Want to hear your thoughts... what is going to keep CUSA 3.0 fans from adopting the same mentality as their MAC counterparts to the north? By mentality, I mean (... with apologies to my MAC friends, but they know it's true, if not about themselves, then about many others in their school's fan base...) a contentment with their current status and a lack of ambition to grow into something that could actually contend on a higher level of competition.

Don't misinterpret the question, or more importantly, the intent of the question. I'm a CUSA fan. I'm a realistic CUSA fan on the one hand--conscious of what realignment has done to our position--and on the other, an idealistic one who refuses to think as others do that we're necessarily destined to a lesser status.

But I think if you're going to aspire to greater and greater relevance, you have to take inventory and just be honest and assess "what do we have going for us that we can say is going to keep us from sinking into a less ambitious mindset as a group of fans?"

(05-18-2013 04:29 PM)_sturt_ Wrote:  Want to hear your thoughts... what is going to keep CUSA 3.0 fans from adopting the same mentality as their MAC counterparts to the north? By mentality, I mean (... with apologies to my MAC friends, but they know it's true, if not about themselves, then about many others in their school's fan base...) a contentment with their current status and a lack of ambition to grow into something that could actually contend on a higher level of competition.

Don't misinterpret the question, or more importantly, the intent of the question. I'm a CUSA fan. I'm a realistic CUSA fan on the one hand--conscious of what realignment has done to our position--and on the other, an idealistic one who refuses to think as others do that we're necessarily destined to a lesser status.

But I think if you're going to aspire to greater and greater relevance, you have to take inventory and just be honest and assess "what do we have going for us that we can say is going to keep us from sinking into a less ambitious mindset as a group of fans?"

So much talent in the Southeast and Texas! We are the teams that will challenge the MWC (becasue the West Coast has a ton of football players too). Our direct competition... the conference we must out-perform... is the AAC. They are CUSA 'market' teams. Our goal should be to become the premier "non-elite" conference.

(05-18-2013 05:39 PM)T_Won1 Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 04:29 PM)_sturt_ Wrote:  Want to hear your thoughts... what is going to keep CUSA 3.0 fans from adopting the same mentality as their MAC counterparts to the north? By mentality, I mean (... with apologies to my MAC friends, but they know it's true, if not about themselves, then about many others in their school's fan base...) a contentment with their current status and a lack of ambition to grow into something that could actually contend on a higher level of competition.

Don't misinterpret the question, or more importantly, the intent of the question. I'm a CUSA fan. I'm a realistic CUSA fan on the one hand--conscious of what realignment has done to our position--and on the other, an idealistic one who refuses to think as others do that we're necessarily destined to a lesser status.

But I think if you're going to aspire to greater and greater relevance, you have to take inventory and just be honest and assess "what do we have going for us that we can say is going to keep us from sinking into a less ambitious mindset as a group of fans?"

So much talent in the Southeast and Texas! We are the teams that will challenge the MWC (becasue the West Coast has a ton of football players too). Our direct competition... the conference we must out-perform... is the AAC. They are CUSA 'market' teams. Our goal should be to become the premier "non-elite" conference.

Interesting...

As a conference, we must win OOC games versus P5 & especially games versus other Go5 teams. Also have to do well in bowl games as well as March Madness. Need to be at least a 2 bid conference on a year to year basis.

Our girls are hotter.

We have you, sturt. You will keep us on our toes by continuing to start thought provoking threads, the replies to which will lead us to greatness.

Okay, sarcasm off.

There is absolutely nothing we fans can do except continue to buy tickets, go to games, and donate to support our programs. Everything else is up to our administrations, coaches and players. To garner respect you have to win. That's it.

(05-18-2013 04:29 PM)_sturt_ Wrote:  Want to hear your thoughts... what is going to keep CUSA 3.0 fans from adopting the same mentality as their MAC counterparts to the north? By mentality, I mean (... with apologies to my MAC friends, but they know it's true, if not about themselves, then about many others in their school's fan base...) a contentment with their current status and a lack of ambition to grow into something that could actually contend on a higher level of competition.

