(04-19-2018 09:26 AM)Rocco Wrote:  

(04-19-2018 08:37 AM)Tribal Wrote:  Of the three students busted for WEED ONLY, two were in possession of a felony amount of grass and the third was caught distributing.

There's no such thing as a felony amount of weed if it's simple possession. Now if you've got 50 pounds of marijuana you're likely catching a PWID charge but simple possession is a misdemeanor no matter the amount.

Reading the articles, I think that is exactly what happened here.

(04-19-2018 10:02 AM)zablenoise Wrote:  

(04-19-2018 09:26 AM)Rocco Wrote:  

(04-19-2018 08:37 AM)Tribal Wrote:  Of the three students busted for WEED ONLY, two were in possession of a felony amount of grass and the third was caught distributing.

There's no such thing as a felony amount of weed if it's simple possession. Now if you've got 50 pounds of marijuana you're likely catching a PWID charge but simple possession is a misdemeanor no matter the amount.

Reading the articles, I think that is exactly what happened here.

aaaand that's where the media has been misleading this week.

Pretty sure any sort of selling near a school is an automatic felony, regardless the amount. So a felnoy amount could literally be half a gram

(04-19-2018 10:19 AM)TDenverFan Wrote:  Pretty sure any sort of selling near a school is an automatic felony, regardless the amount. So a felnoy amount could literally be half a gram

That's correct but it's also a separate code section.

Agree with an earlier poster that several of the students linked to this are likely to get out of significant legal trouble as their involvement is likely less significant, but were arrested as part of the broader investigation.

Im sure these students are going to be expelled, but most likely this investigation is out to get the bigger players.
Drug use and sales such as these are probably present in every university in the country. The tie-in to sexual assault is likely from those assault reports leading to a few reoccurring names of drug dealing sources.

I'm a recent alum, so maybe I feel a closer connection to these students (although I didn't know any of them), but this drives me crazy. The thing about the drug war in general is that the consequences are often much worse for a person's life than the drugs.

For example, some of these kids got charged with one count of distribution of marijuana and one count of doing so within 1000 feet of a school (presumably they were on campus). Some others were caught only with schedule II drugs. Now they could go to jail for years. From what I understand only one was a serious dealer, and he ended up wearing a wire to catch the others (the "undercover informant"). The rest were just sharing some with their friends, but are still getting distribution charges. Messing up their whole education and future job prospects is much worse for them and their families than the pot would have been, so what have we really solved here?

I have less sympathy for the students caught with harder drugs, but that seems to be a minority.

Students are up in arms about unreported sexual assaults being used as a justification for this too. Most don't believe there really is any connection, and there is widespread dissatisfaction with how police in the area have handled *reported* sexual assaults in the past. Most students feel that resources are being used in a crackdown on pot rather than to handle more serious threats like sexual assault.

For what it's worth, I believe five students were caught only with possession of marijuana, but that is being handled by the College itself so their faces aren't in the article. It's still pointless in my opinion, and the College is deeply unhappy this was done without WMPD's knowledge or consent.

(04-19-2018 05:35 PM)2017WithPep Wrote:  I'm a recent alum, so maybe I feel a closer connection to these students (although I didn't know any of them), but this drives me crazy. The thing about the drug war in general is that the consequences are often much worse for a person's life than the drugs.

For example, some of these kids got charged with one count of distribution of marijuana and one count of doing so within 1000 feet of a school (presumably they were on campus). Some others were caught only with schedule II drugs. Now they could go to jail for years. From what I understand only one was a serious dealer, and he ended up wearing a wire to catch the others (the "undercover informant"). The rest were just sharing some with their friends, but are still getting distribution charges. Messing up their whole education and future job prospects is much worse for them and their families than the pot would have been, so what have we really solved here?

I have less sympathy for the students caught with harder drugs, but that seems to be a minority.

