Hello There, Guest! (LoginRegister)

Post Reply 
Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
Author Message
Hokie Mark Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 23,830
Joined: Sep 2011
Reputation: 1410
I Root For: VT, ACC teams
Location: Greensboro, NC
Post: #1
Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
When Warchant asked Swofford about what the ACC might do once the NCAA rules on conference championship games are changed, he made these statements:

Quote:(1) "what we are for... is to eliminate NCAA requirements that you... play everybody in [your] division"
(2) "...one thing we do continue to look at ...whether there's a better way ...that our teams that are in separate divisions are playing each other more often"
(3) "the majority of our schools continue to prefer having divisions and having the divisions as they currently exist."

Sounds like he's talking about skipping some teams in your own division each year in order to play more crossover games.

Now the only model that really works out mathematically is 3 permanent rivals and 5 rotating games (as we've discussed here before). If we assume that teams want to keep their current crossover rival as one of the permanents, that leaves 2 in division, which works out like this:
* IN DIVISION: 2 permanent, 2 rotate (every other year)
* CROSS DIVISION: 1 permanent, 3 rotate (every other year)

Ex. Florida State might play Miami, Clemson and Louisville every year, then rotate as follows:
* Atlantic: NC State, BC - OR - Wake, Cuse
* Coastal: GT, Duke, VA - OR - UNC, VT, Pitt

Seems very workable to me... the big question: if everyone keeps their crossover "rival" as-is, who would be the 2 permanent in-division rivals for each team?
04-24-2015 03:46 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


Wolfman Offline
All American
*

Posts: 4,465
Joined: Nov 2011
Reputation: 181
I Root For: The Cartel
Location: Raleigh, NC
Post: #2
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
I prefer the 3-5-5 scenario.
04-24-2015 04:02 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
krux Offline
Banned

Posts: 2,490
Joined: Apr 2010
I Root For: Louisville
Location: st louis
Post: #3
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
I'm greedy...Give Louisville FSU and Clemson, please :D
04-24-2015 04:02 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
georgia_tech_swagger Offline
Res publica non dominetur
*

Posts: 51,449
Joined: Feb 2002
Reputation: 2027
I Root For: GT, USCU, FU, WYO
Location: Upstate, SC

SkunkworksFolding@NCAAbbsNCAAbbs LUGCrappies
Post: #4
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
(04-24-2015 03:46 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  * IN DIVISION: 2 permanent, 2 rotate (every other year)
* CROSS DIVISION: 1 permanent, 3 rotate (every other year)


Georgia Tech permanents:
In Division: Duke, UNC
Cross Division: Clemson

Virginia, Pitt, and FSU are the only other teams that move the needle.
04-24-2015 04:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
CollegeCard Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 12,102
Joined: Sep 2004
Reputation: 317
I Root For: UofL
Location: Ohio
Post: #5
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
(04-24-2015 04:11 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  
(04-24-2015 03:46 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  * IN DIVISION: 2 permanent, 2 rotate (every other year)
* CROSS DIVISION: 1 permanent, 3 rotate (every other year)


Georgia Tech permanents:
In Division: Duke, UNC
Cross Division: Clemson

Virginia, Pitt, and FSU are the only other teams that move the needle.

I'm curious, is Pitt a personal preference or are you speaking for the average GT fan? I wouldn't have expected to see Pitt so high on the list for GT compared to schools that are closer geographically and have more games played against the Yellow Jackets.
04-24-2015 04:27 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
MKPitt Offline
Special Teams
*

Posts: 844
Joined: Dec 2012
Reputation: 51
I Root For: Pitt
Location:
Post: #6
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
In division it would be VT and Miami followed by GT, UNC then Duke and UVA tied for last.

