Lolly Popp Wrote:Something still doesn't make sense. If Willingham was secretly talking to Washington and Notre Dame was planning to fire him anyway, why didn't they just let him take the Washington job and quit on them? That way they could have avoided all of the negative publicity and there would be no race questions.

Notre Dame could have taken the high road, thanked Willingham for his three years, even though it didn't turn out to be the best fit, and wished him well in the future. They could have also started their own secret coaching search for his replacement as all of this was going on.

But no. They are high and mighty Notre Dame. They can't have a coach quit on them. They have to have the last word in every conversation. Their decision has to be the be all and end all. It was a bad way to handle the situation. They should have let him quit, saved the money, and avoided the bad publicity.

I'd say this is certainly closer to the truth and it has nothing to do with race.

L-yes Wrote:

OSUofL Wrote:

L-yes Wrote:

SF Husky Wrote:The point is ND committed to Charlie Weiss without any hesitation after he had similar 1st year as coach Willingham. Even though ND fans think Weiss is the next coming, but the truth is his ND team has beat some ok teams but lost badly to some good teams (see game vs. OSU last year). I think Weiss will have a decent year due to a weaker schedule, but we really don't know because this ND team is clearly overrated. Please keep in mind coach Willingham had very tough schedules while he was at ND.

Anyway, who knows what went behind the door but it won't surprise anyone if his firing had more to do with what happened on the football field. After all, there is a reason why there are 6 or 7 black football coaches in D-1A. Hint: It has nothing to be with football coaching abilities. I am just glad Washington gave him a chance.

That 'hint' is perhaps the biggest reach in this thread. I assure you that if black coaches were winning ball games they would have jobs.

Not always true pal.

Enlighten me and tell me where its happened. Arkansas and Nolan Richardson?

Tell you where whats happened?

[quote="njndirish"]The Ty Willingham fact sheet

THE TY WILLINGHAM FACT SHEET:

1. Tyrone Willingham has lost 8 games by at least 3 touchdowns. By comparison, Bob Davie lost 4 games by 3 touchdowns and Gerry Faust lost 3 games by 3 touchdowns. That means that in 3 years Tyrone Willingham has lost more games by 3 touchdowns than Bob Davie and Gerry Faust did in their 10 years combined.



2. Notre Dame was shut out by at least 30 points twice in 2003. The last time that happened was 1904.

3. In Tyrone Willingham

SF Husky Wrote:Great coach and I don't think he got a fair shake at ND. I am almost certain skin color had a lot to do with his firing. ND got Charlie Weiss and he is a good coach, but his ND squad is so overrated it is sickening.

Agreed ND Sux and is wicked overated. They should have lost to Michigan State, it was a fluke that they won.........they should go 6-6 or 7-5.
Once again they will take a bowl from the Big East, they should be thrown out now, don't care about their agreement with NBC. Join or out of BE......
The Irish Catholics adore ND and they are in high places this is why they got rated high......

Stookey57 Wrote:

SF Husky Wrote:Great coach and I don't think he got a fair shake at ND. I am almost certain skin color had a lot to do with his firing. ND got Charlie Weiss and he is a good coach, but his ND squad is so overrated it is sickening.

Agreed ND Sux and is wicked overated. They should have lost to Michigan State, it was a fluke that they won.........they should go 6-6 or 7-5.
Once again they will take a bowl from the Big East, they should be thrown out now, don't care about their agreement with NBC. Join or out of BE......
The Irish Catholics adore ND and they are in high places this is why they got rated high......

If Notre Dame goes 7-5 or 6-6 this year, I don't think many fans would complain if they took the Big East's spot in the Birmingham Bowl, no one seems to be excited about going there anyway. Just keep them away from the Gator/Sun, Houston Texas, Meineke, or Toronto.

ND should beat Purdue and has a toss up with UCLA. With 2 wins here, a loss to USC, and 5 cupcakes to finish they are in a BCS Bowl with a 10-2 record collecting 4.? million for the bowl. BE gets Sun / Gator, BCS (2?), and the Trained goose mickey mouse bowls. We will take them all.