Don't misinterpret the question, or more importantly, the intent of the question. I'm a CUSA fan. I'm a realistic CUSA fan on the one hand--conscious of what realignment has done to our position--and on the other, an idealistic one who refuses to think as others do that we're necessarily destined to a lesser status.

But I think if you're going to aspire to greater and greater relevance, you have to take inventory and just be honest and assess "what do we have going for us that we can say is going to keep us from sinking into a less ambitious mindset as a group of fans?"

This may or may not answer your question BUT...

Everyone that has come through the CUSA pipeline (sans maybe Army) has aspired to do better... winning, program investment, facilities investment, chip on the shoulder from being 2nd class in their own states. Some have come out the other side into "better" spots than where they started. Some are in progress of upward trend--or, with some factors outside their control haven't moved up yet. The MAC is too content with their lot in life. CUSA Schools want to move onward and upward.

women's ncaa football could be a start. Next, I say we be the first conference to adopt MMA as a conference sport

(05-18-2013 07:47 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  women's ncaa football could be a start. Next, I say we be the first conference to adopt MMA as a conference sport

MMA could be Title IX certified as they have both mens and womens fighters.

Really...honestly....NOTHING

We are going to take it up the arse like the rest of America in the separation movement of the 'haves' and 'have nots'

...a pointless excursion....and I'm a half full guy (of shite...lol)

...too much money and influence to overcome

....smoke green....makes it much easier to handle....lmfao

(05-18-2013 07:52 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 07:47 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  women's ncaa football could be a start. Next, I say we be the first conference to adopt MMA as a conference sport

MMA could be Title IX certified as they have both mens and womens fighters.

now we're talking. screw the sports networks, we can make our money off of PPV and with 85 women's scholarships we wouldn't need other rinky-dinky sports that the majority of us don't care about.

(05-18-2013 07:39 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 04:29 PM)_sturt_ Wrote:  Want to hear your thoughts... what is going to keep CUSA 3.0 fans from adopting the same mentality as their MAC counterparts to the north? By mentality, I mean (... with apologies to my MAC friends, but they know it's true, if not about themselves, then about many others in their school's fan base...) a contentment with their current status and a lack of ambition to grow into something that could actually contend on a higher level of competition.

Don't misinterpret the question, or more importantly, the intent of the question. I'm a CUSA fan. I'm a realistic CUSA fan on the one hand--conscious of what realignment has done to our position--and on the other, an idealistic one who refuses to think as others do that we're necessarily destined to a lesser status.

But I think if you're going to aspire to greater and greater relevance, you have to take inventory and just be honest and assess "what do we have going for us that we can say is going to keep us from sinking into a less ambitious mindset as a group of fans?"

This may or may not answer your question BUT...

Everyone that has come through the CUSA pipeline (sans maybe Army) has aspired to do better... winning, program investment, facilities investment, chip on the shoulder from being 2nd class in their own states. Some have come out the other side into "better" spots than where they started. Some are in progress of upward trend--or, with some factors outside their control haven't moved up yet. The MAC is too content with their lot in life. CUSA Schools want to move onward and upward.

No there is a key difference but you and Sturt are missing it due to our schools cultural differences.

It is laughable to suggest that MAC schools do not want to improve. They keep adding/improving facilities, they keep finding ways to win in various sports, and they have managed to stay competitive with each other and with other schools across the country.

Let us use Kent State as an example because they are a quintessential MAC school. Every Mens sport outside track/cross country have been ranked in the top 25 recently (track has been successful in the MAC just not ranked), many womens sports have been ranked, baseball went to a college world series, basketball has had 19+ wins since the late 90s with an elite 8 several NCAA appearances and MAC titles, football FINALLY did something, wrestling had a national champion, golf has been fantastic finishing 5th last year. For at least the past 5 eyars Kent has been ranked in the 70s for the director's cup which is very good for a school at its level. Yet with all this success and all the school saying that they want to continue this trend and want to do even better you never hear Kent State saying it wants to leave. If the only way to improve your school was to try to leave conferences then how could this be?

