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SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #1
SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
... at least if this report from Alabama.com is correct. They quote a CBS Sports report that says the Network will "eventually" be worth $28.6 million per school:

"CBSSports.com cited a television source today not directly affiliated with the deal as estimating the SEC's eventual television worth from ESPN and CBS at $400 million annually. That would be $28.6 million per school in TV revenue alone, not counting other payouts, including increased postseason football money."

Why is that a disaster for the SEC? Because that "eventually" clearly refers to some time in the future, near the end of the 20 year deal. But, the B1G is ALREADY getting $25 million per school from its media deals, and that figure is rising:

"The Big Ten, which started a conference TV network in 2007, paid out about $25 million to each member last year, according to published reports."

This raises the issue of why the SEC Network payout will be so paltry? The answer is the awful, perhaps ultimately fatal, decision by Mike Slive to sign those 2008 15-year deals with CBS and ESPN for peanuts:

" .... the SEC missed a big opportunity several years ago by negotiating longterm deals with ESPN and CBS that everybody now knows were fairly under-market deals. Referring to those deals, a media consultant says:

".... at the time, they looked like they were fully-valued deals," he said. "But it's fair to say the market accelerated forward and has changed quite dramatically. As a result of those deals, the SEC has to deal with ESPN in a non-free agency matter. It's very difficult because ESPN has the leverage of 15 years worth of future rights to have the preferred structural outcome."

That's the rub right there: No matter how the SEC tries to dress this pig up, it's still a pig, and one that ensures that the SEC will fall FAR behind the B1G in revenues, since the B1G smartly decided to control its own destiny with the BTN, a true "Big 10 network", as they own 50% of it. The SEC is stuck with the basic terms of the 2008 deals, terms that have proven to be immensely favorable to ESPN and CBS.

While the B1G collects all the profits of ownership, the SEC is stuck working as ESPN's employee for the next 20 years. Yes, ESPN and SEC executives can stand on a stage and pretend that they are "partners", but whereas FOX and the B1G truly are partners, the SEC is ESPN's vassal.

I'm guessing that by 2018, while the SEC schools might be getting $26 million per school, B1G schools will be clearing at least $35 million, maybe $40 million. That will make SEC schools vulnerable to poaching.

If i were the SEC, I'd sign a GoR, and quick. 07-coffee3
(This post was last modified: 05-03-2013 10:04 PM by quo vadis.)
05-03-2013 10:01 PM
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jdgaucho Offline
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Post: #2
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
The network is a year away and someone's already complaining about the value being "only" worth $28.6 million per school. We should all feel their pain. If they don't want those funds they could always give some to us.
05-03-2013 10:17 PM
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Lurker Above Offline
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Post: #3
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
Nope.

"They quote a CBS Sports report that says the Network will "eventually" be worth $28.6 million per school:

"CBSSports.com cited a television source today not directly affiliated with the deal as estimating the SEC's eventual television worth from ESPN and CBS at $400 million annually. That would be $28.6 million per school in TV revenue alone, not counting other payouts, including increased postseason football money."

These comments are contradictory and it looks like the original write got it wrong and the story has been republished across the net.

And the "eventually" obviously means once it gets its carriage rights negotiated.

Here is some info for you:

"In January, USA Today conducted a study and they arrived at darn near the exact same numbers. Their analysis projected that league schools would likely make about $34 million per school per year starting in 2014-15.

So if you’re wondering what the network will be worth to SEC schools, broaden your thinking. With the network and several other new revenue streams kicking in, SEC schools will likely see their annual checks from the home office spike 50-75% in the next two or three fiscal years with potential for much larger growth as the conference and ESPN get deeper into their 20-year deal."

http://www.mrsec.com/2013/05/the-sec-net...lus-links/

The referenced USA Today link:
"Already home to many of the nation's best-financed college athletics programs, the Southeastern Conference is about two years from distributing at least $10 million -- and perhaps as much as $14 million -- more per school than it did during the 2011-12 fiscal year, a USA TODAY Sports analysis projects.

