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UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
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MTPiKapp Online
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Post: #21
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-12-2018 12:50 PM)WKUFan518 Wrote:  Wow you actually had a vote? That's crazy, usually schools just say they are charging more and that's that....NOt sure how any UTSA fan thought this was actually going to pass, look at your student attendance for basketball. I don't know what your student attendance is for football but judging by basketball doesn't look like you get that great of student interest in sports....

You make it sound like you believe a similar measure would pass with a unanimous vote in Bowling Green...
02-12-2018 01:34 PM
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Lizard Breath Offline
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Post: #22
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-12-2018 12:50 PM)WKUFan518 Wrote:  Wow you actually had a vote? That's crazy, usually schools just say they are charging more and that's that....NOt sure how any UTSA fan thought this was actually going to pass, look at your student attendance for basketball. I don't know what your student attendance is for football but judging by basketball doesn't look like you get that great of student interest in sports....

We averaged about 25k in 2017 & 27k in 2016 for football. We finished 6-5 last year & 6-7 in 2016. Once we start winning we will probably see around 30k -35k. Our basketball gym is a joke too, if they ever get money to get a new one hopefully it will change.
(This post was last modified: 02-12-2018 01:54 PM by Lizard Breath.)
02-12-2018 01:53 PM
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joshdude182 Offline
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Post: #23
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-12-2018 01:21 PM)thefaU Wrote:  
(02-12-2018 12:50 PM)WKUFan518 Wrote:  Wow you actually had a vote? That's crazy, usually schools just say they are charging more and that's that....NOt sure how any UTSA fan thought this was actually going to pass, look at your student attendance for basketball. I don't know what your student attendance is for football but judging by basketball doesn't look like you get that great of student interest in sports....

UTSA had the 2nd highest football attendance in 2017 and 3rd highest football attendance in 2016.

Google is your friend.

And reading comprehension is yours. He said student attendance, not overall attendance.
02-12-2018 02:21 PM
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Lizard Breath Offline
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Post: #24
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-12-2018 02:21 PM)joshdude182 Wrote:  
(02-12-2018 01:21 PM)thefaU Wrote:  
(02-12-2018 12:50 PM)WKUFan518 Wrote:  Wow you actually had a vote? That's crazy, usually schools just say they are charging more and that's that....NOt sure how any UTSA fan thought this was actually going to pass, look at your student attendance for basketball. I don't know what your student attendance is for football but judging by basketball doesn't look like you get that great of student interest in sports....

UTSA had the 2nd highest football attendance in 2017 and 3rd highest football attendance in 2016.

Google is your friend.

And reading comprehension is yours. He said student attendance, not overall attendance.


Yea student attendance is pretty bad. I'm not sure if they separate that from the actual overall attendance though.
02-12-2018 02:24 PM
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thefaU Offline
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Post: #25
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-12-2018 02:21 PM)joshdude182 Wrote:  And reading comprehension is yours. He said student attendance, not overall attendance.

And where is student attendance data made available? 07-coffee3

It's not. His assertion was solely based on overall basketball attendance.

And logic is yours.
02-12-2018 02:40 PM
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Post: #26
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-09-2018 08:28 AM)SpaceRaider Wrote:  In Texas, do these student votes have any legitimate authority or are they just opinion polls? IIRC, in some instances where these student votes have occurred, the universities have ignored the results and gone ahead with the fees.

yes they carry some weight

the laws have changed recently and they go more on a "per university basis" now as to what fees can be charged and the amount of those fees

in that case the laws are generally written where there is an allowed increase over and above the existing fees and then to raise it beyond that there is a mandatory student vote

the administration CAN ignore a POSITIVE vote for a student athletics fee increase, but they cannot ignore a no vote and raise the fees anyway above the currently legally allowed amount

different schools have different dollar amounts that can be charged, some have restrictions on the number of credit hours it can be applied to (12 or 15 or as many as the student takes) and most all that have a set legal limit also have a limit as to what it can be raised without a student vote

the reality is though there is really nothing that prevents the administration from still taking other money (as long as it is not state funded dollars) and applying that to athletics and that happens regularly and I would imagine if enough of these student votes start getting pushed people will discover that and there will be harder caps put in place and there will be no opportunity to shift other funding (generally from regular tuition) over to athletics

this can be demonstrated with UTSA

currently UTSA has a $20 dollar an hour cap with that being charged to a max of 12 credit hours

