If Liberty University were located in say... Washington D.C., Charlotte, Atlanta, Nashville, Virginia Beach, Tampa, or another large city or nice location... Would we have received an FBS invite by now?

I don't think so. Liberty isn't far from Roanoke, Washington, D.C., Richmond, Virginia Beach, etc. We have alumni all over the country and we have a unique mission that gets us support from non-alumni and non-locals but that is the source of much of why we aren't in FBS.

It's near Roanoke, but not really the others, not close enough to be considered in that large market. If LU were in a major market I think we might have had a better shot at FBS.

If we were a state school we would have. For sure. The religious affiliation is what cost us the SBC.

Being in Lynchburg is not a significant impediment to FBS membership for us. Being private, well-funded and controversial are what have kept us out.

(04-06-2016 11:04 PM)SlyFox Wrote:  Being in Lynchburg is not a significant impediment to FBS membership for us. Being private, well-funded and controversial are what have kept us out.

I agree 100%. Of the three factors that you listed as keeping us from FBS, do you think changing one would get us to FBS? If so, which one?

I think if we weren't private, then we'd be in FBS by now. Each school does something controversial and having money is generally a great thing so being private hurts us the most no matter how much we try not to be the snobby private and instead be the "every man" private.

(04-12-2016 05:43 PM)GE and MTS Wrote:  

(04-06-2016 11:04 PM)SlyFox Wrote:  Being in Lynchburg is not a significant impediment to FBS membership for us. Being private, well-funded and controversial are what have kept us out.

I agree 100%. Of the three factors that you listed as keeping us from FBS, do you think changing one would get us to FBS? If so, which one?

I think if we weren't private, then we'd be in FBS by now. Each school does something controversial and having money is generally a great thing so being private hurts us the most no matter how much we try not to be the snobby private and instead be the "every man" private.

I think the main factor is we are controversial in todays culture and social climate. And by controversial, I mean we are unashamedly Christian. We actually think, speak, and act upon the Christian values the school was founded on. Let's face it, being Christian in America today is less accepted than it was just a few years ago. That persecution is only going to grow. The fact that Liberty is a conservative evangelical Christian university is enough to threaten secular schools that can't tolerate LU being seen as a peer or on their level.

(04-21-2016 06:00 AM)army56mike Wrote:  

(04-12-2016 05:43 PM)GE and MTS Wrote:  

(04-06-2016 11:04 PM)SlyFox Wrote:  Being in Lynchburg is not a significant impediment to FBS membership for us. Being private, well-funded and controversial are what have kept us out.

I agree 100%. Of the three factors that you listed as keeping us from FBS, do you think changing one would get us to FBS? If so, which one?

I think if we weren't private, then we'd be in FBS by now. Each school does something controversial and having money is generally a great thing so being private hurts us the most no matter how much we try not to be the snobby private and instead be the "every man" private.

I think the main factor is we are controversial in todays culture and social climate. And by controversial, I mean we are unashamedly Christian. We actually think, speak, and act upon the Christian values the school was founded on. Let's face it, being Christian in America today is less accepted than it was just a few years ago. That persecution is only going to grow. The fact that Liberty is a conservative evangelical Christian university is enough to threaten secular schools that can't tolerate LU being seen as a peer or on their level.

The perception of LU is the reason LU is still FCS. Secondary factors are the public/private position and LU being a religious school.

What perception?

Mike agree. If Falwell had not made those comments we would still be in fcs and in the Big South. Personally I don't think we'll ever be invited to another conference including FCS conferences. We teach creation as well as the theory of evolution. Do you know how crazy that drives secular progressives?

(04-25-2016 08:20 AM)army56mike Wrote:  What perception?

ArmyMike, it seems like you missed my reply to point in the MAC opening thread on this board. My post there is re-posted here:

The most credible reason for LU not receiving an invite is it's perception. The public/private is an issue but not the main reason. LU's perception unfortunately has not improved as much as needed. As I stated in late 2015, the comments Jr. made about guns and Muslims created another setback. This is noted in an article in the News&Advance regarding the VHSL not renewing the high school playoffs at LU.