This would represent at least a 50% increase in the SEC's per-school take, which could get close to $34 million in 2014-15 and for a few years exceed the revenue each of the Big Ten Conference schools get from their shares of conference and NCAA revenues. In part because of the Big Ten Network's success, most Big Ten schools recently have been receiving $1 million to $4 million more per year than SEC schools – roughly $23 million to $25 million apiece."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/col...Stories%29
(This post was last modified: 05-03-2013 11:21 PM by Lurker Above.)
05-03-2013 11:04 PM
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Jericho Offline
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Post: #4
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
This can't be considered all that shocking though, can it? It was not like the SEC Network was going to be this HUGE cash cow when ESPN already owned the vast majority of rights. what's more, the SEC schools had to buy back their own Tier 3 rights to form this network. And no one is subtracting those costs from the projected revenues.

I still think the deal is a net gain for the conference, but it's unlikely to be a huge one.
05-03-2013 11:37 PM
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Lurker Above Offline
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RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-03-2013 11:37 PM)Jericho Wrote:  This can't be considered all that shocking though, can it? It was not like the SEC Network was going to be this HUGE cash cow when ESPN already owned the vast majority of rights. what's more, the SEC schools had to buy back their own Tier 3 rights to form this network. And no one is subtracting those costs from the projected revenues.

I still think the deal is a net gain for the conference, but it's unlikely to be a huge one.

Do you really thing Alabama, Georgia and Florida gave up $10 to $15 million a year in tier 3 rights so they could get a $8 million increase on its ESPN contract? And get nothing for aTm and Mizzou? And get nothing for the contract extension?

Seriously people.
05-03-2013 11:44 PM
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Zombiewoof Offline
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Post: #6
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-03-2013 11:44 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  
(05-03-2013 11:37 PM)Jericho Wrote:  This can't be considered all that shocking though, can it? It was not like the SEC Network was going to be this HUGE cash cow when ESPN already owned the vast majority of rights. what's more, the SEC schools had to buy back their own Tier 3 rights to form this network. And no one is subtracting those costs from the projected revenues.

I still think the deal is a net gain for the conference, but it's unlikely to be a huge one.

Do you really thing Alabama, Georgia and Florida gave up $10 to $15 million a year in tier 3 rights so they could get a $8 million increase on its ESPN contract? And get nothing for aTm and Mizzou? And get nothing for the contract extension?

Seriously people.

As much as some here would love for the SEC Network to be a "disaster for the SEC," they are probably going to be severly disappointed. Lurker Above is likely correct in his assumption that the most powerful schools in the SEC aren't going to spend upwards of $15 million in order to gain around $8 million and they aren't going to stand for a net zero gain for the additions of Missouri and Texas A&M. Moreover, ESPN and CBS may have a contract with the SEC that is less than the conference could have negotiated today, but it isn't in the networks' interest in subjugating the SEC. I don't think they will tear up the old contract, but I do believe there are probably some escalators built in that will increase the take. Even if there aren't, it is in the best interest of ESPN and CBS not to tick off the SEC, so I believe things will work out just fine for the conference. Maybe the overall money for the contract period won't equal the payout for the Big Ten, but is unlikely to be a disaster.
05-04-2013 12:27 AM
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BirdstheWord Offline
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Post: #7
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
Okay, so what can the SEC expect to make per school during their first year?
05-04-2013 12:53 AM
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Lurker Above Offline
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Post: #8
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-04-2013 12:53 AM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  Okay, so what can the SEC expect to make per school during their first year?

$35 million per school if we stay at 8 conference games and 14 conference schools.

Which we won't.
05-04-2013 01:02 AM
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BirdstheWord Offline
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Post: #9
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-04-2013 01:02 AM)Lurker Above Wrote:  
(05-04-2013 12:53 AM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  Okay, so what can the SEC expect to make per school during their first year?

$35 million per school if we stay at 8 conference games and 14 conference schools.

Which we won't.

Then where did this $28.7 million number come from? There are so many numbers and scenarios.

Your bet's on adding more teams?
05-04-2013 01:18 AM
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Lurker Above Offline
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Post: #10
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-04-2013 01:18 AM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  
(05-04-2013 01:02 AM)Lurker Above Wrote:  
(05-04-2013 12:53 AM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  Okay, so what can the SEC expect to make per school during their first year?

