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Loyola to MVC is official
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SubGod22 Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Loyola to MVC is official
I think it's pretty obvious that Bardo voted yes because there weren't two other schools willing to vote no. It's pretty clear that WSU isn't thrilled with the direction the MVC is headed but there's nothing they can do about it. IF the MVC looks to 12 in the next year or two and we're still unfortunate enough to be stuck, the additions better have basketball value.

I still don't see a lot of positives with Loyola. It's going to be awhile before they're competitive and will be a play-in team for at least the next 5 years. Unless Bradley gets its act together, all four IL schools will be playing on Thursday in STL the next few years. Such exciting times for the MVC...
04-23-2013 09:09 AM
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BirdstheWord Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Loyola to MVC is official
(04-23-2013 09:09 AM)SubGod22 Wrote:  I think it's pretty obvious that Bardo voted yes because there weren't two other schools willing to vote no. It's pretty clear that WSU isn't thrilled with the direction the MVC is headed but there's nothing they can do about it. IF the MVC looks to 12 in the next year or two and we're still unfortunate enough to be stuck, the additions better have basketball value.

I still don't see a lot of positives with Loyola. It's going to be awhile before they're competitive and will be a play-in team for at least the next 5 years. Unless Bradley gets its act together, all four IL schools will be playing on Thursday in STL the next few years. Such exciting times for the MVC...

There are enough teams in Illinois that they have a good chance of doing something. Illinois State came in third this past year in the tournament.

Also, while there are four teams in the state if Illinois, two of which are public schools, they really represent different areas of the state and country. For example, SIU gets most of its students from Southern Illinois and not many go to ISU.

I know Wichita State likes to talk about the money that they put towards basketball, but just wait until Loyola finishes stretching their muscles, they are really going all out on updating facilities now.
04-23-2013 06:40 PM
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MSUBear42 Offline
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Post: #23
Re: RE: Loyola to MVC is official
(04-23-2013 09:09 AM)SubGod22 Wrote:  I think it's pretty obvious that Bardo voted yes because there weren't two other schools willing to vote no. It's pretty clear that WSU isn't thrilled with the direction the MVC is headed but there's nothing they can do about it. IF the MVC looks to 12 in the next year or two and we're still unfortunate enough to be stuck, the additions better have basketball value.

I still don't see a lot of positives with Loyola. It's going to be awhile before they're competitive and will be a play-in team for at least the next 5 years. Unless Bradley gets its act together, all four IL schools will be playing on Thursday in STL the next few years. Such exciting times for the MVC...

Add. Football. Please.

WE ARE. MO STATE
04-23-2013 08:56 PM
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SubGod22 Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Loyola to MVC is official
(04-23-2013 06:40 PM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  
(04-23-2013 09:09 AM)SubGod22 Wrote:  I think it's pretty obvious that Bardo voted yes because there weren't two other schools willing to vote no. It's pretty clear that WSU isn't thrilled with the direction the MVC is headed but there's nothing they can do about it. IF the MVC looks to 12 in the next year or two and we're still unfortunate enough to be stuck, the additions better have basketball value.

I still don't see a lot of positives with Loyola. It's going to be awhile before they're competitive and will be a play-in team for at least the next 5 years. Unless Bradley gets its act together, all four IL schools will be playing on Thursday in STL the next few years. Such exciting times for the MVC...

There are enough teams in Illinois that they have a good chance of doing something. Illinois State came in third this past year in the tournament.

Also, while there are four teams in the state if Illinois, two of which are public schools, they really represent different areas of the state and country. For example, SIU gets most of its students from Southern Illinois and not many go to ISU.

I know Wichita State likes to talk about the money that they put towards basketball, but just wait until Loyola finishes stretching their muscles, they are really going all out on updating facilities now.
Illinois State also lost most if not all of their firepower from this years underachieving team. I want to see you guys do well, but it's not happening this year.

SIU just lost their only real post player and will suck again. Hinson has a heck of a job to get them competitive. Probably at least another 3-4 years at least.