Students are up in arms about unreported sexual assaults being used as a justification for this too. Most don't believe there really is any connection, and there is widespread dissatisfaction with how police in the area have handled *reported* sexual assaults in the past. Most students feel that resources are being used in a crackdown on pot rather than to handle more serious threats like sexual assault.

For what it's worth, I believe five students were caught only with possession of marijuana, but that is being handled by the College itself so their faces aren't in the article. It's still pointless in my opinion, and the College is deeply unhappy this was done without WMPD's knowledge or consent.

Eloquent. I'm only slightly further removed from the current student body but I feel much the same way.

I found the sexual assault excuse particularly problematic.

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(04-19-2018 05:35 PM)2017WithPep Wrote:  I'm a recent alum, so maybe I feel a closer connection to these students (although I didn't know any of them), but this drives me crazy. The thing about the drug war in general is that the consequences are often much worse for a person's life than the drugs.

For example, some of these kids got charged with one count of distribution of marijuana and one count of doing so within 1000 feet of a school (presumably they were on campus). Some others were caught only with schedule II drugs. Now they could go to jail for years. From what I understand only one was a serious dealer, and he ended up wearing a wire to catch the others (the "undercover informant"). The rest were just sharing some with their friends, but are still getting distribution charges. Messing up their whole education and future job prospects is much worse for them and their families than the pot would have been, so what have we really solved here?

I have less sympathy for the students caught with harder drugs, but that seems to be a minority.

Students are up in arms about unreported sexual assaults being used as a justification for this too. Most don't believe there really is any connection, and there is widespread dissatisfaction with how police in the area have handled *reported* sexual assaults in the past. Most students feel that resources are being used in a crackdown on pot rather than to handle more serious threats like sexual assault.

For what it's worth, I believe five students were caught only with possession of marijuana, but that is being handled by the College itself so their faces aren't in the article. It's still pointless in my opinion, and the College is deeply unhappy this was done without WMPD's knowledge or consent.

I’m far from a recent grad but support all you’re saying EXCEPT there’s no such thing as ONLY a schedule II drug. Kids are dying across the country every day because of schedule II addiction and abuse.

Some of these young men were caught distributing hard drugs, not just marijuana. They very well may face hard time in prison...these drugs kill people. Certainly these guys face expulsion. Others will surely lose this semester and possibly one more before being allowed back.

There are no excuses for any of them; they were either extremely stupid or remarkably naive to get involved in this. It is a blot on their lives forever and I can only imagine the anguish within their families back home.

To criticize the Williamsburg police is wrong; this was a well-organized, extensive drug dealing operation
and who knows how many buyers from this distribution group became addicted or sick from their selling. I can also imagine the pressure on the gang (and that's what it is...a gang) right now to turn on their suppliers.

(04-19-2018 05:35 PM)2017WithPep Wrote:  I'm a recent alum, so maybe I feel a closer connection to these students (although I didn't know any of them), but this drives me crazy. The thing about the drug war in general is that the consequences are often much worse for a person's life than the drugs.

For example, some of these kids got charged with one count of distribution of marijuana and one count of doing so within 1000 feet of a school (presumably they were on campus). Some others were caught only with schedule II drugs. Now they could go to jail for years. From what I understand only one was a serious dealer, and he ended up wearing a wire to catch the others (the "undercover informant"). The rest were just sharing some with their friends, but are still getting distribution charges. Messing up their whole education and future job prospects is much worse for them and their families than the pot would have been, so what have we really solved here?

As much as I sympathize that the existing penalties for drug possession are absurdly punitive, knowing that getting caught destroys your life has to be an obvious reality to college aged kids at this point too. You can't make decisions in life based on how you think the world ought to be and assume normative reality will bend to your ethic. The permissive attitude towards what was uncovered here strikes me as a classic example of defining deviancy down.