I'm happy with Syracuse as the crossover and Louisville and BC would be fine too from the Atlantic. Personally, I don't really care at all about playing NC State, WF, Clemson or FSU annually but wouldn't mind seeing them all a little more than once every 6 years.
(This post was last modified: 04-24-2015 04:34 PM by MKPitt.)
04-24-2015 04:30 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


Hokie Mark Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 23,830
Joined: Sep 2011
Reputation: 1410
I Root For: VT, ACC teams
Location: Greensboro, NC
Post: #7
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
(04-24-2015 04:02 PM)Wolfman Wrote:  I prefer the 3-5-5 scenario.

That's what this is, just with divisions kind of overlaid to keep certain folks happy.
04-24-2015 04:46 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
georgia_tech_swagger Offline
Res publica non dominetur
*

Posts: 51,449
Joined: Feb 2002
Reputation: 2027
I Root For: GT, USCU, FU, WYO
Location: Upstate, SC

SkunkworksFolding@NCAAbbsNCAAbbs LUGCrappies
Post: #8
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
(04-24-2015 04:27 PM)CollegeCard Wrote:  I'm curious, is Pitt a personal preference or are you speaking for the average GT fan? I wouldn't have expected to see Pitt so high on the list for GT compared to schools that are closer geographically and have more games played against the Yellow Jackets.

The two institutions are quite similar. Strong academics. In a pro city. Very rich history in football. Has an in state cow college which does dirty things and which all the Wal-Mart fans gravitate to. Has a famous place serving burgers/dogs nearby which will taste amazing right before it gives you a heart attack and evacuates your entire lower track. Both have alumni as major ESPN personalities ... though ours doesn't slurp the SEC. They played the Sugar Bowl against each other in what is I believe the first integrated game against a team from the Deep South, to the protest of GA's Governor at the time.
(This post was last modified: 04-24-2015 04:51 PM by georgia_tech_swagger.)
04-24-2015 04:48 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
georgia_tech_swagger Offline
Res publica non dominetur
*

Posts: 51,449
Joined: Feb 2002
Reputation: 2027
I Root For: GT, USCU, FU, WYO
Location: Upstate, SC

SkunkworksFolding@NCAAbbsNCAAbbs LUGCrappies
Post: #9
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
Oh -- and if it is divisionless:

Georgia Tech permanent rivals: Clemson, Duke, UNC in that very explicit order.

Beyond that FSU, UVA, Pitt in that order but only weakly so.
04-24-2015 04:52 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Ragu Online
All American
*

Posts: 4,844
Joined: May 2012
Reputation: 608
I Root For: FAU/FSU
Location:
Post: #10
Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
(04-24-2015 04:52 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  Oh -- and if it is divisionless:

Georgia Tech permanent rivals: Clemson, Duke, UNC in that very explicit order.

Beyond that FSU, UVA, Pitt in that order but only weakly so.

Unc would probably want duke nc st and uva in that scenario

I'd rather have 3 permanent rivals with Georgia tech instead of Louisville but this lay out isn't bad either.

Majority wanting the divisions as they are is the coastal division plus prob nc state
(This post was last modified: 04-24-2015 05:19 PM by Ragu.)
04-24-2015 05:17 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
ChrisLords Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 8,685
Joined: Jun 2007
Reputation: 339
I Root For: Virginia Tech
Location: Earth
Post: #11
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
I think what will eventually happen is GT will swap divisions with Louisville. It puts both schools in divisions with the schools closest to them. Whether or not we'll skip teams in our division to play more in the other division, I don't know. I'd like to see it happen though.

Coastal
-----
Duke
Louisville
Miami
North Carolina
Pittsburgh
Virginia
Virginia Tech

Atlantic
-----
Boston College
Clemson
Florida State
Georgia Tech
North Carolina State
Syracuse
Wake Forest
04-24-2015 06:02 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


georgia_tech_swagger Offline
Res publica non dominetur
*

Posts: 51,449
Joined: Feb 2002
Reputation: 2027
I Root For: GT, USCU, FU, WYO
Location: Upstate, SC

SkunkworksFolding@NCAAbbsNCAAbbs LUGCrappies
Post: #12
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
(04-24-2015 06:02 PM)ChrisLords Wrote:  I think what will eventually happen is GT will swap divisions with Louisville. It puts both schools in divisions with the schools closest to them. Whether or not we'll skip teams in our division to play more in the other division, I don't know. I'd like to see it happen though.

