(03-29-2013 07:34 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 07:12 PM)AntiG Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 10:36 AM)CincyBro Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 10:27 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  The big east isn't dead. Quit saying rest in peace. It's like holding a funeral for a person going through a divorce.

Sorry RedMan, but to most your new conf. will not be THE BE, it will be the BE in name only. You can't replace Syracuse, UL,UConn,Pitt., UC,etc. with three mid majors and expect the same kind of reverance. At best your new league will be a 3 or 4 bid Conf., Xavier is sliding downhill, McDermott will leave for pros and Stevens to UCLA is heating up. This will be a G'Town, Marquette league and that is all.

Agreed. Outside of Georgetown and the Johnnies during the 90s (which I rooted for during the Artest and Barkley days), the traditional Big East was all about Syracuse, UConn, Pitt, and then later on after the ACC defections, Louisville, W Va, Marquette, ND and Cincy.

The new Big East will be a good basketball league, but the Big East as we know it is dead... cut in half with the "divorce" and the best programs in the league in basketball (Syracuse, UConn, Cincinnati, Louisville, Pittsburgh, Notre Dame, West Va) are gone, and the notable football programs that really rounded out the conference (Miami, BC, Louisville, Syracuse, Virginia Tech, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, West Va, Rutgers) are gone. Its not the Big East that was up there in the college all-sports landscape with the big boys that developed over the past 2 and a half decades.

That's why I said Rest in Peace, Big East.

You can say what ever you want but it doesn't make you right. WVU had a nice ru towards the end but was mostly fodder during their tenure. Notre Dame never made a conference final, Cincy wasn't that good, my johnnies during our decade of mediocrity had a winning record against them, Pitt constantly underperformed in the NCAA, UofL was in the league for only 7 years. So we really only lost one true blue big east power.

You also left out Villanova. The C7 has had 3 final fours in the last ten years. Marquette is about to get to another. Throw in butlers 2 and that's 5 from this group.

Yeah, keep wishing that we died because were that good. Keep discrediting us brcayse you're all scared. I would be too! This league is dangerous. Watch out kids.

LOL I'm not "wishing" that you died, its just a fact. The Big East as we all knew it will be dead after this tournament.

After that is a split of Big East powers, after the defections of a bunch of the best and most influential programs that the conference had.

You guys are starting anew and I wish you luck. I certainly have no complaints, my Scarlet Knights are now part of the richest, most influential conference in college sports.

But as someone that grew up with Big East basketball AND football, its a sad day to see it end like this, no matter how you want to spin it because to me, the Big East was all about Syracuse, Miami, Va Tech, Rutgers, St. Johns, UConn, Louisville, Cincinnati, Georgetown, and yes throw in Nova which I accidentally left out. RIP

(03-29-2013 07:12 PM)AntiG Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 10:36 AM)CincyBro Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 10:27 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  The big east isn't dead. Quit saying rest in peace. It's like holding a funeral for a person going through a divorce.

Sorry RedMan, but to most your new conf. will not be THE BE, it will be the BE in name only. You can't replace Syracuse, UL,UConn,Pitt., UC,etc. with three mid majors and expect the same kind of reverance. At best your new league will be a 3 or 4 bid Conf., Xavier is sliding downhill, McDermott will leave for pros and Stevens to UCLA is heating up. This will be a G'Town, Marquette league and that is all.

Agreed. Outside of Georgetown and the Johnnies during the 90s (which I rooted for during the Artest and Barkley days), the traditional Big East was all about Syracuse, UConn, Pitt, and then later on after the ACC defections, Louisville, W Va, Marquette, ND and Cincy.

The new Big East will be a good basketball league, but the Big East as we know it is dead... cut in half with the "divorce" and the best programs in the league in basketball (Syracuse, UConn, Cincinnati, Louisville, Pittsburgh, Notre Dame, West Va) are gone, and the notable football programs that really rounded out the conference (Miami, BC, Louisville, Syracuse, Virginia Tech, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, West Va, Rutgers) are gone. Its not the Big East that was up there in the college all-sports landscape with the big boys that developed over the past 2 and a half decades.

That's why I said Rest in Peace, Big East.

The Big XII lost one third of their members and are still the Big XII, right? Wasn't the BE originally a BB only conference? Well they still are now... and they will be fine. Don't try to flatter us with the B1G crap. Rutgers hasn't played a game in the B1G yet. You are going to be romped all over in your "most influential" league. That statement makes me laugh even while I am typing... If Kansas, Syracuse, or Missouri were still available, the B1G would have never looked your way.

