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Calgary Flames relocating?
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NoDak Offline
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Post: #41
RE: Calgary Flames relocating?
(02-07-2018 09:31 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 09:20 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 04:32 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 11:40 AM)bluesox Wrote:  If San Diego built a new arena they could work to snag the coyotes.

I think that'd be one too many teams in an area of the country not big on hockey. No area of San Diego or thereabouts is far from Anaheim or at the very least, anyone that wants to be a season ticket holder of the Mighty Ducks bad enough can be. That's right, I said the Mighty Ducks, not the Ducks. That's what I grew up on.

I think it's a general rule that beaches and hockey don't really mix.

LA works because the market is massive. I guess Tampa is fine, but there are tons of snowbirds in Florida.

If I was an owner, I wouldn't risk it.

Not gonna say you can't have legit fan bases in non-traditional areas but I would argue that as far as hockey goes its hard to build that ground up infrastructure for fans of the sport when you don't have the outdoor weather and the facilities (read ice rink) to build that grass roots fan base for the sport. That said, with some sun belt teams, winning has helped propel the pro teams to keep up a good stable of fan support.
The areas around NHL teams are now significant hockey talent. The LA basin, Phoenix, DFW metroplex, Columbus, Pittsburgh etc all produce high end talent when essentially none previously existed. The Miami area may be the sole exception.
02-07-2018 10:25 PM
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C2__ Offline
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Post: #42
RE: Calgary Flames relocating?
Move and keep these teams in Canada or close by. Quebec City, Hamilton, Kitchener, etc... all need teams.
02-07-2018 10:34 PM
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AllTideUp Offline
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Post: #43
RE: Calgary Flames relocating?
(02-07-2018 10:25 PM)NoDak Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 09:31 PM)PirateTreasureNC Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 09:20 PM)AllTideUp Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 04:32 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  
(02-07-2018 11:40 AM)bluesox Wrote:  If San Diego built a new arena they could work to snag the coyotes.

I think that'd be one too many teams in an area of the country not big on hockey. No area of San Diego or thereabouts is far from Anaheim or at the very least, anyone that wants to be a season ticket holder of the Mighty Ducks bad enough can be. That's right, I said the Mighty Ducks, not the Ducks. That's what I grew up on.

I think it's a general rule that beaches and hockey don't really mix.

LA works because the market is massive. I guess Tampa is fine, but there are tons of snowbirds in Florida.

If I was an owner, I wouldn't risk it.

Not gonna say you can't have legit fan bases in non-traditional areas but I would argue that as far as hockey goes its hard to build that ground up infrastructure for fans of the sport when you don't have the outdoor weather and the facilities (read ice rink) to build that grass roots fan base for the sport. That said, with some sun belt teams, winning has helped propel the pro teams to keep up a good stable of fan support.

The areas around NHL teams are now significant hockey talent. The LA basin, Phoenix, DFW metroplex, Columbus, Pittsburgh etc all produce high end talent when essentially none previously existed. The Miami area may be the sole exception.

Miami is such a different culture in and of itself. That and you've got beaches for miles around to occupy people's free time. Pro sports, in general, in Miami don't really get the kind of support you see in other places so perhaps it's an outlier altogether.

I think the general problem is that outside of these major cities, the opportunity to engage in youth hockey is almost non-existant. And even if you have youth hockey opportunities, will the local high schools sponsor the sport..something that is generally necessary in order to guarantee community involvement? Not many do.

Small towns aren't going to bother building a rink. Some of the small cities have one, but the entire area is basically going to have to share it. For example, Birmingham is a metro of 1.1 million people and there is one rink in the entire area.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not down on hockey in the Sun Belt as a whole. The NHL has been very successful in some places and if you've got a local opportunity to play youth hockey then by all means take advantage of it, but penetration is the problem.

I always enjoy going to Bama club games for example, but I have to drive to Birmingham to see them play. That and I've discovered that watching hockey live and watching it on TV are two totally different experiences. Watching it live is so much more fun. Problem, of course, is that it's hard to take in a live game because rinks are sparse.

