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big east was the most under rated conference of all time
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Dr. Isaly von Yinzer Offline
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Post: #101
RE: big east was the most under rated conference of all time
I think when we're talking about Paterno, or the Catholic schools, or anyone else involved, the clear takeaway - for me at least - is that there are no white knights or victims in this process. Everyone played in role in this process and nobody is blameless. Also, that aspect of this discussion is 100 percent irrelevant.

The Northeastern all sports league never came together for the same reasons that the Big East ultimately fell apart: everyone had their own interests and agendas and was unwilling to bend/bend enough/continue to bend on those issues to make things work. It's not remotely complicated.
(This post was last modified: 07-14-2013 11:21 AM by Dr. Isaly von Yinzer.)
07-14-2013 11:20 AM
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CardinalZen Offline
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Post: #102
RE: big east was the most under rated conference of all time
I'm just sorry that Big East 2.0 didn't hold together. It was fun while it lasted.

It was the conference structure that was unworkable over the long term, so individual schools or groups of schools shouldn't be blamed for it failing.

Don't hate the player. Hate the game.

04-cheers
07-14-2013 11:34 AM
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CardFan1 Offline
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Post: #103
RE: big east was the most under rated conference of all time
the final blow was when the Big East wouldn't finish a west partnership for Boise and SDSU. had they brought in more farther West schools. the travel costs could have been cut in half had BYU, UNLV, Fresno or others been brought in with Houston, SMU and put Memphis in the East , but the administration of the BE waited too long and added more Eastern oriented schools. The C7 Would probably still have left later as We would or any other with a power 5 invite. Boise could have kept a power 6 AQ hope alive had BYU worked out.
(This post was last modified: 07-14-2013 01:06 PM by CardFan1.)
07-14-2013 01:03 PM
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john01992 Offline
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Post: #104
RE: big east was the most under rated conference of all time
(07-14-2013 01:03 PM)CardFan1 Wrote:  the final blow was when the Big East wouldn't finish a west partnership for Boise and SDSU. had they brought in more farther West schools. the travel costs could have been cut in half had BYU, UNLV, Fresno or others been brought in with Houston, SMU and put Memphis in the East , but the administration of the BE waited too long and added more Eastern oriented schools. The C7 Would probably still have left later as We would or any other with a power 5 invite. Boise could have kept a power 6 AQ hope alive had BYU worked out.

had bsu joined a year early like the big east wanted, temple would never have been added
07-14-2013 01:33 PM
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NJRedMan Offline
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Post: #105
RE: big east was the most under rated conference of all time
(07-14-2013 01:03 PM)CardFan1 Wrote:  the final blow was when the Big East wouldn't finish a west partnership for Boise and SDSU. had they brought in more farther West schools. the travel costs could have been cut in half had BYU, UNLV, Fresno or others been brought in with Houston, SMU and put Memphis in the East , but the administration of the BE waited too long and added more Eastern oriented schools. The C7 Would probably still have left later as We would or any other with a power 5 invite. Boise could have kept a power 6 AQ hope alive had BYU worked out.

Not really, they still would have most likely backed out after you guys and Rutgers left.
07-14-2013 02:20 PM
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NJRedMan Offline
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Post: #106
RE: big east was the most under rated conference of all time
(07-14-2013 01:03 AM)johnbragg Wrote:  
(07-13-2013 10:15 PM)john01992 Wrote:  im so sick of this false mentality from c7/new big east fans that they were not responsible for the breakup for the league. im sick of these comments that they didnt ask/get special treatment when in fact they did.
I already got called a lying troll by one of you guys only to post factual evidence proving that im right, and now imma do the same with you.

myth #1 the c7 never got football money
-the BC AD in an interview stated that the acc contract had a 85%-15% football-basketball value. the big east contract gave 66% to football 33% to basketball. clearly the big east had more basketball value than the acc. but 33%?????? thats way overpriced.

Given the experiences of the AAC and the Big East, I suggest that ESPN was feeding the ACC a load of crap.

There were two separate contracts, negotiated separately. Three actually, because there was also a basketball contract with CBS.

Best I can piece together: http://espn.go.com/blog/playbook/dollars/post/_/id/705/

The ESPN football contract was for $100M for 7 years, about $14M a year, which is about $1.8M per school for football.

The ESPN basketball contract was for $100M for 6 years, about $16.66M per year, which means a little over $1M per school for basketball from ESPN.

And the CBS deal was for $54M for 6 years, $9M per year, a little over $500,000 per school.

So basketball was bringing in around $25M a year in TV money, football was bringing in $14M.