The Big East of the last 25 years had a spotlight from September all the way to the end of March, and many times the beginning of April. Regardless of the programs there or not there, that spotlight only has a chance to shine from January to March now. Big East basketball, no matter how great it is, will not turn the nation away from college football's regular season and bowl games. For that reason alone, the Big East as an entire generation of fans know it, is no more after this tournament is over.

(03-29-2013 08:41 PM)Texas2Step Wrote:  The Big East of the last 25 years had a spotlight from September all the way to the end of March, and many times the beginning of April. Regardless of the programs there or not there, that spotlight only has a chance to shine from January to March now. Big East basketball, no matter how great it is, will not turn the nation away from college football's regular season and bowl games. For that reason alone, the Big East as an entire generation of fans know it, is no more after this tournament is over.

That'd not even close to true. The big east FB conference wasn't even mentioned during FB season unless they were getting made fun of. The BBall was the side that was actually respected. The basketball side was NEVER reffered to as "The Big Least".

This idea that the conference is somehow dead because a few good teams and a bunch of mediocre teams left is a joke.

Miami
VT
Rutgers
USF

These four never did anything in BE BBall play.

Notre Dame never made the conference tournament final.

WVU for most of their tenure in the league was fodder.

UofL only spent 7 of the 34 years the league as it currently sits was around.

Cincy is 4-8 against Xavier the last 12 years.

I don't see how that means St. John's, Georgetown, Villanova, Seton Hall and Providence are not the big east?

(03-29-2013 06:32 PM)NJRedMan Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 05:44 PM)IceJus10 Wrote:  This is it, the Big East is we've always known it will be dead after this season -- so go out with a BANG! I'd like to see half of the Final Four be Big East teams just as a great big F'U to the naysayers!

Will you stop this nonsense. You keep saying this and I keep proving you wrong. 5 of the 8 original members with the name, history and MSG means the bug east everyone knows is living on. I know that a UNC/ACC fan wishes the league would go away but it's not. Keep throwing those coins in fountains and wishing upon those shooting stars though.

No your just not accepting reality.

The BIG EAST of Dave Gavitt will be gone after 30 June 2013...but it is going out in style in both Football & Basketball.

Fact of the matter whether some want to admit it or not...the real BIG EAST died on a Saturday in September in 2011 when Syracuse left.

The league that will carry out the name will be a good basketball league...but in reality it will be a counterfeit to what was the BIG EAST that I grew up with...

The problem is that Louisville did more than Providence and Seton Hall did COMBINED. St John's barely resembles the outfit back in the 80's- and is irrelevant today.

To say the Big East next year won't be different means you really lose all creditability. There's no way it will be the same. I'm sorry but Georgetown/Xavier doesn't mean the same as Georgetown/Syracuse. St John's/Creighton doesn't mean as much as St Johns/UConn has. It just doesn't.

(03-29-2013 10:18 PM)Maize Wrote:  The BIG EAST of Dave Gavitt will be gone after 30 June 2013...but it is going out in style in both Football & Basketball.

Fact of the matter whether some want to admit it or not...the real BIG EAST died on a Saturday in September in 2011 when Syracuse left.

The league that will carry out the name will be a good basketball league...but in reality it will be a counterfeit to what was the BIG EAST that I grew up with...

Hahahahaha 5 of the original 8 members are left but its counterfeit because the school who won as many national titles as 2 of the remaining members left. Hahahahahaha!!!!

Dude, you guys were here for a minute. Don't go telling us what we are.

(03-29-2013 08:41 PM)Texas2Step Wrote:  The Big East of the last 25 years had a spotlight from September all the way to the end of March, and many times the beginning of April. Regardless of the programs there or not there, that spotlight only has a chance to shine from January to March now. Big East basketball, no matter how great it is, will not turn the nation away from college football's regular season and bowl games. For that reason alone, the Big East as an entire generation of fans know it, is no more after this tournament is over.

You must be from Texas where the world revolves around football.

BTW, I'd hardly call what the Big East had shining on it in the fall a spotlight.

(03-29-2013 10:18 PM)Maize Wrote:  The BIG EAST of Dave Gavitt will be gone after 30 June 2013...but it is going out in style in both Football & Basketball.

Fact of the matter whether some want to admit it or not...the real BIG EAST died on a Saturday in September in 2011 when Syracuse left.

The league that will carry out the name will be a good basketball league...but in reality it will be a counterfeit to what was the BIG EAST that I grew up with...

Sorry, but the Big East was and is bigger than Syracuse.

BTW, it's news to me that Syracuse left in September, 2011. AFAIK, they're still a big East member to this very day.