This is actually one of the reasons I think soccer is destined to become one of our more beloved sports in this country. It's too easy to build a field or just throw a ball out into an open area and play. It's only a matter of time before it becomes one of the major sports here.
02-08-2018 05:22 AM
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C2__ Offline
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Post: #44
RE: Calgary Flames relocating?
I'd say it's because of the immigrant groups not because we're suddenly gonna embrace soccer.
02-08-2018 02:27 PM
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Wedge Offline
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Post: #45
RE: Calgary Flames relocating?
(02-08-2018 02:27 PM)_C2_ Wrote:  I'd say it's because of the immigrant groups not because we're suddenly gonna embrace soccer.

When I was growing up 03-old , very few kids ever played soccer, not even on a playground or in a school PE class and certainly not in the widespread youth soccer leagues today that range from recreational through competitive and travel teams.

So many people who have been kids over the past 20 years have played soccer, especially in warm-weather states, and they know the sport. They're far more likely to watch it as adults than they are to watch some sport that they don't know any better than curling or biathlon.
02-08-2018 02:39 PM
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C2__ Offline
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Post: #46
RE: Calgary Flames relocating?
My brother played soccer...he neither plays it nor watches it and hasn't done so since the time he was playing it. There are many like him. It's just a youth activity.

Not saying soccer won't catch on, it slowly is in the US but not just because more kiddies are playing it.
(This post was last modified: 02-09-2018 02:41 AM by C2__.)
02-08-2018 02:50 PM
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Wedge Offline
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Post: #47
RE: Calgary Flames relocating?
Lots and lots of kids play baseball and don't watch it as adults, either.

The point is that the percentage of adults watching, out of those who have played the sport, is much higher than the percentage of adults watching out of the group who have never played the sport.
02-08-2018 03:22 PM
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AllTideUp Offline
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Post: #48
RE: Calgary Flames relocating?
I used to play soccer as a kid. I was born in the 80s though and as I grew older I, along with most everyone I know, didn't particularly care for the sport. In the last several years, I started to learn more about the game and its history. All of a sudden I found myself watching it and enjoying it thoroughly. I don't quite know what happened or precisely when it happened, but I suspect it has more to do with the fact that nowadays it's on TV everywhere.

Soccer is far more popular now than it was 30 or 40 years ago. Actually, I'd say it's more popular now than it was 10 years ago. Some say the seminal moment that the culture started to change was when the US hosted the World Cup in 1994.

Since then MLS has been created and has gone from a middling entity to a fairly profitable league that has attracted major investors across the country. It's certainly not on the level of the NFL or the other major pro sports leagues, but it's come a heck of a long way in the last 20 years. At that, the best leagues in the world are now readily available on cable TV.

With regard to the last couple of World Cups, people have actually started to care about the US performance and even games where the US isn't involved get pretty good ratings.

You want to hear something crazy? When it comes to the Men's National team, one of the consistently strongest DMAs is Birmingham. That says something.

Most still don't care that much, I understand, but the popularity is growing at a pretty high rate when you consider where it was 30 years ago.

The influx of immigrants has had something to do with it, I don't doubt that at all, but that is sort of the story of the USA isn't it? Immigrants come in and in their own way alter the culture.
02-08-2018 04:34 PM
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Love and Honor Offline
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Post: #49
RE: Calgary Flames relocating?
The southern hockey markets are a double whammy of bad hockey market potential because they not only are unnatural fits for hockey due to lack of icy climates, but they also tend to have a relatively high number of transplants. It's hard to build a following when your city is full of snowbird fans with lifelong allegiances to longstanding teams. One also has to remember that these southern teams moved or were founded starting in the nineties for the most part, when cable TV was king and nowadays you can follow a team with the click of a phone, and that in turn helps breed casual fan bases.

The most successful southern hockey cities are Tampa and Nashville, which both have nice arenas in downtown areas with local, involved ownership and no NBA team to compete with. Of course even traditional hockey markets won't succeed that much unless those first few factors are in place, but especially so in the south when you tend to have transient populations. It's why a team like the Hurricanes have a chance at building a following again imo even if they're last in attendance today, and why I think the Panthers and Coyotes are kinda doomed given how they have suburban arenas and as unstable of ownership as you can get.
02-08-2018 08:14 PM
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Post: #50
RE: Calgary Flames relocating?
I hope Calgary keeps their team.

Seattle feels like a natural NHL city and an ideal place for the Coyotes or team #32.

Most of the other markets out there that lack NHL either lack a natural hockey fanbase due to climate or have competition from the NBA throughout the season.
02-16-2018 04:47 PM
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