Coastal
-----
Duke
Louisville
Miami
North Carolina
Pittsburgh
Virginia
Virginia Tech

Atlantic
-----
Boston College
Clemson
Florida State
Georgia Tech
North Carolina State
Syracuse
Wake Forest

Very very deeply not a fan. GT already had Clemson. In this swap it gives up UVA, Pitt, UNC, and Duke for FSU. FAIL.
04-24-2015 06:06 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Ragu Online
All American
*

Posts: 4,844
Joined: May 2012
Reputation: 608
I Root For: FAU/FSU
Location:
Post: #13
Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
The coastal teams didn't want wake bc and cuse. Hence they forced them on fsu and Clemson.

Like I said I like gt more than Louisville but I can definitely live with this setup. Fsu plays cuse bc and wake half as much while getting the other coastal teams 3 times as much.

I'll take it

And the pansy schools still have a shot to win a soft division in some years
(This post was last modified: 04-24-2015 06:37 PM by Ragu.)
04-24-2015 06:30 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
EvilVodka Offline
stuff

Posts: 3,585
Joined: Jan 2014
I Root For: FSU LSU
Location: Houston, TX
Post: #14
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
(04-24-2015 04:02 PM)krux Wrote:  I'm greedy...Give Louisville FSU and Clemson, please :D

Works for me
04-24-2015 06:40 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
EvilVodka Offline
stuff

Posts: 3,585
Joined: Jan 2014
I Root For: FSU LSU
Location: Houston, TX
Post: #15
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
(04-24-2015 06:06 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  
(04-24-2015 06:02 PM)ChrisLords Wrote:  I think what will eventually happen is GT will swap divisions with Louisville. It puts both schools in divisions with the schools closest to them. Whether or not we'll skip teams in our division to play more in the other division, I don't know. I'd like to see it happen though.

Coastal
-----
Duke
Louisville
Miami
North Carolina
Pittsburgh
Virginia
Virginia Tech

Atlantic
-----
Boston College
Clemson
Florida State
Georgia Tech
North Carolina State
Syracuse
Wake Forest

Very very deeply not a fan. GT already had Clemson. In this swap it gives up UVA, Pitt, UNC, and Duke for FSU. FAIL.

You're skeeeered
04-24-2015 06:42 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
georgia_tech_swagger Offline
Res publica non dominetur
*

Posts: 51,449
Joined: Feb 2002
Reputation: 2027
I Root For: GT, USCU, FU, WYO
Location: Upstate, SC

SkunkworksFolding@NCAAbbsNCAAbbs LUGCrappies
Post: #16
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
(04-24-2015 06:42 PM)EvilVodka Wrote:  You're skeeeered

No, I just like playing games in 'Murica. And 'Murica ends at Richmond, VA.
04-24-2015 07:27 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Advertisement


Hokie Mark Offline
Hall of Famer
*

Posts: 23,830
Joined: Sep 2011
Reputation: 1410
I Root For: VT, ACC teams
Location: Greensboro, NC
Post: #17
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
(04-24-2015 04:11 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  
(04-24-2015 03:46 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  * IN DIVISION: 2 permanent, 2 rotate (every other year)
* CROSS DIVISION: 1 permanent, 3 rotate (every other year)


Georgia Tech permanents:
In Division: Duke, UNC
Cross Division: Clemson

Virginia, Pitt, and FSU are the only other teams that move the needle.