$35 million per school if we stay at 8 conference games and 14 conference schools.

Which we won't.

Then where did this $28.7 million number come from? There are so many numbers and scenarios.

Read my posts above.
Your bet's on adding more teams?

Yep. That has been my prediction for years and still is.

I thought the full Slive quote from an interview on Tuesday was interesting:

"One of the curiosities of the new SEC Network is that it will be headquartered in Charlotte, N.C., which happens to be outside the footprint of the SEC.

SEC commissioner Mike Slive had an interesting comment on that.

"Matter of fact I think it's an advantage," Slive said. "I'm delighted to have a presence in North Carolina."

Slive was asked if he could elaborate on that.

"No. I don't need to," Slive said, smiling.

But, Slive was told, people might think he means the SEC will be in the state of North Carolina soon.

"I don't need to (elaborate)," Slive repeated."

http://www.macon.com/2013/05/02/2463370/...north.html
05-04-2013 01:26 AM
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fsugrad99 Offline
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Post: #11
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
Of all the stupid things said on this board, this thread title has to be top ten, if not top five.
05-04-2013 02:42 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #12
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-03-2013 10:17 PM)jdgaucho Wrote:  The network is a year away and someone's already complaining about the value being "only" worth $28.6 million per school. We should all feel their pain. If they don't want those funds they could always give some to us.

Obviously, $28.6 million is a load of money and nothing to feel sorry for towards the SEC. But big picture, the SEC competes with the B1G for supremacy, and there's no getting around the disastrous nature of its network compared to the B1G's.
05-04-2013 05:41 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #13
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
I think you are making too much of the first writer's invocation of "the network" as meaning he meant to exclude the CBS portion of the deal. While that is possible, I think it more likely that he meant to refer to the totality of the media revenues, which includes CBS, but just forgot that CBS is not part of this network.

As for the USA Today article, with the $34 million figure, its author seems to be referring to all revenue streams, not just the media money, including money from the new playoffs system. And while the SEC will be getting about another $7 million or so per school under the playoffs system, so will the B1G, so that doesn't obviate a gap in media revenues between them.


(05-03-2013 11:04 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  Nope.

"They quote a CBS Sports report that says the Network will "eventually" be worth $28.6 million per school:

"CBSSports.com cited a television source today not directly affiliated with the deal as estimating the SEC's eventual television worth from ESPN and CBS at $400 million annually. That would be $28.6 million per school in TV revenue alone, not counting other payouts, including increased postseason football money."

These comments are contradictory and it looks like the original write got it wrong and the story has been republished across the net.

And the "eventually" obviously means once it gets its carriage rights negotiated.

Here is some info for you:

"In January, USA Today conducted a study and they arrived at darn near the exact same numbers. Their analysis projected that league schools would likely make about $34 million per school per year starting in 2014-15.

So if you’re wondering what the network will be worth to SEC schools, broaden your thinking. With the network and several other new revenue streams kicking in, SEC schools will likely see their annual checks from the home office spike 50-75% in the next two or three fiscal years with potential for much larger growth as the conference and ESPN get deeper into their 20-year deal."

http://www.mrsec.com/2013/05/the-sec-net...lus-links/

The referenced USA Today link:
"Already home to many of the nation's best-financed college athletics programs, the Southeastern Conference is about two years from distributing at least $10 million -- and perhaps as much as $14 million -- more per school than it did during the 2011-12 fiscal year, a USA TODAY Sports analysis projects.

This would represent at least a 50% increase in the SEC's per-school take, which could get close to $34 million in 2014-15 and for a few years exceed the revenue each of the Big Ten Conference schools get from their shares of conference and NCAA revenues. In part because of the Big Ten Network's success, most Big Ten schools recently have been receiving $1 million to $4 million more per year than SEC schools – roughly $23 million to $25 million apiece."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/col...Stories%29
05-04-2013 05:47 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-03-2013 11:44 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  
(05-03-2013 11:37 PM)Jericho Wrote:  This can't be considered all that shocking though, can it? It was not like the SEC Network was going to be this HUGE cash cow when ESPN already owned the vast majority of rights. what's more, the SEC schools had to buy back their own Tier 3 rights to form this network. And no one is subtracting those costs from the projected revenues.