(04-20-2018 05:53 AM)bubbadog57 Wrote:  Some of these young men were caught distributing hard drugs, not just marijuana. They very well may face hard time in prison...these drugs kill people. Certainly these guys face expulsion. Others will surely lose this semester and possibly one more before being allowed back.

There are no excuses for any of them; they were either extremely stupid or remarkably naive to get involved in this. It is a blot on their lives forever and I can only imagine the anguish within their families back home.

To criticize the Williamsburg police is wrong; this was a well-organized, extensive drug dealing operation
and who knows how many buyers from this distribution group became addicted or sick from their selling. I can also imagine the pressure on the gang (and that's what it is...a gang) right now to turn on their suppliers.

You can throw President Reveley and the W&M police department in as those who also are criticizing WPD over these events. Per an alleged email that was sent to the student body last night, the administration has requested a meeting to “mend relations and demand explanations” from the Williamsburg Police Department, who apparently did not notify the school nor WMPD that they were wiring students up and taking drug dogs through school buildings.

Maybe we could get some insight from J Comey is on these matters? We know that good people can mess up. Just ask Andy! This town and gown conflict has been there in the burg forever. Nothing new there. So there are pockets of dopers in the student body. Who would have thunk it? Anyone with any brains.

You can argue the amounts and types of drugs that were used and distributed. You can justify all of this. You can argue that a drug should be legal. You can deflect and point fingers at all involved.

We (not just millenials), collectively as a society, young and old, have decided that laws, rules, whatever don’t matter. They are out dated, they don’t reflect my beliefs. So, I’m going to say and do whatever I want.

Today as the laws are written, the acts of these individuals broke the law.

They are bright intelligent people or they would not have been accepted into WM. Those who distributed knew full well what they were doing. They got greedy, they got caught.

Those who are just users, regardless of the amount possesed, also broke existing laws. They too knew what they were doing. They got caught.

They are attending one of the finest colleges in America. They most likely would graduate with a degree and alumni connections that would set them up with earnings that would provide a great quality of life.

They put all of that at risk when they made the choice to engage in an activity that was illegal.

I am not against a person using a drug of any kind, if you want to ruin your life, go for it. But, when you consciously know you are breaking the law and do it any way and are caught, it brings with it consequences.

Actions have consequences, good and bad. These kids made bad choices and unfortunately will suffer the consequence. You can argue and justify the severity, none the less, they screwed up.

Attacking those who caught them is just a way to deflect responsibility for ones choices, which unfortunately has become the norm in our society.

Some additional information:

https://wydaily.com/local-news/2018/04/2...=hootsuite

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I have wrestled a lot with this story today, not out of any support/sympathy for illegal drug use or distribution, but out of my skepticism of how this has transpired with the Williamsburg PD and what makes W&M any different, at this moment, from any other school in the country.

From the Daily Press:
"Riley said the investigation began when police received information from a variety of sources about unreported sexual assaults due to an increase in drug activity occurring on and nearby the William and Mary campus.

Police have not, to this point, received any reports of sexual assaults taking place as a result of increased drug activity near or on campus, Riley said.

“We made a decision to target that drug activity, and that’s what led to these arrests,” Riley said. “We have not received any reports about actual sexual assaults.”

Huh??? A little contradiction here.

The reason given by the Williamsburg PD that W&M campus police were not included was because the tips about unreported sexual assaults that started the drug investigation did not come from campus. This seems like a shaky cover for intentionally excluding campus police and targeting the campus. Common law enforcement courtesy and cooperation warrant working together when you're investigating a supposed "increase in drug activity occuring on or nearby the William and Mary campus."

I can't imagine Richmond or Henrico PD's conducting a similar investigation involving VCU or UR and not including their campus police.

In past media reporting, this new police chief was supposedly selected because of believed strengths for improving "community" involvement. Hello, W&M IS part of the community. In addition, regarding the Tri-Rivers Task Force, why is W&M's campus police not included in this group?