I would expect UNC, Duke, and UVa to want each other as perma-rivals, which cuts everyone else out of their loop. Perhaps a better approach is to form a chain like a double-linked list:

Coastal Rivals
Pitt - Miami, VT
VT - UVA, Pitt
UVA - VT, UNC
UNC - UVa, Duke
Duke - UNC, GT
GT - Duke, Miami
Miami - GT, Pitt

Atlantic Rivals
Louisville - FSU, Cuse
Syracuse - UL, BC
BC - Cuse, Wake
Wake Forest - BC, NCSU
NC State - WFU, Clemson
Clemson - NCSU, FSU
FSU - Clemson, UL
04-24-2015 09:17 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
opossum Offline
2nd String
*

Posts: 381
Joined: Jan 2014
Reputation: 22
I Root For: Duke
Location: DC area
Post: #18
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
I think Duke would be quite happy with GT, UNC-Chapel Hill and Wake as its annual rivals. Especially if it means playing NC State and everyone else home and away every four years years rather than every twelve years. I couldn't make Duke's first trip to the Carrier Dome the season before last, and the next one isn't until 2021 or 2022 (I have in-laws from Syracuse). That's not good for cohesion.
04-24-2015 09:54 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
nzmorange Offline
Heisman
*

Posts: 8,000
Joined: Sep 2012
Reputation: 279
I Root For: UAB
Location:
Post: #19
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
SU - BC and Pitt. After that I really don't care. Would probably get UL, which is fine, but I would also like any one of Duke, Miami, UVA, or VT.
04-24-2015 10:23 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Kaplony Offline
Palmetto State Deplorable

Posts: 25,393
Joined: Apr 2013
I Root For: Newberry
Location: SC
Post: #20
RE: Division Reform - Who are the Rivals?
(04-24-2015 09:17 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  
(04-24-2015 04:11 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  
(04-24-2015 03:46 PM)Hokie Mark Wrote:  * IN DIVISION: 2 permanent, 2 rotate (every other year)
* CROSS DIVISION: 1 permanent, 3 rotate (every other year)


Georgia Tech permanents:
In Division: Duke, UNC
Cross Division: Clemson

Virginia, Pitt, and FSU are the only other teams that move the needle.

I would expect UNC, Duke, and UVa to want each other as perma-rivals, which cuts everyone else out of their loop. Perhaps a better approach is to form a chain like a double-linked list:

Coastal Rivals
Pitt - Miami, VT
VT - UVA, Pitt
UVA - VT, UNC
UNC - UVa, Duke
Duke - UNC, GT
GT - Duke, Miami
Miami - GT, Pitt

Atlantic Rivals
Louisville - FSU, Cuse
Syracuse - UL, BC
BC - Cuse, Wake
Wake Forest - BC, NCSU
NC State - WFU, Clemson
Clemson - NCSU, FSU
FSU - Clemson, UL

Replace NCSU with GT and you are set. NCSU isn't a rival, they are just a team we have a game against with a contrived trophy that we beat far more often than not.

Clemson and GT is simply the best football rivalry in the conference. Bobinski might claim they wouldn't have a problem dropping us but there is a reason Clemson was the ACC gam moved on the rotation to be opposite UGA. Clemson sells out for SC State.......who does GT sell out for?
(This post was last modified: 04-24-2015 11:14 PM by Kaplony.)
04-24-2015 11:14 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 




User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)


Copyright © 2002-2024 Collegiate Sports Nation Bulletin Board System (CSNbbs), All Rights Reserved.
CSNbbs is an independent fan site and is in no way affiliated to the NCAA or any of the schools and conferences it represents.
This site monetizes links. FTC Disclosure.
We allow third-party companies to serve ads and/or collect certain anonymous information when you visit our web site. These companies may use non-personally identifiable information (e.g., click stream information, browser type, time and date, subject of advertisements clicked or scrolled over) during your visits to this and other Web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services likely to be of greater interest to you. These companies typically use a cookie or third party web beacon to collect this information. To learn more about this behavioral advertising practice or to opt-out of this type of advertising, you can visit http://www.networkadvertising.org.
Powered By MyBB, © 2002-2024 MyBB Group.