(02-22-2016 11:45 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  I think the AAC has better options. ODU has a pretty well rounded program and decent market. UNCC could be another in addition to UMass.
UTSA would be an option if they didn't still have Southland facilities (i.e. the convocation center used for basketball).

Those are all horrible start-up programs. They might end being quality additions in the future, but right now they are a crap shoot. I'd rather wait and see how schools like that develop before rushing to add them (its not like they wont be there later). Just remember---these days, 12 is just a number. The MW was the best non-power conference for nearly a decade and they had just 9 to 10 members.

No need to rush to add warm bodies just for the sake of having 12 members. We can still have our CCG with just 10 members. If we cant add Army, Air Force, BYU---or at least MW schools that are institutional fits with the AAC--then just stand pat with 10 football playing members. We can add Wichita as a non-football member to try and bolster basketball a bit.

(02-22-2016 11:48 AM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:36 AM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:30 AM)chess Wrote:  If the American has a doomsday scenario, my suggestion is for the remaining schools to merge with the Mountain West Conference for football only (east and west and maybe we have a championship game in Las Vegas).

This may be the best choice for all the football members (MWC and American).

The American can stay together for all other sports. The MWC can stay together for all other sports.

There is too much dead weight in the MWC to bring in all the old WAC teams (teams like Hawaii, SJSU, etc, would kill it).

Seriously, if there is to be a West Wing, you have to anoint the few, so they can gain traction against the bottom feeders.

Just like Memphis now has a solid advantage over the G5's in that region, you ONLY invite 4 out West, so the brand doesn't become diluted.

I tend to agree with this. The AAC has positioned itself as the premier G5, why through a life line to the MWC programs that wouldn’t bring value to the conference.

Another issue with this is a western expansion needs to be strategic in the sense that any program that would be brought in as a football only playing member would need to find a home conference that offered all sports with the exception of FBS football. It’s why Navy can keep all their sports with the exception of football in the Patriot League and football in the AAC.

If you have a merger it would need to be for all sports and then you would have ridiculous travel expenses each year and you also have that sticky situation with BSU and the uneven distribution of TV revenue.

IMO A merger is not a realistic option.

I think with two 7 team divisions (in a 14 team conference), travel can be effectively managed to an extent. BSU's disproportionate share has really hamstringed the MWC, and they'd be an equal partner with everyone else. I think even their current conference mates would appreciate that.

(02-22-2016 11:54 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:45 AM)MWC Tex Wrote:  I think the AAC has better options. ODU has a pretty well rounded program and decent market. UNCC could be another in addition to UMass.
UTSA would be an option if they didn't still have Southland facilities (i.e. the convocation center used for basketball).

Those are all horrible start-up programs. They might end being quality additions in the future, but right now they are a crap shoot. I'd rather wait and see how schools like that develop before rushing to add them (its not like they wont be there later). Just remember---these days, 12 is just a number. The MW was the best non-power conference for nearly a decade and they had just 9 to 10 members.

No need to rush to add warm bodies just for the sake of having 12 members. We can still have our CCG with just 10 members. If we cant add Army, Air Force, BYU---or at least MW schools that are institutional fits with the AAC--then just stand pat with 10 football playing members. We can add Wichita as a non-football member to try and bolster basketball a bit.

This.

(02-22-2016 11:48 AM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:36 AM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:30 AM)chess Wrote:  If the American has a doomsday scenario, my suggestion is for the remaining schools to merge with the Mountain West Conference for football only (east and west and maybe we have a championship game in Las Vegas).

This may be the best choice for all the football members (MWC and American).

The American can stay together for all other sports. The MWC can stay together for all other sports.

There is too much dead weight in the MWC to bring in all the old WAC teams (teams like Hawaii, SJSU, etc, would kill it).

Seriously, if there is to be a West Wing, you have to anoint the few, so they can gain traction against the bottom feeders.

Just like Memphis now has a solid advantage over the G5's in that region, you ONLY invite 4 out West, so the brand doesn't become diluted.