The April 22 article stated"...On Dec. 18, 2015, the VHSL released a statement saying it was concerned about safety at LU following comments by university President Jerry Falwell Jr. at a Dec. 4 convocation.

Falwell made national headlines when he said, “I always thought if more good people had concealed-carry permits, then we could end those Muslims before they walked in and killed them.”

Those remarks followed the Dec. 2 attack in San Bernardino, California. Falwell later said his remarks were aimed at Islamic extremists responsible for that attack and not at Muslims in general. The VHSL said Falwell’s comments had raised alarm among some of its members...."

The full article is at http://www.newsadvance.com/sports/high_s...a3621.html

It's sad that Jr. cannot tone it down at least long enough, for a year or two to at least to get an invite. The public/private position is a consideration but a secondary one.

BYU is very religious but they are not POLITICAL.

They even prohibit their administration from getting involved in political campaigns. They have a strict political neutrality policy.

I wish liberty would do the same. There's really no reason to get involved in politics.

(04-26-2016 03:43 PM)Libertygrad01 Wrote:  I wish liberty would do the same. There's really no reason to get involved in politics.

Agree. Hopefully wise future actions to be low key without political endorsements, stances on gun rights and fewer attention grabbing headlines will increase LU's future appeal.

(04-26-2016 02:21 PM)voss749 Wrote:  BYU is very religious but they are not POLITICAL.

They even prohibit their administration from getting involved in political campaigns. They have a strict political neutrality policy.

And yet, BYU is being shunned by the PAC 12 and Big 12.

I wish Liberty wouldn't "endorse" candidates (I know they don't technically do as a non-profit, but they still do a *wink*wink thing), and I wish they got rid of the whole "politically incorrect" mentality. I don't want Liberty to conform to non-Christian beliefs, but I don't want them to continue going out of the way to spit in the face of opposition. I want Liberty to be endorsing ideals and messages rather than candidates.

Do I think Liberty's recent-ish gun control comments kept Liberty from joining a conference? No. Do I think Jerry Jr.'s endorsement of Trump kept Liberty from joining a conference? No. I don't think one particular issue or stance is against Liberty, it is the culmination of many and the resistance to change that keeps conferences away. As a Christian university, Liberty should emphasize the good that they are doing in the community and around the world, like this article: http://www.liberty.edu/aboutliberty/inde...PID=33810. Focus on being Christian, stay out of the political candidate spotlight, grow the school, improve the sports, and build alumni support.

(04-27-2016 06:47 PM)GE and MTS Wrote:  

(04-26-2016 02:21 PM)voss749 Wrote:  BYU is very religious but they are not POLITICAL.

They even prohibit their administration from getting involved in political campaigns. They have a strict political neutrality policy.

And yet, BYU is being shunned by the PAC 12 and Big 12.

I wish Liberty wouldn't "endorse" candidates (I know they don't technically do as a non-profit, but they still do a *wink*wink thing), and I wish they got rid of the whole "politically incorrect" mentality. I don't want Liberty to conform to non-Christian beliefs, but I don't want them to continue going out of the way to spit in the face of opposition. I want Liberty to be endorsing ideals and messages rather than candidates.

Do I think Liberty's recent-ish gun control comments kept Liberty from joining a conference? No. Do I think Jerry Jr.'s endorsement of Trump kept Liberty from joining a conference? No. I don't think one particular issue or stance is against Liberty, it is the culmination of many and the resistance to change that keeps conferences away. As a Christian university, Liberty should emphasize the good that they are doing in the community and around the world, like this article: http://www.liberty.edu/aboutliberty/inde...PID=33810. Focus on being Christian, stay out of the political candidate spotlight, grow the school, improve the sports, and build alumni support.

The culmination of statements made by Jr. on guns, Muslims, political endorsements and more have create the perception by others that LU is a maverick. It's a perception that causes decision makers considering LU as a FBS member to ponder. While the maverick posture can be popular with a small, select group, the result will be a lack of support rather than ringing endorsements from FBS conferences.