in 2014 UTSA had $12,158,968 in student fees and $2,651,967 in "school funds" (I used 2014 because it was the easiest available data)

in Fall of 2014 they had 311,670 FTE credit hours taken....now generally a Full Time Equivalent Undergrad is considered 15 hours scheduled but since there are part time students and there are many students that do not take a full 15 hours they only take 12 those credit hours come pretty close to the amount that would be charged the $20 per credit hour

so 311,670 undergrad credit hours X $20 = $6,233,400 for the fall semester now most places the Spring enrollment is slightly less, but there is also summer enrollment to count as well so if you double that $6.2 million you get right at the reported $12 million and change in reported student athletics fee dollars.....so where does the other $2.6 million come from.....well it would be illegal to take it from state funding or grants so it is just a general transfer of other tuition dollars to athletics outside of the student fees.....and to be clear it is not "donations" because those are in their own category

this is common at most Texas public universities with the exception of UT Austin that has no mandatory student fee and no other university funds (and athletics actually sends $10 million TO academics) and sometimes A&M does not have a transfer

(02-09-2018 10:00 AM)AustinFromUNT Wrote:  In Texas, the student athletics fee can be raised by $1 1 time without a vote. After that the student body must vote for further raises. After each raise though, the 1 time $1 resets.

this is 100% false especially in the case of north Texas state and in the case of several other universities as well

in the case of north Texas state they are allowed to raise the fee a SINGLE TIME for an amount equal to 10% of what the existing fee was at the time (it was $10 dollars) so north Texas state could raise the fee one time and ONE TIME ONLY for one dollar and that is it without a student vote in favor of raising it again

it CANNOT be raised PER YEAR it can be raised ONE TIME without a student vote

this is confirmed from the office of the legislative member that wrote the bill

Craig Holzheauser

Legislative Director

Office of Representative Myra Crownover

CAP 1N.10

(512) 463-0582

so contrary to what people believe in greenweenies.noinfo the university CANNOT keep raising the fee 10% or $1 dollar per year without a student vote it was able to be raised 1 time for 10% to 11 dollars
02-13-2018 02:38 PM
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joshdude182 Offline
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Post: #27
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-12-2018 02:40 PM)thefaU Wrote:  
(02-12-2018 02:21 PM)joshdude182 Wrote:  And reading comprehension is yours. He said student attendance, not overall attendance.

And where is student attendance data made available? 07-coffee3

It's not. His assertion was solely based on overall basketball attendance.

And logic is yours.

If his assertion is based solely on overall basketball attendance, then why did he specifically say "student" each time he mentioned attendance? Maybe he was actually talking about student attendance. Instead of you telling me what you think he meant, I'll go by what his words actually say.

Logic? Come on man...don't even get me started.
02-13-2018 03:42 PM
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JCMiner Offline
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Post: #28
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
I remember back in 2010 UTEP made a similar attempt to pass an athletic fee to the students. They voted NO. Eight years later we are the worst football team and one of the worst basketball teams in the nation. Makes one wonder how different things would be for us if the students had voted yes.
02-13-2018 05:11 PM
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thefaU Offline
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Post: #29
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-13-2018 03:42 PM)joshdude182 Wrote:  If his assertion is based solely on overall basketball attendance, then why did he specifically say "student" each time he mentioned attendance? Maybe he was actually talking about student attendance. Instead of you telling me what you think he meant, I'll go by what his words actually say.

Logic? Come on man...don't even get me started.

I didn't realize a WKU fan was so well-versed on UTSA basketball's student attendance. My apologies. 07-coffee3

And you seriously lack any sort of logic if you take what people say on this board as truth without some sort of evidence provided or by verifying it for yourself.

North Texas needs to be able to better defend against the run in 2018 because they lost to Florida Atlantic twice by more than 3 touchdowns in 2017. http://www.meangreensports.com/sports/m-...sched.html
^This is an assertion where evidence is provided.

UTSA basketball's student attendance is low.
^Evidence? (If you're going to cite their overall attendance as low to which you infer their student attendance is also low, you just proved my point.)

You should actually use logic and verify what you're reading and not take it at face value if there is no evidence provided. Just some life advice for ya.
02-13-2018 06:45 PM
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Irish Rowdy Offline
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Post: #30
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-12-2018 12:50 PM)WKUFan518 Wrote:  Wow you actually had a vote? That's crazy, usually schools just say they are charging more and that's that....NOt sure how any UTSA fan thought this was actually going to pass, look at your student attendance for basketball. I don't know what your student attendance is for football but judging by basketball doesn't look like you get that great of student interest in sports....