Quote:-of the negotiated split between the 110 million in exit fees, even though 13% of it came from football only members sdsu, tcu, & bsu, and the loss of those schools hurt in fb much more than bb, the aac/c7 negotiated to split it 50-50. the right for msg & the name was then deducted from the C7s 50% share. the cost the c7 paid for the name & msg was so undervalued that you have to assume that part of the deal was that the c7 gave up its claim to football related money

The $110 million was the exit fees and basketball credits left behind by the football schools that left. We left almost all of that money behind, in return for the name, the MSG contract, and waiving the 27-month waiting period. I'm not sure what you're getting at here.

Quote:myth #2 the C7 never asked for football revenue
-i already posted a quote from mike trangese stating that the basketball members asked for 25% of the football revenue back in the 80s

There wasn't any Big East football revenue in the 80s, because there wasnt any Big East football.

Quote:-heres an excerpt from an espn article stating just how bad the BB mentality was.....

Last year, at the spring meetings in Ponte Vedra Beach, Fla., one proposal suggested a 75/25 split -- 75 percent of the money going to football schools, and 25 percent going to basketball schools. One athletic director at a basketball school raised his hand and wondered why the numbers were not flipped, since hoops is the reason the Big East exists in the first place.

I still wonder if the quote is accurate. Because in the Boise STate expansion agreement, Boise State had an out clause if 70% of the TV revenues "are not allocated to the broadcast of football games." So were the ADs talking about 25% going to basketball SCHOOLS, or the basketball CONTRACT? Because that would mean 12.5% going to the basketball schools. Since under the 2006-2012 contracts, basketball was bringing in 2/3 of the money and football 1/3 of the money, I suggest that the basketball AD's comment is best translated as "Go f--- yourself."

myth #3, the bb schools didnt vote on FB issues
-jim boehiem blamed notre dame for why the 1.4 bill football contract failed and yahoo reported that notre dame lead the charge against it

-espn reported that georgetown voted no and lead the charge against it

The four schools who voted NO initially were, yes, Georgetown, joined by Pitt, Rutgers and West Virginia. I remember hearing somewhere that those three have FBS football teams. (After the PAC deal, the vote against the ESPN deal was unanimous.)

Quote:you guys gotta come down to reality and stop pretending the bb schools werent ******** to the fb schools. and lets face it, the only reason why they allowed fb to happen in the first place was because they saw $ and wanted a piece of the pie.

No. The basketball schools tried again and again to accommodate the football schools. But nothing was enough. Did the basketball schools want MIami? No. Did the basketball schools want Rutgers, West Virginia and eventually Virginia Tech? No.

Quote:why do you think so many of the bb schools upgraded their football including a failed attempt by c7 member villanova.

The only basketball school that upgraded was UConn.

Quote:the bb schools got more special treatment than any other conference including the 4 texas schools in the b12, the 4 nc schools in the acc, byu with the wac/mwc & the 4 california schools in the pac. the BE commish was a providence for almost the entire time of the BE existence and the conference was HQ'd in providence.

these schools have huge egos, they hated the FB direction the conference was going and refused to accept it. when BC/cuse begged for psu to join they said no, when miami begged for more schools to close the outlier gap they said no, when the FB schools asked for a new contact to make their payout closer to other bcs conferences they said no.

but what i think really annoyed those schools into leaving.......was that they couldnt handle the fact that the football schools were better than them. they couldnt come to terms with louisville, syracuse, & uconn running the show. while nova, sju, shu, provy, gtown & shu were down, pitt, cincy, su, lv, uconn, & wvu were running the show while the only bb school running the show was quette. they couldnt handle the truth that the fb schools were better than them in bb

No, that was what was holding the league together at that point. It would have been madness to walk away from a basketball league with Syracuse, UConn, Louisville etc. But Syracuse, Pitt, West Virginia, Louisville walked away.

Quote:which is probably why they wanted nothing to do with uconn, notre dame, cincy, temple, & Memphis as bb only members

/Cocks head like terrier/ Wha?

Quote:they kicked a charter member out of the league,

UConn chose FBS football. It's possible that UConn would have been accepted by the C7 but UConn had no place to put football.

And before we throw UConn a pity party over the C7's perfidy in kicking them out, let's remember that they were publicly begging for an ACC invite. Not that I blame them given what was going on, but just mentioning it.

Quote:and to show how sleezy & scummy these schools are......look no further than their new bb contract. the 7 BE schools get 3 million a year while the 3 newcomers get 500k a year. thats the most lopsided revenue sharing plan in the history of college sports. which goes back to my earlier statement. these schools just cant handle the fact that these schools (xavier, creighton, butler are better than they are in basketball.....so they give them less money to show their dominance

That would be a really good point except that it's not happening.
[/quote]

Thanks John, for being more level headed than I was when I saw these ridiculous claims being posted. Your response was what I wanted to say but couldn't find the words. The claims he was making were so far off base it was maddening.
07-14-2013 05:43 PM
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