The answer is simply that Kent State, like many MAC schools, sees the burden of improvement on itself and that leaving is not needed to get better. Unlike most of the CUSA schools past and present there is a long shared history between the schools and they are very similar as institutions and in what they can do. CUSA was not like that you have schools of all shapes, sizes, levels, and you have several schools that had or have significant advantages over the others (for example Memphis in CUSA 2 in reference to basketball).

Outside of a power league calling it just does not seem worth it for a MAC school to move. The evidence supports that MAC schools can and do improve while staying in the MAC and I don't see anything outside of a power conference (or perhaps the AAC IF they can somehow keep the perception that they are significantly more special than the rest of the 5 which currently it does not) doing enough for a MAC school. I don't see a move to CUSA as helping a MAC school in any way. They would be the same school, in a similar situation, with even less nearby to make for any local excitement.

Contrast this with CUSA schools with little to hold them in to a particular conference. For these schools you might as well just keep moving as it seems your schools are never happy with who they are with since you can't seem to find the right fit.

(05-18-2013 08:05 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 07:52 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 07:47 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  women's ncaa football could be a start. Next, I say we be the first conference to adopt MMA as a conference sport

MMA could be Title IX certified as they have both mens and womens fighters.

now we're talking. screw the sports networks, we can make our money off of PPV and with 85 women's scholarships we wouldn't need other rinky-dinky sports that the majority of us don't care about.

Women's Beach Volleyball FTEW!


*************

Personally, I'd like to see ECU go D1 Hockey and D1 Beach Volleyball.... Title IX covered and two sports worth watching in person

(05-18-2013 08:12 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 08:05 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 07:52 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 07:47 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  women's ncaa football could be a start. Next, I say we be the first conference to adopt MMA as a conference sport

MMA could be Title IX certified as they have both mens and womens fighters.

now we're talking. screw the sports networks, we can make our money off of PPV and with 85 women's scholarships we wouldn't need other rinky-dinky sports that the majority of us don't care about.

Women's Beach Volleyball FTEW!


*************

Personally, I'd like to see ECU go D1 Hockey and D1 Beach Volleyball.... Title IX covered and two sports worth watching in person

Man if there was one sport that I wish Kent would bring back is hockey. We used to have a team but it is club now (a good ranked club most of the time but it is not the same). The MAC could have a good league going if we brought back or brought online more hockey teams.

You know what is really laughable...that people still pay for cable/satellite.

We now have the means to play in our playground, not theirs.

Truly shocking to me fwiw.....

The only way to take them down is to not participate (regarding the networks)

FK 'EM!

(05-18-2013 08:16 PM)Sultan of Euphonistan Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 08:12 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 08:05 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 07:52 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 07:47 PM)randaddyminer Wrote:  women's ncaa football could be a start. Next, I say we be the first conference to adopt MMA as a conference sport

MMA could be Title IX certified as they have both mens and womens fighters.

now we're talking. screw the sports networks, we can make our money off of PPV and with 85 women's scholarships we wouldn't need other rinky-dinky sports that the majority of us don't care about.

Women's Beach Volleyball FTEW!


*************

Personally, I'd like to see ECU go D1 Hockey and D1 Beach Volleyball.... Title IX covered and two sports worth watching in person

Man if there was one sport that I wish Kent would bring back is hockey. We used to have a team but it is club now (a good ranked club most of the time but it is not the same). The MAC could have a good league going if we brought back or brought online more hockey teams.

I take hockey over any other sport to be in the stands....hands down the best spectator sport. Hands, feet, eyes, balance, speed, stick, puck....etc. IMO, is my favorite.

(05-18-2013 08:12 PM)Sultan of Euphonistan Wrote:  No there is a key difference but you and Sturt are missing it due to our schools cultural differences.

It is laughable to suggest that MAC schools do not want to improve. They keep adding/improving facilities, they keep finding ways to win in various sports, and they have managed to stay competitive with each other and with other schools across the country.