I tend to agree with this. The AAC has positioned itself as the premier G5, why through a life line to the MWC programs that wouldn’t bring value to the conference.

Another issue with this is a western expansion needs to be strategic in the sense that any program that would be brought in as a football only playing member would need to find a home conference that offered all sports with the exception of FBS football. It’s why Navy can keep all their sports with the exception of football in the Patriot League and football in the AAC.

If you have a merger it would need to be for all sports and then you would have ridiculous travel expenses each year and you also have that sticky situation with BSU and the uneven distribution of TV revenue.

IMO A merger is not a realistic option.

No way. These western schools need to be full members. Besides, schools like SDSU, New Mexico, and Colorado St have solid basketball programs. They would be good basketball additions. The football only stuff was one of the primary reason the last western wing attempt failed. Football only is a bad deal for most MW schools.

The distance and travel issues can be controlled via the use of divisional play in basketball and non-revenue sports. Im confident the travel cost issues can be managed. A league that extends nationwide will make us a unique conference and give the AAC an clear identity among the G5. It would also make us far more valuable to networks as we would be the only FBS league that was not regional. A nationally televised AAC game would literally be of interest in most major regions of the county because there would be an AAC rooting interest in most regions. After the P5, the AAC would be by far the most valuable FBS media property.

(02-22-2016 11:59 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:48 AM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:36 AM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:30 AM)chess Wrote:  If the American has a doomsday scenario, my suggestion is for the remaining schools to merge with the Mountain West Conference for football only (east and west and maybe we have a championship game in Las Vegas).

This may be the best choice for all the football members (MWC and American).

The American can stay together for all other sports. The MWC can stay together for all other sports.

There is too much dead weight in the MWC to bring in all the old WAC teams (teams like Hawaii, SJSU, etc, would kill it).

Seriously, if there is to be a West Wing, you have to anoint the few, so they can gain traction against the bottom feeders.

Just like Memphis now has a solid advantage over the G5's in that region, you ONLY invite 4 out West, so the brand doesn't become diluted.

I tend to agree with this. The AAC has positioned itself as the premier G5, why through a life line to the MWC programs that wouldn’t bring value to the conference.

Another issue with this is a western expansion needs to be strategic in the sense that any program that would be brought in as a football only playing member would need to find a home conference that offered all sports with the exception of FBS football. It’s why Navy can keep all their sports with the exception of football in the Patriot League and football in the AAC.

If you have a merger it would need to be for all sports and then you would have ridiculous travel expenses each year and you also have that sticky situation with BSU and the uneven distribution of TV revenue.

IMO A merger is not a realistic option.

No way. These western schools need to be full members. Besides, schools like SDSU, New Mexico, and Colorado St have solid basketball programs. They would be good basketball additions. The football only stuff was one of the primary reason the last western wing attempt failed. Football only is a bad deal for most MW schools.

The distance and travel issue can be controlled via the use of divisional play in basketball and non-revenue sports. Im confident the travel cost issues and be managed. A league that extends nationwide will make us a unique conference and give the AAC an clear identity among the G5. It would also make us far more valuable to networks as we would be the only FBS league that was not regional. A nationally televised AAC game would literally be of interest in most major regions of the county because there would be an AAC rooting interest in most regions. After the P5, the AAC would be by far the most valuable FBS media property.

I agree 100%.

For the record, San Diego State never really wanted to leave.

Combine them with any 3 of UNLV, Air Force, Boise, Colorado State, BYU, or even maybe Fresno or New Mexico, and I think we have a good West division (with Houston, SMU, and Tulsa). Basketball would be good.

I would have to agree to stay at 10 and try to pluck 2 quality basketball only schools. We should be able to offer them more money and a decent basketball conference depending on who leaves.

(02-22-2016 11:59 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:48 AM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:36 AM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:30 AM)chess Wrote:  If the American has a doomsday scenario, my suggestion is for the remaining schools to merge with the Mountain West Conference for football only (east and west and maybe we have a championship game in Las Vegas).