W&M has a media blitz coming next week with the Comey town hall, and consequently, for better or worse, is in the playing field with all of the crazed political warfare that the country is dealing with. The timing of the police investigation and how it was handled cannot help, but leave some skepticism about political motivation.

Either there is an issue with failings of W&M and campus police to build a strong working relationship with this new Williamsburg PD leadership and/or vice versa, or this new Williamsburg PD leadership had an ulterior motive here?

I certainly hope it was the former. If not, then I'd certainly like to see someone demand to know where the so called "information" came from that started all of this, since there are no actual reports of sexual assault.

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(04-20-2018 07:09 PM)Tribeheart Wrote:  I have wrestled a lot with this story today, not out of any support/sympathy for illegal drug use or distribution, but out of my skepticism of how this has transpired with the Williamsburg PD and what makes W&M any different from any other school in the country.

From the Daily Press:
"Riley said the investigation began when police received information from a variety of sources about unreported sexual assaults due to an increase in drug activity occurring on and nearby the William and Mary campus.

Police have not, to this point, received any reports of sexual assaults taking place as a result of increased drug activity near or on campus, Riley said.

“We made a decision to target that drug activity, and that’s what led to these arrests,” Riley said. “We have not received any reports about actual sexual assaults.”

Huh??? A little contradiction here.

The reason given by the Williamsburg PD that W&M campus police were not included was because the tips about unreported sexual assaults that started the drug investigation did not come from campus. This seems like a shaky cover for intentionally excluding campus police and targeting the campus. Common law enforcement courtesy and cooperation warrant working together when you're investigating a supposed "increase in drug activity occuring on or nearby the William and Mary campus."

I can't imagine Richmond or Henrico PD's conducting a similar investigation involving VCU or UR and not including their campus police.

In past media reporting, this new police chief was supposedly selected because of believed strengths for improving "community" involvement. Hello, W&M IS part of the community. In addition, regarding the Tri-Rivers Task Force, why is W&M's campus police not included in this group?

W&M has a media blitz coming next week with the Comey town hall, and consequently, for better or worse, is in the playing field with all of the crazed political warfare that the country is dealing with. The timing of the police investigation and how it was handled cannot help, but leave some skepticism about political motivation.

Either there is an issue with failings of W&M and campus police to build a strong working relationship with this new Williamsburg PD leadership and/or vice versa, or this new Williamsburg PD leadership had an ulterior motive here?

I certainly hope it was the former. If not, then I'd certainly like to see someone demand to know where the so called tips came from that started all of this.

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As per the highlighted section above, I hope that there is no connection in the press with these arrests, the Comey spectacle, and the BLM shouting down the ACLU program about free speach that gives the College a black eye ala what happened at Mizzou.

(04-20-2018 07:35 PM)LeadBolt Wrote:  As per the highlighted section above, I hope that there is no connection in the press with these arrests, the Comey spectacle, and the BLM shouting down the ACLU program about free speach that gives the College a black eye ala what happened at Mizzou.

I fear the political seeds for that news feed have already been set in motion.

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Round, and round she goes, where she stops nobody knows.

Speculation is a wonderful thing!

Just for the record, I'm with the Task Force on this whole affair. Their record of successful interdiction is strong, particularly for a limited regional effort. They had reports from informants of sexual assaults occurring around drug activity which were not being reported. They investigated that drug activity. They have made 10 arrests so far for serious drug offenses. And somehow they're the bad guys?

Just shut up.

Thanks for the insight.

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(04-20-2018 08:35 PM)Tribe4SF Wrote:  Just for the record, I'm with the Task Force on this whole affair. Their record of successful interdiction is strong, particularly for a limited regional effort. They had reports from informants of sexual assaults occurring around drug activity which were not being reported. They investigated that drug activity. They have made 10 arrests so far for serious drug offenses.

I agree with you, but it's still weird that WMPD was left out of this without a public reason given for why. That lends itself to wild speculation.