Loyola says they're going to invest and throw money at their athletics program. I hope it leads to results. I simply don't have a lot of faith in them and their glorified HS gyim. But it's a nice HS gym.
04-24-2013 08:26 AM
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SubGod22 Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Loyola to MVC is official
(04-23-2013 08:56 PM)MSUBear42 Wrote:  
(04-23-2013 09:09 AM)SubGod22 Wrote:  I think it's pretty obvious that Bardo voted yes because there weren't two other schools willing to vote no. It's pretty clear that WSU isn't thrilled with the direction the MVC is headed but there's nothing they can do about it. IF the MVC looks to 12 in the next year or two and we're still unfortunate enough to be stuck, the additions better have basketball value.

I still don't see a lot of positives with Loyola. It's going to be awhile before they're competitive and will be a play-in team for at least the next 5 years. Unless Bradley gets its act together, all four IL schools will be playing on Thursday in STL the next few years. Such exciting times for the MVC...

Add. Football. Please.

WE ARE. MO STATE
I wish.
04-24-2013 08:26 AM
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jdgaucho Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Loyola to MVC is official
(04-24-2013 08:26 AM)SubGod22 Wrote:  
(04-23-2013 08:56 PM)MSUBear42 Wrote:  
(04-23-2013 09:09 AM)SubGod22 Wrote:  I think it's pretty obvious that Bardo voted yes because there weren't two other schools willing to vote no. It's pretty clear that WSU isn't thrilled with the direction the MVC is headed but there's nothing they can do about it. IF the MVC looks to 12 in the next year or two and we're still unfortunate enough to be stuck, the additions better have basketball value.

I still don't see a lot of positives with Loyola. It's going to be awhile before they're competitive and will be a play-in team for at least the next 5 years. Unless Bradley gets its act together, all four IL schools will be playing on Thursday in STL the next few years. Such exciting times for the MVC...

Add. Football. Please.

WE ARE. MO STATE
I wish.

Don't. Add. Football. You guys are better off without it.
04-24-2013 10:03 AM
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College Basketball Fan Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Loyola to MVC is official
(04-23-2013 08:56 PM)MSUBear42 Wrote:  Add. Football. Please.

WE ARE. MO STATE

This may go against the common narrative, but I don't see the money in football. How profitable is the FCS? How profitable is DII or DIII football?

Here, let me put it in a graph:

[Image: 2010_FBALL_revenue.jpg?MOD=AJPERES]

Now, you might ask why I am talking about FCS football when clearly the goal of every program is to get to the FBS level. Guess, what:

In ten to twenty years, the low end of FBS will BE the new FCS!

Why would Wichita State want to add football to try and get a lower level FBS league? The Sun Belt sucks, and would be a ridiculous downgrade in the sport we actually care about. Would we join C-USA, a league so successful that it successfully lost every founding member of the conference? The MAC? Get out of here.

The only exceptions would be the AAC and the MWC. We would want to join those conferences, but for basketball only. I see no future in football outside of the Power5 conferences. Even if we never see a full breakaway, I think you'll continue to see 90% of the media money go to the power conferences.

If we DID add football, you would be looking at millions a year in expenses. For example, UMass was spending about $8.5 million on football. How much extra money would we get by moving from the MVC to a G5 conference?

AAC: < $3 million (estimate)
MWC: $1.33 million
C-USA: $1.15 million
MAC: Virtually nothing ($600,000 for the whole conference)
Sun Belt: Virtually nothing times two ($208,000 for the whole conference).

If we added football, we would go from being in the black to being millions of dollars in the red (not to mention the tens of millions needed for facilities). We live in a world where football is not necessary, and IMHO is not the money-maker for non-Power5 schools. It is far easier to run a really good basketball program and make money than it is to make money from football in a non-power conference.