This may be the best choice for all the football members (MWC and American).

The American can stay together for all other sports. The MWC can stay together for all other sports.

There is too much dead weight in the MWC to bring in all the old WAC teams (teams like Hawaii, SJSU, etc, would kill it).

Seriously, if there is to be a West Wing, you have to anoint the few, so they can gain traction against the bottom feeders.

Just like Memphis now has a solid advantage over the G5's in that region, you ONLY invite 4 out West, so the brand doesn't become diluted.

I tend to agree with this. The AAC has positioned itself as the premier G5, why through a life line to the MWC programs that wouldn’t bring value to the conference.

Another issue with this is a western expansion needs to be strategic in the sense that any program that would be brought in as a football only playing member would need to find a home conference that offered all sports with the exception of FBS football. It’s why Navy can keep all their sports with the exception of football in the Patriot League and football in the AAC.

If you have a merger it would need to be for all sports and then you would have ridiculous travel expenses each year and you also have that sticky situation with BSU and the uneven distribution of TV revenue.

IMO A merger is not a realistic option.

No way. These western schools need to be full members. Besides, schools like SDSU, New Mexico, and Colorado St have solid basketball programs. They would be good basketball additions. The football only stuff was one of the primary reason the last western wing attempt failed. Football only is a bad deal for most MW schools.

The distance and travel issue can be controlled via the use of divisional play in basketball and non-revenue sports. Im confident the travel cost issues and be managed. A league that extends nationwide will make us a unique conference and give the AAC an clear identity among the G5. It would also make us far more valuable to networks as we would be the only FBS league that was not regional. A nationally televised AAC game would literally be of interest in most major regions of the county because there would be an AAC rooting interest in most regions. After the P5, the AAC would be by far the most valuable FBS media property.

I agree, I may not have been clear. I was simply addressing the idea of merging for football only (bold in the original post), and that it’s almost impossible to do that for more than a team or 2 because you need to find an all sports home.

I do agree 100%, if additions came from the west they should be for all sports, but only a limited number of teams, 2 to 4 max and only if we lost 2 programs first.

(02-22-2016 12:10 PM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:59 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:48 AM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:36 AM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:30 AM)chess Wrote:  If the American has a doomsday scenario, my suggestion is for the remaining schools to merge with the Mountain West Conference for football only (east and west and maybe we have a championship game in Las Vegas).

This may be the best choice for all the football members (MWC and American).

The American can stay together for all other sports. The MWC can stay together for all other sports.

There is too much dead weight in the MWC to bring in all the old WAC teams (teams like Hawaii, SJSU, etc, would kill it).

Seriously, if there is to be a West Wing, you have to anoint the few, so they can gain traction against the bottom feeders.

Just like Memphis now has a solid advantage over the G5's in that region, you ONLY invite 4 out West, so the brand doesn't become diluted.

I tend to agree with this. The AAC has positioned itself as the premier G5, why through a life line to the MWC programs that wouldn’t bring value to the conference.

Another issue with this is a western expansion needs to be strategic in the sense that any program that would be brought in as a football only playing member would need to find a home conference that offered all sports with the exception of FBS football. It’s why Navy can keep all their sports with the exception of football in the Patriot League and football in the AAC.

If you have a merger it would need to be for all sports and then you would have ridiculous travel expenses each year and you also have that sticky situation with BSU and the uneven distribution of TV revenue.

IMO A merger is not a realistic option.

No way. These western schools need to be full members. Besides, schools like SDSU, New Mexico, and Colorado St have solid basketball programs. They would be good basketball additions. The football only stuff was one of the primary reason the last western wing attempt failed. Football only is a bad deal for most MW schools.