(03-29-2013 10:29 PM)stever20 Wrote:  The problem is that Louisville did more than Providence and Seton Hall did COMBINED. St John's barely resembles the outfit back in the 80's- and is irrelevant today.

To say the Big East next year won't be different means you really lose all creditability. There's no way it will be the same. I'm sorry but Georgetown/Xavier doesn't mean the same as Georgetown/Syracuse. St John's/Creighton doesn't mean as much as St Johns/UConn has. It just doesn't.

It doesn't now, but it will.

Georgetown/Syracuse didn't mean anything when the conference started either.

What exactly did Louisville do for Big East basketball? The Big East was special before Louisville joined and they continued to be special afterwards with or without Louisville.

As for Louisville doing more than Seton Hall + Providence combined, here's the score card during their time in the Big East:

Big East Competition:
Louisville = 2 regular season championships + 3 tournament titles
SHU + PC = 2 regular season championships + 3 tournament titles

NCAA Competition:
Louisville = 4 Elite 8's + 1 Final Four + 0 NC games
SHU + PC = 4 Elite 8's + 2 Final Fours + 1 NC games

Timing in life is everything. Seton Hall's & Providence's contributions in the 1980's & '90's were very important to building the conferences' reputation and the value of its brand. Louisville's contributions in the past 8 years mattered little since the brand was already well established and their were plenty of other conference members having success that the brand didn't depend on them.

(03-30-2013 01:43 AM)Melky Cabrera Wrote:  

(03-29-2013 10:29 PM)stever20 Wrote:  The problem is that Louisville did more than Providence and Seton Hall did COMBINED. St John's barely resembles the outfit back in the 80's- and is irrelevant today.

To say the Big East next year won't be different means you really lose all creditability. There's no way it will be the same. I'm sorry but Georgetown/Xavier doesn't mean the same as Georgetown/Syracuse. St John's/Creighton doesn't mean as much as St Johns/UConn has. It just doesn't.

It doesn't now, but it will.

Georgetown/Syracuse didn't mean anything when the conference started either.

What exactly did Louisville do for Big East basketball? The Big East was special before Louisville joined and they continued to be special afterwards with or without Louisville.

As for Louisville doing more than Seton Hall + Providence combined, here's the score card during their time in the Big East:

Big East Competition:
Louisville = 2 regular season championships + 3 tournament titles
SHU + PC = 2 regular season championships + 3 tournament titles

NCAA Competition:
Louisville = 4 Elite 8's + 1 Final Four + 0 NC games
SHU + PC = 4 Elite 8's + 2 Final Fours + 1 NC games

Timing in life is everything. Seton Hall's & Providence's contributions in the 1980's & '90's were very important to building the conferences' reputation and the value of its brand. Louisville's contributions in the past 8 years mattered little since the brand was already well established and their were plenty of other conference members having success that the brand didn't depend on them.

Shouldn't those numbers be normalized to the fact that Louisville spent one third the years in the BE as SHU and PC?

You and Redman are just living in the past. To say that Louisville going to 4 elite 8 in the 8 years they have been in the Big East means little? Epic fail there. SHU and PC have 5 titles in reg season/playoffs in a combined what 70 years of play with last one almost 20 years ago? Living in the past.

Bottom line- for you and redman to say that the Big East will be the same- you are like a big ******* ostrich with your head in the sand. Of course it's going to be different. Of the top 8 conference tourney champions(all the multiple ones)- the BE is losing 4 this year(and had lost BC already). UConn, Louisville, Syracuse, Pittsburgh all leaving. Like I said you lose all credibility by saying that it will be the same because we have 5 original teams still around. 5 original teams- 14 championships. leaving teams- 17 championships plus the one that left last year. You and a lot of big east blowhards are living like it's 1985 and that's the problem. You can't(err, won't) recognize that things have changed. You say we have the big tv contract so we must be special. If you look at the NCAA units this year- our 10 team conference would be tied with the A10, P12 for the 3rd most units(converting the units from Louisville, Syracuse, ND, Pitt to the ACC). With 10 units- 1 per school. Last year, we had 23 units or almost 1.5 per school. Yeah, that's the same. Not.

Oh and the crap about SHU and PC building the Big East's reputation by their final four's. BULLCRAP! If those 2 don't make the final 4, the conference rep is the exact same. The brand didn't depend on Providence or Seton Hall. PERIOD. If they're not there- are you saying that the Big East wouldn't have been as big? Wow, that's idiotic.

What Louisville did was take the Big East to a whole another level- to the best conference EVER. To ignore that is just foolish.

As a Syracuse fan, I would definitely say the Big East was more than any one team.