For inspiration, look no farther than the C7. A conference with no football that is LEAGUES better than any of the G5 schools in terms of media money. Sure, Wichita State is unlikely to ever join that league, but the potential for basketball to make money exists and is far more likely (at least for Wichita State) than ever turning a profit from football.

Sorry for the rant, but I think football is the last option for us to leave the MVC, something we would only do if the MVC completely hamstrung us from moving forward.
04-24-2013 01:03 PM
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Max Power Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Loyola to MVC is official
(04-23-2013 06:40 PM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  There are enough teams in Illinois that they have a good chance of doing something. Illinois State came in third this past year in the tournament.

Also, while there are four teams in the state if Illinois, two of which are public schools, they really represent different areas of the state and country. For example, SIU gets most of its students from Southern Illinois and not many go to ISU.

I know Wichita State likes to talk about the money that they put towards basketball, but just wait until Loyola finishes stretching their muscles, they are really going all out on updating facilities now.

Are you serious? Illinois State finished 6th, only 1 game ahead of the 9th place team. And they're losing a projected 2nd round draft pick in Jackie Carmichael, plus a 2nd team all MVC in Tyler Brown, plus two more starters in Wilkins and Ekey. If Muller can take a preseason #2 team and finish 6th, just think what he can do with less talent. They'll be lucky to finish ahead of Loyola. NCAA drought extends to 16 years in Normal. Sorry.
(This post was last modified: 04-25-2013 02:16 PM by Max Power.)
04-25-2013 02:10 PM
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BirdstheWord Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Loyola to MVC is official
(04-25-2013 02:10 PM)Max Power Wrote:  
(04-23-2013 06:40 PM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  There are enough teams in Illinois that they have a good chance of doing something. Illinois State came in third this past year in the tournament.

Also, while there are four teams in the state if Illinois, two of which are public schools, they really represent different areas of the state and country. For example, SIU gets most of its students from Southern Illinois and not many go to ISU.

I know Wichita State likes to talk about the money that they put towards basketball, but just wait until Loyola finishes stretching their muscles, they are really going all out on updating facilities now.

Are you serious? Illinois State finished 6th, only 1 game ahead of the 9th place team. And they're losing a projected 2nd round draft pick in Jackie Carmichael, plus a 2nd team all MVC in Tyler Brown, plus two more starters in Wilkins and Ekey. If Muller can take a preseason #2 team and finish 6th, just think what he can do with less talent. They'll be lucky to finish ahead of Loyola. NCAA drought extends to 16 years in Normal. Sorry.

Well, first off, have you heard of "playing the numbers"? If you have enough of one thing the chances go up a lot.

Secondly, ISU's recruiting class, once it's all said and done, will be great.

Tell me, do you know how many starters WSU lost last year and how far they got into the tournament this year?
04-25-2013 10:09 PM
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Max Power Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Loyola to MVC is official
Yes I have heard of "playing the numbers." I don't think you know what that means.

Their recruiting class will be good if they sign McIntosh. If not, their biggest recruit is a midget gunner whose only other offers were Iona (with an N) and Evansville (with an Evansville).

Do I really have to explain that last year's Wichita team was the exception to the rule? Not to mention, their recruits were much higher ranked than what ISU will bring in next year. Those guys are JUCO all Americans and VanVleet was top-100 out of Rockford.
04-26-2013 01:24 PM
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BirdstheWord Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Loyola to MVC is official
(04-26-2013 01:24 PM)Max Power Wrote:  Yes I have heard of "playing the numbers." I don't think you know what that means.

Their recruiting class will be good if they sign McIntosh. If not, their biggest recruit is a midget gunner whose only other offers were Iona (with an N) and Evansville (with an Evansville).

Do I really have to explain that last year's Wichita team was the exception to the rule? Not to mention, their recruits were much higher ranked than what ISU will bring in next year. Those guys are JUCO all Americans and VanVleet was top-100 out of Rockford.

I see, so your reasoning is "I'm right because I'm right" because nothing said has shown otherwise.
04-27-2013 02:17 AM
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