Back to the title of the thread Willingham is a class act and Weis is still winning with his recruits. It will take until years three and four to properly evaluate the real Charlie Weiss. However by then he should be able to build off the success of Willingham's recruits and his pro style offense. :shhh:

I am no Notre Dame apologist but to imply that Willingham was let for anything other than poor performance would be laughable if it wasn't so sad. Does racism still rear its ugly head in todays world? I'm sorry to say that it does. Thankfully there are people that watch for it and hold us ALL accountable when it happens. Does anyone think for a minute that a African American coach could be removed from a high profile job without causing a stir if the removal was for something other than job performance. The NAACP and Rainbow Coalition would have been to Willingham's defense in a second and rightfully so.
We have all had jobs that just don't seem like the right fit. I think Willingham knew he made a mistake leaving Stanford the day he walked into Notre Dame. Perhaps Ty is a west coast guy and likes to coach outside the media spotlight that is Notre Dame football. Some people thrive under pressure some don't. Maybe PAC10 football is what best fits Coach Willingham.
CJ

I agree with the idea that Notre Dame should have just let Ty Willingham quit and go to Washington on his own. How could they be dumb enough not to realize that firing him would just cause them unflattering controversy? Then, instead of paying him a settlement package, they could have bought new uniforms for the women's swimming team or something. Yes, I know money is no obstacle at Notre Dame, but they wasted a nice chunk of change all the same.

Stookey57 You are a complete idiot

Quote:Dude your taking up way to much space here, this post is disrespectful.
This is the BE not notre dame board, so get the hell out of here and go to ND board. ND sux and they should be thrown out of the Big East, they do whats best for them period.......your not wanted here so leave and don't come back.

In response to your 1st post
1. I have been on this board longer than you, back when it was a part of thenewbigeast.com
2. Your flame is one of many i will endure
3. My first post was to prove why Tyrone Willingham was fired, and its very good proof at that, no matter the length
4. kicked out of the big east, check the ratings, the sold out venues, and the BE Champs in baseball, cross country, womens soccer, womens volleyball, golf, rowing, Track and field, and softball, then tell me ND is bad and doesn't belong in the BE

Quote:Agreed ND Sux and is wicked overrated. They should have lost to Michigan State, it was a fluke that they won.........they should go 6-6 or 7-5.
Once again they will take a bowl from the Big East, they should be thrown out now, don't care about their agreement with NBC. Join or out of BE......
The Irish Catholics adore ND and they are in high places this is why they got rated high......

ND sux, wow that's like saying notre lame lol
6-6, now where are these 5 losses coming from
Purdue?
Army?
Navy?
Air Force?
UCLA?
Stanford?
UNC?
USC is the only team i see ND could lose to. (Key word could not going to) And don't scream that overrated sh#t at me. ND is ranked where ND is ranked. I like to gloat about rankings, but in the end i know they mean nothing unless you are #1.
NBC has no influence on the BE nor ND.
Your last statement is Bigotry, Irish Catholics all don't love ND 1st of all. I know some who dont. 2nd not many Irish Catholics vote in the AP, Harris, or Coaches poll. 3rd You are just a good ole bigot, not racism because racism involves hatred, you just don't like irish catholics because you are stupid.

Quote:I am no Notre Dame apologist but to imply that Willingham was let for anything other than poor performance would be laughable if it wasn't so sad. Does racism still rear its ugly head in todays world? I'm sorry to say that it does. Thankfully there are people that watch for it and hold us ALL accountable when it happens. Does anyone think for a minute that a African American coach could be removed from a high profile job without causing a stir if the removal was for something other than job performance. The NAACP and Rainbow Coalition would have been to Willingham's defense in a second and rightfully so.

To counter your point, Ty was offered lawyers from the NAACP, but he refused. He told them that he was rightfully fired because he did not do his job to expectations. I understand where you are coming from, but ND is different from UL. ND wants the major bowl every year, whether the 2nd place BE bowl or better, not some website bowl. ND dosen't want to be blown out by thirty on a regular basis by the same team. UL has been moving forward and doesn't have the 125 year history ND has. I conclude that Ty was fired because of his poor coaching (by ND standards)

njndirish Wrote:Stookey57 You are a complete idiot

Quote:Dude your taking up way to much space here, this post is disrespectful.
This is the BE not notre dame board, so get the hell out of here and go to ND board. ND sux and they should be thrown out of the Big East, they do whats best for them period.......your not wanted here so leave and don't come back.