However, Syracuse was the lynchpin for both sides - football and basketball. It's amazing the league stayed together as long as it did considering its dichotomy. But one of the key reasons it did stay together was Syracuse.

In terms basketball (the discussion at hand), the Big East was basically three programs - Georgetown, Syracuse, and Connecticut (with Louisville on the cusp of joining those three had the league managed to stay together for another three-to-five years).

Next year, those three basketball programs will each play in a different conference.

Cheers,
Neil

The thread tells about our ages more than anything else. At 44, I see the Big East clearly built by Georgetown, St John's and Villanova; with Syracuse following. Providence and Seton Hall solidified the Big East as one with amazing depth (from 1985 thru 1989 alone, SIX (6) of us made the Final Four-- 5 of those 6 are in the C-7...). the success of the early years allowed later teams to succeed.

In the 90s, Seton Hall, UConn (national title), Syracuse (national final), St John's, Georgetown, Providence and BC all made Elite-8's, and Villanova had a couple of years ranked in the Top 5. The 90s additions of Miami, Rutgers, Notre Dame and West Va (and Va Tech) were good but had no NCAA tourney runs (in the 90s).

So by the time of the expansion to 16, our conference's reputation was in the stratosphere, because we also had the national titles of UConn and Syracuse. Louisville and Marquette have been excellent adds, with Cincinnati solid recently, but this is recent history... it would like discussing American history, but starting it in the Clinton years.

Cool OT moment this week:
As an insignificant but cool example of the BE's mystique, after the PC loss to Baylor Wednesday while shaking hands, excellent Baylor PG Pierre Jackson looked up unexpectedly at God Shammgod, yelled in his face "holy sh1t!, God Shammgod!" and ran over to his teammates to tell them.

(03-30-2013 02:42 AM)omniorange Wrote:  As a Syracuse fan, I would definitely say the Big East was more than any one team.

However, Syracuse was the lynchpin for both sides - football and basketball. It's amazing the league stayed together as long as it did considering its dichotomy. But one of the key reasons it did stay together was Syracuse.

In terms basketball (the discussion at hand), the Big East was basically three programs - Georgetown, Syracuse, and Connecticut (with Louisville on the cusp of joining those three had the league managed to stay together for another three-to-five years).

Next year, those three basketball programs will each play in a different conference.

Cheers,
Neil

I have always said this about Syracuse, they were the heart & soul of the BIG EAST....not taking anything always from schools like UConn, Georgetown, Villanova & Pitt but when hans of Non-BIG EAST schools thought about the league the first school that came to mind was the Orange.

The Dave Gavitt BIG EAST got attention from September through April...the league that will carry on the name and really just name only will get attention basicaly from the end of the Super Bowl to March Madness....it is a stronger version of the A-10 with a good TV Deal

But in the here and now the BIG EAST has 3 schools in the Elite Eight with Louisville making the Elite Eight for the 4 time in 6 years...

Can I repeat this too, since we're discussing conference strength, depth and reputation?... and tell me if this doesn't shock you:

Since 2004, no ACC team other than UNC and Duke has advanced beyond the Sweet-16.

Since 1996, only UNC, Duke, Maryland and Ga Tech have advanced beyond the Sweet-16 from the ACC.

(03-30-2013 04:17 AM)billyjack Wrote:  Can I repeat this too, since we're discussing conference strength, depth and reputation?... and tell me if this doesn't shock you:

Since 2004, no ACC team other than UNC and Duke has advanced beyond the Sweet-16.

Since 1996, only UNC, Duke, Maryland and Ga Tech have advanced beyond the Sweet-16 from the ACC.

Another amazing stat I heard on the radio yesterday...this is the 12 straight year a school under the BIG EAST Banner has been to the Elight Eight.

On the Football Side since realignment it is 5-3 in BCS Bowl games and has the 2nd best Bowl Game Record while usually finishing in the Top 4 in the BCS Computer Rankings.

While the media bashed the BIG EAST...like I said earlier on the Gridiron & Hardwood the BIG EAST did not have to take a backseat to nobody

(03-29-2013 07:44 AM)NJRedMan Wrote:  If Marquette gets by Cuse on saturday, the C7 Big East will have 5 final fours in 10 years. Going into this season we held the same stat.

You C-USA Marquette right? Lets be honest.

Nobody on here wishes the new BE any ill will, it's just that everybody except one person understands that the new conf. isn't anywhere close to being what the current conf. is perceived to be nationally. Even B. Raftery was singing the demise of the BE while broadcasting the Championship game, no bigger homer for the BE than he was. Good luck to the new conference, still think they are going to get lost on this new Fox sports network. Being on what will be the 4th rated sports network probably isn't going to help much.