it dead in its tracks.

(03-17-2013 01:37 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(03-16-2013 01:56 PM)lazydawg58 Wrote:  Giving the poor families' child a college education seems awfully generous to me. I'm spending about 20% of my yearly income putting my child through college. Actually I'm incurring home equity debt at a rate of about 20% of my yearly income to put her through school. Another 20% of my yearly income goes to medical costs. It is kind of hard for me to rationalize paying health care and travel expenses for family members of football players, much less paying them to play in college. Especially when many of them wouldn't otherwise qualify to attend that school.

It is long term foolish to the NCAA to not do this to at least football, and likely football and basketball. If you don't ... then don't be surprised or shocked when NCAA football breeds the same one and done or straight to pro plague that NCAA basketball currently enjoys. You cannot expect a man coming from a DIRT POOR family to pass up a few million dollars to let his family remain dirt poor for several more years. It's okay that momma died because she couldn't afford that surgery, because I got a nicely framed piece of paper!

(03-16-2013 02:42 PM)4x4hokies Wrote:  Obama has them covered now. Why would the schools pay for what the taxpayers already are?

I cannot disagree with this enough. ObamaCare is appalling. And some states have rightfully stopped it dead in its tracks.

Yes North Carolina will definately be a better place by failing to provide 500,000 uninsured poor people medicare coverage. I'll just continue to pay higher hospital bills because I'm paying for my families bills and all the uninsured that show up at the emergency room because they can't afford to go to a doctor before their medical issues become so severe that they show up at the ER. And our rural hospitals that treat such large numbers of the uninsured poor will find it more and more difficult to stay out of the red, can't provide expanded services or employ additional workers etc. We can just do what we use to do, drive fifty miles to a hospital, or die on the way.

Yet you are the one bringing up momma dying because she can't afford the surgery because her athletic son doesn't get her health insurance from the college he attends? I don't get your thinking at all.

Sorry I got into politics on a sports board. But sometimes I can't help but respond when I see something like that. I'll shut up now.

Agree to strongly disagree. Start a thread in the Spin Room and I'd be happy to go into it further with you. Or better yet -- there's a thread already there about it.

I can get behind the 2k dollars of living expenses. If the student wants to spend that on rent, food, health insurance for his family, flying them to games, whatever then I'm ok w/ that.

I don't want to open a "traveling" can of worms. Are 50yd line tickets, first class flight, ritz carlton, limo at the airport, and room service comparable to bus fair, general admission, hotel 8,taxi fare, and vending machine money? The amounts could be very very different.