But the ones that do go to games got to watch your team get beat by UTSA.
02-13-2018 11:35 PM
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Post: #31
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
there is plenty of student support for UTSA athletics

https://www.texasmonthly.com/articles/be...ll-almost/

Financing it required not only a $15 million fund-raising campaign but also a vote from the UTSA student body to double the athletics fee that’s added to tuition each semester (it passed overwhelmingly).

so when the move up was first proposed the vote to raise the fee easily passed and that was not all that long ago

the new campaign was a terrible idea and extremely poorly executed

in the past:

they had the full support of the administration from the top down

the AD had done studies and knew what it would take

there was a plan in place and conference openings

the president had been there forever

the university was trying to go through a transformation academically

other programs in SA were starting and others in Texas were moving up and UTSA wanted to be a part of that

in the present:

the new president has not been in office long and has issues to clean up after the past president was run out before he could fully retire

there is a new AD

the football coach has not been there long and the programs is not as hot as it was at first though it is still competitive and should step up again

the university has other things to concentrate on

football is under fire at all levels for various things

the administration was silent on the issue because it was just tossed together with no plan other than the oft failed "we just need more money"

the highlight of the plan was "others have more so we need more" which is not really that great of a sell when UTSA is not doing bad compared to programs with bigger budgets

it is going to be difficult to solve the facilities issues with a SMALL increase in the athletics fee and this increase would have done nothing to solve that issue especially with ZERO plan in place to do anything with facilities

there was no private money component as there was in the past specifically because this vote was not something the administration had a part of



this whole vote was an exercise in poor planning, poor execution, poor selling, knee jerking, and believing that if you just say you need more money with no indication of what will be done with it that people will just give more money.....they would have been better off with a gofundme because at least if it failed it would not be a mark against future better planned and executed fee increases
02-14-2018 03:59 AM
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owlcountry40 Offline
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Post: #32
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-11-2018 09:13 PM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  In 2012, 71% of students graduating from 4 year colleges had student loan debt.

In 2015 (in Texas) 56% of graduates had student loan debt, with the average debt being: $27,324.

The average class of 2016 graduate has $37,172 in student loan debt. The average monthly student loan payment ( borrowers ages 20-30) is $351.

In light of this, and the fact that kids graduating with phenomenal debt seems to be an increasing proposition, I really can't blame students for voting down increases in Athletic fees.

Colleges/Universities are going to have to get more creative as it pertains to rising athletic costs. Students are about tapped out.
What pisses me off is I have great credit and I can not lower my interest rate on the few loans I have. They are government loans and a couple portions of that are around 6.2 percent. I could go buy a house with a wayyy lower rate. Yet you still have people like that which Devos making harder to pay back loans out there.
02-14-2018 09:27 AM
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Post: #33
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-14-2018 09:27 AM)owlcountry40 Wrote:  
(02-11-2018 09:13 PM)Bobcat87 Wrote:  In 2012, 71% of students graduating from 4 year colleges had student loan debt.

In 2015 (in Texas) 56% of graduates had student loan debt, with the average debt being: $27,324.

The average class of 2016 graduate has $37,172 in student loan debt. The average monthly student loan payment ( borrowers ages 20-30) is $351.

In light of this, and the fact that kids graduating with phenomenal debt seems to be an increasing proposition, I really can't blame students for voting down increases in Athletic fees.

Colleges/Universities are going to have to get more creative as it pertains to rising athletic costs. Students are about tapped out.
What pisses me off is I have great credit and I can not lower my interest rate on the few loans I have. They are government loans and a couple portions of that are around 6.2 percent. I could go buy a house with a wayyy lower rate. Yet you still have people like that which Devos making harder to pay back loans out there.

you say "loans" plural have you looked into a consolidation and that lowering the interest rates
02-14-2018 09:59 AM
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RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
UAB students voted overwhelmingly YES (84%) to pass a $25 per semester increase for student athletic fees to help the return of football, bowling, and rifle back in 2015.
02-14-2018 10:16 AM
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MTPiKapp Online
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RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-14-2018 10:16 AM)UABslant Wrote:  UAB students voted overwhelmingly YES (84%) to pass a $25 per semester increase for student athletic fees to help the return of football, bowling, and rifle back in 2015.