Let us use Kent State as an example because they are a quintessential MAC school. Every Mens sport outside track/cross country have been ranked in the top 25 recently (track has been successful in the MAC just not ranked), many womens sports have been ranked, baseball went to a college world series, basketball has had 19+ wins since the late 90s with an elite 8 several NCAA appearances and MAC titles, football FINALLY did something, wrestling had a national champion, golf has been fantastic finishing 5th last year. For at least the past 5 eyars Kent has been ranked in the 70s for the director's cup which is very good for a school at its level. Yet with all this success and all the school saying that they want to continue this trend and want to do even better you never hear Kent State saying it wants to leave. If the only way to improve your school was to try to leave conferences then how could this be?

The answer is simply that Kent State, like many MAC schools, sees the burden of improvement on itself and that leaving is not needed to get better. Unlike most of the CUSA schools past and present there is a long shared history between the schools and they are very similar as institutions and in what they can do. CUSA was not like that you have schools of all shapes, sizes, levels, and you have several schools that had or have significant advantages over the others (for example Memphis in CUSA 2 in reference to basketball).

Outside of a power league calling it just does not seem worth it for a MAC school to move. The evidence supports that MAC schools can and do improve while staying in the MAC and I don't see anything outside of a power conference (or perhaps the AAC IF they can somehow keep the perception that they are significantly more special than the rest of the 5 which currently it does not) doing enough for a MAC school. I don't see a move to CUSA as helping a MAC school in any way. They would be the same school, in a similar situation, with even less nearby to make for any local excitement.

Contrast this with CUSA schools with little to hold them in to a particular conference. For these schools you might as well just keep moving as it seems your schools are never happy with who they are with since you can't seem to find the right fit.

Its not wanting out of CUSA because of CUSA its moving onward to P5/BCS conference because that is were a good majority of CUSA schools aspire to be.

CUSA has never had geography on its side like the MAC has but for a majority the schools that have come through it they have had long histories together playing each other as CUSA mates, Independents, or in prior conference situations. ECU, USM, UC, Houston, Memphis to some degree Louisville and USF can be factored in.

(05-18-2013 08:01 PM)stinkfist Wrote:  Really...honestly....NOTHING

We are going to take it up the arse like the rest of America in the separation movement of the 'haves' and 'have nots'

...a pointless excursion....and I'm a half full guy (of shite...lol)

...too much money and influence to overcome

....smoke green....makes it much easier to handle....lmfao

Still will always be fun to watch one of us beat the haves on Saturdays!

(05-18-2013 08:32 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 08:12 PM)Sultan of Euphonistan Wrote:  No there is a key difference but you and Sturt are missing it due to our schools cultural differences.

It is laughable to suggest that MAC schools do not want to improve. They keep adding/improving facilities, they keep finding ways to win in various sports, and they have managed to stay competitive with each other and with other schools across the country.

Let us use Kent State as an example because they are a quintessential MAC school. Every Mens sport outside track/cross country have been ranked in the top 25 recently (track has been successful in the MAC just not ranked), many womens sports have been ranked, baseball went to a college world series, basketball has had 19+ wins since the late 90s with an elite 8 several NCAA appearances and MAC titles, football FINALLY did something, wrestling had a national champion, golf has been fantastic finishing 5th last year. For at least the past 5 eyars Kent has been ranked in the 70s for the director's cup which is very good for a school at its level. Yet with all this success and all the school saying that they want to continue this trend and want to do even better you never hear Kent State saying it wants to leave. If the only way to improve your school was to try to leave conferences then how could this be?

The answer is simply that Kent State, like many MAC schools, sees the burden of improvement on itself and that leaving is not needed to get better. Unlike most of the CUSA schools past and present there is a long shared history between the schools and they are very similar as institutions and in what they can do. CUSA was not like that you have schools of all shapes, sizes, levels, and you have several schools that had or have significant advantages over the others (for example Memphis in CUSA 2 in reference to basketball).

Outside of a power league calling it just does not seem worth it for a MAC school to move. The evidence supports that MAC schools can and do improve while staying in the MAC and I don't see anything outside of a power conference (or perhaps the AAC IF they can somehow keep the perception that they are significantly more special than the rest of the 5 which currently it does not) doing enough for a MAC school. I don't see a move to CUSA as helping a MAC school in any way. They would be the same school, in a similar situation, with even less nearby to make for any local excitement.