LU has not been able to parlay it's strengths. When it seems FBS membership is a possibility, the school admins have been unable to act wisely and tone down their rhetoric.

The hiring of former governor Bob McDonald is another example of a poor choice. It would have been interesting to have been in the meeting with the idea was considered to hire McDonald. Discussions were surely made on the pros and cons of the hire. The hiring of McDonald was secondary as the lead of the story reported at the time was former VA governor and accused felon hired. Where was the upside for LU? The impact of the hire is another example of LU being unable to foresee the residue of a controversial action. It again brought unfavorable attention to the school. The kind of attention that has created a pattern where others, who control if LU becomes FBS, question the leadership of the school.

This is not about LU being a Christian school. It's not about LU being a martyr for being a private university. It's not about LU being different. It's not about LU changing it's values. It's about how past actions, that were magnified greatly with the stances of Sr. many years ago, were toned down by Jr. after Sr.'s passing. Then the unprecedented growth and success of the school began. LU was poised and positioned for FBS membership. And then shortly, incrementally, the culmination of events as stated by myself and others, made an impact with the decision makers to again bypass LU for FBS membership.

LU will eventually achieve FBS membership. It will happen with the great facilities and fan support, attendance, FOCA and more the school has to offer. Unfortunately, it will take longer due to stances, positions, actions and comments made that were spoken and acted upon before the impact was considered.

I agree there is a perception against Liberty due to self-inflicted wounds. But I disagree that Liberty would have moved up without those. BYU is begging for a P5 conference and their baggage is they don't play on Sundays while being a private, Mormon school. Their location isn't terrible, and they have a stronger connection with Mormons globally than Liberty does with Christians or Baptists.

If Liberty was less divisive to a tolerable level, who would Liberty have replaced in the FCS to FBS call ups? Likely not App State, Georgia Southern, Charlotte, UMass and probably not Old Dominion and Georgia State. I think Coastal Carolina is the only school we'd have a strong argument over but, then again, they aren't private, aren't flush with money, and are closer to the footprint of the rest of the Sun Belt.

(04-28-2016 06:06 PM)GE and MTS Wrote:  I agree there is a perception against Liberty due to self-inflicted wounds. But I disagree that Liberty would have moved up without those. BYU is begging for a P5 conference and their baggage is they don't play on Sundays while being a private, Mormon school. Their location isn't terrible, and they have a stronger connection with Mormons globally than Liberty does with Christians or Baptists.

If Liberty was less divisive to a tolerable level, who would Liberty have replaced in the FCS to FBS call ups? Likely not App State, Georgia Southern, Charlotte, UMass and probably not Old Dominion and Georgia State. I think Coastal Carolina is the only school we'd have a strong argument over but, then again, they aren't private, aren't flush with money, and are closer to the footprint of the rest of the Sun Belt.

My comments were stimulated by the recent action by the Virginia High School League to consider removing all but one playoff game from LU as previously stated. True App St and GaSo with their FCS successes were more appealing choices for the SBC. GaSt with the Atlanta market and ODU with their rapid FCS success and the Coastal Virginia population were larger market driven choices. Coastal Carolina is the best example where a clearly less mature and developed program was selected over LU due to perception.

The intent of the post was to show the pattern that exists at LU with their positions/statements/endorsements that cause cautions and concerns by the admins of other conference schools.

I've always thought LU would be in a better position and a better fit in the CUSA rather than the SBC. The goal for LU to achieve FBS membership means being wise and calculating rather than being impulsive and making knee jerk statements/actions/endorsements.

Wow! We have a really beefy OL next season.

LT - 290 - 6'4
LT - 310 - 6'6
LG - 290 - 6'3
LG - 310 - 6'1
C - 320 - 6'1
C - 280 - 6'4
RG - 280 - 6'4
RG - 320 - 6'4
RT - 315 - 6'5
RT - 325 - 6'5