I'd be willing to bet the vote would have failed if it weren't to bring football back.
02-14-2018 10:30 AM
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WKUFan518 Offline
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Post: #36
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-12-2018 01:21 PM)thefaU Wrote:  
(02-12-2018 12:50 PM)WKUFan518 Wrote:  Wow you actually had a vote? That's crazy, usually schools just say they are charging more and that's that....NOt sure how any UTSA fan thought this was actually going to pass, look at your student attendance for basketball. I don't know what your student attendance is for football but judging by basketball doesn't look like you get that great of student interest in sports....

UTSA had the 2nd highest football attendance in 2017 and 3rd highest football attendance in 2016.

Google is your friend.

I was talking about basketball, you cannot have that many students attend in a 1500 seat arena....
02-14-2018 11:09 AM
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WKUFan518 Offline
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RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-12-2018 01:34 PM)MTPiKapp Wrote:  
(02-12-2018 12:50 PM)WKUFan518 Wrote:  Wow you actually had a vote? That's crazy, usually schools just say they are charging more and that's that....NOt sure how any UTSA fan thought this was actually going to pass, look at your student attendance for basketball. I don't know what your student attendance is for football but judging by basketball doesn't look like you get that great of student interest in sports....

You make it sound like you believe a similar measure would pass with a unanimous vote in Bowling Green...

Bowling Green University in BOwling Green Ohio? What the hell are you talking about? The city is not voting for it, the school is... My point was how would UTSA expect this to pass if you allow the students to vote?...Most students sounds at this particular university are not that invested in sports or at least basketball...Sounds like football they have good interest, but basketball is another key sport if you ever want to take next step and upgrade your arena.....WKU did not have a vote taken on last athletic fee, it was automatically added...I am sure the profs and newspaper staff at WKU are against anything sports related but that is at most universities...However enough students care and realize sports at WKU helps grow the university perception wise if we have success on the court and field...Only helps universities, look at UCF as example...
(This post was last modified: 02-14-2018 11:12 AM by WKUFan518.)
02-14-2018 11:11 AM
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WKUFan518 Offline
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Post: #38
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-13-2018 06:45 PM)thefaU Wrote:  
(02-13-2018 03:42 PM)joshdude182 Wrote:  If his assertion is based solely on overall basketball attendance, then why did he specifically say "student" each time he mentioned attendance? Maybe he was actually talking about student attendance. Instead of you telling me what you think he meant, I'll go by what his words actually say.

Logic? Come on man...don't even get me started.

I didn't realize a WKU fan was so well-versed on UTSA basketball's student attendance. My apologies. 07-coffee3

And you seriously lack any sort of logic if you take what people say on this board as truth without some sort of evidence provided or by verifying it for yourself.

North Texas needs to be able to better defend against the run in 2018 because they lost to Florida Atlantic twice by more than 3 touchdowns in 2017. http://www.meangreensports.com/sports/m-...sched.html
^This is an assertion where evidence is provided.

UTSA basketball's student attendance is low.
^Evidence? (If you're going to cite their overall attendance as low to which you infer their student attendance is also low, you just proved my point.)

You should actually use logic and verify what you're reading and not take it at face value if there is no evidence provided. Just some life advice for ya.

Come on man! THe gym holds about 1500 and when we played against UTSA on a Saturday didn't look like 500 total people in the seats, how many actual students attended those basketball games? 50? Why would overall attendance have anything to do with a "student" vote?
(This post was last modified: 02-14-2018 11:15 AM by WKUFan518.)
02-14-2018 11:14 AM
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WKUFan518 Offline
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Post: #39
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
(02-13-2018 11:35 PM)Irish Rowdy Wrote:  
(02-12-2018 12:50 PM)WKUFan518 Wrote:  Wow you actually had a vote? That's crazy, usually schools just say they are charging more and that's that....NOt sure how any UTSA fan thought this was actually going to pass, look at your student attendance for basketball. I don't know what your student attendance is for football but judging by basketball doesn't look like you get that great of student interest in sports....

But the ones that do go to games got to watch your team get beat by UTSA.

Congrats, you guys have owned us last two seasons out of 100...Cannot wait to met again in conference tournament!
02-14-2018 11:16 AM
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Post: #40
RE: UTSA Students Vote Against Athletic Fee Hike
They should put professors raises up for vote by the student body too. At the university I work for, we literally have people making $400,000 a year to teach two classes.
02-14-2018 11:20 AM
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