The distance and travel issue can be controlled via the use of divisional play in basketball and non-revenue sports. Im confident the travel cost issues and be managed. A league that extends nationwide will make us a unique conference and give the AAC an clear identity among the G5. It would also make us far more valuable to networks as we would be the only FBS league that was not regional. A nationally televised AAC game would literally be of interest in most major regions of the county because there would be an AAC rooting interest in most regions. After the P5, the AAC would be by far the most valuable FBS media property.

I agree, I may not have been clear. I was simply addressing the idea of merging for football only (bold in the original post), and that it’s almost impossible to do that for more than a team or 2 because you need to find an all sports home.

I do agree 100%, if additions came from the west they should be for all sports, but only a limited number of teams, 2 to 4 max and only if we lost 2 programs first.

We're on the same page!

(02-22-2016 12:43 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 12:10 PM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:59 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:48 AM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:36 AM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  There is too much dead weight in the MWC to bring in all the old WAC teams (teams like Hawaii, SJSU, etc, would kill it).

Seriously, if there is to be a West Wing, you have to anoint the few, so they can gain traction against the bottom feeders.

Just like Memphis now has a solid advantage over the G5's in that region, you ONLY invite 4 out West, so the brand doesn't become diluted.

I tend to agree with this. The AAC has positioned itself as the premier G5, why through a life line to the MWC programs that wouldn’t bring value to the conference.

Another issue with this is a western expansion needs to be strategic in the sense that any program that would be brought in as a football only playing member would need to find a home conference that offered all sports with the exception of FBS football. It’s why Navy can keep all their sports with the exception of football in the Patriot League and football in the AAC.

If you have a merger it would need to be for all sports and then you would have ridiculous travel expenses each year and you also have that sticky situation with BSU and the uneven distribution of TV revenue.

IMO A merger is not a realistic option.

No way. These western schools need to be full members. Besides, schools like SDSU, New Mexico, and Colorado St have solid basketball programs. They would be good basketball additions. The football only stuff was one of the primary reason the last western wing attempt failed. Football only is a bad deal for most MW schools.

The distance and travel issue can be controlled via the use of divisional play in basketball and non-revenue sports. Im confident the travel cost issues and be managed. A league that extends nationwide will make us a unique conference and give the AAC an clear identity among the G5. It would also make us far more valuable to networks as we would be the only FBS league that was not regional. A nationally televised AAC game would literally be of interest in most major regions of the county because there would be an AAC rooting interest in most regions. After the P5, the AAC would be by far the most valuable FBS media property.

I agree, I may not have been clear. I was simply addressing the idea of merging for football only (bold in the original post), and that it’s almost impossible to do that for more than a team or 2 because you need to find an all sports home.

I do agree 100%, if additions came from the west they should be for all sports, but only a limited number of teams, 2 to 4 max and only if we lost 2 programs first.

We're on the same page!

The sad reality is that what's best for the conference is the worst thing for UConn, UC, UH, Memphis, etc., etc., etc., that would be no P5 expansion.

I really do feel that if nothing happens from a P5 realignment standpoint for the next 2 to 5 years, and the AAC schools commit to continuing to invest in its athletics and academics the landscape of college athletics will have changed and the conference will be in an excellent position to entice the programs that may be holding out for something better. BYU, an Army AFA combo and a 4th western member that makes geographic and competitive sense. The conference just needs to get a solid run of stability under its belt and prove itself as the best alternative to a P5 invitation that’s not coming.

Unbelievable... This ^^^ list isn't sexy.