I still think the deal is a net gain for the conference, but it's unlikely to be a huge one.

Do you really thing Alabama, Georgia and Florida gave up $10 to $15 million a year in tier 3 rights so they could get a $8 million increase on its ESPN contract? And get nothing for aTm and Mizzou? And get nothing for the contract extension?

Thing is, if Alabama could have sold its Tier 3s for $15 million, that would put its combined take from those rights plus the existing (pre-Network) deals with CBS and ESPN, about $17 million per school right now, at approximately $32 million. Toss in an extra $2 million for the Missouri/AM expansion and you get around $34 million.

Which is what USA Today is saying the SEC Network + CBS will be worth. Not much difference there.

The question that I think you should ponder is: Since CBS and ESPN already have the SEC's far and away most valuable rights on the hook until 2024, and with very favorable terms, why would they allow any type of new arrangement like an "SEC Network" to alter those basic terms?

Answer: They wouldn't, unless they were crazy.
(This post was last modified: 05-04-2013 05:55 AM by quo vadis.)
05-04-2013 05:53 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-04-2013 12:27 AM)Zombiewoof Wrote:  
(05-03-2013 11:44 PM)Lurker Above Wrote:  
(05-03-2013 11:37 PM)Jericho Wrote:  This can't be considered all that shocking though, can it? It was not like the SEC Network was going to be this HUGE cash cow when ESPN already owned the vast majority of rights. what's more, the SEC schools had to buy back their own Tier 3 rights to form this network. And no one is subtracting those costs from the projected revenues.

I still think the deal is a net gain for the conference, but it's unlikely to be a huge one.

Do you really thing Alabama, Georgia and Florida gave up $10 to $15 million a year in tier 3 rights so they could get a $8 million increase on its ESPN contract? And get nothing for aTm and Mizzou? And get nothing for the contract extension?

Seriously people.

As much as some here would love for the SEC Network to be a "disaster for the SEC," they are probably going to be severly disappointed. Lurker Above is likely correct in his assumption that the most powerful schools in the SEC aren't going to spend upwards of $15 million in order to gain around $8 million and they aren't going to stand for a net zero gain for the additions of Missouri and Texas A&M. Moreover, ESPN and CBS may have a contract with the SEC that is less than the conference could have negotiated today, but it isn't in the networks' interest in subjugating the SEC. I don't think they will tear up the old contract, but I do believe there are probably some escalators built in that will increase the take. Even if there aren't, it is in the best interest of ESPN and CBS not to tick off the SEC, so I believe things will work out just fine for the conference. Maybe the overall money for the contract period won't equal the payout for the Big Ten, but is unlikely to be a disaster.

IMO, of course it is in ESPN's and CBS's interests to enforce the terms of their 2008 deal. That's why they negotiated those deals to begin with. And all the available evidence suggests that ESPN has played hard-ball: With both the ACC and SEC, ESPN has been unwilling to offer them much more during the "look-in" negotiations that were triggered after expansion.

ESPN is a $40 billion a year colossus. Its revenues are 30-40 times greater than the SEC's. As big as the SEC is, it is only one of many significant properties to ESPN and far from the most valuable, and they would have no compunction in enforcing the terms of their 2008 deal.
05-04-2013 05:59 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-04-2013 01:26 AM)Lurker Above Wrote:  
(05-04-2013 01:18 AM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  
(05-04-2013 01:02 AM)Lurker Above Wrote:  
(05-04-2013 12:53 AM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  Okay, so what can the SEC expect to make per school during their first year?

$35 million per school if we stay at 8 conference games and 14 conference schools.

Which we won't.

Then where did this $28.7 million number come from? There are so many numbers and scenarios.

Read my posts above.
Your bet's on adding more teams?

Yep. That has been my prediction for years and still is.