Contrast this with CUSA schools with little to hold them in to a particular conference. For these schools you might as well just keep moving as it seems your schools are never happy with who they are with since you can't seem to find the right fit.

Its not wanting out of CUSA because of CUSA its moving onward to P5/BCS conference because that is were a good majority of CUSA schools aspire to be.

CUSA has never had geography on its side like the MAC has but for a majority the schools that have come through it they have had long histories together playing each other as CUSA mates, Independents, or in prior conference situations. ECU, USM, UC, Houston, Memphis to some degree Louisville and USF can be factored in.

IF we can get UAB back in the East we may have geography on our side.

(05-18-2013 08:32 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  

(05-18-2013 08:12 PM)Sultan of Euphonistan Wrote:  No there is a key difference but you and Sturt are missing it due to our schools cultural differences.

It is laughable to suggest that MAC schools do not want to improve. They keep adding/improving facilities, they keep finding ways to win in various sports, and they have managed to stay competitive with each other and with other schools across the country.

Let us use Kent State as an example because they are a quintessential MAC school. Every Mens sport outside track/cross country have been ranked in the top 25 recently (track has been successful in the MAC just not ranked), many womens sports have been ranked, baseball went to a college world series, basketball has had 19+ wins since the late 90s with an elite 8 several NCAA appearances and MAC titles, football FINALLY did something, wrestling had a national champion, golf has been fantastic finishing 5th last year. For at least the past 5 eyars Kent has been ranked in the 70s for the director's cup which is very good for a school at its level. Yet with all this success and all the school saying that they want to continue this trend and want to do even better you never hear Kent State saying it wants to leave. If the only way to improve your school was to try to leave conferences then how could this be?

The answer is simply that Kent State, like many MAC schools, sees the burden of improvement on itself and that leaving is not needed to get better. Unlike most of the CUSA schools past and present there is a long shared history between the schools and they are very similar as institutions and in what they can do. CUSA was not like that you have schools of all shapes, sizes, levels, and you have several schools that had or have significant advantages over the others (for example Memphis in CUSA 2 in reference to basketball).

Outside of a power league calling it just does not seem worth it for a MAC school to move. The evidence supports that MAC schools can and do improve while staying in the MAC and I don't see anything outside of a power conference (or perhaps the AAC IF they can somehow keep the perception that they are significantly more special than the rest of the 5 which currently it does not) doing enough for a MAC school. I don't see a move to CUSA as helping a MAC school in any way. They would be the same school, in a similar situation, with even less nearby to make for any local excitement.

Contrast this with CUSA schools with little to hold them in to a particular conference. For these schools you might as well just keep moving as it seems your schools are never happy with who they are with since you can't seem to find the right fit.

Its not wanting out of CUSA because of CUSA its moving onward to P5/BCS conference because that is were a good majority of CUSA schools aspire to be.

CUSA has never had geography on its side like the MAC has but for a majority the schools that have come through it they have had long histories together playing each other as CUSA mates, Independents, or in prior conference situations. ECU, USM, UC, Houston, Memphis to some degree Louisville and USF can be factored in.

True and that subset could be happy in a league together but that is the issue isn't it? In order to make a full league you have to bring in outsiders and for many of your schools you are used to being alone and just playing select schools. This is not a "bad" thing but I do think it colors your view of what is acceptable. A MAC school has not had to be alone for decades and I think that colors our view. We like to play each other and we like the idea of pushing forward together.

As an example of that think of the old MVC with Tulsa. Tulsa ended up leaving because most of that conference would not or could not stay in FBS (or at least I think so a Tulsa fan could correct me if I am wrong). MAC schools were in the same boat but somehow we as a full conference decided to stay in FBS as a group. I bet the conversations leading to that were very interesting because I am sure there were schools that wanted to stay FBS and others that probably thought to move down. In the end we decided that staying together at FBS was the best choice and today I would say that it continues to be a good choice because it helps keep us in the public view (not as much as a power conference but still more than most non-FBS leagues).