I have a hard time believing those MWC teams would be leaving their conference... Obviously i have a bit of bias as to why, but let's eliminate some of the obvious ones and why they wouldn't join the AAC

Boise- no way they give up that deal with ESPN. They'd literally be throwing millions away

BYU- will never be in a G5 as long as Utah is P5. They'd rather strive for ND status as independent and wait out a P5 offer. Unfortunately for them, as I think they'd be a slam dunk in the AAC

The rest is up for interpretation but that's a lot of travel to add CSU, UNLV, SDSU, or any of the others

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(02-22-2016 01:56 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  I have a hard time believing those MWC teams would be leaving their conference... Obviously i have a bit of bias as to why, but let's eliminate some of the obvious ones and why they wouldn't join the AAC

Boise- no way they give up that deal with ESPN. They'd literally be throwing millions away

BYU- will never be in a G5 as long as Utah is P5. They'd rather strive for ND status as independent and wait out a P5 offer. Unfortunately for them, as I think they'd be a slam dunk in the AAC

The rest is up for interpretation but that's a lot of travel to add CSU, UNLV, SDSU, or any of the others

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

There are any number of viable 4 candidates in that pool.
(Air Force, San Diego State, Colorado State, Boise State, BYU, Fresno, New Mexico, UNLV)
You only need four, and presently they're in a conference who's champion just played the AAC #6, and two of their teams played each other in a bowl.

Their TV deal is heavily favoring one school, and if 3 teams departed, Boise would have to renegotiate that anyway, when they add Idaho and NM State.

Either way, NIU isn't getting in bro.

(02-22-2016 11:22 AM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  IMO, if the AAC lost teams I would say from a perception standpoint any CUSA teams should be a non-starter.

The AAC programs have worked extremely hard through their investments in facility upgrades, hiring high profile basketball coaches, making a financial commitment to keeping it’s good young football coaches, new AD’s and improving it’s academic rankings to distance itself from the other G5 conferences. Adding additional CUSA schools would just feed the perception that the AAC is just another G5 and worse that that just a warned over CUSA.

Using USM as an example because they were brought up in this thread.

USNWR lists them as not ranked as a national university.
Athletic budget is 23 million.
Lost their football coach a few days before signing day.
Current basketball RPI rank is 305 and they are 4-10 in a bad CUSA.
They have no TV market

No more CUSA teams, it doesn’t make business sense.

Substitute Big East for AAC and you finally see what UConn, UC and USF fans have been saying for three years.

(02-22-2016 02:18 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:22 AM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  IMO, if the AAC lost teams I would say from a perception standpoint any CUSA teams should be a non-starter.

The AAC programs have worked extremely hard through their investments in facility upgrades, hiring high profile basketball coaches, making a financial commitment to keeping it’s good young football coaches, new AD’s and improving it’s academic rankings to distance itself from the other G5 conferences. Adding additional CUSA schools would just feed the perception that the AAC is just another G5 and worse that that just a warned over CUSA.

Using USM as an example because they were brought up in this thread.

USNWR lists them as not ranked as a national university.
Athletic budget is 23 million.
Lost their football coach a few days before signing day.
Current basketball RPI rank is 305 and they are 4-10 in a bad CUSA.
They have no TV market

No more CUSA teams, it doesn’t make business sense.

Substitute Big East for AAC and you finally see what UConn, UC and USF fans have been saying for three years.

UC and USF were Conference USA before CUSA was cool. UConn just started football.

(02-22-2016 02:15 PM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 01:56 PM)Stay Cool Wrote:  I have a hard time believing those MWC teams would be leaving their conference... Obviously i have a bit of bias as to why, but let's eliminate some of the obvious ones and why they wouldn't join the AAC

Boise- no way they give up that deal with ESPN. They'd literally be throwing millions away

BYU- will never be in a G5 as long as Utah is P5. They'd rather strive for ND status as independent and wait out a P5 offer. Unfortunately for them, as I think they'd be a slam dunk in the AAC

The rest is up for interpretation but that's a lot of travel to add CSU, UNLV, SDSU, or any of the others

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

There are any number of viable 4 candidates in that pool.
(Air Force, San Diego State, Colorado State, Boise State, BYU, Fresno, New Mexico, UNLV)
You only need four, and presently they're in a conference who's champion just played the AAC #6, and two of their teams played each other in a bowl.

Their TV deal is heavily favoring one school, and if 3 teams departed, Boise would have to renegotiate that anyway, when they add Idaho and NM State.