Adding UNC would be a tremendous coup for the SEC, but how are they going to achieve that with the ACC GoR in place?
05-04-2013 06:02 AM
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RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-03-2013 10:01 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  ... at least if this report from Alabama.com is correct. They quote a CBS Sports report that says the Network will "eventually" be worth $28.6 million per school:

"CBSSports.com cited a television source today not directly affiliated with the deal as estimating the SEC's eventual television worth from ESPN and CBS at $400 million annually. That would be $28.6 million per school in TV revenue alone, not counting other payouts, including increased postseason football money."

Why is that a disaster for the SEC? Because that "eventually" clearly refers to some time in the future, near the end of the 20 year deal. But, the B1G is ALREADY getting $25 million per school from its media deals, and that figure is rising:

While your overall point will likely prove true (although I do not believe the disparity will be as large as you think it will be), this is comparing apples to oranges.

That future $28 million for the SEC is TV revenue alone.

The $25 million for the BiG is ALL shared revenue.

http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com...5-million/

Cheers,
Neil
05-04-2013 06:09 AM
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quo vadis Offline
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Post: #18
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-04-2013 06:09 AM)omniorange Wrote:  
(05-03-2013 10:01 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  ... at least if this report from Alabama.com is correct. They quote a CBS Sports report that says the Network will "eventually" be worth $28.6 million per school:

"CBSSports.com cited a television source today not directly affiliated with the deal as estimating the SEC's eventual television worth from ESPN and CBS at $400 million annually. That would be $28.6 million per school in TV revenue alone, not counting other payouts, including increased postseason football money."

Why is that a disaster for the SEC? Because that "eventually" clearly refers to some time in the future, near the end of the 20 year deal. But, the B1G is ALREADY getting $25 million per school from its media deals, and that figure is rising:

While your overall point will likely prove true (although I do not believe the disparity will be as large as you think it will be), this is comparing apples to oranges.

That future $28 million for the SEC is TV revenue alone.

The $25 million for the BiG is ALL shared revenue.

http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com...5-million/

Cheers,
Neil

Fair point. The B1G media revenue is currently at around $21 million, with an additional $4 million in bowl money.
05-04-2013 06:13 AM
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Maize Offline
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Post: #19
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
The bottom line is this:
1. In the near future 4 out of the 5 Power Leagues will have 24 Hour Conference Networks and 3 out of the 4 will be partners with their leagues with either Fox or ESPN.

2. In the near future if you want to watch your schools you will likely need these networks...the SEC Basketball Tournament if I am not mistaken is only going to be on the SEC Network.

3. The Presidents of these leagues have pretty much agreed to this and must see the earning potential.

Fact is this, much like the NCAA Tournament in the near future most of the College Sports will be on "Pay Networks/Conference Networks, FX-Fox, ESPN Brands or in the case of the NCAA's Turner"....it is what it is.
05-04-2013 06:34 AM
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Post: #20
RE: SEC Network is a disaster for the SEC
(05-04-2013 01:26 AM)Lurker Above Wrote:  
(05-04-2013 01:18 AM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  
(05-04-2013 01:02 AM)Lurker Above Wrote:  
(05-04-2013 12:53 AM)BirdstheWord Wrote:  Okay, so what can the SEC expect to make per school during their first year?

$35 million per school if we stay at 8 conference games and 14 conference schools.

Which we won't.

Then where did this $28.7 million number come from? There are so many numbers and scenarios.

Read my posts above.
Your bet's on adding more teams?

Yep. That has been my prediction for years and still is.

I thought the full Slive quote from an interview on Tuesday was interesting:

"One of the curiosities of the new SEC Network is that it will be headquartered in Charlotte, N.C., which happens to be outside the footprint of the SEC.

SEC commissioner Mike Slive had an interesting comment on that.

"Matter of fact I think it's an advantage," Slive said. "I'm delighted to have a presence in North Carolina."

Slive was asked if he could elaborate on that.

"No. I don't need to," Slive said, smiling.

But, Slive was told, people might think he means the SEC will be in the state of North Carolina soon.

"I don't need to (elaborate)," Slive repeated."

http://www.macon.com/2013/05/02/2463370/...north.html

Sounds like the SEC maybe going after East Carolina University.
05-04-2013 07:21 AM
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