In response to your 1st post
1. I have been on this board longer than you, back when it was a part of thenewbigeast.com
2. Your flame is one of many i will endure
3. My first post was to prove why Tyrone Willingham was fired, and its very good proof at that, no matter the length
4. kicked out of the big east, check the ratings, the sold out venues, and the BE Champs in baseball, cross country, womens soccer, womens volleyball, golf, rowing, Track and field, and softball, then tell me ND is bad and doesn't belong in the BE

Quote:Agreed ND Sux and is wicked overrated. They should have lost to Michigan State, it was a fluke that they won.........they should go 6-6 or 7-5.
Once again they will take a bowl from the Big East, they should be thrown out now, don't care about their agreement with NBC. Join or out of BE......
The Irish Catholics adore ND and they are in high places this is why they got rated high......

ND sux, wow that's like saying notre lame lol
6-6, now where are these 5 losses coming from
Purdue?
Army?
Navy?
Air Force?
UCLA?
Stanford?
UNC?
USC is the only team i see ND could lose to. (Key word could not going to) And don't scream that overrated sh#t at me. ND is ranked where ND is ranked. I like to gloat about rankings, but in the end i know they mean nothing unless you are #1.
NBC has no influence on the BE nor ND.
Your last statement is Bigotry, Irish Catholics all don't love ND 1st of all. I know some who dont. 2nd not many Irish Catholics vote in the AP, Harris, or Coaches poll. 3rd You are just a good ole bigot, not racism because racism involves hatred, you just don't like irish catholics because you are stupid.

Quote:I am no Notre Dame apologist but to imply that Willingham was let for anything other than poor performance would be laughable if it wasn't so sad. Does racism still rear its ugly head in todays world? I'm sorry to say that it does. Thankfully there are people that watch for it and hold us ALL accountable when it happens. Does anyone think for a minute that a African American coach could be removed from a high profile job without causing a stir if the removal was for something other than job performance. The NAACP and Rainbow Coalition would have been to Willingham's defense in a second and rightfully so.

To counter your point, Ty was offered lawyers from the NAACP, but he refused. He told them that he was rightfully fired because he did not do his job to expectations. I understand where you are coming from, but ND is different from UL. ND wants the major bowl every year, whether the 2nd place BE bowl or better, not some website bowl. ND dosen't want to be blown out by thirty on a regular basis by the same team. UL has been moving forward and doesn't have the 125 year history ND has. I conclude that Ty was fired because of his poor coaching (by ND standards)

NJIrish, you are a very childish individual. I know that your just a kid, but please learn to except other folks opinions no matter how much they may sound stupid TO YOU. You are attacking people and calling them stupid, or telling them their an idiot or a bigot, simply because you dont agree with what they said. Noone has called you a name and you have said some of the silliest things that I have ever read on the internet. You really need to grow up.

BTW, just because you have been posting here longer than someone else does not give you any more credibility than anyone else. And it doesnt make dumb things that you say sound any smarter.

just the way this person went around talking about ND just drove me up a wall

L-yes Wrote:

SF Husky Wrote:Great coach and I don't think he got a fair shake at ND. I am almost certain skin color had a lot to do with his firing. ND got Charlie Weiss and he is a good coach, but his HD squad is so overrated it is sickening.

The above quote is sickening. He was terrible at Notre Dame and I'm not even a Notre Dame fan. But hey, race cards are fun to play.

I have yet to meet one person, even one, who uses the term "race card" with any regularity who is worth taking seriously.

That said, I think there was more than sufficient reason to fire a coach who wasn't performing up to expectations. The same could have been said of Davie. Why the two situations went down differently only the insiders know. It's just as naive and misguided to claim he was fired because of racism as it is to argue that it could not have been a factor. Did any of you have to take logic in school? Come on.