Either way, NIU isn't getting in bro.

We'll see. I have a feeling the powers that be disagree with your assessment but we will agree to disagree.

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(02-22-2016 02:20 PM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 02:18 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:22 AM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  IMO, if the AAC lost teams I would say from a perception standpoint any CUSA teams should be a non-starter.

The AAC programs have worked extremely hard through their investments in facility upgrades, hiring high profile basketball coaches, making a financial commitment to keeping it’s good young football coaches, new AD’s and improving it’s academic rankings to distance itself from the other G5 conferences. Adding additional CUSA schools would just feed the perception that the AAC is just another G5 and worse that that just a warned over CUSA.

Using USM as an example because they were brought up in this thread.

USNWR lists them as not ranked as a national university.
Athletic budget is 23 million.
Lost their football coach a few days before signing day.
Current basketball RPI rank is 305 and they are 4-10 in a bad CUSA.
They have no TV market

No more CUSA teams, it doesn’t make business sense.

Substitute Big East for AAC and you finally see what UConn, UC and USF fans have been saying for three years.

UC and USF were Conference USA before CUSA was cool. UConn just started football.

and your school was in C-USA more recently than UC and USF were when the BE blew up.

Point I am making is you and others are being hypocritical.

(02-22-2016 02:27 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 02:20 PM)BigEastHomer Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 02:18 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 11:22 AM)NYCTUFan Wrote:  IMO, if the AAC lost teams I would say from a perception standpoint any CUSA teams should be a non-starter.

The AAC programs have worked extremely hard through their investments in facility upgrades, hiring high profile basketball coaches, making a financial commitment to keeping it’s good young football coaches, new AD’s and improving it’s academic rankings to distance itself from the other G5 conferences. Adding additional CUSA schools would just feed the perception that the AAC is just another G5 and worse that that just a warned over CUSA.

Using USM as an example because they were brought up in this thread.

USNWR lists them as not ranked as a national university.
Athletic budget is 23 million.
Lost their football coach a few days before signing day.
Current basketball RPI rank is 305 and they are 4-10 in a bad CUSA.
They have no TV market

No more CUSA teams, it doesn’t make business sense.

Substitute Big East for AAC and you finally see what UConn, UC and USF fans have been saying for three years.

UC and USF were Conference USA before CUSA was cool. UConn just started football.

and your school was in C-USA more recently than UC and USF were when the BE blew up.

Point I am making is you and others are being hypocritical.

What does 'more recently' have to do with it? ECU was more recent than Houston. It's all relative. You guys just cashed larger checks for a lot longer. If anyone should just keep their mouths shut, it's you. Cincinnati and USF started CUSA. Houston was in the SWC up till then.

(02-22-2016 10:40 AM)HuskyU Wrote:  I don't believe it, but my order preference between those 4 are:

1. NIU
2. La Tech
3. WKU
4. Southern Miss

1) Army FB only
1a) southern miss
2) ODU
3) Charlotte
4) Umass

(02-22-2016 02:52 PM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 10:40 AM)HuskyU Wrote:  I don't believe it, but my order preference between those 4 are:

1. NIU
2. La Tech
3. WKU
4. Southern Miss

1) Army FB only
1a) southern miss
2) ODU
3) Charlotte
4) Umass

Before the AAC extends offers to ODU and Charlotte, the should offer Wichita State a place to play football.

(02-22-2016 02:52 PM)KNIGHTTIME Wrote:  

(02-22-2016 10:40 AM)HuskyU Wrote:  I don't believe it, but my order preference between those 4 are:

1. NIU
2. La Tech
3. WKU
4. Southern Miss

1) Army FB only
1a) southern miss
2) ODU
3) Charlotte
4) Umass

You'd prefer recent FBS start up Charlotte and doesn't even have an OCS with bathrooms UMASS to the ones on the list? I can understand USM and ODU, army is a pipe dream though. Same as BYU is.

I will never understand some people on this board's infatuation with UMASS...

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